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I grew up in extreme poverty myself - I am only 40 - I know (sm)

Posted By: To all Obama supporters on 2008-09-23
In Reply to: my granfather was deeply - andromedica

I know what the world is really like. I am not superficial. You just have no idea what you are talking about. I AM being a resonsible American and this is not nonsense. That is the confusion here.


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"I think the extreme left and extreme right both need to get a clue!"..sm
That's what you said in a post above, and yet, your post is definitely extreme right.  I don't think you have a clue about most of the crap you spout out. 
I used to know it all, just like you, then I grew up (sm)
and realized I was wrong. You will too. Let's hope our country is still free by that point in time so you can still express your views, once you have truly learned what your views are.
I grew up on..............sm
peas grown in my Dad's garden and cornbread cooked in my mom's stove.

My Dad was the sole breadwinner in our family of 4 and Mom was a magician when it came to stretching Dad's paycheck to provide the family with all that we NEEDED. We learned early on in life that there was a large distinction between our NEEDS and our WANTS. Our menu was very basic, like yours, beans and cornbread, peas, chicken and dumplings, etc. The only time we had steaks was when Dad had a steer butchered when he had cattle. We also raised hogs at one time for meat. My mother made every stitch of clothes I wore almost until I left home, including my prom dresses. She would have made my wedding dress, but we lived on a red dirt road and she just knew that my white dress would no longer have been white had she made it. But we did find the perfect dress at a bridal shop on sale for $100.....remember this was 1978, LOL. She could not have sewn it for that, even if we had lived on a paved road!

Still, with all that, I never knew I grew up poor until I was well past grown and looked back over some of the events of my childhood. We were rich in love and family and faith in God.

Part of the problem with the welfare system, and America in general, is that we have been offered so many choices for so long, that we have become greedy and feel entitled to have anything we want, regardless of whether we can afford it or not. That, I fear, is not something that welfare reform or legislation can change.
Yes, my income grew after 2001...nm
Moved home, and I took my primary account home with me as an IC, and then promptly found two other accounts. I've always worked more than one job, and being at home is no different. And it's always been just me doing the work, no one else.

However, in the last two years, since dems have had control of Congress, my income has plummeted by 20,000. The most I ever made was close to $80,000 a year, and that was working 12 hours a day, every day, seven days a week.

Now, I have to work more day, get paid less, and make somewhere around $55 or 60,000.

I'm an IC MT/editor/QA type person, who does all three, for different clients, depending on who I work for.

Not an MTSO, but took advantage of all the tax breaks for small businesses, as well as HSA account for health purposes, just for my husband and myself.

Soooo...to answer your question to sam....Yes, I did well in the first four years after 9/11. I work my butt off, to be able to live where I do. We're middle class America....but dropping fast.

I cannot afford to have more taxes. I cannot afford to pay for more social programs for those who do not work.

As someone said recently on this board. Why should I work my butt off to make $60,000 a year, to be told I am in an upper middle class bracket, and have to dole out thousands more in taxes to the people who refuse to work? (And if they can't work, there are progrmas for them) I'd do just as well working only 40 hours a week, instead of the 80 to 100 I do work.


Do not believe for a moment, that Obama knows what he's doing for the economy. It's all a subterfuge to raise taxes anything that isn't tied down, and then some. A one time tax rebate to lower and middle America, to buy their votes. Then tax, tax, tax.

No thanks.


She actually grew up middle class
and made her own money. Then married Sir Rothschild. Why couldn't I have found a guy like that?!?
It didn't say he grew up in Pakistan
Big difference.
I don't mind you asking. I grew up north of ...
Sallisaw, Oklahoma. About 23-24 miles from Fort Smith down Interstate 40. Arkansas border to the north at Siloam Springs...to the east Fort Smith. Beautiful part of the country. I hope to go back some day.

Never been to the casino at Siloam, but I have been gone from that area quite awhile. There was an antique/flea market kind of place there in Siloam I used to like to go to...browse for hours. lol.

As to Buy American...yep, and they tried to keep it that way for a long time. And I know you don't want to hear this...but every time Democrats got control of congress taxes went up, especially on corporations...and you have to do something to compete.

And you have to face it...there would be millions of Americans without jobs if it weren't for Wal-Mart. They are a huge part of the American economy. :)
I grew up with guns in the house.

My father had gun racks and he always kept one rifle loaded in case someone tried to break into the house.  All three of us kids knew it and we also knew not to touch it.  My dad taught us how to shoot, the safe way to use guns, and what NOT to do with a gun.  I think the problem with a lot of gun related accidents is that parents hide the guns and don't teach their kids the dangers and how to properly handle guns. 


If you take guns away from the law-abiding citizens....it won't stop the criminals from getting them and then we will have nothing to protect ourselves with.  That is common sense really.  It will just create an even bigger black market for guns and only the unlawful citizens will buy them illegally like that which will leave the lawful citizens unprotected from criminals. 


Sometimes this guy is way too extreme....
for me, but if you look past the rhetoric and pick out the points, he makes some good ones. Just my take.
How am I extreme right?

I think abortions should continue to be legalized but late-term abortions stopped.  If doctors and/or certain hospitals do not believe in abortion, I believe they have the right to refuse to perform it.  That is their right.  They shouldn't be forced to do so for fear of losing funding or their job.  I lean conversative but I'm not a right-wing nut job.  I want a smaller government.  I want people to grow up and learn how to be responsible for themselves instead of depending on others to provide for them.  I do not want to reward laziness and stupidity....which is what we are heading for.  We should reward hard work and achievement.  Not everyone has a right to a house, car, etc.  You have to earn that stuff.  I don't want government telling me what I can and can't have done medically or for government to decide whether I should have treatment for an illness or not.   


Like I said....I may lean conservative but I see the fault in both political parties....which.....it doesn't appear that you do.  Everything is still Bush's fault in your eyes.


Question: When the economy GREW the 4 years after
Job security? Standard of living? Most likely not, unless you happen to live in India.
I grew up Baptist, and we thoroughly studied both books
And, as always, we picked and chose that which we would apply to our lives, and how we would interpret what it said.

You know the only things I took away from my childhood religion?

"Love your sisters and brothers."

"Judge not, lest ye be judged."

"Do unto others as you would have done to you."

And having studied the Nag Hammadi library, which gave much, much more insight into what Jesus recommended, it seems as if that - believe it or not - is exactly what he meant.

So when you say someone is "wrong," you are judging them. When you are asking someone to change their lives to accommodate your beliefs, you are doing unto them something you're asking not be done to you. And I believe we can agree that love is unconditional (something I believe 1 Corinthians 13:1-13 alluded to), regardless of what other's choices are - even if you disagree with them.
I grew up in California and it is a real problem...
They end up closing down emergency rooms because they can't turn away illegals who need medical help and most don't pay. Don't know anything about PA, but it seems to be pretty bad here in Nebraska where I have been lioving since December.
Well, I say good for him! 'Bout time somebody grew
--
Yes, poverty is a problem that will never...
go away until people stop the incessant fatherlessness in our society.  You can blame rich people, you can blame whites, you can blame anybody you want, but tossing EVEN MORE money at this problem (records amounts are already spent, and have been for 40 years), but the problem will never go away until the root causes of it are addressed.  A young black male being raised in a project by an uneducated, probably too young to be his mother, mother, doesn't stand a chance without some very rare personal gumption.  He has no father at home to teach him how to be a man, drops out of school, and the street becomes his family.  He listens to Ludacris to learn how to treat women, gets several girls pregnant, and the cycle repeats itself.  As Bill Cosby tries to say, the problem and the fix comes from within.  It's time to stop the blame. 
Global Poverty Act here we come.
Obama has said over and over that if elected he will push through the Global Poverty Act. He says this bill "is a priority."

The GPA requires the American president to "develop and implement" a "specific and measurable" official policy to cut GLOBAL poverty in HALF in six years. Specifically, it would earmark 0.7% of AMERICA'S gross national product for foreign aid ABOVE AND BEYOND the amount America already spends in foreign aid. So in addition to bailing out Wall Street, we get to bail out Bangalor and other poverty sockets to the tune of an extra $845 BILLION dollars, at the mandate of the United Nations.

And the US president would be held accountable to the UN if he failed to fork over the dough, making this nothing more than a TAX on America.

Once you teach a man to fish, you shouldn't have to keep throwing fish at him. At some point, we have to put country first. OUR country.
Did ya' ever think the whole reason there is poverty

I am voting for Obama; we need change, but of course the good ole' boys will never let that happen.  It's a shame that greed goes right alongside corrupt. 


Furthermore, just because someone is poor does not make them unintelligent.  There are some people who have just fell on hard times for many different reasons, one being medical problems or a sick child. 


Why doesn't grampa just give it up?  Him and his "hootsy" sidekick whatever her name is from nowhere.  The pubs throw more mud and find ways to look away from today's troubles, it's almost sickening instead of answering direct questions.


Yes I can and it's called POVERTY
:
so you'd rather have "Trickle-Up poverty"
yea... that's probably best
Trickle up poverty

I decided to Google this phrase and see what came up.  Not suprising the first on the list was from Rush Limbaugh.   I did find this too though and I couldn't agree more.  I have no idea who wrote it.


http://www.opednews.com/articles/Trickle-Up-Poverty-and-the-by-Cameron-Salisbury-080923-947.html


Other than extreme circumstances....SM

one is too many.


Can we say extreme prejudice? (sm)

Now where have I heard that kind of sentiment before......hmmmm....oh, I know.  It was Hitler.  In your statement you have shown a complete disregard for life.   In my opinion, anyone who would so enthusiastically support genocide, regardless of the circumstances, is simply disgusting and a waste of good air.


What makes you think that everyone who believes in Jesus grew up in the church?
I most definitely did not, and it is an absolute MIRACLE that I even came to the Lord. My parents are as far from Christ as can be. I literally came to Christ "kicking and screaming". I did not want to believe in him. Mostly because I did not want to have to follow HIS rules. But I am here, and I am saved, and I thank God that I am! It is the best thing to ever happen to my SOUL.


What I posted about poverty was an opinion...
from someone who has worked in the system for several years. And, frankly, I think the people in the trenches are better suited to have those opinions than Washington Bureaucrats who base everything on a census...and frankly, we know how reliable THAT is.
Ever consider you and your lifestyle is just 1 or 2 layoffs away from poverty?

What if you're laid off, maybe your jobs are sent out of the country and you can't find another job.  Would you be too proud to take a handout from the government in the form of unemployment benefits?  Maybe food stamps so you could eat.  Judge not...............


Not everyone is looking to have you and your cohorts fork over part of your paycheck so they don't have to work.  Think overpaid CEOs.  Think companies (also MT companies) who send jobs out of the country so they can bloat their bottom line and put more in THEIR paycheck while taking it out of YOUR paycheck.  Isn't that what's being done already?  Is your MT pay getting better......or worse?


Socialism = Abject Poverty
And no, you couldn't go to the doctor unless you were on a waiting list for four months first. Read up on the history of Russia before you think Socialism is such a great idea.
And you don't think you are extreme? Christian bashing again, I see. nm

No liberals here just extreme leftists

I know some good liberals and the ones who are here are not them.


If you are not a Bush hater or a Bush basher on this board then you're a troll.


God help these people if they ever do get in a real fight.


Don't you think that is a bit extreme? She is no worse than anybody else and at least she doesn&
I may disagree with most of what she says but she doesn't resort to name calling, except maybe in sarcasm. I would even go so far as to say she is doing some actual debating, albeit maybe a bit much.
yeah, just another extreme leftist who would never
nm
All who oppose your party extreme? I put US first.
nm
yes, I agree, the torture was extreme, we just
got a 'glimpse' of it. But this is not the right time to expose it when the US troops are still in Iraq, Afghanistan and Pakistan.
Katrina Reveals Poverty Reality






It wasn't long ago that I was told by my conservative mtstars buddies that poverty in American was not as bad as we thought.  To them poverty only meant you didn't have extra spending money and that the impoverished had color TVs, air conditioning, cars, the whole enchilada.  They even went through the spiel of posting articles to support them.  It has always been my opinion that poverty is alive and well in America and Katrina has unfortunately revealed this to us all too tragically.


--------------------


Katrina Reveals Poverty Reality


Thursday, September 08, 2005

By Kelley Beaucar Vlahos















PHOTOS
VIDEO














Click image to enlarge








STORIES




Stories of the grinding poverty among the survivors of Hurricane Katrina in New Orleans vividly illustrate what many say is a forgotten truth of modern American life — that pockets of desperate poverty still exist in a country of unsurpassed wealth and privilege.


Underscoring that reality, a report by the U.S. Census Bureau (search) released the same week Katrina hit the nation's southeast announced that the national poverty rate rose for the fourth straight year despite continuing growth in production and political rhetoric that the nation's economy is on the upswing.


Click here to read the U.S. Census Bureau's report.


According to that report, the number of Americans living under the poverty line grew by 1.1 million in 2004 for a total of 37 million people nationwide. That equals 12.7 percent of the total U.S. population. It is the fourth annual increase.


[Poverty] is a problem in America that hasn't gone away — it just went underground for a while, and it shouldn't have, said Sheila Zedlewski, director of the Urban Institute's Income and Benefits Policy Center.


Through images of the predominantly black residents of New Orleans pleading for help, leaving destroyed homes with nothing but the clothes on their backs, America got a wake-up call according to Sheldon Danziger at the National Poverty Center at the University of Michigan.


People are putting these things together, and it will be interesting to see if the attention of the public stays on this, he said. As a country we'd like to think we moved beyond it, but in reality, [poverty] is still a substantial problem.


Others caution against putting too much weight into the new numbers, pointing out that they do not reflect the public assistance low-income individuals and families receive, like Medicaid (search) and welfare, and do not distinguished between truly impoverished individuals and those who are temporarily poor.


The poverty rate began to climb in 2000, the year it hit a 26-year low of 11.3 percent of Americans living under the poverty level, according to U.S Census Bureau figures. That was the lowest point since 1974, when the number was 11.2 percent. The highest point of poverty in recent times was in 1993 at 15.1 percent. Before that, was in 1983, at 15.2 percent.


In 2004, according to the latest study, the poverty rate among African Americans remained the same — at 24.7 percent. Hispanics also saw no change in their poverty rate at 21.9, while whites saw an increase, from 8.2 percent to 8.6 percent. Asian Americans experienced the only decrease, from 11.8 percent to 9.8 percent.


The poverty rate among American families remained at 10.2 percent of the population in 2004. The Office of Budget and Management (search) defines a family of two adults and two children with a median household income of $19,157 or less as living in poverty; or a family of two with no children, making $12,649 a year.


Median household income went unchanged in 2004, according to the census bureau, at $44,389. Blacks continue to have the lowest median income among all ethnic and racial groups, making $30,134 annually.


Wages earned among Americans, however, declined in 2004. For men over 15 working full-time, year round, the real median earnings declined 2.3 percent from 2003, to $40,798. For women with similar work experiences, wages declined by 1 percent to $31,223.


And while unemployment has gone down from 5.5 percent in August 2004 to 4.9 percent in August this year, unemployment among blacks is still the highest in the country, at 9.6 percent in August compared to 4.2 percent for whites and 5.8 for Hispanics.


In New Orleans, where blacks make up 67 percent of the population, 27 percent of the residents are living below poverty level according to a recent study by Total Community Action, Inc. (search), a public advocacy group based in New Orleans.


Click here to read that study.


But some warn that the new census bureau figures may not be an ideal measure, given that they do not take into account the impact of public assistance on a household, or recent tax cuts and child tax credits. Others say the poverty rate had been in steady decline since the early 1990's and see the recent increases as the tail end of the 2000 recession.


It's a bit unfortunate to link the hurricane with the issue of poverty in this country, as though there has been no reduction in poverty since the 1980's, said Rey Hederman, senior policy analyst for the Heritage Foundation.


Since a high point in 1983 the poverty rate for the U.S has been on a decline, aside from the four years following the brief recession in 1989 and the most recent hike, according to the Census Bureau.


Like other economic analysts, Hederman believes the growth in productivity in the U.S economy will eventually produce more jobs and higher incomes for workers.


But so far, Hederman admits, that hasn't happened.


We've got strong productive growth but wages have been relatively stagnant. It's a bit of a paradox as to why it hasn't happened sooner, said Phillip Swagel of the American Enterprise Institute, who blames, in part, the Internet bust six years ago.


Nonetheless, he calls today's economy the most golden era for productivity growth in more than 50 years.


In the short term, it means that firms have been able to produce more without hiring more people, Swagel continued. But in the long term, it will mean that wages and income will go up. It takes time for that relationship to take hold.


But on Wednesday, the Congressional Budget Office (search) announced that hurricane's damage to the southeast could reduce national economic growth by nearly a percent at time when forecasters were hoping for a three to four percent increase by the end of the year. It also expects a loss of 400,000 jobs in the labor market.


Some say that inner cities that have never fully recovered from past economic recessions will no doubt be the hardest hit.


I think for the last 25 years, we have had an economy where most of the gains have been concentrated in a small percentage of the workforce, said Danziger. [The] rising tide has not lifted all boats, the economy has shifted so that a smaller portion of the population gets the increases, and the rest is simply happy to have jobs that experience no wage increase or income increases.


According to the recent Total Community Action study, poverty rates have remained stagnant in New Orleans in the last 40 years and even without the near total destruction of the city, have been the highest in the nation.


It would be ironic that it would take a disaster like this to focus [national attention] on this,


Rep. Mel Watt, R-N.C., and member of the Congressional Black Caucus (search), told FOXNews.com, Every area of our lives these disparities exist and we have tried to focus on them all year.


Minority populations left behind in many cities often suffer from bad schools and are at a real disadvantage compared to their suburban middle class and affluent counterparts, say experts.


The poverty differences by education, by race, by central city versus the suburbs, are long standing, said Danziger, who also said that by leaving New Orleans' most disadvantaged, immobile residents behind the hurricane clearly brought that into stark contrast.


The Urban Institute’s Zedlewski admits that over the last several years more resources have been focused on the symptoms of poverty — poor education and healthcare.


If you look at the long haul it is true progress has been made, she said, adding that more needs to be done, particularly in the African American community, regarding single motherhood, the high rate of incarcerated males and investing in adult education.


Swagel, who recently left his job as chief of staff for the White House Council of Economic Advisors (search), believes the current administration has put into place policies — notably tax cuts — that have stimulated growth and are benefiting middle and lower income families the most.


I would say our policies are on the right track, he said. They are working in the right direction, and we should not reverse course when things are improving.


Watt doesn't buy the tax cut stimulus scenario. As soon as this President came in and passing these massive tax cuts, [the poverty rate] turned and went in the opposite direction, he said. This administration is about supporting people of higher income and it makes no bones about it.


Meanwhile, thousands of displaced people from New Orleans are looking for jobs, and trying to begin new lives in places like Houston and Baton Rouge. Poverty advocates hope that in the long term, available education and job training opportunities, as well as the higher wages that have been promised by economists, aren't out of reach.


Katrina Reveals Poverty Reality





Katrina Reveals Poverty Reality

Friday, September 09, 2005

By Kelley Beaucar Vlahos















PHOTOS VIDEO














Click image to enlarge








STORIES




Stories of the grinding poverty among the survivors of Hurricane Katrina in New Orleans vividly illustrate what many say is a forgotten truth of modern American life — that pockets of desperate poverty still exist in a country of unsurpassed wealth and privilege.


Underscoring that reality, a report by the U.S. Census Bureau (search) released the same week Katrina hit the nation's southeast announced that the national poverty rate rose for the fourth straight year despite continuing growth in production and political rhetoric that the nation's economy is on the upswing.


Click here to read the U.S. Census Bureau's report.


According to that report, the number of Americans living under the poverty line grew by 1.1 million in 2004 for a total of 37 million people nationwide. That equals 12.7 percent of the total U.S. population. It is the fourth annual increase.


[Poverty] is a problem in America that hasn't gone away — it just went underground for a while, and it shouldn't have, said Sheila Zedlewski, director of the Urban Institute's Income and Benefits Policy Center.


Through images of the predominantly black residents of New Orleans pleading for help, leaving destroyed homes with nothing but the clothes on their backs, America got a wake-up call according to Sheldon Danziger at the National Poverty Center at the University of Michigan.


No posts regarding war, poverty, health care....
only bush bashing. Don't pretend you actuallyt talk about issues here. You don't.
I'll take socialism over abject poverty....
And that's where we are headed - all due to that big fat present waiting on Obama's desk when he was sworn in. Socialism would be a welcome relief. At least I could go to the freakin' doctor.
Not surprising, since you're an extreme liberal.

Extreme medical situations is NOT what this doctor
--
Oh, those poor, poverty stricken CEOs. I really feel for them all.
How DO they survive???
Exactly...but Obama is still pushing his Global Poverty Bill.....
It is designed to send BILLIONS of our hard earned dollars to Africa and other 3rd world countries to cut poverty there by half.

How can he cut their poverty by half?? He should be worrying about OUR poverty. Which is a telling point in my mind. Why is Obama so bent on giving OUR money away? I don't know about you, but I don't need the govt' telling what to do or not do with my money. I earned it, I have the final decision.
Genocide? Talk about extreme. And Clinton's lies
Yes, it's not a newsflash that ALL politicians lie, Dem and Repub alike, but the guy was busted with his cigar in the ... err, his hand in the cookie jar, yet stood there and lied to everyone. Guess that's okay as long as he's DEMOCRAT. If you think Dems don't lie just as much as Repubs, then you are completely blind. It's just all in whose lies you are more willing to believe, and apparently for you it's Democrat. Please, if you can't admit one other darn thing, you all have to admit that they ALL lie to us. This country is going to hellina handbasket, but the people of the country share some of that blame. The economy is bad, but a lot of people bought houses they couldn't really afford (bad loan companies or not, they had to know), racked up credit card bills they could never pay, and the list goes on. WE share in the blame. The only way any change is going to happen, whether it's Repub or Dem on Nov. 4, is if we all pull up our sleeves and work toward it instead of lashing out at each other based on stupid party lines and making excuses and placing blame for every single thing that happens, even when it's a natural disaster like a hurricane, flood, etc. God help us all if there are a lot of other people that think like you do. You DO realize that while you're blaming Repubs for only believing what they read/see in media and not researching what they believe, a lot of what you say comes straight from the media and isn't even entirely accurate. Do yourself a favor and practice what you preach and do some truly unbiased research, not based in Dem or Repub muddle, before you reply. No hearsay, no op ed piece drivel, no blog spewing, but honest to goodness FACTS. Going to be hard to find when the media is so biased, but it's out there. Something tells me you won't bother because you've already made up your closed mind, as long as it's Republican affiliated, you hate it. That's your idea of being a broad thinker?
sounds like extreme liberal games to me to make mccain look bad...sm
I also think it's hypocritcal how burning mccain in effigy seems to be a-okay to the libs, and no one reports it.


think they're obama plants too...it's very plain to me.


If his tax plan scares you, check out his Global Poverty Act. Link inside.
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=56405
Psychiatry Ponders Whether Extreme Bias Can Be an Illness...see article/link

Psychiatry Ponders Whether Extreme Bias Can Be an Illness




By Shankar Vedantam
Washington Post Staff Writer
Saturday, December 10, 2005; Page A01



The 48-year-old man turned down a job because he feared that a co-worker would be gay. He was upset that gay culture was becoming mainstream and blamed most of his personal, professional and emotional problems on the gay and lesbian movement.


These fixations preoccupied him every day. Articles in magazines about gays made him agitated. He confessed that his fears had left him socially isolated and unemployed for years: A recovering alcoholic, the man even avoided 12-step meetings out of fear he might encounter a gay person.







src=http://media3.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/photo/largerPhoto/images/enlarge_tab.gif
Darrel
Darrel A. Regier of the American Psychiatric Association favors research but says it is not clear that establishing a diagnosis would be useful. (By Marvin Joseph -- The Washington Post)









He had a fixed delusion about the world, said Sondra E. Solomon, a psychologist at the University of Vermont who treated the man for two years. He felt under attack, he felt threatened.


Mental health practitioners say they regularly confront extreme forms of racism, homophobia and other prejudice in the course of therapy, and that some patients are disabled by these beliefs. As doctors increasingly weigh the effects of race and culture on mental illness, some are asking whether pathological bias ought to be an official psychiatric diagnosis.


I thought McCain was going to have a stroke. He was grimacing, rolling his eyes, showing extreme
anger.  Not much poise at all which is needed. 
wrong again - I did not say grew up in Paky, I said "was" in Paky.
.