Interestingly, other atrocities on US soil...(sm)
Posted By: Just the big bad on 2009-01-13
In Reply to: So tell me - what other atrocity on US soil has happened - jm
since 9/11 have not come from the usual suspects, but rather from our own government. I'm going to go with the patriot act that pretty much killed the constitution, an unjust war that has not only killed numerous Americans but has also destroyed any credibility of the US, and then there's Gitmo and torture, all perpetrated right here in the good ol USA.
If those aren't atrocities, I don't know what is.
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Interestingly............. sm
the economy tanked about the time that Obama was elected. Things were not good before then, but they really went south fast after it was announced that Obama had won the election. Curious, don't you think?
Interestingly, you write:
"Obama is flying on the premise that he is innocent until proven guilty..."
That's what the Constitution you claim to support so much demands: Innocent until proven guilty (and not a word about "flying on the premise" of same).
I'm just curious. Once this bogus b/c issue is "officially" revealed as such by the SC, you have promised to let this issue go.
What's next on your list to pound this man into the ground about? Because it's obvious that you're never going to give him an honest, fair chance to be a good president. (He hasn't even been sworn in yet.)
So what's the next bogus issue on the agenda that will be raised to continue to try to drag him (and the country) down?
My last question: Did you complain as vigorously about George W. Bush's blatant contempt for the Constitution that you claim to love so much?
Interestingly, a lot have no clue how manipulated things are by them. sm
Their corporations own the media, Hollywood, Federal Reserve and, yes, even politicians. I definitely see Bush as a puppet, but many say he is not as dumb as everyone thinks, maybe dumb when convenient.
Anyway, the US government has a history of creating incidents and being dishonest to get public support for wars. Thanks to the Freedom of Information Act and declassification of documents, we now know to be fact:
1. Operations Northwoods
Unexecuted plan created by US military to stage a fake attack by Cuba against the US for the purpose of justifying war with Cuba. Documented fact.
2. Tonkin Incident
That thrust us into Vietnam - pretty much now common knowledge that it never happend. Jittery sailors and/or radar abberations leveraged by LBJ to gain popular support for unpopular war, and a blank check from congress.
3. Pearl Harbor
Long held rumor backed by some fairly compelling evidence that FDR both instigated and was aware that the Japanese would attack. At the time 89% of the US population did not want to be involved in Europe's war...
The fact remains that when the government remains secret and manipulative after an attack on the United States, when an administration uses an attack to further its own political goals, puts money in the pockets of its corporate cronies, it makes people tend to question what they are told and to not believe anything the administration says. Bush has made it worse still by lying about nearly every single detail concerning the Iraq invasion, specifically why we invaded. The more lies we hear, the less we believe and the farther back we start to question.
A quote from PNAC's Rebuilding America's Defenses:
Further, the process of transformation, even if it brings revolutionary change, is likely to be a long one, absent some catastrophic and catalyzing event — like a new Pearl Harbor.
PNAC - page 50.
Did we know the scope of his atrocities then?
I'm going to have research that a little bit, because I was just a kid in the eighties. I don't know the exact year the turning point happened with Iraq.
I have a question for you though, would you like to see Saddam back in power? I'm just kind of wondering whose side you're on?
There are atrocities in lots of countries
and nobody seems to give a dam@. We are only interested in countries that have something we want.
I thank God Bush stopped having war on US soil after 911! nm
x
So tell me - what other atrocity on US soil has happened
since the towers. I can't think of a single one.
America is safer because of the policies in place.
atrocities? Burned alive with saline....
sliced and diced and sucked out of the one place you should be SAFEST? Having a needle stuck in your neck and your brain sucked out? And you want to talk atrocities?? Puleezzee. Yeah..that's certainly just YOU...it certainly isn't me.
He invaded a country and committed horrible atrocities there...
we beat him back, should have taken him in the first Gulf war. But we're always going overboard trying to be nice and where does that get us? Same place it got us with N. Korea. Jimmy Carter barters a deal with them for food, and they take the money and use it to build nukes. Where's the outrage over that? Sometimes a people just cannot rise up and oust a dictator. They need help. And now the time has come for them to quit squabbling amongst themselves and make something out of their country. Let's not forget how many years it took for Japan and Germany to get on their feet. We need to give them a little more time. Heck, this country dissolved into civil war after 100 years. Time and patience.
Then Again, how many would have lived and suffered atrocities if Hitler's mom had had an abortion
I am not trying to be flip or funny here, because it is not, but I do not think we can use that particular logic...just say that ALL life is precious, whether a baby grows up to be Einstein, Ghandi, or Charles Manson, it either must ALL be in God's hands because He is Creator of All, or there is no logic. Just wonder how everyone feels about the ultimate sanctity of life when it comes to capital punishment....
Don't get me wrong, I amy be a Democrate, but I am moderate and I DO believe, in instances such as the rape/murder/brulity of children, serial killers, etc, that putting a monster like this to sleep, as you would a rabid animal who will kill and destroy otherwise, is the best thing we can do for our sick society, not perfectly okay, but the best that can be done to protect others. But whenever I see this particular reason NOT to abort, it makes it sound as though if a child were retarded or slow, or even a sociopath (not a psychopath), it would be okay, PLAYING GOD IS PLAYING GOD in either case. IMHO
I've already experienced martial law on American soil
(I think the article is over the top, and wishful thinking by the author, BTW)
So, after Katrina in Gulfport, MS, here's what martial law was like:
1. When the troops moved in, they took over and started ordering us around like cattle. Offered to shoot us for even trying to ask 'em a question. Rude and mean to everyone. The skies were full of helicopters - felt like living in a MASH rerun. Jeeps raced up and down my street at double the speed limit, nearly running me over if I stuck a toe in the road. Nobody lifted a finger to help me clear the debris in my yard - in fact they were irritated that I dared set foot outside at all.
2. They commandeered any resource that was left, for the powers that be. They took over every airport, every gas station, every Walmart still standing, every hotel or restaurant that had a generator, jammed all the phone lines (and yes, folks, MINE STILL WORKED until the troops arrived, then suddenly it did not). All that stuff was appropriated for whoever they deemed important - the county officials, the media, rubbernecking senators they flew in. Woe unto you if you tried to get a drop of gas, a cold drink, or speak to anyone about why you could not - a gun gets stuck in your face.
3. Curfew makes you feel like a little kid when its given by your parents. It makes you feel like a criminal when its set by your government. Yeah, they offered to shoot me because I forgot something in my car and tried to leave my house to go get it. They had roadblocks on every corner. I worked at a hospital nights and daily had to show my ID just to get to work and back. People that didn't have a good reason to be out and about got turned back and threatened. They roadblocked all the highway exits to our town and turned away anybody that came offering help - saying it wasn't needed. Actually, they just weren't organized enough to accept donations or direct would-be heros where they could help - so they just turned them away, rudely. If you wanted to leave town after Katrina, forget it - they had taken all the gas away and didn't want us on the roads.
4. They sectioned off parts of our town with barbed wire and told us it was unsafe. Sorry, I walked through it right after the storm and knew it was no worse than the rest of the town. They threw residents that had survived the storm off their property and wouldn't let them come back without an armed escort and government permission. Sometimes they bulldozed their houses flat before letting them come back into the protected zone. All in the name of protecting them.
5. The majority of the soliders raced around acting important. Never saw any lift a finger to help anyone in any type of distress. I guess their orders were to stand around and wait for more orders, while intimidating us (obviously that's what the confused, scared, and needful survivors required from their government?). They also took over our local radio and had them tell us to just sit isolated in our houses and wait for help, and discouraged us from helping one another or traveling across town to help a friend. Nobody ever knocked on our door and asked us if we needed anything - so if I'd obeyed orders and believed help was coming I would have waited until I died. I suppose they wanted us to just sit there and die, so we'd be less hassle.
6. The only help we received were from average citizens brave enough to argue their way through the military road blocks. Not the government. Their function was to take over, snatch whatever comforts still existed, and isolate and scare us.
I was shocked I could be treated the way I was on American soil, and I realized it can happen anywhere to anyone, if and when the powers that be decide to take over an area for whatever reason they deem necessary. I suddenly realized this happens all over the world in wartime, when our troops move in to occupy their country - and I realized I felt like those people must have felt at the sight of the soldiers. Most people just don't think it can happen here - well trust me, it can and it does. Maybe next time, in your neighborhood.
I've already experienced martial law on American soil
(I think the article is over the top, and wishful thinking by the author, BTW)
So, after Katrina in Gulfport, MS, here's what martial law was like:
1. When the troops moved in, they took over and started ordering us around like cattle. Offered to shoot us for even trying to ask 'em a question. Rude and mean to everyone. The skies were full of helicopters - felt like living in a MASH rerun. Jeeps raced up and down my street at double the speed limit, nearly running me over if I stuck a toe in the road. Nobody lifted a finger to help me clear the debris in my yard - in fact they were irritated that I dared set foot outside at all.
2. They commandeered any resource that was left, for the powers that be. They took over every airport, every gas station, every Walmart still standing, every hotel or restaurant that had a generator, jammed all the phone lines (and yes, folks, MINE STILL WORKED until the troops arrived, then suddenly it did not). All that stuff was appropriated for whoever they deemed important - the county officials, the media, rubbernecking senators they flew in. Woe unto you if you tried to get a drop of gas, a cold drink, or speak to anyone about why you could not - a gun gets stuck in your face.
3. Curfew makes you feel like a little kid when its given by your parents. It makes you feel like a criminal when its set by your government. Yeah, they offered to shoot me because I forgot something in my car and tried to leave my house to go get it. They had roadblocks on every corner. I worked at a hospital nights and daily had to show my ID just to get to work and back. People that didn't have a good reason to be out and about got turned back and threatened. They roadblocked all the highway exits to our town and turned away anybody that came offering help - saying it wasn't needed. Actually, they just weren't organized enough to accept donations or direct would-be heros where they could help - so they just turned them away, rudely. If you wanted to leave town after Katrina, forget it - they had taken all the gas away and didn't want us on the roads.
4. They sectioned off parts of our town with barbed wire and told us it was unsafe. Sorry, I walked through it right after the storm and knew it was no worse than the rest of the town. They threw residents that had survived the storm off their property and wouldn't let them come back without an armed escort and government permission. Sometimes they bulldozed their houses flat before letting them come back into the protected zone. All in the name of protecting them.
5. The majority of the soliders raced around acting important. Never saw any lift a finger to help anyone in any type of distress. I guess their orders were to stand around and wait for more orders, while intimidating us (obviously that's what the confused, scared, and needful survivors required from their government?). They also took over our local radio and had them tell us to just sit isolated in our houses and wait for help, and discouraged us from helping one another or traveling across town to help a friend. Nobody ever knocked on our door and asked us if we needed anything - so if I'd obeyed orders and believed help was coming I would have waited until I died. I suppose they wanted us to just sit there and die, so we'd be less hassle.
6. The only help we received were from average citizens brave enough to argue their way through the military road blocks. Not the government. Their function was to take over, snatch whatever comforts still existed, and isolate and scare us.
I was shocked I could be treated the way I was on American soil, and I realized it can happen anywhere to anyone, if and when the powers that be decide to take over an area for whatever reason they deem necessary. I suddenly realized this happens all over the world in wartime, when our troops move in to occupy their country - and I realized I felt like those people must have felt at the sight of the soldiers. Most people just don't think it can happen here - well trust me, it can and it does. Maybe next time, in your neighborhood.
I've already experienced martial law on American soil
(I think the article is over the top, and wishful thinking by the author, BTW)
So, after Katrina in Gulfport, MS, here's what martial law was like:
1. When the troops moved in, they took over and started ordering us around like cattle. Offered to shoot us for even trying to ask 'em a question. Rude and mean to everyone. The skies were full of helicopters - felt like living in a MASH rerun. Jeeps raced up and down my street at double the speed limit, nearly running me over if I stuck a toe in the road. Nobody lifted a finger to help me clear the debris in my yard - in fact they were irritated that I dared set foot outside at all.
2. They commandeered any resource that was left, for the powers that be. They took over every airport, every gas station, every Walmart still standing, every hotel or restaurant that had a generator, jammed all the phone lines (and yes, folks, MINE STILL WORKED until the troops arrived, then suddenly it did not). All that stuff was appropriated for whoever they deemed important - the county officials, the media, rubbernecking senators they flew in. Woe unto you if you tried to get a drop of gas, a cold drink, or speak to anyone about why you could not - a gun gets stuck in your face.
3. Curfew makes you feel like a little kid when its given by your parents. It makes you feel like a criminal when its set by your government. Yeah, they offered to shoot me because I forgot something in my car and tried to leave my house to go get it. They had roadblocks on every corner. I worked at a hospital nights and daily had to show my ID just to get to work and back. People that didn't have a good reason to be out and about got turned back and threatened. They roadblocked all the highway exits to our town and turned away anybody that came offering help - saying it wasn't needed. Actually, they just weren't organized enough to accept donations or direct would-be heros where they could help - so they just turned them away, rudely. If you wanted to leave town after Katrina, forget it - they had taken all the gas away and didn't want us on the roads.
4. They sectioned off parts of our town with barbed wire and told us it was unsafe. Sorry, I walked through it right after the storm and knew it was no worse than the rest of the town. They threw residents that had survived the storm off their property and wouldn't let them come back without an armed escort and government permission. Sometimes they bulldozed their houses flat before letting them come back into the protected zone. All in the name of protecting them.
5. The majority of the soliders raced around acting important. Never saw any lift a finger to help anyone in any type of distress. I guess their orders were to stand around and wait for more orders, while intimidating us (obviously that's what the confused, scared, and needful survivors required from their government?). They also took over our local radio and had them tell us to just sit isolated in our houses and wait for help, and discouraged us from helping one another or traveling across town to help a friend. Nobody ever knocked on our door and asked us if we needed anything - so if I'd obeyed orders and believed help was coming I would have waited until I died. I suppose they wanted us to just sit there and die, so we'd be less hassle.
6. The only help we received were from average citizens brave enough to argue their way through the military road blocks. Not the government. Their function was to take over, snatch whatever comforts still existed, and isolate and scare us.
I was shocked I could be treated the way I was on American soil, and I realized it can happen anywhere to anyone, if and when the powers that be decide to take over an area for whatever reason they deem necessary. I suddenly realized this happens all over the world in wartime, when our troops move in to occupy their country - and I realized I felt like those people must have felt at the sight of the soldiers. Most people just don't think it can happen here - well trust me, it can and it does. Maybe next time, in your neighborhood.
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