They're a lot more progressive and educated.
Posted By: . on 2008-10-15
In Reply to: Who cares what Europe thinks? They are no - example..in worse shape than we are.nm
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right, al the young and educated, progressive
people voted for Mousavi. Even before all the votes were in, the government already announced a landslide win for Ahmedinejad. Definitely fraud, Ahmedinejad's ratings before the elections were very low, high unemployment rate. How could he win?
I'll take progressive-thinking, educated liberals any day
8)
A note about educated and un-educated
I think a lot of people get the two mixed up. They believe that if you have a degree you are educated. Anyone can go to school, sit through classes, study and take a test. That's the easy part. The hard part (IMHO) is for people to receive information, process it, understand it, and make their own informed decisions. I have a sister who has a 4 year degree and graduated from a college, but she is not educated on the policies or what is going on in the country and around the world. Also have a brother & brother in-law with their degrees. One understands the issues presented to us, the other, like my sister only knows what they were taught in class, and they tell me that the instructors would not lie to them so they will believe what their instructors taught them. You ask them about a policy or why laws were put into place, ask them to talk to you about what's going on in the country/world, etc, and they cannot answer.
Then there are those who did not receive a "formal" education yet when you talk to them you can have an honest intelligent discussion with them. They ask questions and give input. They share information and think on their own.
Therefore the two really need to be separated.
Education = informed and able to think and process information without being told how to think. This can include both people with degrees and without.
Uneducated - blindly following what someone tells you what to do and how to think. You have no ideas of your own and just mimic the words of others. This can include both people with degrees and without.
Progressive new sources
On reviewing the posts below, I see someone has supplied you with a number of conservative sources to investigate. For the sake of balance, here is a list I prepared a few days back of progressive sources that will also give some insight into the Obama camp and their beliefs. You could Google around with this list, but don't be overwhelmed. In my personal opinion, the Democracy Now! Amy Goodman is a nice all-round overview of all the others. Here's that link and the list.
http://www.democracynow.org/
Democracy Now! with Amy Goodman
Ariana Huffington.
Bill Mahar.
Bill Moyers.
Indymedia.
Independent Press Association (IPA)
Chris Matthews
Keith Olberman
Richard Dreyfuss
Helen Thomas
Jim Hightower
Fairness and Accuracy in Reporting (FAIR)
Naomi Klein
Al-Jazeera English
Jeremy Scahill
Robert Scheer
Nir Rosen
Allan Nairn
James Steele
John Ghazvinian
Seymour Hersh
Scotter Ritter
The Nation
Rolling Stone
Mother Jones
The American Prospect
Greg Palast
why progressive taxation?
Two answers:
1. Because it's good for the economy. Money doesn't exist to stagnate in pools; it has to move.
2. Because it's the moral thing to do. If you have for example a flat 10% income tax, a millionaire will flinch, but a poor man will starve.
progressive taxation
See, DNH, the thing I'm getting at is, it already *is* my money. My money, your money, it's being taken already, and given to people who don't work, billionaires who have not a worry in the world.
Your example of a 25% tax rate is even better than mine. That guy making 60,000, he's making 45,000 after taxes. Well and good--it was a big bite of his income, but he can still afford his house and to feed his kids. But what about the guy making 30,000? Suddenly he's making 22,500 a year, and how's he going to pay his heating bill this winter? He can't afford food, he can't make rent.
So what looks initially like equal treatment, is actually something far different: A neglible weight on the wealthy, a noticeable burden on the middle class, and a death sentence on the lower class.
The incentive argument doesn't work, either. During the height of taxation in the 50s, the economy grew at a healthy rate, and it grew by making things, building things, actual goods and services, not the fake growth we've seen in the recent low-tax decades, where all the wealth is made up of obscure financial instruments that nobody understands.
People don't give up their dreams because they fear a high tax rate. They give up their dreams because suddenly they can't afford food anymore, and they're going to get thrown out of their houses, and their kids are going to be dressed in rags, because every dime they worked so hard for is being redistributed right on up into the hands of billionaires.
What if it were my money? I'd rather every dime I had go to the poor, than yet another penny wind up in somebody's else's hedge fund.
I a progressive politically. Sounds like it. nm
nm
Tax cuts, progressive tax system, social programs
are as American as apple pie and these same policies and initiatives can be found puncuating the pages of our history from the day of our country's inception.
You do not understand Marxism or socialism, or you would be a lot more exercised by the current redistribution of wealth that takes your tax dollars and moves them upward to an elite ruling class that represses and undermines the middle class at the drop of a hat. State ownership of banks, lending institutions and direct personal property "buy outs" (as proposed by McCain certainly smack of Marxism and are not exactly what you could call traditional American values.
They towed Bush's line for 6 long years. Ask any progressive
better still, branch out and listen to opposing media views, including progressive radio and newspapers...those guys have yet to get mainstream coverage. To get any kind of decent international coverage, one is forced to go to media source outside of our own country. You might be REALLY surpised at what you find there. Get real.
better educated does not always
equal more intelligent. don't people get that?
Well, here's some of your educated
answers:
“He was born and educated in America.” He spent 10 years in Indonesia.
“What you are saying is ridiculous” yet you don’t back it up with anything.
“Are you kidding me?” and don’t back it up with anything.
“I am a refined democrat” but don’t give reasons why.
“What’s this nonsense” yet nothing to back it up?
and my favorite:
“Why should an American President be born in the US?
This should be amended. It is old fashioned.
A child born to illegal immigrants in the US can become an American President.
Is this LOGIC?”
This means you don’t care if who runs for president from other countries, even terrorists. Way to go!
in an mature and educated
community this would be ideal. Kerry thought there were enough reasonable adults to see through the Swift Boat lies and did not fight back; that is why he lost the election. I am glad Obama choses not to stoop to smear and fear. Yet to prevent another Swift Boat type election, somebody has to sling the garbage back at the same level as the bottom feeders. Its a dirty job but hey . . .
oops...that should be under-educated. (nm)
xx
Yea, they are SOOOO educated that they
be taken over by Muslim terrorists.....yea, they're really on top of it.
You are so right. You educated yourself to the issues and now sm
You realize, as I do, that Obama is going to fight for us. He is going to penalize companies who outsource. That means OUR jobs. What is up with people on this board? I am sure if they paid attention like you did they would be voting Obama too. I, like you, have dissected every bit of info this year. I watched Dem and Repub primaries, follow all of the issues and it's so completely clear that Obama is the right one.
Maybe not hicks, but obviously not educated..
enough to work hard instead of sitting on the internet, watching dancing with the stars, eating doritos and flipping through people magazine whlie waiting for their check in the mail. Sheeple will follow each other over the cliff, hope you have on your hiney is well padded!
You don't sound educated because
of some of your posts below.
I'm very educated and I voted for him
Maybe if you would take the time to educate yourself rather than just read crap on blogs, you might not worry so much. The bill is creating the Congressional Commission on Civic Service, which may be referred to as the Generations Invigorating Volunteerism and Education Act (GIVE).
In section 6104 it states
(b) Specific Topics- In carrying out its general purpose under subsection (a), the Commission shall address and analyze the following specific topics:
(6) Whether a workable, fair, and reasonable mandatory service requirement for all able young people could be developed, and how such a requirement could be implemented in a manner that would strengthen the social fabric of the Nation and overcome civic challenges by bringing together people from diverse economic, ethnic, and educational backgrounds.
They're simply exploring whether a national service requirement is even feasible. They're not implementing anything yet. Why people get worked up without even knowing what they're getting worked up about is beyond me. Which is why I usually stay off the political board.
I'm going back to work now.
college educated voter in the
suburb up the road says farmer is an ignorant redneck who does not check facts.
Then maybe that college educated voter......... sm
might like to test that theory by working a season or two in the redneck farmer's fields.
I live in an area where there are a lot of immigrant workers. The truth of the matter is that farmers really cannot afford to pay a wage high enough to be able to afford even a modest apartment, let alone buy food and pay utilities. I live right down the road from a poultry farm which employs a family of Mexican immigrants. The farmer, while making a fairly decent living (at least until Pilgrim's filed bankruptcy) provides a mobile home for the family to live in, pays utilities on said home and also pays the family wages to work on his poultry farm. No doubt this family recieves Medicaid and food stamps as well and the children probably get free lunches at school. It is very hard, if not impossible, to get Americans to work these kinds of jobs. I'm not condoning illegal immigrants, but if legal immigrants will do the job, then why not hire them?
ever heard of over-educated idiots?
mind you, i am not calling anyone that, but just stating how it is commonly understood that one can be very educated in the system, and not be too smart still. you just keep watching, and be fair to both candidates, and see if you don't see what i am talking about.
F: Obama more intelligent, better educated. nm
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Do you consider yourself to be an intelligent educated person?
.
OBAMA 08! the only educated choice NM
Democrats are more educated and have more class sm
But I agree that Fox News watchers are easily manipulated and usually not all that bright.
Can these people not see the class that Obama has? sheesh.
Seems the EDUCATED are "whacked out" (like your president). nm
x
Is Obama an elitist because he is better educated than McCain?
What do you think makes Obama an elitist?
Palis? See what I mean about educated? typossss on an MT board? nm
nm
Obama supporters are very educated and not hicks nm
nm
To all well-educated voters and free thinkers...
On Tuesday night, If and when Barack Hussein Obama wins the 2008 United States Presidential Election, please join me in announcing that "The tribe has spoken, and that John McCain, Sarah Palin, and the ubiquitous Sam have officially been voted off the island!"
Michelle is a nice, educated person, BUT
I would not call her beautiful. Come on! What is beautiful on her? And regarding her 'own' style?
Sure, everybody has his/her own style.
"...he is a self-educated, caring, honest, and intelligent man"
.
Apparently you don't understand statistics or science. Get educated, please!!
It's not scientifically sound to make pseudo-scientific statements about U.S. obesity based on a television program you saw that featured some obese people in it. But it seems when it comes to scientific fact, statistics or the truth - you CONS don't have a clue.
Rankings: Obesity Rates Grew In Every State But Oregon
Mississippi Ranked Heaviest State
POSTED: 8:29 am PDT August 23, 2005
UPDATED: 9:34 am PDT August 23, 2005
The obesity epidemic isn't winding down -- in fact, it's expanding, according to state rankings released Tuesday by Trust for America's Health, a nonprofit health advocacy group.
Obesity rates continued to rise last year in every state but Oregon. Mississippi ranked as the heaviest state, Colorado as the least heavy, according to the report, titled F as in Fat: How Obesity Policies are Failing in America, 2005.
The rankings are based on averages of three years of data from 2002 to 2004 from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. Hawaii was not included in the report.
About 64.5 percent of adult Americans are either overweight or obese. The report found that more than 25 percent of adults in 10 states are obese, including in Mississippi, Alabama, West Virginia, Louisiana, Tennessee, Texas, Michigan, Kentucky, Indiana and South Carolina.
Obama is the choice of the educated and smartest people nm
nm
Commie? This is out of line. Obama supporters are educated. nm
nm
Totally wrong because the most educated people vote for Obama sm
That is a fact. The dumb, uneducated vote repub, the greedy rich vote repub and the religious right vote repub. The college educated people vote Obama. Why do you think McBush and Failin are out there calling Joe SixPack etc... that's their only hope. They know the filthy rich without conscience will vote for them. They know the religiouis nuts but some of the eehaas and dummies have been going to Obama and McBush and Failin are freaking out a little.
You're entitled to your opinion. I guess it depends on what side of the spectrum you're on.nm
x
We're not defending Bush we're pointing out the obvious
All you see in your view is Bush, Bush, Bush. Nobody else exists. You have yet to answer any of the questions I posed yesterday. We're not the one obsessing about Bush. I'm sure you'll counter that with I don't owe you any answers! It's really telling that for five or six days this board was mute about the Israel/Lebanon situation. You were too busy posting trash news about Bush like nothing was even happening, but I know that the left has wait for its talking points. You all cannot formulate opinions on your own. You have boilerplates ready to go though. *This is Bush's fault because _____________ but you have to wait on Howard Dean, Bill Clinton, etc. etc. to fill in the blanks for you. It's not just a phenomenon here but with all the left. You can count on at least two days of silence when something unforseen breaks out in the world, because they have to retreat to their bunkers to get their talking points straight, but it will always start with *This is Bush's fault because....
Hey, if they're smoking cigs, they're paying for SCHIP.
xx
They're too lazy to show patriotism......they're waiting
xx
So you're not racist but you're most definitely SEXIST and AGEIST!!!
"Someone more in our age group..."
"She should be taking care of her family."
Your true colors are showing, and they're truly ugly.
Just because they're LOSING doesn't mean they're VICTIMS.
What is it with people these days? You think that just because Hamas is getting its fanny handed to it that that magically makes them victims, and we should all weep and throw cash at them?
From the dawn of time, lesser civilizations have fallen to stronger ones.
It's why the human species survived and the neanderthals didn't.
It's why Rome conquered the Celts.
It's why the Barbarians conquered the Western Roman Empire.
It's why the British conquered the American Indians.
It's why the Spanish conquered the Aztecs.
It's why the Muslims conquered Israel the first time. But, since their societal progres seems to have permanently parked in the Stone Age, now Israel is conquering them right back.
Deal with it.
You're right. They're simply not worthy of a reply.
They're not tax breaks....they're tax credits
xx
I'm snotty, you're rude...we're even....
My dearrrr....not everyone in this country pays taxes. So you are wrong there. Obama said "spread the wealth." From his own mouth. The interview in Canada...economic parity and redistribution. Words from HIS mouth. If you believed those words from his mouth as much as you believed other words from his mouth, you would know he is a socialist. Selective memory is a wonderful thing ain't it??
You're right. They're all wack-jobs... nothing
so they try to make themselves feel important by standing around on street corners with their posters and their dollies.
Most of them are just buffoons, good for nothing other than being laughed at by the rest of us. But the ones that totally lose all reason, and go so far as to shoot people (in a church of all places...) is pretty off the deep end.
You're a liar. GT didn't curse. You're a filthy liar, but you are a gift from God.
God sent you here to as a constant reminder of the kind of person I DON'T want to be and if I ever have a bad day when I feel temporarily stupid, all I have to do is read your posts, and I realize there are those out there who are much worse off than I am and for them it's not temporary.
They're doing to this board what they're trying to do
to the whole country. They're trying to take it over. They want to control which God you believe in, who you love and what you do with your body, be it regarding life or regarding death. If you don't voluntarily agree to turn your free will over to their control, they will hunt you down and nag you to death (since they can't do anything more violent on a message board). It's obvious they are sick, sick people and need major help.
But they ARE like watching a car wreck and are sometimes hard to ignore.
I've thought about it, and for me personally, the very best thing to do is ignore them and for 2 reasons:
1. Ignoring them and not reading their posts makes my visit on this board much more pleasant. I already know I'm not missing anything because there isn't one post on this entire board written by them that has contributed anything of value or intelligence.
2. If we all refuse to read and respond to their posts, they might give up and go find another board to terrorize. I doubt that, though, because they've taken over this board and simply don't have the CLASS to leave. They take pride in their bully on the playground mentality and are proud of their ignorant behavior. They will probably just continue to pat themselves on their backs on this board. The only thing that might startle them and cause them to stop is that the NUMBER of posts on the Liberal board are starting to increase heavily as a direct result of their posting. In the past, they've used the Liberal board's lower numbers to trash us for not being as interesting, when, in fact, the CON board must be pretty boring if they are always choosing to be HERE instead.
Like I said, I've decided that I'd like my visits here to be pleasant, so I'm just going to stop subjecting myself to their cesspools of attacks. They've proven their posts aren't worth wasting time reading, so I'm just going to stop and will feel much better as a result of stopping. 
Your not you're. I hope you're not an MT. nm
.
They're children, though. They're not
adults. Mom and Dad need to know these things even if only to possibly prevent problems later.
You're welcome.
If I find anything, I'll be sure to post it, but I doubt he's going to be saying much. I think he understandably wants to distance himself as far away from this administration as he can.
I wish he would run for President. I'd very proudly vote for him in a heartbeat! I'd finally be able to vote for the best candidate instead of the least worst one.
I agree with you, and I admire and respect him very much.
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