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working poor and middle class need defending not rich

Posted By: gt on 2005-09-28
In Reply to: These liberals crack me up, they act as if there isn't a rich greedy Democrat - anywhere on earth. nm

Believe me, the rich do not need to be defended.  They are getting along just fine and can pay for the best defense in the world.  Debating about how the rich should have their money, on and on..if anyone needs defending, it is the working poor and the middle class whose salary for the past five years has gone down, not increased. 


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Not super rich, am middle class, but i am not a ...
Marxist socialist. That kind of stomping on I can do without. I may have to live through it, but I am not handing him the ball bat to hit me over the head with.
So, rich tax cuts expire, middle class gets benefit,
will undermine, erode and ultimately vaporize capitalist money/greed ambition and incentive to produce, but keep minimum wage workers at sub-living-wage levels and expect them to have exhibit impeccible work ethic and slave away 24/7 with no complaints? I think I got it now.
helping the lower class and middle class will NOT
Giving handouts to those that do not work certainly does nothing to help their situations; it only encourages it. Middle class are your working class, the support and backbone of this country. Obama's interference in their lives is just that, interference. The democrats have always felt they have the right to interfere in our lives by taxing us to death. What does that do to help us? It only makes us MORE dependent on the government......nothing about MORE government is helping us in any way.

I'm glad you think crime is JUST a biproduct of poverty, not race, which proves you obviously don't live in an area where that would prove you wrong. I live in an area where I know that every BLACK has the same opportunities as whites, the EXACT same education and FREE two college years....FREE, FREE, FREE.....all they have to do is finish high school....not all As or even any Bs, just finish high school. Now, a lot of young people take advantage of that but MANY do not. What do they do instead? Stand on the street corner, run around with their pants hanging down to the knees, steal for drugs, sell drugs to make money so they can buy expensive hubcaps for their souped up cars, buy their expensive shoes and ugly pants, and make MORE BABIES, which by the way, I SUPPORT with my taxes. No, I don't want to hear all that hogwash about their poverty. The media has made so much of that garbage, those that don't live in or near it, don't realize many blacks have the same opportunities; it's just that a lot of blacks, especially in my town, have grown up generation after generation living off the taxpayer and see no reason whatsoever to change their situation. They make more babies.....I'm forced to raise them so that generation can make more babies. Do I wish their situation would change? ABSOLUTELY! Do they have plenty of resources available in this town alone to change that? ABSOLUTELY! Do most of them take advantage of that? ABSOLUTELY NOT!!!! Yes, the majority of crimes in our town is committed by blacks but it AIN'T because of poverty; it's because THEY WANT TO COMMIT A CRIME!! We have poor whites as well and the majority of those do not feel they have the right to steal what belongs to others, kill someone over drugs or a stupid girl, or whatever else one wants to use as an excuse.

Obama will do nothing to help those that feel entitled and look to Obama as just a bigger free paycheck. You don't help anyone by giving them free handouts. If they don't want an educate, won't help themselves, and continue to feel ENTITLED to MY money, Obama certainly won't change that by encouraging laziness and lack of worth ethics.

Making the middle class dependent on the government is in no way helping them; if anything, Obama will be the end to the middle class as we know it today.
stop defending the rich
Either you are rich or a fool..Do you actually think the rich are defending us the way you are defending them?  We need to take care of the people who carry America on their backs, the middle class.  The rich could not care less about us.  They dont even know the workings of every day life.  I have an extremely well off friend..he does not use credit cards..pays with cash..told me I should just pay with cash for my new Jeep that I bought a few years ago instead of monthly payments..yeah, right, LOL..thanks for the advice...moon beam..he never even used an ATM..thinks being rich is justified cause they can show us Renoir paintings (as when Bellagio had Steve Wynns paintings on show), they can show the little people the beauty of life..Oh geez..the rich do not even realize that the middle class exists..other than to work at their companies and factories, so they can stay rich.
Middle class
Didn't McCain define "middle class" as anyone with $5 million???  How realistic is that?  I don't personally have, nor do I know anyone, who has $5 million. The "real" middle class is screwed with either of these clowns.
If the new middle class is $120,000 (sm)

Then my income will just push us into that bracket.  I wonder if that will negate my entire income?  If so, I guess we may be better off if I just quit? Right now I work because I can't afford to quit.  I won't be able to afford it then either so what will I do?  I wonder how many others will be in my situation? 


FYI, we live in a small older home that we are trying to pay off so that when our two children are college-age, maybe we can afford it. We don't live extravagently by any means.  What will happen to people like us?


Middle class? sm
If Obama is elected, that is something that our children's children will be reading about in a history book. It is fast disappearing and will be completely gone if Obama takes office.
A New Way To Tax the Middle Class

Just call it something besides a tax.


Who Pays for Cap and Trade?


Hint: They were promised a tax cut during the Obama campaign.Article


Cap and trade is the tax that dare not speak its name, and Democrats are hoping in particular that no one notices who would pay for their climate ambitions. With President Obama depending on vast new carbon revenues in his budget and Congress promising a bill by May, perhaps Americans would like to know the deeply unequal ways that climate costs would be distributed across regions and income groups.


Politicians love cap and trade because they can claim to be taxing "polluters," not workers. Hardly. Once the government creates a scarce new commodity -- in this case the right to emit carbon -- and then mandates that businesses buy it, the costs would inevitably be passed on to all consumers in the form of higher prices. Stating the obvious, Peter Orszag -- now Mr. Obama's budget director -- told Congress last year that "Those price increases are essential to the success of a cap-and-trade program."


Hit hardest would be the "95% of working families" Mr. Obama keeps mentioning, usually omitting that his no-new-taxes pledge comes with the caveat "unless you use energy." Putting a price on carbon is regressive by definition because poor and middle-income households spend more of their paychecks on things like gas to drive to work, groceries or home heating.


The Congressional Budget Office -- Mr. Orszag's former roost -- estimates that the price hikes from a 15% cut in emissions would cost the average household in the bottom-income quintile about 3.3% of its after-tax income every year. That's about $680, not including the costs of reduced employment and output. The three middle quintiles would see their paychecks cut between $880 and $1,500, or 2.9% to 2.7% of income. The rich would pay 1.7%. Cap and trade is the ideal policy for every Beltway analyst who thinks the tax code is too progressive (all five of them).


But the greatest inequities are geographic and would be imposed on the parts of the U.S. that rely most on manufacturing or fossil fuels -- particularly coal, which generates most power in the Midwest, Southern and Plains states. It's no coincidence that the liberals most invested in cap and trade -- Barbara Boxer, Henry Waxman, Ed Markey -- come from California or the Northeast.


Coal provides more than half of U.S. electricity, and 25 states get more than 50% of their electricity from conventional coal-fired generation. In Ohio, it totals 86%, according to the Energy Information Administration. Ratepayers in Indiana (94%), Missouri (85%), New Mexico (80%), Pennsylvania (56%), West Virginia (98%) and Wyoming (95%) are going to get soaked.


Another way to think about it is in terms of per capita greenhouse-gas emissions. California is the No. 2 carbon emitter in the country but also has a large economy and population. So the average Californian only had a carbon footprint of about 12 tons of CO2-equivalent in 2005, according to the World Resource Institute's Climate Analysis Indicators, which integrates all government data. The situation is very different in Wyoming and North Dakota -- paging Senators Mike Enzi and Kent Conrad -- where every person was responsible for 154 and 95 tons, respectively. See the nearby chart for cap and trade's biggest state winners and losers.


Democrats say they'll allow some of this ocean of new cap-and-trade revenue to trickle back down to the public. In his budget, Mr. Obama wants to recycle $525 billion through the "making work pay" tax credit that goes to many people who don't pay income taxes. But $400 for individuals and $800 for families still doesn't offset carbon's income raid, especially in states with higher carbon use.


All the more so because the Administration is lowballing its cap-and-trade tax estimates. Its stated goal is to reduce emissions 14% below 2005 levels by 2020, which assuming that four-fifths of emissions are covered (excluding agriculture, for instance), works out to about $13 or $14 per ton of CO2. When CBO scored a similar bill last year, it expected prices to start at $23 and rise to $44 by 2018. CBO also projected the total value of the allowances at $902 billion over the first decade, which is some $256 billion more than the Administration's estimate.


We asked the White House budget office for the assumptions behind its revenue estimates, but a spokesman said the Administration doesn't have a formal proposal and will work with Congress and "stakeholders" to shape one. We were also pointed to recent comments by Mr. Orszag that he was "sure there will be enough there to finance the things that we have identified" and maybe "additional money" too. In other words, Mr. Obama expects a much larger tax increase than even he is willing to admit.


Those "stakeholders" are going to need some very large bribes, starting with the regions that stand to lose the most. Led by Michigan's Debbie Stabenow, 15 Senate Democrats have already formed a "gang" demanding that "consumers and workers in all regions of the U.S. are protected from undue hardship." In practice, this would mean corporate welfare for carbon-heavy businesses.


And of course Congress is its own "stakeholder." An economy-wide tax under the cover of saving the environment is the best political moneymaker since the income tax. Obama officials are already telling the press, sotto voce, that climate revenues might fund universal health care and other new social spending. No doubt they would, and when they did Mr. Obama's cap-and-trade rebates would become even smaller.


Cap and trade, in other words, is a scheme to redistribute income and wealth -- but in a very curious way. It takes from the working class and gives to the affluent; takes from Miami, Ohio, and gives to Miami, Florida; and takes from an industrial America that is already struggling and gives to rich Silicon Valley and Wall Street "green tech" investors who know how to leverage the political class.


Sad he uses the working class as an excuse
This man has abused/used the working class/middle-class name to climb the backs of those hardworking people who actually are so sick and tired that they are willing to fall for anything.

Only he has climbed their backs up the ladder to socialism. Looking at his early years, the only people he wanted to help and still ONLY want to help are the minority. And by duping some middle-class families into voting for him, he will take their hard earned money and increase the welfare payroll.

It is so disgusting. Flame all you want!!!!
She actually grew up middle class
and made her own money. Then married Sir Rothschild. Why couldn't I have found a guy like that?!?
The middle class has already all but disappeared under...sm
republican rule. Based on earnings, we have a huge lower class, a very small middle class, and a tiny upper class that makes over 90% of the income in the US.
The middle class needs to realize

that John McCain's economic plan is designed from the ground up to raise incomes and create jobs for Americans - especially middle-class Americans - and get our economy moving again. It is in sharp contrast to Barack Obama's plan, which does not treat the middle class well and which will reduce jobs rather than create them.


"The McCain tax plan will allow middle-class Americans to keep more of what they earn than the Obama tax plan. McCain will increase the exemption for children from $3,500 to $7,000 per child, and he will provide a refundable health care tax credit of $5,000 for every family. What does this mean for middle-class families? Consider a married couple, one of whom works, earning $55,000 plus employer-paid health insurance of $8,000, and who rent their home and have two young children. Under McCain's plan, this family would receive a tax refund of $2,087 for health care and other things. Under Obama's plan, including his proposed worker's credit, this same family would not get any tax refund; in fact, they will have to pay taxes of $1,213. That's a $3,300 advantage for that family with McCain's plan compared with Obama's.


McCain's plan also provides incentives for firms to hire more workers and to pay them more. He will stop penalizing American firms when they create jobs in America rather than overseas. The U.S. tax code now levies a tax of 35 percent on American firms, the second highest in the world. McCain would reduce the tax to 25 percent, an important reason why his plan creates more jobs than Obama's. Another reason is that McCain will not raise the tax on small businesses, as Obama's plan does. Under Obama's plan, the top marginal income tax rate, which many small businesses pay, will rise to over 50 percent, including his proposed 5 percent increase in the statutory rate, 3 percent for Medicare, 3 percent for Social Security, and 4 percent from the phase out of exemptions.


McCain's economic plan is comprehensive and helps the middle class in many other ways. By promoting domestic energy production, including nuclear power and exploration and production of oil and gas - which Obama has opposed - McCain will reduce the price of gasoline, electricity and heating oil. By promoting free-trade agreements, he will reduce taxes on job-creating exports and reduce the prices that middle- and lower-income families pay for food and clothing. In contrast, Sen. Obama opposes good trade agreements - voting against the Colombia free-trade agreement - that would create jobs in America."


Does the middle class ever get a break?

All I heard during Barrack Obama's campaign was how he was going to look out for the middle class and how Bush and McCain would do nothing more than make the rich richer.  Well, every time I turn on the news, I cringe.  All I see are crooks.  CEO crooks, rich crooks, and political crooks.  These crooks are getting rich off of taxpayers and we are getting nothing in return.  The initial bailout has done nothing.  The stock market is still extremely low.  The only good thing I've heard of late is that gas is below 2 dollars a gallon right now.  Now GM wants a bailout.  Their CEOs flying in on private jets and asking for a handout.  I truly do not want to get them one because I know it won't change anything.  However, it breaks my heart to think of the millions of people who will truly suffer from this....including my mother.


Now President-elect Obama still claims to be out there for the middle class, but I just don't see it.  His plans will do nothing more than to help the lower class.  The rich will survive as they are rich, but it will be the middle class who again takes the hit.  The more TV I watch, the more I see Obama as nothing more than a puppet of his political party. 


My husband is so stressed out about this economy and his business that he is losing sleep at night.  He had to fire someone yesterday to save costs which means he will have to work a lot more hours to cover for the person he had to let go which will add more stress and little to no downtime for him.  Not to mention the poor bloke he had to fire right before the holidays. 


I'm sitting here at my desk thinking about our monthly house payment and our two kids and I wonder how we will make it if my husband's boss decides to close his store.  Will he send him to another store or will he just let him go?  How will he find another job in this economy that would make enough money to pay our house payment?  What will happen to my mom if GM gets rid of legacy expenses and she loses my dad's pension and her health benefits.  What happens to my brother when his factory goes under and he is left with three kids and a wife to support? 


Is anyone else literally sick to their stomach about all of this?  I feel like I could just hurl and then I turn TV on and see all these crooks and I just want to scream.  I've tried to stay positive and I've tried to give Obama the benefit of the doubt but his pal Bill Clinton is the one who started the housing crisis by forcing bad loans to be given and Obama has done nothing but surround himself with Clintons and I just can't shake the feeling that we won't rebound from this......at least not for a very very long time.


CLASS - that's rich!!! ROFL - LOL -

The rich people are ticked, and many of the working
people are too uninformed to realize Bush hurt them & Obama is trying to help them... sigh....
Dems to focus on middle class..sm
Pelosi, Hoyer Say Their Focus Will Be on Helping Middle Class

Monday, November 20, 2006
Associated Press

WASHINGTON — House Speaker-elect Nancy Pelosi said Monday her new Democratic majority will extend a hand to Republicans in moving the agenda of relieving the middle-class squeeze. She said restoring the military draft will not be part of that agenda when Democrats take over the House in January.

Pelosi, following a strategy meeting with the next House majority leader, Steny Hoyer, D-Md., said she will meet with incoming House Minority Leader John Boehner and we'll find our common ground for the American people.

The principle of civility and respect for minority participation in this House is something we promised the American people. It's the right thing to do, she said.

Pelosi and Hoyer repeated that in the first 100 legislative hours of the new Congress that convenes in January, they will try to pass bills that directly affect the pocketbooks of working-class and middle-class people, including raising the minimum wage, cutting interest rates for student loans and allowing the Medicare program to negotiate lower drug prices.

Other top priorities for January are lobbying reform, implementing the recommendations of the 9/11 Commission and rolling back subsidies to the oil industry.

Pelosi said restoring the draft will not be on that list and was not something she supported.

The speaker and I discussed scheduling and it did not include that, Hoyer added.

Incoming Ways and Means Committee Chairman Charlie Rangel, D-N.Y., caused a stir by repeating a long-held position that a draft is the best way to ensure that all levels of society are represented in the military. Besides Rangel, there is almost no support in Congress for restoring the draft.

It's not about a draft, it's about shared sacrifice in this country, Pelosi said. She said Rangel is a strong voice for social justice in our country and his support for the draft was a way to make a point.

And do you know why the cost of living for the middle class has gone down...?
because we are being taxed to death. The amount of our income off the top for taxes has increased over all those years. More programs to help the "poor," some of which have moved people from what used to be middle class to the "poor class" to get on some of those social programs...which is never a good thing...and meanwhile the working middle class continues to get the tax shaft. Yeah, we are being had...by those who want to spend, tax, spend, tax, spend....
Obama's tax cut plan for middle class
http://www.barackobama.com/issues/economy/#tax-relief
Provide Middle Class Americans Tax Relief
Obama will cut income taxes by $1,000 for working families to offset the payroll tax they pay.
• Provide a Tax Cut for Working Families: Obama will restore fairness to the tax code and provide 150 million workers the tax relief they need. Obama will create a new "Making Work Pay" tax credit of up to $500 per person, or $1,000 per working family. The "Making Work Pay" tax credit will completely eliminate income taxes for 10 million Americans.
• Eliminate Income Taxes for Seniors Making Less than $50,000: Barack Obama will eliminate all income taxation of seniors making less than $50,000 per year. This proposal will eliminate income taxes for 7 million seniors and provide these seniors with an average savings of $1,400 each year. Under the Obama plan, 27 million American seniors will also not need to file an income tax return.
• Simplify Tax Filings for Middle Class Americans: Obama will dramatically simplify tax filings so that millions of Americans will be able to do their taxes in less than five minutes. Obama will ensure that the IRS uses the information it already gets from banks and employers to give taxpayers the option of pre-filled tax forms to verify, sign and return. Experts estimate that the Obama proposal will save Americans up to 200 million total hours of work and aggravation and up to $2 billion in tax preparer fees.

Well I guess the middle class who can't scrape
enough together to feed their kids, or pay their bills don't really have a good sense of humor right now - imagine that.

IMO it was just another insensitive remark he has made, trying to be the comedian.
He plans to give the middle class (that would be US)
Don't know about you, but I just can't pay any more taxes without going under financially. (Unless someone invents a vaccine that makes it possible to survive without having to EAT.)
Big corporations (I'm not talking about SMALL businesses, here... I said 'BIG'), aren't paying their fair share & pulling their weight tax-wise. Compounding that is the fact that they currently are actually getting incentives for sending work offshore. Why else do you think the LARGEST MT companies are the ones that offshore? In addition to paying p1ss-ant wages to us peons, they're getting financial incentives to do so.
There are also too many loopholes in labor laws that the big co's have going for them. How else would it be possible to tell a U.S. MT that they cannot work overtime, yet that MT has to work 2-6 hrs. over OT per DAY, just to make the 'minimum' line count and keep her health insurance. All withOUT getting paid for said overtime.
With McCain in office, there is little hope that any of that will improve. The fact that Obama is from a younger generation, with newer ideas, at least gives me a glimmer of HOPE, and right now hope means a lot to me, and alot of other people in the US. Will he get some things wrong? Undoubtedly. No one has ever had a 'perfect Presidency'. But will he get some things RIGHT? Absolutely. He will base a lot of his military decisions on TODAY's world situation, not the one that existed in 1942, or 1969.
I don't agree with EVERYthing Obama says (but then again, I never agree with everything ANYone says.) But I think that for this particular time in our country's and the world's history, we stand a better chance of improving the way things are with some new blood in the White House, NOT the same-ol', same-ol'.


Why wasn't he worried about us in the middle class...
when first McCain and then the Bush admin warned about fannie/freddie and that they needed to be reeled in? Where was all that concern for us then, when it realy mattered??
I hope you are right, that someone is standing up for the middle class (sm)
But I think what is more likely to happen is that we will ALL be taxed more and we will ALL have less money and it will be spread throughout the world. What you see as wealth and middle class will no longer be the same. Wealth will be being able to afford to feed your family. The jobs will go overseas alright, even more so than they are now. I wish I believed that you are right. That would be great! Unfortunately, I think it is a dream, far from the reality of the nightmare that is coming.
Walking up the backs of the middle-class to
xx
Just proof that Obama really isn't out for the middle class.

He just wants our vote and he figured this would be the way to get it.  To promise to not tax us middle class folks.  I don't believe he intends to keep his promise.  He may at first but the bottom line is that all the government spending of his and the 3 trillion dollars he plans to spend....where he is going to get that money?  He is going to get it from us and that includes the middle class. 


All the companies who get tax hikes will pass that tax onto us as well by jacking up prices of products and services so we the consumers pay for that tax hike.  Then Obama will have to raise taxes on the middle class as well to cover his government spending.  It is common sense people.  Look at his record.  He has consistently wanted to raise taxes and that includes on us middle class folks he is all of sudden so interested in helping out since he is up for election.  Give me a break.  I see through the lies and false promises.  That isn't change.  That is Washington elitists at their norm.


I see the new middle class has dropped from 250,000 to 120,000 and could be lower.

Very, very contradicting to me.  Obama changing a lot of what he said lately and it gets worse.  He wants us to vote early and take off from work Nov. 4th to help him win.  Fox news also reports Obama and his campaign lays out plans to kill expectations after win because of concerns that many supporters are now harboring unrealistic hopes of what can be achieved.  What the heck?  Now he says, "it will be hard to achieve goals and will take time."  He says one thing and then says another.  I want to know where these unauthorized credit cards came from for his campaign.  I want to see his birth certificate that he cannot cough up and there is a petition out and he is under investigation if he was truly born in the good ole USA.  Call your State Department and they will tell you there is an investigation and they trying to get this resolved before Nov. 4th.  So much uncertainty.   Hope I do not offend anyone, but just like a bumper sticker I read


I'll keep my God, my freedom, my guns, and my money, you can keep THE CHANGE.  VOTE FOR MCCAIN/PALIN.


What tax cuts is Barack going to give middle class?
facts to back it up. We are most definitely middle class and in the last 4 years, I made more money as an IC but didn't have to pay in at year end, for the first time in YEARS. We also got a higher child credit, etc. Or maybe I should ask what you consider middle class, but I am quite sure my measly salary doesn't qualify as anything but and I sure as heck am not in the upper 10%. The proof is in the pudding for me, and not having to pay taxes when I always had before, despite having made more money as an IC, is tasty pudding to me. I can't complain on that particular point.

I've compared both Obama's and McCain's tax proposals, and I sure didn't see a lot of give for middle class in either so apparently you are privy to some information that I am not. Can you show me where I can find that? IMO, they are both ignoring the middle class and the middle class is most of America.
I am middle class, but I dont "buy" Obama's
nm
Actually, the black middle class is the fasted growing population, but
x
I didn't realize middle class meant uneducated......
xx
Why all this defense of the poor downtrodden rich?
You said:
Yes, the rich get the bulk of tax cuts, that's because THEY pay most of the taxes.

I say:
That's because they make most of the MONEY. That's perfectly right. And yes they pay a higher rate which is also perfectly right because they are not paying taxes on WAGES. Capital gains and investment income - i.e. money that was not earned by hard labor - SHOULD be taxed at a higher rate. We know that if we win 20 grand in the lottery the government is going to take up to half of it, right? - we expect that. We expect free money to be taxed at a higher rate than wage income. So why are you fretting about free money for the rich being taxed at a higher rate also?

As far as tax revenues being higher now, the answer to that is ridiculously simple - many more people soared into higher tax brackets during the boom years of the Clinton administration and their new wealth is now generating more free money which then gets taxed and flows into the revenue coffers. Now are you glad about this or not? You can't say both the poor rich are being abused by high tax rates! and at the same time parade around praising Bush for his financial saavy because look, the revenues are overflowing! That's kind of schizophrenic. And besides the glow of joy is going to have to fade a bit when you consider that no matter how high revenues are, the exorbitant and wasteful spending of this administration has caused such huge deficits that your grandchildren will still not be seeing any benefit from those increased revenues.

And in addition, there are MORE people in general now, so of course tax revenues will rise with a rise in population. BushCo uses the same old tired tactic of braying about more people own homes now than ever before in the history of the country! Well duh. That's because there are more PEOPLE. More people = more total homes owned. They aren't talking percentage of the population owing their own homes. Instead they try to take credit for a simple total number that they had nothing to do with increasing.

Have to watch these guys - they know how to spin a statistic, but spin is all it is. Too bad it keeps right on fooling the worshippers.
Taking from the poor, giving to the rich
US House of Representatives approves $50 billion in social cuts
By Joseph Kay
19 November 2005


In the early hours of Friday morning, the House of Representatives
passed a budget reconciliation bill that includes cuts of nearly $50
billion over five years, primarily in social programs for the poor.
At the same time, Congress is considering extending tax cuts that
overwhelmingly benefit the wealthy in the amount of $60 billion-$70
billion over the same period.

The budget reconciliation bill modifies requirements for mandatory
spending programs, in particular, entitlement programs such as
Medicaid, Social Security, Food Stamps and Medicare. Unlike the rest
of government outlays, known as discretionary spending, which are
allocated each year in appropriation bills, spending for these
mandatory programs is determined by legal requirements. If the
reconciliation bill is signed into law, it will mark the first time
since 1997 that entitlement programs have been slashed.

The House passed the bill 217-215 after Republican leaders kept the
vote open 25 minutes to drum up sufficient support. It will now go
to a House-Senate conference committee, where negotiators from the
two chambers will work out a compromise between the House bill and a
Senate bill passed earlier this month.

The Senate version includes cuts amounting to $35 billion over five
years. While leaving out some of the most egregious cuts in the
House version, the Senate bill includes one major provision left out
by the House: the opening up of the Alaskan Arctic National Wildlife
Refuge (ANWR) for oil exploration.

The compromise will then be subject to a final vote in both chambers
before going to President Bush to be signed into law.

Major cuts in the House bill include:

* Cutting Medicaid spending by $11.8 billion. The bill would place
new restrictions on the ability of elderly people to transfer assets
to relatives so as to become eligible for Medicaid, and would allow
states to charge higher premiums and co-payments for emergency room
visits and some drugs. It would give states greater discretion to
cut services for low-income recipients who earn more than the
poverty level, including such services as eye and ear care.

* A $14.3 billion reduction in spending on financial assistance for
college students. The bill repeals a previous 6.8 percent cap on
interest rates for federal student loans, increasing it to 8.25
percent. One estimate calculates that this would lead to an increase
of $5,800 in payments for a college student graduating with a debt
load of $17,500. The bill includes other increases in taxes and
interest on a variety of loans, as well as a provision to reduce
subsidies to lenders.

* Cuts in the Food Stamp program totaling $700 million. The bill
would end a provision that automatically enrolls welfare recipients
in Food Stamps, denying eligibility to approximately 165,000 people,
mainly among the working poor. It would deny Food Stamps to
approximately 70,000 legal immigrants by extending the waiting
period for eligibility from five to seven years. Since eligibility
for Food Stamps automatically gives children access to free school
lunches, thousands of students may be stripped of this benefit. This
cut will worsen an already growing problem of hunger in the US. An
article in the Boston Globe of October 29 noted, The number of
people who are hungry because they cannot afford to buy enough food
rose to 38.2 million in 2004, an increase of 7 million in five
years. The number represents nearly 12 percent of US households.

* Other measures include nearly $5 billion in cuts associated with
child support enforcement; $577 million in cuts for child welfare
programs; a reduction of $732 million in social security income
payments, including payments to some disabled people; and more
stringent work requirements for welfare eligibility.

House passage of these draconian measures demonstrates the
determination of the ruling elite to continue its assault on social
programs. Hurricane Katrina, which laid bare the persistence of
poverty and the growth of social inequality, as well as the
devastating consequences of decades of neglect of the social
infrastructure, is being used as an excuse to accelerate the very
policies that compounded the disaster.

The position of the Bush administration and the Republican-
controlled Congress is that the tens of billions appropriated for
immediate hurricane relief and reconstruction in New Orleans and
other Gulf Coast areas must be offset by a more determined assault
on entitlement programs for working people and the poor. At the same
time, there is to be no retreat in providing tax windfalls for big
business and the rich.

This was spelled out in a summary of an earlier version of the bill
published by the House Budget Committee, which stated that the bill
was intended to provide a down-payment toward hurricane recovery
and reconstruction costs and begin a longer-term effort at slowing
the growth of entitlement spending and stimulate reform of
entitlement programs, many of which are outdated, inefficient, and
excessively costly.

Speaking before the right-wing think tank, the Heritage Foundation,
Tom DeLay, the former House majority leader who was forced to step
down after being indicted on corruption charges, made clear that the
budget was intended to spearhead a permanent rollback of social
programs. He said the budget would not only provide the nation
immediate fiscal relief, but also institute permanent reforms of the
way our government spends money and solves problems.

Last month, Bush urged Republican congressmen to push the envelope
when it comes to cutting spending. On Friday, he welcomed the House
bill and called for Congress to quickly pass a final version for him
to sign into law.

The ultimate bill as agreed by the conference committee will likely
include many of the cuts in the House bill. Senate leaders,
moreover, have vowed to reject any bill that does not include the
opening up of the ANWR, which has been a major goal of the energy
industry and the Bush administration.

At the same time that Congress is negotiating these cuts in social
spending, it is preparing the passage of a separate tax cut
reconciliation bill. The two bills were deliberately separated in an
effort to obscure the connection between tax cuts for the wealthy
and cuts in social programs.

Early on Friday, the Senate passed a bill that would cut taxes by
$60 billion over five years. This includes $30 billion in cuts
resulting from an extension in exemptions to the alternative minimum
tax. It also includes $7 billion in tax cuts for corporations as
part of Bush's so-called Gulf Opportunity Zone—a scheme to use the
hurricane as an opportunity to give handouts to businesses. The
Senate rejected any windfall tax on record oil company profits;
however, it did include an accounting rule change that is expected
to increase taxes for oil companies by about $4.3 billion over five
years.

The House is considering a companion bill. However, its version
would focus on extending tax cuts on dividends and capital gains
that are not due to expire until 2008. These taxes are paid
overwhelmingly by the wealthy. Once the House version is passed, the
two bills will go to a conference committee. Bush has vowed to veto
any bill that includes the accounting change for oil companies.

There is some nervousness within the political establishment over
the budget process. House Republican leaders were forced to delay
their budget bill for a week as they sought to win enough support
within their own party to push the bill through, and the final
version slightly pared down some of the cuts in Food Stamps and
other programs.

The two measures—the one cutting social programs for the poor, and
the other providing tax cuts for the rich—constitute such a blatant
redistribution of wealth from the bottom to the top that several
Republicans have opposed the measures. Congressional elections are
only a year away, and the mounting popular opposition to the Bush
administration has caused Republican representatives to fear losing
their seats.

On Thursday, the House voted down the appropriations bill for the
departments of Labor, Education and Health and Human Services, after
the defection of a number of Republicans. The bill, which includes
cuts in various pet projects for representatives as well as in
social programs such as rural health care, may have to be modified
or attached to the defense appropriations bill in order to push it
through.

In spite of this nervousness, the consensus within the ruling elite
is that social programs must be cut one way or another. Democratic
opposition to the size of the current cuts notwithstanding, both
parties agree on this basic policy, which has been ongoing for more
than a quarter century.

The Democrats are themselves proposing no significant measures—
whether for jobs, housing, health care or education—to deal with the
acute social crisis exposed by the Hurricane Katrina disaster,
underscoring their abandonment of any policy of social reform.

The current budget reconciliation process is in many ways a
continuation and deepening of cuts initiated by the Clinton
administration, which ended welfare as a federal entitlement. The
1996 budget act, moreover, permanently barred legal immigrants from
receiving Food Stamps. In 2001, the Bush administration modified
this provision to allow legal immigrants to receive Food Stamps
after a five-year waiting period. The House is now proposing to
extend the waiting period to seven years.

The bulk of the tax cuts for the wealthy enacted under Bush were
voted in with the support of the Democratic Party leadership, while
at the state level Democratic governors are overseeing massive cuts
in Medicaid and education programs.

The new budget bill places in sharp relief the fact that the entire
political system is an instrument of big business, dedicated to
increasing the wealth of a financial aristocracy at the expense of
the working class. It is one more _expression of the crisis and rot
of the profit system.


Post is about tax burden of rich, poor,
I will not concede your suggestion that there was NO surplus under Clinton. If the amount of in question, so be it, even though I have seen that figure in multiple sources and have provided the link to them repeatedly. Fact is that GW inherited a surplus in the hundreds of millions. Even if he started from zero (which he did not), he still created a deficit of $400 billion, so no matter how diligently you try to suggest that there was no surplus under BC (a delusional notion), fact remains that the public has every right to compare JM (who voted with Bush 90% of the time) and GW when it comes to lack of fiscal responsibility. Observations about relationship between tax burden and distribution of wealth are valid economic principles and cannot be knocked out by the spin machine.
Also, because we are white middle class and have a house, we are putting kids through college, ever
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10% across-the-board. Rich or poor. Big company or small.
X
Her point is that Obama voted repeatedly against tax breaks for the middle class and suddenly he'

the middle class person's best friend!  Funny how now he wants to help us, when each time he had the opportunity to, he voted against it. 


is the the starting point or the end point for the middle class?
x
Rich or poor, cheaters are cheaters. And closing
I hope he not only makes the big rich companies FINALLY pay their fair share of the taxes, I also hope they have to pay through the nose for selling out American workers.

The President's speech made my day!
Poor, poor MT. She can't pick a fight with anyone on her own board tonight and must come here to

Poor Poor Rush. Hey, how is AIR AMERICA
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Actually I believe in working hard and working
Are you really that bitter?  I'll say a prayer for you.
Many rich are rich because they too are hard
xx
Poor, poor Obama......sm
and I bet you don't think that huge press conference, surrounded by the adoring media masses, pandering to poor me (O) being taken advantage of....you don't believe that was political grandstanding?


Tsk tsk.






Not that she needs defending . . . sm

All of you haters have the nerve to call JTBB hateful?  Are you kidding or extremely delusional?  Don't bother -- I already know the answer to that one.  First of all, just look at your comments.  Very scary stuff, i must say, and extremely immature.  Anybody with a brain can read the comments on this board and know who is hate-filled and it sure ain't JTBB.  Should I run through the list of those on your hate list?  Let's see:  Democrats, homosexuals, non-Christians, anyone not American, your own President and ANYONE who has a different opinion than yours.  When I read comments like these, I picture a crazed mob with pitchforks in hand out for blood!  Pretty picture, huh?


As for the comment about JTBB going to the Faith board, I have read some of the very adult discussions she has had there, and they are nothing but thought-provoking, backed by historical or theological facts, and have a genuine curiosity about what Christians believe and is NEVER degrading, condescending or goading in any way, and usually the posters she engages there are likewise adult and willing to have an honest discourse without attacking or being as hateful as you people here. 


 "First they laughed at us...and then they died."  (Hope your're proud of this very threatening comment; you should really seek some help).


"JTBB is the most bigoted voice on here."  (Guess you don't listen to yourself much, do you?)


". . .no problem going to the Faith board in the hopes of goading someone into a fight."


I find most of the anger and and outright hatred expressed on this forum extremely distasteful and very disturbing and it makes me ashamed to share the same industry with people like you, as I consider the medical field to usually require a compassionate type of personality, and I see none of that here.


 


 


 


 


There is no defending this action. SM
But what makes you think this guy is a conservative?  Did he say that. I read this and I don't see him making a statement.   Your signs don't even begin to measure up to mine.  I would have thought the cesspool DU could have come up with better than that.
I am not necessarily defending them.
I am trying to make people have a broader view of them.  Gadfly seemed to be headed in that direction, but, of course, that was too much for you to bear. One mind, I know the drill.  Hateful?  Not at all.  Truth, gt. It's called truth.  It's my truth and I am sticking to it.  More might be truthful with you if they weren't afraid of getting their leg chewed off to the knee.  You won't argue with me, because you can't.  You don't operate on logic, you operate on emotion.  Kill the messenger was invented as a slogan exactly for people like you.  If you move outside your comfort zone, you attack the messenger, cut them off at the knees, with an airy 'this just isn't worth discussing' or some such.  Surely, I am not the first to have pointed this out to you.  I won't be the last either.  I have had my fill.  My expectations were far too high on finding this board.  I will move on along, before you revoke my privileges.  As far as racism, I posted many excellent examples of it up at the top of the board, not that you would read it. I can imagine that you are the type who never reads posts, only the headings, or at the very least a line or two, and then just responds out of sheer emotion.  One can do that on chat boards.  How you get away with it in life,  I have an idea.  I won't say it here though, lest you endanger yourself with a stroke at hearing the truth. 
Geez. Of course I would be defending her....
her wealth has NOTHING to do with it. She is a first-time offender. You hate her because she is rich, that's obvious. I don't care how much money she has or does not have. She is a first offender. She should be treated like any other first offender. Barack Obama AND John McCain are for rehab, not incarceration, for first-time offenders. Neither of them tie it to wealth. Barack Obama is a millionaire. What if we were talking about Michelle Obama instead of Cindy McCain? You would be screaming at the top of your lungs to defend Michelle Obama and guess what...SO WOULD I. Even though I don't want her husband to be President and even though they are RICH. Your bias is showing.
defending these thugs? Wow,
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Defending Obama

He does not really need defending.  He is out there for all to see.  There will always be a fringe element passing along conspiracy theories and innuendo -- that's what the Atwaters of the world depend on.  The sensible majority has spoken and Obama was elected. I have noticed that traffic at this site has dropped drastically since the neocons were so soundly trounced.  I would expect that the few remaining will eventually run out of gas as Obama continues to forge ahead with his principled approach to the country's problems. Future's so bright I have to wear shades.  Obama and Michelle interviewed by Barbara Walters tonight - a happy pre-Thanksgiving treat.


 


P.S. Thank you for defending our country and

keeping us free.


I'm not defending Republicans. sm
If Bush were still President, they would sign the bill. Both sides are bunch of rats to me.
None of you are doing a good job in defending
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