Despite the fact that this has been answered over and over,
Posted By: It has been addressed yet again. nm on 2008-10-21
In Reply to: Good question.-and it ISNT fair. Notice how Obama - supporters dont even answer? nm
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Yes, I know, but the fact remains my question has still not been answered. SM
How is it that people feel they can make these kind of egregious statements about someone so effortlessly and not support those statements with facts. Pardon me if I am a little insistent that credible proof be provided that Laura Bush was drunk when she was involved in the accident that killed her friend.
The fact that an article was written does not make it fact. I hope you know that. nm
.
I answered you below -
I've got more important things to do than to continue this argument you want to have. You are wrong!
Thanks to you who have answered...
I may be a dem to the core, but I do appreciate your input.
I answered this below......sm
When you can come up with something different, let me know.
You never answered my question.
I asked how many troops our ally Israel sent to Iraq. I would truly like to know. It might help to change my mind regarding their commitment to being our ally.
Answered in all honesty...
the entire thread was about the Plame case and whether or not she was covert. I posted the court document where the media outlets (CBS, ABC, NBC, CNN, etc) filed to try to stop the judge from compelling the reporters to give their sources (their aim was to protect whistle-blowers, which is definitely not a bad thing). In that brief it was stated: "We do not believe a crime was committed as she was not covert at the time of the incident." CBS acknowledged that they believed that Plame was not covert...supported by the fact that she was openly working at a desk job in the CIA offices and had been for some time. I thought it was hypocritical of CBS to now bring Plame on and in effect say they believe that she was covert. Then some, not all, of the usual posters piled on questioning the integrity of the court and how decisions can be influenced...when it really had nothing to do with the court, but with the filed brief. CBS et AL actually lost the case. If they had won it, there would have been no Libby prosecution. That is what makes what the liberals posted that much harder to understand. It just seemed like just because a conservative posted it, it could not possibly have any merit, and then when they had to admit it did have merit, suddenly the court had no integrity.
Honest answer.
First of all, I don't see that she answered the question. nm
.
Asked and answered...
...ad nauseam! 
He has answered the questions
by what authority do you determine he has not answered the questions truthfully?
You just answered your own question
about "what critism" when you said Missouri MT said something and then said she didn't say it.
You answered your own question.
My assessment was in line with "most of the world," who laid responsibility for the massacre squarely at the feet of the Israelis, where it belonged, especially since the Shaba and Shatilla refugee camps were under the control of the IDF, not the Lebanese Phalangists, whom the IDF gave access to the refugees in the camps. Do not try to rewrite history that I unfortunately was around to experience directly, at least in its aftermath some 16 days later.
I have not forgotten about the assassination of Bachir Gemayel (Phalangist leader and president-elect, who never took office, BTW) just 2 days before the massacre and the history of hatred between the Phalangists and the Palestinians. If I was aware of it as a young, naïve, ill-informed American, it is only logical that the Israelis were aware of it too and had drawn the conclusion that giving access to the Phalangists was the perfect opportunity for them to commit massacre by proxy, which adds the specter of cowardice to the already atrocious and horrendous act and its outcome.
Trying to belittle me will not effectively disguise your not-so-artful attempt to dodge direct discussion of ISREAL'S invasion of Lebanon, the death of 3000 women, children and elders in the camps and another 30,000 Lebanese they killed during that campaign. So, no, it is pretty easy to distinguish between Israelis, the killers and the Lebanese, the dead guys.
I am not in the habit of giving direct answers to dirt, filth and blatant lies such as yours. Your preposterous notion that Arabs didn't give a flip about the massacre of 3000 Arabs is beyond absurd and speaks for itself, but comes as no surprise from a Zionist who would actually try to gain credibility by discounting 2550 corpses of women, children and elders by disputing fatality figures. The only odd thing here is that your delusions would allow you to believe that anyone in their right mind would accept this callous dismissal as the basis of a credible statement. Evidence of the ice water that flows through you veins can be easily surmised from your bigoted and hateful statement blaming the "Pakistanis" (I am guessing you really meant Palestinians) for somehow inviting the slaughter of the Shaba and Shatila refugees. Yeah, right.
Read my lips. The IDF WAS IN CONTROL of those camps. It was their responsibility to keep them secure. It also would not be the first time they failed to live up to Geneva Convention war conduct imperatives and instead, commit horrendous war crimes. They were the invaders, after all, and Lebanon, the invaded. This seems to be a pervasive affliction of yours, not being able to distinguish between the occupiers and occupied, the invaders and the invaded, the killers and the dead.
My 3000 dead figure is extracted from Sabra and Shatila: Inquiry into a Massacre, penned by ISRAELI journalist Amnon Kapeliouk in June 1984...2000 bodies disposed of by official and Red Crescent sources and another 1000-1500 he documented by investigative reporting and interviews with Phalangist officials. BTW, the findings of an Israeli govt study that Israel was only guilty of not foreseeing the future is like accepting the fox's report about the disappearance of the chickens from the coup. You are more stupid still to say that 3000 "sounds better" than 450, unless you are presuming that I take the same pleasure you obviously take in stacks and piles of Palestinian bodies in mass graves. NOT.
Sorry. I am not able to decipher your last parting shot. What are you referring to when you ask about the [square symbol] attacks on Palestinian refugee camps? Please clarify and I would be happy to comment.
I answered your question.
I provide examples of the current administration's bragging of how effective their policy has been in keeping us safe all turned out to be untrue because the threats were not credible.
I believe you just answered your own question
It's administered just like Medicare and Medicaid.
Lots of fraud within those two organizations, both from users and providers. We all know that from being MTs.
You asked, I answered.
I don't think fairy tales make for good foreign policy. Pre-emptive war under false pretenses that kill over 100,000 people waged in the WRONG COUNTRY to avenge daddy's honor and advance mythical global hegemony. No, Lu, the shrub has not made us safer, though you are free to give credit where you see fit. I would never try to talk down a blind Bushie but I can state with unwavering certainty that there are better, smarter, more honest and less deadly approaches to foreign policy, which you are about to witness first-hand on the dawn of this new era.
No just the poster you answered.
I'm beginning to feel the same way. He's pouring good money after bad. He should get wise and stop it RIGHT NOW.
After giving AIG more money yesterday, I feel all O knows is how to spend and that seems to be his cure-all for what ails the country. You would think he would get the hint by now with the market tanking and everyone losing their pensions and 401Ks.
Yes, you are a bit confused. I answered
your posts - this is a free forum, isn't it? - and you referred to me as JTBB.
Do not try to justify your insensitivity with 'I was just joking', this is lame. Because you were NOT joking. You find all the torture and cruelty done to prisoners amusing and entertaining, as you decorate your comments with .. 'LOL, ROFL, Geez etc....'
You asked a question, I answered it. I'm not sure what you want. nm
OK, on that same note you answered your own question..sm
You believe abortion is immoral and that it should be illegal. I think the same thing about this war. Yeah congress passed it, so for all intents and purposes on paper it is legal, but it should be illegal to preempt war against a dictator and his followers (because technically we are not at war against Iraq) that is not a eminent threat to us.
He already has answered tough questions and without a
teleprompter. Now it is about time they let Palin answer a few.
Re: "associations" -- you never answered a prior
Jes' curious............
I agree, was very good. -and she answered with
nm
Maybe no one answered the two previous posts...sm
becuase they're tired of getting jumped on by your side, you know, the anti-fanatic fanatics...lol....but true.
I've refrained from commenting on this issue, even though I feel as if Obama is hiding something. Wonder what it could be?
I answered you above - you are making things up
You accused me earlier of being a racist and posting racist posts. I challenged you and you can't find one. You tried to use something I said after you accused me. I also read through all my posts and there are none. When I referred to Michelle not talking like a black woman I was referring to your typical stereotyping us because we don't always talk or write the way you think all black people do. I'll say it again. Michelle Obama is one classy lady.
You know one thing I was taught growing up is if I'm ever wrong to at least have the decency to say I'm wrong and am sorry, but I guess not everyone is like that.
I saw the snopes link first and have answered
x
If someone had posted the post I answered, yes...
It would be racist if a white person voted for someone just because he was white. It would be racist for a black person to vote for a black person just because he was black. It would be racist for a white person not to vote for a black person just because he was black. It would be racist for a black person to not vote for a white person just because he was white.
Does that clear it up for you?
I answered above and your badgering doesn't rattle me,
x
I feel these questions could have been best answered by Kfir. sm
Frankly, I am not sure how much more evidence you need after the article I posted on the Conservative board regarding Mike Wallace's interview with Iran's president. You made allegations that Christians are only now interested in Israel because we see *the end* coming. That just isn't so. But you state it as fact, not as a personal opinion. Maybe that is where the disconnect lies, that what you perceive has become fact to you. As far as personal attacks, I haven't attacked you. You have to admit, though, that your question to Kfir about why the Israeli army did not fight in Iraq was kind of startling in light of what happened in the Gulf war and in light of the hatred between Israeli and Arab. I would love to debate you, but I don't think we would be debating so much as defending our own belief system. Again, I say this respectfully and this is based on reading your posts here. Your aggression towards Kfir and his defense of his country is puzzling to me. Yet you felt the one attacked. There is just too much emotion here. This milieu is just not conducive to logical debate. People say things they would not ordinarily say in person. I thought the remark you make to Kfir about him not being representative of most Israeli was offensive. I do, believe this conversation has become way too personal, on all levels.
Hope this post answered your question.
no message
If McCain/Palin win, Heaven has answered my
nm
I asked a simple question, and you answered...nm
I in no way twisted your post, merely asked if it extended to the opposition, as you have mainly been talking about the president in this thread.
Thanks for answering.
A previous poster asked who PNAC was. I answered. sm
They influence US and world policy, so believe they are definitely a threat. I first heard about the Illuminati in a Bible study class. Thought everyone knew about them. You all must think everything said is a conspiracy theory. No, Bush isn't one, but I am sure he takes orders from them, and so does other world leaders. In the book, The Creature from Jekyll Island, the creature is a monster known as The Federal Reserve System conjured up at a secret meeting by a group of Illuminati snakes on a remote island off the east coast of America in 1913.
I do believe Islam is a threat, but I also think they are being provoked and persecuted. If you do not know history on the above, then you wouldn't understand why I think this.
I answered you, sam. You are putting words in Obama's mouth
show me where O said he would give rebates to people w/o income and show me where he said they would get a tax break. This question has been answered already. Read the previous post BEFORE you throw out another dodge to my still unanswered question about progressive tax system being socialist, the rebate and your outlandish claims about what you think Obama said.
Stop attacking me!!!!! - and JTBB answered my question
All I asked is where will the troops be coming from that he is going to send to Afghanistan. I didn't state anything else about the troops except that a lot of us thought they'd be coming home. I know the military are committing suicide at an alarming rate. What does that have to do with the question "Where are the troops coming from that Obama is going to send to Afghanistan". The only thing transparent here is how eager you are to attack me for my thoughts and beliefs. Can't anyone ask a question anymore without being attacked for it.
I asked a question and JTBB answered it and I thanked her for it.
And for your information. I don't hate Obama. I VOTED FOR HIM IN THE PRIMARIES!!!!!!! (and don't even call me a pub cos I didn't vote for McCain either). Personally, I like Obama. Good looking guy, in great shape, beautiful family, very pleasant speaking voice. Nothing to hate there and these decisions he is telling us about are not his decisions. He is doing what he is told to do by his bosses. I guess I probably feel the same way lots of people feel about Bush lying to us on certain issues (like Obama's promise for change which he is not keeping it), except I don't have the hatred towards Obama that most do towards Bush.
Please people stop attacking me for me asking questions. If you also read any of my posts you also read that I say over and over - "If I'm wrong I'll admit it" Unlike some of the other posters.
P.S. - Thank you JTBB for being civil to me in your posts. People can disagree and be civil about it and you have shown that so thank you. The rest just please leave me alone!
Actually, I answered your posts line by line
about not "allowing" you to have an opinion. Those are your words, not mine. This is a good example of how this discussion has escalated from a simple link to this utter squashed bug nonsense. Why are you not able to simply debate the original issue at hand...the Eric Holder appointment? Too much of an intellectual challenge when somebody presents a THIRD-PARTY alternative viewpoint? You are the one who mentioned losing sleep and I remarked that it was probably unnecessary since you were blowing something out of proportion....something you have been doing all afternoon. You takes things WAY too personally.
I answered your post point-by-point and
all you can come up with is a lame tit-for-tat? Can you provide some sort of substantive response that would argue against the point I am trying to make here? Of course not.
Please show me what part of my post reflects bigotry or ignorance? I have made a few statements based on my own life experience, rather than the hook-line-and-sinker method of forming my world view. Then the impotence of your suicide bomber reference was buried under concrete evidence of informed, researched and factual data that would suggest an oppressed, occupied, half-starved population does not have the upper hand when it comes to defending themselves against Israel's US-bankrolled arsenal of pain, misery, death and destruction. They are just a tad out-gunned, wouldn't you say?
I answered your post point-by-point and
all you can come up with is a lame tit-for-tat? Can you provide some sort of substantive response that would argue against the point I am trying to make here? Of course not.
Please show me what part of my post reflects bigotry or ignorance? I have made a few statements based on my own life experience, rather than the hook-line-and-sinker method of forming a world view. Then the impotence of your suicide bomber reference was buried under concrete evidence of informed, researched and factual data that would suggest an oppressed, occupied, half-starved population does not exactly have the upper hand when it comes to defending themselves against Israel's US-bankrolled arsenal of pain, misery, death and destruction they employ in order to "secure" themselves.
The Palestinians are just a tad out-gunned, wouldn't you say? This might just account for the lop-sided fatalities/injuries ratios between the Israelis and the Palestinians. In closing, it is worth noting that even with the advantage of all those terrorist toys and tools our tax dollars have bestowed upon them, security and peace of mind just seem to be further and further beyond their reach. Wonder why that is?
Fact is, since I'm not
etc., you wouldn't believe it - no matter how strong the evidence - so why would I supply you with more?
Fact is fact ???
The economy is growing. I don't care if it is exploding. The fact here is that more and more people are becoming more and more desperate. I think going to college is fine but what jobs are these people going to get when they get out of college. You mentioned something about trades...please, all the manufacturing jobs are gone. Small business...only a handful ever succeed. My guess is that most people wiped out of good paying jobs with benefits are supposed to go to Wal-Mart and just pretend everything is okay, and here in Florida, join the service industry. Money, the real god of our times, is what is killing a lot of people here in Florida. As an example, in my town, there are hundreds of small mobile home parks inhabited primarily by the elderly. The big money developers are coming in here, buying the parks and the people are out on the street. The owners of the park get millions of dollars and the people are usually offered a flat fee that would pay rent for about 2 years, or given 60 days to find a place to move their homes, On fixed income this, of course, cannot be done. Many of these folks lived all their lives doing the right thing, playing by all the rules. They moved to Florida, own a little bit of property and now they are expected to rent again and work again. An apartment 1 BR 1 BA that is decent would be around $1000. You do the math. Even those communities that are owned by the homeowners themselves have no say. Eminent domain comes into play and then they are really in trouble so...being elderly, forced out of your home, having Medicare screwed up beyond belief is okay because the economy is strong. I don't care about words or pie charts. I care about what I see and know to be true by looking at it with my own eyes. Just who is it benefitting from this growing economy?? Oh well, the market will straighten everything out, just wait.
Another thing is that everyone is not college material, even these days when a degree doesn't mean all that much anyway. It surely won't guarantee you a job and if you went to college after the 1970s you don't even have to be smart to get in; not that smart people are not in college, you just don't have to be anymore. You don't even have to know how to read..but that is for another day. How many middle management degreed people have lost their jobs...quite a few. Airlines, GM, drug companies, utility companies...all these places hire degreed people. That old sheepskin won't save you anymore.
You say the poor will always be with us and I believe that as well. I do not believe that it is okay to walk over the additional bodies that greed has produced and there are legion. You call it lack of motivation on the part of the poor. I call it greed.
By the way, I see that the Iraq election is mysteriously mirroring the US election, split right down the middle.
Oh, and the drilling in Alaska. Why don't they drill in Detroit and make some cars that use some other form of fuel. It just never ends.
Debacle...absolutely.
So is the fact sm
that Saddam's son-in-law said the WMDs were moved to Syria before the U.S. got involved. But that always gets overlooked. There are a lot of facts out there. Suffice it to say, people believe the set that fits their overall world view.
While I still do not buy the fact that....
the US has made "constant intrusion" in the middle east for oil (if that were the case, you would think that when it has not netted results in the 40+ years posters here say it has been happening, they could see the handwriting on the wall)...in fact, I don't believe it. The reason we started importing so much oil is that the lovely Democratic congresses so taxed the oil industry in this country that drilling became too expensive, they stopped building refineries because not only taxation but environmentalists raising all kind of cane, yada yada. Our own government has done it to us. Overtaxation is the cause of multiple problems and is the MAIN reason for outsourcing. People want the cheapest they can buy, so in order for businesses to meet that demand they have to offshore...because their own government has taxed them to death. Sad, but true.
I do agree with what you said about Obama not knowing squat about foreign affairs....you are right, he does not. And who he has advising him should scare the knickers off ALL of us.
Obama is a figurehead with big money backers and politcos behind him...a marionette with a hand up his back. When he is not giving "hope" and "change" speeches that have been written for him, when he has to think on his feet, he is not as "eloquent." That being said, it is the hand up his back and the people he surrounds himself with that concern me. THAT tells the tale.
I look at his voting record...one of the most liberal in the US...THAT is the real Barack Obama. He is trying to move to the center now as he doesn't think there are enough of the far left (like he really is) to get him elected. Like I said in the other post...beware the wolf in sheep's clothing. I don't trust him, I don't believe him. "Hope" and "change" are buzz words. Yeah, he wants to "change" things...but to what is the question.
It was me; I said, in fact, you were the one who had the...
inside track to what Obama thinks...I believe it was because you posted "Obama thinks" and went on to say what he thought... ;)
What I said in this post was common sense...if Obama is as smart as everyone says he is, he has sat on boards with Ayers and Ayers hosted a political fundraiser for him, so I can't imagine he doesn't know what Ayers is about. It is not exactly a secret...I wasn't very old when Ayers was doing his bombing but I know he still holds the same beliefs..he has said so on numerous occasions. So if little old me knows it, I cannot imagine Barack Obama does not know it. I never hinted what Obama THINKS about Ayers, what I said was that he knows Ayers and knows that Ayers still holds anarchist views and is not a bit bit sorry for what he did in the past. It should be obvious to anyone he knows what Ayers is about. Now what he personally thinks about Ayers...that is another story entirely. I don't know. Maybe the stuff Columbia University released will shed some light. Maybe it won't. We shall see.
The fact is
The teen was raised in that family, but as a human being she made her own decisions that her mother can't always control. Just because she didn't fully coincide with her mother's platform of abstinence, she is with her pro-life stance and keeping her baby, marrying the dad.
Fact is fact whether you want to believe it or not
Your hatred for one candidate blinds you to the truth of what your candidate is all about and who supports him.
Obama's plans for America WILL turn our country into a socialist country. They will take your hard earned money to support their programs. That is not a scare tactic, that is the truth and his website even supports those facts (the website lists all his programs he supports). If you think it's fair that I have to work 60 hours a week to support my family, but when Obama gets in there I'll now have to work 80 hours a week because the extra 20 hours I get paid for is going to go the the people who benefit from me working (when they don't). That is not free enterprise, that IS most definitely socialism. What part of that don't you understand. I learned that in grammar school. You make it sound so innocent "help our fellow American's in need". That is not helping them. That is stealing from people who work pretty darn hard at their jobs, but now have to work more hours so the government can steal it from us and give it to people who are not working and who will benefit from all these programs. That is redistrubution of wealth. That is socialism. I don't know if its communism, not sure what the difference between the two are, but I do know that a lot of the people who influenced Obama when he was growing up were communists. And if I want to "help my fellow American in time of need" I will donate to the charity I want to donate to and I will donate how much I want to. Right now I work from 7:30 am to 10:30 pm just to earn enough money to live (and have maybe an extra $10 left over at the end of a couple weeks. Now when Obama gets in I'm going to have to work from maybe 6am to 12 am if not more with the extra taxes I will have to pay. That is the cold hard truth and it doesn't sound too comforting to me.
The only thing rediculous about this post was asking if Jesus was a socialist, and then giving a sermon in the post (again that place is the faith board). Socialism was not around when Jesus lived. I also think if this was happening when he was alive people would give what they could to help out others, but Jesus would not go out and tell them you have to work double time now and give to those while they do nothing.
People seem to think they know what Jesus would do but they don't. They don't do enough researching to find out what this man was about. They just repeat what they've heard their church leader spout and then try and make others feel guilty if they don't give (but then again that is for another post).
I don't think the fact that I don't like
Obama's view on united healthcare, pro-choice, tax plans and foreign policy make me ignorant. I have a different idea on where I would like this country to be and that just isn't it. Just because it's not your viewpoint does not mean that it's ignorant.
I totally understand that conservatives are not going to be able to convince liberals to take their viewpoint and vice versa because they want different things! How hard is that for people to understand?
The sad fact is
it is so possible for it to get that bad here, for another civil war to break out. Only this time, we have bigger and better guns and equipment which will kill so many more. And don't forget, the whole world is watching us, and don't think for a second that these unfriendly countries wouldn't pounce on us in a second if they saw we were at war with ourselves.
We need to be able to debate about this without resorting to name calling, fighting, death threats, cheating, blowing things out of proportion, etc. I believe this election has thrown us way back in terms of racism and segregation. From BOTH sides! I live in Georgia and you would swear we were back in the 1930s. The animosity and tension that is growing is ridiculous.
I think our biggest problem is that we have two candidates that, for the most part, have followers who are 100% FOR them or people who are 100% against them. It's not like we are choosing who we think is the better of the two. We are choosing by saying we don't want the other guy. I'm just as guilty as everyone else. So therefore, whoever wins, there will be quite a few people who still don't agree with him and will watch his every move and be ready to point out the slightest mistake. So we are in for at least four years of being torn apart. THAT isn't going to fix anything!
We have to wake up. We have to stop getting so EMOTIONAL about this election. We have to remember that half of what these POLITICIANS say, no matter how "great" we think they are or are not, half of what they say they aren't going to do. And half of what they are saying they won't do, they will.
Either way, we need to all start living within our means and working together and helping each other, not expecting government to do it for us. That's just humanity, not politics.
No...it has to do with the fact
that some of the associations he has had in his lifetime condone terrorist attacks on our country and others condone racism by spouting hate messages from the pulpit. It has nothing to do with his name or his color. It has to do with who he associates with. If you want to know a true person.....look who they hang with. Birds of a feather, my friend.
But putting all sketchy associations aside, the bottom line is that there are issues that I just don't agree with Obama on. That is why I'm not voting for him. I do not condone abortion. I want to keep my guns. I do not want to raise taxes for anyone. I don't want to give welfare checks to people who are too lazy to get an education and work. I want to stop government spending. I want smaller government. There are just so many issues where Barrack Obama and I do not see eye to eye that I really don't even have to use his race or associations as a reason to not vote for him.
Fact
It is a fact that he did not vote for it because there was already legislation in place to protect the infant in this case.
More scare tactics.
It has nothing to do with the fact that
it is Obama's plan. It has everything to do with the fact that holding these prisoners indefinitely without processing them goes against everything our democracy stands for. I would applaud the Bush administration for doing the same thing and have written members of the current administration and Congress saying just that.
You POV is not a fact.
You give way too much importance to yourself. It's of no consequence to me anyway. In fact, I encourage O haters to continue on the same track they were on before the election and are still on. All that fear mongering, prognostications of gloom and doom, Armageddon, those witch hunts, smears and scandal vigils will do nothing more than insure O's re-election in 2012. Keep up the good work, dear.
Given the fact............ sm
that the magazine would have to procure his permission to print that photo, I would say that his permission alone verifies the fact that he is pleased with his rock-star image and America's infatuation with him.
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