Lets bash the pastor.

According to dictionary.com, the meanings of the N-word are “deeply disparaging and are used when the speaker deliberately wishes to cause great offense.”  They go on to say, conversely, “it is sometimes used among African-Americans in a neutral or familiar way.”  Since he whispered the statement behind what he thought was a cold microphone, it is highly unlikely that Rev. Jackson intended to cause great offense and his use of the word probably falls into the latter category of usage. 

For example, the N-word can become much less offensive and even assume neutrality within historical discourse, literature, poetry, cinema theater and the like.  One could further argue that within certain contexts (i.e. rap music, conversations within the black households, neighborhoods and businesses, to name a few) connotations of the word can be construed so as to convey a sense of community…even a brotherhood, of sorts.  Language is fluid, dynamic and vital in its nature, not static or one-dimensional.  Context, message, intent, environment, speaker and audience all impact the ultimate nuance of meaning in all forms of communication. 

I agree with you and take deep offense at the use of the N-word, regardless of who says it.  However, I would like to comment on some of the other points you raised in your post.  A careful read of the actual statement shows that Rev. Jackson did not use this epithet to personally attack Obama.  Rather, he was referring to the black population as a whole.  Granted, his choice of words was extremely poor (at least from a white perspective), but the statement was not meant for public scrutiny.  It was spoken from one black individual to another, much the same was that Rev. Jeremiah Wright’s statements were made from black preacher to black congregation. 

As a white person, I do not believe I can sit in judgment one way or another regarding his choice of words when taken completely out of context, in the same way I am not qualified to criticize the sermons of Rev. Wright.  I would like to think that I am intelligent enough to understand that, having lived in the US as a white person both before and after the civil right eras (1948 to present), I have not experienced life in America the same way black people have.  They are entitled to their own “take” on their own lives.  Who am I to tell them how to “tell it like it is?”

One last point.  I am sure that much flap and bruhah will ensue over this unfortunate news.  However, the very fact that Rev. Sharpton, you, I, the media and countless others will be having this debate over our outrage and dismay is a testament as to just how effective Rev Jackson and other early leaders in the civil rights movement were in defining the key issues, defying status quo of his times, enlisting support for the cause, effectively engaging his opposition in ongoing bipartisan initiatives over nearly 4 decades and producing fruitful, far-reaching and substantial bodies of legislation from which today’s black community continue to reap bountiful benefits and blessings.  They weathered storms of protests, incarceration, series after series of setbacks and reversals, and buckets of bloodshed in their efforts to secure the civil liberties and rights that reach far beyond the black community to encompass other forms of discrimination against women, gays, immigrants and the poor, to name a few…all so casually taken for granted and so easily dismissed in the blink of an eye with one ill-chosen, unfortunate slip of the tongue. 

For those of us whose memories reach further back than the latest round of CNN sound bytes and chat room chatter, we probably would forgive Obama should he decide not to denounce Rev Jackson’s support, nor would we feel driven to force him to abandon his own pastor of 20 years for the sake of our own righteous indignation. 

• Jesse Jackson and the N-word. - .
  • Lets bash the pastor. - Free speech rocks.
    • N-Word - TT112OldTimer
    • Let's make one thing crystal clear.... - sam
      • Well said s/m - TT112OldTimer
        • Let me make something clear. - CG
          • Okay, I'll bite - TT112OldTimer
        • I couldn't agree more. - .
          • I just call myself a mutt S/M - TT112OldTimer
    • Free speech, you rock! - CG
      • Thank you kindly. I was surprised... - Free speech here
        • I am all for equality.... - .
          • Right there with you... - Z-ville MT
          • I appreciate your feedback....sm - Free speech here

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WEST BEND, Wis. (AP) - Thirty-three pastors in 22 states used their sermons to make pointed recommendations about political candidates today.

The effort was orchestrated by the Arizona-based Alliance Defense Fund.

The conservative legal group plans to send copies of the pastors' sermons to the Internal Revenue Service with hope of setting off a legal fight and abolishing restrictions on church involvement in politics.

Critics call it unnecessary, divisive and unlikely to succeed.

The Reverend Eric Williams of Columbus has organized 55 religious leaders across the nation to file a complaint about the ADF's challenge.

The minister with the liberal United Church of Christ says churches should stand apart from the government.

My word can you ever rant.  But you don't seem so great at sticking to facts.  I read the posts you paraphrased and do not agree with your synopsis.  She did not say you were a cliche, among other things....she said you were using a cliche.  Superior intellect?  Huh?  Where'd you get that?  She stated she liked western history.  Just because someone likes to read doesn't mean they are boasting that they are superior.  How silly!!!

The founding pastor of a second Colorado church has resigned over gay sex allegations, just weeks after the evangelical community was shaken by the scandal surrounding megachurch leader Ted Haggard.

Haggard, a gay-marriage opponent, admitted to unspecified sexual immorality when he resigned last month as president of the National Association of Evangelicals and pastor of the 14,000-member New Life Church in Colorado Springs. A male prostitute had said he had had sex with Haggard for three years.

On Sunday, Paul Barnes, founding pastor of the 2,100-member Grace Chapel in this Denver suburb, told his evangelical congregation in a videotaped message he had had sexual relations with other men and was stepping down.

Dave Palmer, associate pastor of Grace Chapel, told The Denver Post that Barnes confessed to him after the church received a call last week.

The church board of elders accepted Barnes' resignation on Thursday.

On the videotape, which The Post was allowed to view, Barnes told church members: I have struggled with homosexuality since I was a 5-year-old boy. ... I can't tell you the number of nights I have cried myself to sleep, begging God to take this away.

Barnes, 54, led Grace Chapel for 28 years. He and his wife have two adult children.

Palmer said in a written statement that While we cannot condone what he has done, we continue to support and love Paul.

Of course, we all know the Christian Right will haul out the WMDs to slay the messenger, but for the rest of us, this will be a pretty interesting read.  I have not had a chance to completely view the video, but it will be fascinating to see how the Christian Right can bash this Pentacostal Worldview.  Here's the link.  http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/09/02/palins-church-may-have-sh_n_123205.html

In Germany they first came for the Communists,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Communist.

Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Jew.

Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Catholics,
and I didn't speak up because I was a Protestant.

Then they came for me —
and by that time no one was left to speak up.

Conservative board.

Never a problem there.

The right wing rag I got my figures from was the IRS:

Progressivity and the Tax Burden

Our tax system, however, is highly progressive, meaning that as one's income rises, a higher proportion of that income is taxed. Thus, those in the highest tax brackets contribute more to the overall tax burden even though there are far more people in lower tax brackets.¹

• According to data from the IRS, the bottom 50 percent of income earners pay approximately 4 percent of income taxes.
  
• The top 25 percent of income earners pay nearly 83 percent of the income tax burden, and the top 10 percent pay 65 percent.
  
• The top 1 percent of income earners pay almost 35 percent of all income taxes.

The bottom 50% referred to above includes the middle class.

The $6 billion figure came from one of your own posters down in a lower thread...from the tax institute who evaluated O's plan, and the fact that it would add about a trillion (literally) dollars to the deficit.  You can scroll down and find it yourself.

Yes, $250,000 in INCOME.  That is a small business owner's PAYCHECK.  That is what is left after they have paid all their small business operation bills, and he wants to RAISE the taxes on what they have left.  It HURTS small businesses.  IF they work hard, pay their people, keep their jobs on shore, what do they get for it?  After paying whatever business taxes they have to pay, he wants to tax their bottom line AGAIN.  In my opinion...that sucks.

Don't have time to run through the whole rant right now.  More later.

This is near the bottom of the article I posted.  Maybe you just missed it.

"To gain access to the emergency loans, GM and Chrysler must also agree to a wide range of concessions, including limits on executive pay and the elimination of their private corporate jets. "

Everyone put it on Bush's shoulders to do some thing about this and now that he has, still he gets bashed.  He's not my favorite president by far, but I think he should be afforded some kind of recognition for doing something to help the economy.  As far as pay cuts for the UAW, the article says that they will have to bring their wages more in line with those of foreign auto makers, which is still a danged good salary.  Would the UAW rather have a pay check or be completely unemployed?  That is pretty much what it all boils down to.  I wouldn't particular want to take a pay cut either, but in light of the situation and the current economic picture, I think I would thank my lucky stars that I at least would HAVE a jo

Like the old saying goes "You can please all of the people some of the time and some of the people all of the time but you can't please all of the people all of the time."

Off . 

Okay, let's have Mrs. Palin on the interview shows.  I want to see her interviewed by Bob Shieffer, Mat Lauer, Andrea Mitchell, George Stephanopoulous, Meet the Press, etc.  We saw that she can really deliver a written speech well.  I want to hear her personal views on foreign affairs and improving the economy. She has experience in Alaskan news, so I will expect a camera-ready, polished performance.

Let's say for the sake of argument that he is Muslim.  With this in mind, he would be going to a christian church, all the while faking having the christian belief.  So when Rev. Wright gets up and preaches, I can assume that since Obama is supposedly a Muslim and not a christian, that he would not believe what is being preached.  If Obama is not influenced by what is preached in this church, then what's the big deal about Rev Wright and the supposedly big impact he had on Obama? 

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