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Perhaps a complete history of this issue

Posted By: sm on 2009-02-06
In Reply to: Reasoning........... sm - m

is in order. I find a lot of "cut and paste" abounding in our world and you never get the complete TRUTH. I want the real McCoy before I would even venture to speculate on this issue. I can't imagine anyone would want to make porn available to children - perhaps the argument was about a lot more than this and the most shocking version was condensed to something such as this. And, people like this version so they refuse to educate themselves further.


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A separate issue entirely. History tells us that
nm
Actually that's not the complete story...
You did not mention that when Summersby was dying of cancer she stated that it had been a romantic affair after all and wrote about it in her book.  This contradicted what she had earlier stated.  Who knows what really happened, and does it really matter?  I doubt it.  It only proves that we're all flawed humans, even some Republicans!!
Please do complete a list
of Obama's so-called life-time experienced and then list Palin's.  The only thing he has over her is he is in Washington and she is not....which IMHO is refreshing.  Maybe we need someone who hasn't been corrupted by Washington.  I still do not see how you people keep saying Obama has experience....HE DOESN'T!!!!  You can't complain about Palin not having experience if you are for Obama because you are only bashing your own candidate......although you people refuse to see that.  I can't help but chuckle.
Not complete! YOU ARE SLEEPING.
nm
No, it's not complete......still in the courts
Obama and hs lawyer have tried to get this entire thing dismissed but to no avail. I guess this judge can't be bought. We'll see.
They have to complete 40 hours of
community service each year. The district provides a list of opportunities for them to chose from. If they want to do something that is not on the list, such as initiate their own project, they simply have to have it approved beforehand to be sure it will count toward their credits. Scouting activities, NHS CS commitments, etc., all count toward this requireement.
I am a complete cipher
yet you know what I would do in any given situation?  That is the kind of mindless reactionary, partisan thinking that dug this country in a pit. 
This post is not complete without this
http://wonkette.com/406046/look-its-one-photo-where-george-bush-has-his-coat-off

Bush in shirt sleeves..2nd day in office, if I am recalling KO's report from last week correctly.


There are complete morons
on both sides of the fence here.  There are just as many crooked and ignorant dems as there are pubs.  Once again, I wish you guys would stop playing party lines and actually see particular people for who and what they are instead of giving them free passes just because of their party. If you would take your blinders off, you would see that both parties have screwed us and they only complain about spending when it is the other party in control.  Get a clue!
But you complete ignored the rest of the post....
I am just shaking my head. It is amazing to me that anyone would think God is okay with abortion. I believe he is okay with personal choice, of course I do, my faith is based greatly on that belief. Someone makes a choice when they take any life, inside the womb or outside. That does not mean God condones murder. You are representing that the Bible, and therefore God, condones abortion, and I cannot wrap my mind around that. To follow your line of reasoning, I should be able to steal from you and not have the government interfere because it is my choice to steal from you and I have to answer only to my maker. If a person breaks into your house (his choice) and rapes you or kills you, (his choice), then he should be free to do so and only have to face his maker. Can you not see how destructive that line of thinking can become? You think that is ridiculous, but I promise you that 20 years ago people thought abortion was ridiculous, same sex marriage would horrify my parents...if left unchecked, horrible things can happen. The amazing thing is, the moral compass becomes so skewed that the horrible becomes the acceptable. As I said before, that kind thinking is what helped a madman rise to power, and thousands upon thousands of people either jumped on the bandwagon or turned their heads and condoned something horrific, on the premise that a whole race of people were inferior and subhuman and therefore it was all right to exterminate them. THAT is what happens when people begin to devalue life. I do not want that to EVER happen again, to ANYONE. I realize that is probably falling on deaf ears because I will get the rote I don't believe it is life again and you are unable to draw the parallel. You see, that is a fundamental difference between you and me...I care about what happens to you as an individual and what happens to this country and every person in it, so I gave it one last shot. It is hard for me to just walk away. But walk away I shall, because sometimes you have to. We shall have to agree to disagree, but I will keep standing for what I believe in and calling wrong what I believe is wrong, just as you do. God bless, Maryland Gal.
CNN working to get COMPLETE info.
Perhaps there is more to the story than sam is trying to insinuate...like some of the replies have been suggesting. Take a peek at O's record on Katrina.
http://thinkonthesethings.wordpress.com/2007/08/29/when-the-cameras-are-off-barack-obamas-hurricane-katrina-record/
1. Here is O's record on rebuilding after Hurriane Katrina
2. Sept. 2, 2005: Obama holds press conference urging Illinoisans to contribute to the Hurricane Katrina relief efforts.
3. Sept. 5, 2005: Obama goes to Houston to visit evacuees with Presidents Clinton and Bush.
4. Sept. 7, 2005: Obama introduces bill to create a national emergency family locator system
5. Sept. 8, 2005: Obama introduces bill to create a National Emergency Volunteers Corps. Sept. 8, 2005: Obama co-sponsors the Katrina Emergency Relief Act of 2005 introduced by Senator Harry Reid
6. Sept. 8, 2005: Obama co-sponsors the Hurricane Katrina Bankruptcy Relief and Community Protection Act of 2005 introduced by Senator Russ Feingold
7. Sept. 12, 2005: Obama introduces legislation requiring states to create an emergency evacuation plan for society’s most vulnerable
8. Sept. 15, 2005: Obama issues public response to President Bush’s speech about Gulf Coast rebuilding.
9. Sept. 21, 2005: Obama co-sponsors bill to establish a Katrina commission to investigate response to the disaster introduced by Hillary Clinton
10. Sept. 21, 2005: Obama appears on NPR to discuss the role of poverty in Hurricane Katrina.
11. Sept. 22, 2005: Obama and Coburn’s Hurricane Katrina financial oversight bill unanimously passes Senate committee.
12. Sept. 22, 2005: Obama’s amendment requiring evacuation plans unanimously passes Senate committee.
13. Sept. 28, 2005: Obama and Coburn issue statement about the need for a Chief Financial Officer to oversee the financial mismanagement and suspicious contracts occurring in the reconstruction process
14. Sept. 29, 2005: Obama and Coburn investigate possible FEMA refusal of free cruise ship offer
15. Oct. 6, 2005: Obama and Coburn issue statement on FEMA Decision to re-bid Katrina contracts
16. Oct. 6, 2005: Obama co-sponsors Gulf Coast Infrastructure Redevelopment and Recovery Act of 2005.
17. Oct. 21, 2005: Obama releases statement decrying the extension of FEMA director, Michael “Brownie” Brown’s contract. Obama calls Brown’s contract extension, “unconscionable.”
18. Nov. 17, 2005: Obama and Coburn introduce legislation asking FEMA to immediately re-bid all Katrina reconstruction contracts.
19. Feb. 1, 2006: Obama gives Senate floor speech on his legislation to help children affected by Hurricane Katrina
20. Feb. 2, 2006: Obama introduces legislation to help low-income children affected by Hurricane Katrina
21. Feb. 23, 2006: Obama issues statement responding to a White House report on Hurricane Katrina. Obama noted that the top two recommendations that the report had for the federal government were initiatives he had been working on since immediately after the storm hit. Obama called the administration’s response “delinquent.”
22. May 2, 2006: Obama gives speech about no-bid contracts in Hurricane Katrina reconstruction
23. May 4, 2006: Obama’s legislation to end no-bid contracts for Hurricane Katrina reconstruction passed the Senate.
24. June 15, 2006: Obama and Coburn announce legislation to require amendment to create competitive bidding for Hurricane Katrina reconstruction for federal contracts over $500,000. Although it passed previously, the language was stripped in conference.
25. June 15, 2006: Obama releases podcast about his pending Katrina reconstruction legislation in the Senate.
26. June 16, 2006: Obama and Coburn get no-bid Hurricane Katrina reconstruction amendment into Department of Defense authorization bill.
27. July 14, 2006: Obama and Coburn’s legislation to end abuse of no-bid contracts passes senate as amendment to Department of Defense authorization bill.
28. August 11, 2006: Obama visits Xavier University in New Orleans to give Commencement address
29. August 14, 2006: Obama and Coburn ask FEMA to address ballooning no-bid contracts for Gulf Coast reconstruction
30. Sept. 29, 2006: Obama and Coburn legislation to prevent abuse of no-bid contracts in the wake of disaster passes Senate to be sent to President’s desk to become law.
31. Feb. 2007-Present: As Obama begins his Presidential campaign he references Katrina as a part of his stump speech as he travels around the country in his familiar line, “That we are not a country which preaches compassion and justice to others while we allow bodies to float down the streets of a major American city. That is not who we are.”
32. June 20, 2007: Obama co-sponsors Gulf Coast Housing Recovery Act of 2007 introduced by Senator Chris Dodd.
33. July 27, 2007: Obama and colleagues get a measure in the Homeland Security bill that will investigate FEMA trailers that may contain the toxic chemical, formaldehyde.
34. Aug. 26, 2007: Obama outlines a detailed Hurricane Katrina recovery plan.
35. December 18, 2007: Obama calls on President Bush to protect affordable housing in New Orleans
36. February 16, 2008: Obama releases statement on toxic Gulf Coast trailers

We will soon find out once the investigation is complete
x
The investigation IS complete. Have you been sleeping? nm
.
I agree. This is a complete and utter...... sm
show of lack of respect for his family. They have lost a loved one and should be left alone in their time of grief. While I don't agree with his chosen profession, his family is not to blame and they are the ones being hurt by this, not him.
Your 2nd paragraph is complete and utter nonsense. sm
You wrote: 'Besides, a lot of atheists who try to disprove that God ever existed will usually come to the conclusion that there is too much evidence to prove that He does exist. It usually scares the you know what out of them and they become converts.'

And you know this how? I would say show me the evidence to back up this ridiculous claim, but I already know you have none. It's your opinion/religious propaganda, and it's blantantly false. You also have it backwards. You're implying people start out being athiest, then convert to religion. It's the other way around, when religious or secular people start questioning all the improbable/impossible things the bible is overflowing with, in addition to all of its inconsistenties and outright contradictions.

Forgive me if I doubt that you're an expert on athiests, and forgive me if I doubt your critical thinking skills, because religion frowns upon that - you're not supposed to question god or think for yourself, just obey his commands, or should I say, various human interpretations of his commands...

If there was indeed
'too much evidence to prove that He does exist' then everyone would believe in him. How could anyone deny it? They couldn't. But that's just it, there is no evidence to prove it, whereas there actually IS scientific evidence to the contrary, that you apparently are unaware of or haven't investigated.

Instead, you're willing to believe something based only on 'faith.' In every other area of your life where you'd want or even *demand* facts, proof, or concrete evidence before believing something so important, with religion (some) people are all too willing to blindly accept it on faith.

BTW, an athiest doesn't have to DISprove god (you can't prove a negative, anyway), you have to prove that he *does* exist, and you can't. And wouldn't you think if he really existed, he would prove it to the entire world's satisfaction anyway and put an end to the debate and all the relious wars, conflict, genocide, misery, suffering, etc? He'd rather we kill each over it? I think not. It makes no sense.

You also wrote: 'You can say all you want, but you just can't argue with a completely changed life'

Yes, I can argue it. You changed your life because *you* wanted to change it. You! Not some mystical, magical, invisible being in the sky who cares about your every thought and action. People change their lives for the better every day, without religion. IMO, if you hadn't found religion, you would've kept looking until you found something else that worked for you, and it probably would've been a lot healthier than the brainwashing, closed-minded, divisive phenomenon that is religion.

I have complete faith in John McCain. ...nm
x
Complete child exploitation. This is way scary..... nm

Why voting in the US is a complete waste of time

I've said it for years and years.  This is an excellent article. 


http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article7095.html


 


 


Keith Olbermann is a complete fruitcake!

He sits and states that Texas gets 88% back of every dollar they send to the federal government but another states (midwest) only gets 40+%.  Is he really that brainwashed?   Does he not even think for a moment that Texas has to pay for all the illegals in their state and bear the burden of all the freebies these freeloaders gets?  Healthcare, food, clothing, housing, and the lists go on and on to the tune of millions and millions.    You better believe they need to get EVERY penny back... as far as I am concerned, 88% should be 100%....  BTW we all should be keeping our 100% earnings.   Constitution states individual citizens are NOT to pay taxes to federal government, ONLY corporations.  


Olbermann would kiss the backside of Hitler and bow at his feet if he were still alive.   This man is absolutely sickening!


So did you get the complete roster when you joined the club?


No issue is no issue. Denying that
nm
Case in point. Complete intolerance for any view other than their own.
This is what the Democratic party has become.
The complete text of John McCain's speech, sm

For those who, like me, were not able to hear it on television.


http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/washington/2008/11/john-mccain.html


The article posted is not the complete conversation. Ever hear of Freakanomics? sm
That has a lot to do with the conversation. As usual, the MSM left out significant parts of what was said.  No surprise there.
History is history and opinion is opinion. You need to learn the difference.
x
I know history
Jews and Communism?  Dont get the link there.  Jews are definitely not communist and even in the old world, *Old Europe*, Austria, Germany, Poland, they were not communists..they were shop owners, jewelry makers, prosperous bankers..I have never met a communist or socialist jew and I grew up in NYC.  To quote history, to remember history, to study history, does not mean we are contributing to terrorism..or aiding our enemies..that argument makes no sense.  My major in college was history, minor anthropology.  So, I pretty much know a bit about history.  When people close their eyes to the truth, refuse to admit what is really happening or what type of administration is running the country, follow like sheep without question, that is when we are headed to ruin..not when there is free flow of ideas and talk of history, even quotes from the most evil of them..
What is history but....
windows that open and close. You are correct. However, you still want to beat Bush up for going to Iraq. We went. Nothing can change that. CLinton did not fight them in Somalia like he should...we cannot change that. However, the reason for not leaving Iraq post haste is as much about running yet again from Al Qaeda as it is about abandoning the rank and file Iraqi people. You have to understand that I have been in the military culture for a long time and have daily talks with someone who has been there and done that...he does not form my opinions and we have been known to butt heads...however, he does give me great insight. He knows who the enemy is. He has faced them.
It is history, kam...look it up.
Democrats are the ones who were against freeing the slaves. When Abe Lincoln and the Republicans(yes, he was a Republican) freed the slaves and after the war passed legislation to give them the vote, the Democrats immediately passed poll taxes and literacy tests so that the newly freed slaves would not be able to exercise their new right to vote. African Americans did not get clear right to vote until the Civil Rights Act in the 1960's, when enough Northern Democrats bucked the party and joined the Republicans to pass that act. It is all history, all fact. Look it up.

history and the

impact of Supreme Court decisions on the role of government?  I guess it really has nothing to do with being VP.  All you need is a rah-rah speech, a sense of victimization and a flag pin and you are good to go.  Sorry, sometimes I think.


 


Here is a bit of history.

This election has me very worried.  So many things to consider.  About a year ago I would have voted for Obama. I have changed my mind three times since than.  I watch all the news channels, jumping from one to another.  I must say this drives my husband crazy.  But, I feel if you view MSNBC, CNN, and Fox News, you might get some middle ground to work with.  About six months ago, I started thinking 'where did the money come from for Obama'.  I have four daughters who went to College, and we were middle class, and money was tight.  We (including my girls) worked hard and there were lots of student loans. I started looking into Obama's life.
 


Around 1979 Obama started college at Occidental in California.  He is very open about his two years at Occidental, he tried all kinds of drugs and was wasting his time but, even though he had a brilliant mind, did not apply himself to his studies. 'Barry' (that was the name he used all his life) during this time had two roommates, Muhammad Hasan Chandoo and Wahid Hamid, both from Pakistan.  During the summer of 1981, after his second year in college, he made a 'round the world' trip.  Stopping to see his mother in Indonesia, next Hyderabad in India, three weeks in Karachi, Pakistan where he stayed with his roommate's family, then off to Africa to visit his father's family.  My question - Where did he get the money for this trip?  Neither I, nor any one of my children would have had money for a trip like this when they where in college.  When he came back he started school at Columbia University in New York.  It is at this time he  wants everyone to call him Barack - not Barry.  Do you know what the tuition is at Columbia?  It's not cheap! to say the least.  Where did he get money for tuition?  Student Loans? Maybe. After Columbia, he went to Chicago to work as a Community Organizer for $12,000. a year.  Why Chicago?  Why not New York? He was already living in New York.
 


By 'chance' he met Antoin 'Tony' Rezko, born in Aleppo Syria, and a real estate developer in Chicago.  Rezko has been convicted of fraud and bribery this year.  Rezko, was named 'Entrepreneur of the Decade' by the Arab-American Business and Professional Association'.  About two years later, Obama entered Harvard Law School.  Do you have any idea what tuition is for Harvard Law School?  Where did he get the money for Law School?  More student loans?  After Law school, he went back to Chicago. Rezko offered him a job, which he turned down.  But, he did take a job with Davis, Miner, Barnhill & Galland. Guess what?  They represented 'Rezar' which Rezko's firm.  Rezko was one of Obama's first major financial contributors when he ran for office in Chicago.  In 20 03, Rezko threw an early fundraiser for Obama which Chicago Tribune reporter David Mendelland claims was instrumental in providing Obama with 'seed money'  for his U.S. Senate race. In 2005, Obama purchased a new home in Kenwoood District of Chicago for $1.65 million (less than asking price).  With ALL those Student Loans - Where did he get the money for the property?  On the same day Rezko's wife, Rita, purchased the adjoining empty lot for full price. The London Times reported that Nadhmi Auchi, an Iraqi-born Billionaire loaned Rezko $3.5 million three weeks before Obama's new home was purchased.  Obama met Nadhmi Auchi many times with Rezko.
 


 Now, we have Obama running for President.  Valerie Jarrett, was Michele Obama's boss.  She is now Obama's chief advisor and he does not make any major decisions without talking to her first.  Where was Jarrett born? Ready for this? Shiraz, Iran!  Do we see a pattern here?  Or am I going crazy?
 


On May 10, 2008 The Times reported, Robert Malley advisor to Obama was 'sacked' after the press found out he was having regular contacts with 'Hamas', which controls Gaza and is connected with Iran.  This past week, buried in the back part of the papers, Iraqi newspapers reported that during Obama's visit to Iraq, he asked their leaders to do nothing about the war until after he is elected, and he will 'Take care of things'.
 


Oh, and by the way, remember the college roommates that where born in Pakistan?  They are in charge of all those 'small' Internet campaign contribution for Obama.  Where is that money coming from?  The poor and middle class in this country?  Or could it be from the Middle East? 


And the final bit of news.  On September 7, 2008, The Washington Times posted a verbal slip that was made on 'This Week' with George Stephanapoulos.  Obama on talking about his religion said, 'My Muslim faith'.  When questioned, 'he made a mistake'.  Some mistake!


 All of the above information I got on line.  If you would like to check it - Wikipedia, encyclopedia, Barack Obama; Tony Rezko; Valerie Jarrett: Daily Times - Obama visited Pakistan in 1981; The Washington Times - September 7, 2008; The Times May 10, 2008.


 Now the BIG question - If I found out all this information on my own, Why haven't all of our 'intelligent' members of the press been reporting this?
 


 A phrase that keeps ringing in my ear - 'Beware of the enemy from within'!!!


Don't you know your history?
Yes there has always been a President Elect. They become President Elect after the electorates vote the 2nd week in December. Until then they are still just a citizen. However the media is so anxious to get Bush out (and I don't blame them), that they are not reporting the truth (although that doesn't surprise me from what I saw during the campaign).

However "Office of the President Elect" is new and invented (created out of nothing) by the O.

Here's what one of a hundred different sites says...

Obama Invents 'Office of the President-Elect'

Monday, November 10, 2008 12:54 PM

By: Jim Meyers Article Font Size


Barack Obama has created a stir by proclaiming that he heads “The Office of President-Elect” — an office that does not officially exist.

At his first news conference on Nov. 7, Obama stood at a podium bearing a sign that read: “Office of the President-Elect. Also, his Web site, Change.gov, bears the words “Office of the President-Elect” at the top of its home page.

Writer Larry Anderson referred to the “made-up little title” on the American Thinker Web site, and declared: “I nearly busted a gut ...

“Once again, [Obama] can’t wait to invest himself with the trappings of office.”

Conservative columnist Michelle Malkin wondered: “What other make-believe offices are they going to invent between now and Inauguration Day? I can’t ever recall in my lifetime any mention of such an office.”

Technically speaking, Obama may not even be the President-elect, according to the American Sentinel Web site.

“Megalomaniac Obama’s ego grows even more insufferable,” a weekend posting reads.

“Yes, he will be [president-elect]. But he’s not officially yet, until the Electoral College votes.

“The Constitution provides that on the Monday after the second Wednesday in December, electors convene in their respective state capitals. It’s then that they formally elect the President of the United States, based on the general election results.”

Has anyone ever in history won by this
large of a margin & had the electoral college cast their votes opposite? No. You're grasping at straws.
Are you saying there's a different history?
x
How's this for a history........ sm

Scroll down to the bottom of the 5th page of this report and start reading.  Ogden has argued against opposed the Child Internet Protection Act of 2000, challenged the Child Obsenity and Obscenity Enforcement Act and has represented numerous p*ornographic publishers in various causes.  I think this is more than enough reason to oppose him as DAG.


http://www.scribd.com/full/11607068?access_key=key-18yr2u50t8o0sz54rbrl


You don't know your history very well, do you?
??
There is no issue here.
0
What was the issue again?
nm
For it - should not be an issue
It should not be an issue period. It does not affect me (or anyone else) if Joe & John or Mary & Sara want to get married. As human beings we all have that right.

Civil Union is not the same thing. Talk about discrimination big time. Yes, you love each other but sorry, your of the wrong sex?????

What's next you can only be white to be married or a black and white, hispanic and black or any other combination won't be able to marry.

This is one more issue that should not be political. People should be allowed to marry whomever they wish to and tell everyone else to mind their own business.
this is not a big issue

Your point of view has been expressed. Constant repetition only weakens your case.  If you felt strongly that this was true, you would be confident that you would be proved right and not have to beat a dead horse. Be a member of polite society and consider others' time and interests before you attempt to monopolize a free forum with only your one point over and over.


 


This is a big issue to some of us...

and we are not just repeating ourselves.  We are posting new info for others WHO CARE to read it.  If you are not interested and do not care, DON'T READ IT. 


Interesting post by someone on another site:


ladyplumber10:35AMDec 3rd 2008


When you have 4 different citizenships in question, American, British, Indonesian, and Kenyan, and multiple different names :Barack Obama, aka, Barry Soreto, aka Barack Dunham, aka Barry Dunham...you folks who think this is a piece of cake to wade through are nuts. It's like untangling a badly knotted necklace.
There is a great interview with Alan Keyes on why he is suing Mr Obama in the CA Sumpreme Court in Essence magazine...
http://www.essence.com/news_entertainment/news/articles/alankeyesobama
also it is known that Mr Obama's passport in 1981 at the age of 20 was Indonesian. Ever wonder WHY he has sealed all of his college records @ Columbia and Harvard...likely because he came in under Indonesian
citizenship and qulaified for foreign student grants.
For those of you who think that the certificate shown on his web site is sufficient:
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=80931
PART 1
"Hawaii Revised Statute 338-178 allows registration of birth in Hawaii for a child that was born outside of Hawaii to parents who, for a year preceding the child’s birth, claimed Hawaii as their place of residence," the document said. "The only way to know where Senator Obama was actually born is to view Senator Obama's LONG LEGAL original birth certificate from 1961 that shows the name of the hospital and the name and signature of the doctor that delivered him."

(From Alan Keyes suite against the Sec of State of CA and demanding they hold back the 55 electoral votes)

For those of you who think that even if he was born to an American overseas..he is still a US Citizen...
NOT SO. for the law from 1952-1986 (Obama was born in 1961) states that to an American Citizen and one alien parent in wedlock, the American parent must have resided in the US for 5 years beyond the age of 14 (or the age of 19)Mr Obama's mother was 18 when he was born, so he wouldn't qualify.
http://travel.state.gov/law/info/info_609.html
For those of you who think that he has to have been checked out this far into the game...think again. I met with my DC House REP face to face who said that officials voted into office by the public, don't get checked out...my own rep never had been nor do US senators. The FBI doesn't get involved in political matters, and there is NO PRIOR legal precedent for a prez candidate that wants to keep his life "private". Remember Hillary was the first to challenge his citizenship...but took his short cert of live birth as his long legal birth certificate. This document is not offical enough to get him a passport. So whose job is it to approve a candidate...the candidates own party according to the FBI agent that I interviewed...can you say conflict of interest?! It is also the job of each individual sec of state. Personally, for the prez national election, I think it should be the job of the US Sec of State. Each state sec of state can certify state candidates. FOLKS-this has not resurfaced...it has never left.. but the Obama loving main stream media won't cover it, because they will wind up with egg all over their face. I think a few things are cool: one, that Alan Keyes is the one in CA suing, but no one can call the race card as he is black. Justice Clarence Thomas took the supreme court case, and again no one can call a race card. My DC rep feels that every court in the nation will find a loop hole to dismiss for fear of rioting. I told him that men are fighting and dying overseas to protect our freedoms and our constitution..why should they if we won't protect it from within? Also if the courts were afraid of rioting in the 1950s&1960s SEGREGATION might still be alive today! I would love to see a black man as prez, but not one who had to speak deceit and lies to get there. Let's NOT be in such a hurry to make history, that we are doing nothing to protect history...and to protect our constitution....


http://news.aol.com/political-machine/2008/12/01/obama-birth-certificate-rears-its-ugly-head-again/197#comments


That's not the issue and you know it.
Constitution baby, constitution!
Well, now that's another issue...(sm)

I would argue that the New Deal actually did help the economy, but it wasn't large enough.  During the New Deal the GDP steadily grew with the exception of one period where FDR actually slacked off with his programs and instead did tax cuts.  Unemployment also went down during this period.  I know Fox is saying the New Deal didn't work, but the numbers don't support that theory.


See charts below:


 


EXACTLY!! This isn't a pub/dem issue.........
this is a BIG GOVERNMENT issue. The kind of government that thinks they own the citizens. Of course, Obama's spend spend spend plan is the most outrageous in U.S. history and that's an understatement, but both sides should be ashamed of themselves. I get so sick of seeing the democrats on this board sit idly by as if they are in the right and just point fingers at anyone they perceive as republicans. They forget.......WE ARE THE CITIZENS. I don't give a rat's butt WHO is in office.....NO ONE HAS THE RIGHT TO TAKE MY MONEY AND TAX THE CRAP OUT OF ITS CITIZENS. The government works for us but unfortunately too many in this country have become ignorant to that fact, either by choice or lack of proper education as to their history, constitution, and what that entails of its citizens. They feels no loyalty to this country and do not understand the government is not there to be their leader and caregiver. The government is supposed to work for us and us only, not the United Nations, not some stupid foreign country who has us in their pocket, the Americans of this country....... NOT ILLEGALS EITHER!

We have gotten so far away from the meaning of our constitution; it's not taught in our schools....should we be surprised. After all,our schools are bought and paid for by the government you pay for without any say in the school system, and a bunch of one-sided thinking lamebrains decide the curriculum, so what better than to destroy the constitution so the children never understand anything about loyalty or pride for their country. Instead, they grow up thinking their government is the be all and end all of their lives and without that, we would be nobodies. PLEEZE!!!!

For all those that continue to point at Bush.....HE'S GONE FOLKS!! GET OVER IT! NOW YOU CAN START POINTING FINGERS AT OBAMA!! He's spending and making fake money as fast as he can light up another cigarette.

Obama has no excuse for this disaster he is putting us in.

The reason the majority do not speak up against their tyranical government is because they have become so complacent and when you think about all those who stand or think they stand to come out ahead with this government, they have no problem with sitting back and letting it happen. The day we stop letting illegals vote and special interest groups run this country, we might actually get our country back but that's won't happen until our complacent LEGAL citizens get off their duffs and actually stand up for their country.

Most don't even care and that's what the government is betting on......everyone's lack of education (government schools!) or interest.



The issue is
that men shouldn't be marrying men and women shouldn't be marrying women. The parts don't fit together and it's immoral. Giving them that special "right" will take away the rights of those who believe this behavior is immoral and the right to say so. They should have NEVER been given such a ludicrous "right." And the religious community will keep fighting to right wrongs. :-)
History speaks for itself. sm
You are simply ignorant of it and I said it was ONE of the reasons, not the only reason.  Still trying to twist my words and worm out that you don't know history at all!  Do you EVER watch the History Channel?  Read historical books, not just college course books.  I am through talking to you.  People who can't even admit they are wrong and try to put the onus on someone else aren't worth talking to.  Besides, you are so filled with hatred, I am surprised you didn't say how ugly Bush's daughters are just to throw that in just one more time.
A word on history.
 Whatever it is that is being discussed concering global conflicts, when using history to clarify, define, explain, prove, whatever...I always try to remember that history has always  been written and interpreted by the victor.
Ancient history
I dont care about ancient history.  I care about right now in America. The fact is, the American people have spoken and they have stated with their vote that the Republican controlled congress was not working to their satisfaction or benefit and Bush's ideological based administration was heading American down the wrong track.  I know it must be making many conservatives quite upset but majority rules in America, that is what democracy is, government by the majority of the people.  So, accept it and move on.  Democrats had to for the last 12 years and it was quite a hard pill to swallow at times.  Finally, America will be on the right track and maybe we will be able to rebuild positive relations with the world and get out of Iraq before many more of our heroic soldiers are slaughtered for nothing but a bunch of lies.
You should care about history....
and should learn from it. Sadly, that is something neither party seems to do, and both have left their origins. The sad thing is...as they sow, so shall WE reap.
Your history is messed up

Look what I found in a book about the Democratic party:


The Civil Rights Movement of the 1960s, championed by the party despite opposition at the time from its Southern wing, has continued to inspire the party's liberal principles.


_________


There are also multiple chapters as well as multiple books written about the metamorphosis of BOTH parties since their inception.  See, sometimes books really can be a good thing!!!  By the way, do you get your historical information from the chronic-liars-library or something?  Cuz it surely seems like it. 


Obviously you did not read the history...
I did try to get along...and got attacked wholesale for it. Which seems to be the liberal tack...based only on my experience on this board, mind you.

I do not apologize for finding "the wisdom of the Clinton Presidency" amusing. I know that people would like to think that is the way the Clinton Presidency will be remembered...but unfortunately that will be overshadowed and most people remember him as the President who jumped the intern, lied about it, and was almost removed from office for it.

I have a "fairly broad knowledge base" but pretty much founded 100% founded on those utterly awful right wing rags that make much of America cringe." Please to be specific. What have I said or posted from an utterly awful right wing rag? Please show the post and the right wing rag it came from, please and thank you. My SCHIP information came from the Library of Congress web site and the bill itself...unless you call those right wing rags. On that subject, what are you calling utterly awful right wing rags? Frankly, I think that verbiage would make much of America cringe. And come to that...what do you base THAT statement on?

So...first, what are the utterly awful right wing rags? And then suppor that with "most of America would cringe." Lets see some facts, and not from an utterly awful left wing rag, to use your colorful description. Though until you said that, I really had not viewed them that way. Thank you, really, for a new perspective.

So...let's start with your list of utterly awful right wing rags...and support with fact your assertion that said "rags" "make much of America cringe."


You must know the true history.....
Anyone who has studied history in depth knows West Virginia history and the history of its people. They have been for the most part poor people, black and white, and they are proud people. They made do for themselves, didn't take handouts. It's still that way a lot today and they do look at things a lot differently. Goes back to before civil war days. Knowing that helps me to understand their point of view a little better.