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Army mom, you don't speak for all.

Posted By: Zauber on 2005-09-27
In Reply to: Let me tell you something, gt. - Army Mom

You have a right to voice your opinion and support whom you will. You do not have any more right than the next person to speak for all the troops. At the very moment you having your how DARE you moment, you yourself are attempting to speak for all of them. I know for a fact you are wrong in doing this because I read military message boards frequently and there is no one view represented on them. In fact the majority at this time are anti-Bush and anti-Iraq war. If you don't believe me go and read them yourself.

Isn't it time you stopped lecturing others for wanting to bring the military home from a mission they can't possibly win by any measure of the word and put your outrage to work where it will actually save lives? They can't win. I'm sorry. They could fight until 2020 and all they will do is die. They are not accomplishing anything. It is not their fault! It was the mission itself that was a losing proposition from the start and for that they can't be blamed, they are just doing their jobs as they were trained to do and for that we admire them. But they can't win. There is nothing TO win. There isn't any shame in that. We have bad leaders who did no planning, a bunch of war-avoiding chickenhawks. They are the ones you should be outraged against.

And don't hiss at me - I'm a veteran myself and I know a military snow-job when I see one. As our military deaths double, so does Halliburton stock. Our leaders and their rich friends have no reason to stop the killing and they have every reason to continue it. Our sons and daughters are the pawns in their money-making schemes and don't you think they know it? Most of them do. That doesn't stop them from performing their missions and it doesn't make them cowards simply because they see the game plan for what it is. They CAN'T protest the war. They are not in a position to do so. They rely on us to do it for them. Only we can bring them out of the hell hole. Our leaders are not going to do it unless we demand they do it in a unified voice they can't ignore. Demanding that the troops stay IN Iraq for an undefined mission without end in a war against a vague principle while war profiteers grow rich on their blood doesn't make any sense. THAT is what Cindy Sheehan is saying- not that America isn't worth fighting for like Sean Hannity loves to vomit every other sentence to the gullible and Viet Nam-shellshocked.

THE MISSION IS UNWINNABLE. It's the mission that is not worthwhile, not the troops themselves. Why waste more lives for no purpose? Sunnis want to kill Shiites and you care - why? They have been at it for 700 years or so. We won't change that whether we leave today or five years from now. Wake up. Look at it realistically. Every day we remain Cheney's friends get richer and more mothers lose their loved ones. Come on. Why do you support that? Why would you support the agenda of chickenhawk cowards with all its stinking profiteering undertones more than you support your family member's chance to live life? And why are you angry at those who want to save your son or daughter's life, at those who feel his chance at life is far more important than any contractor's bottom line or egotistical leader's plan to strut on a stage of war glory? Because that really makes no sense. I'm a mother too. I know you want your soldier home safe in one piece regardless of his political views. So why do you fight so hard against those who want exactly the same thing?



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You speak to an Army mom this way. Says a lot about you. nm

You and what army?
.
How is Army Mom sacrificing her son?
Do you really think people are that stupid?  Just like Casey Sheehan ENLISTED.  Army Mom's child ENLISTED too.   You feel the way you feel, but DON'T YOU DARE try to tell us how to feel.  DON'T YOU DARE tell a mother she's sacrificing her son or daughter.  Parent's don't hold that power.  It is completely up to the child  You don't hold the corner on how we should all feel and you will not preach to me and tell me how I should feel.
They are doing that at the Salvation Army
too. Firing people if they arent religious enough or if they wont rat on other employees who dont go to church enough etc. If we dont put a stop to this type of stuff soon, the republicans are going to take all the fun out of living. No dancing, no music, no love, no life, just hate disguised under the flag and religion. Its scary your right.
I was a leader in the Army
Serving in the Army, I know what it is like to be a leader. It not something you learn overnight and doesn't come automatically. It takes years to become a good leader and your actions determine whether or not you are one. A leader exhibits certain qualities (confidence, self-discipline, and intelligence to name a couple). To be a good leader you must listen to many. Communicate with your peers for advice to make the best informed decision. You need to back your people up. You need to stick by them and stick up for them. You need to treat them with respect. You need to be the first to put your foot down on enemy territory and the last to take your foot off. You need to have a vision and see the big picture. You need to communicate effectively and find common ground to work together. You need to be able to motivate and inspire, and most importantly hold yourself to the highest of standards. And you never ever quit. Quitting is not an option. I could probably go on at length about being a leader.

The post above has nothing to do with being a leader. Putting off a debate in the times that we are going through so that you can go back to Washington to do your job and help to fix the problem is the responsible thing to do, which goes to show again that Sen. John McCain is a truly responsible leader. He is putting the American people before his own self interest. This crisis must be resolved before anything further can go on. How do you expect to tackle any of the other issues if we can't even get our own country back on track.

Sen John McCain is a true leader. He is telling us it should not fall upon us to bail out the execs while they walk away with millions, and he is the first to put his campaigning on hold to do this. This is the same courage he showed when he was in a POW camp and would not leave before the other soldiers in the camp. Sen. McCain stands up for what is right and will not quit until a solution has been set. He and Gov. Sarah Palin have proven they are not afraid to go against the "good ol boys", while Sen Obama goes along with the good ol boys. If Sen Obama would let the people know that the money he received as a kickback from FMFM he would be paying back would give me a little more confidence that he does care about the people, but Obama, Dodd, Kerry and others (and yes some republicans) are not about to hand back any of the money.

Sen Obama is a smooth talker and that is about all. He tells you what you want to hear but he does not follow through. He is just one more politician giving us a line of hooey thinking he has us fooled (obvious he does have some fooled) but luckily others see through him.

Also, not sure what TV station you watched but Sen McCain did not put off the convention. It went on just as it planned to exactly the dates it was supposed to. Just like the Democratic convention.
Join the Army and BYOB

(In this case, the *B* stands for body armor.)


From: http://www.optruth.org/index.php?option=content&task=view&id=258&Itemid=66







Body Armor Reimbursement | Print |




OEF/OIF Vets: Did you buy your own body armor, helmet, or other protective gear?  The Pentagon has finally agreed to reimburse you.  Read this article, and get paid back.

October 5, 2005: Once again, Operation Truth’s Online Army helped ensure that those who are risking their lives for this nation get the support they need. After receiving over 5,000 messages from Operation Truth members, the Senate approved an amendment offered by Senator Christopher Dodd, ordering the Secretary of Defense to follow the law and reimburse Troops who were forced to buy their own protective equipment for use in the war in Iraq.


Feeling the pressure from the Senate move, the Department of Defense immediately announced that it will end its stalling and pay Troops back, starting immediately.


OEF/OIF Troops: Here’s what you need to know to get paid back.


Requirements:


1) The equipment must be on a list of critical safety or health equipment that was in short supply. This list includes combat helmets, ballistic eye protection, hydration systems, and tactical vests, including body armor and body armor inserts.  Other equipment, like scopes, are likely to be added soon.


2) With receipts, you’ll be reimbursed for an item’s actual purchase price and shipping cost(up to $1,100 per item). If you don’t have receipts, you will be reimbursed a standard estimated cost for each item.  Here's a partial list of estimated costs:


reimburse.jpg 


3) All reimbursed items become property of the U.S. government and must be turned in to the unit logistics officer, unless they were destroyed in combat or are otherwise no longer available for good reason.


Here’s what you have to do:


Submit Department of Defense Form 2902, Claim for Reimbursement for Privately Purchased Protective, Safety or Health Equipment used in Combat form to your chain of command. If you’ve separated from the service, you can submit this form to an authorizing official designated by their former service at an address on the form.

All claims must be submitted by Oct. 3, 2006.


Army is now recruiting the disabled.






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This speaks volumes and is one of the saddest and most disgusting things I've read in a long time about the administration of compassionate conservatism.   


http://www.oregonlive.com/printer/printer.ssf?/base/news/1146882329307730.xml&coll=7







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An Army of one wrong recruit


Autism - The signing of a disabled Portland man despite warnings reflects problems nationally for military enlistment

Sunday, May 07, 2006
MICHELLE ROBERTS
The Oregonian

Jared Guinther is 18. Tall and lanky, he will graduate from Marshall High School in June. Girls think he's cute, until they try to talk to him and he stammers or just stands there -- silent.


Diagnosed with autism at age 3, Jared is polite but won't talk to people unless they address him first. It's hard for him to make friends. He lives in his own private world.


Jared didn't know there was a war raging in Iraq until his parents told him last fall -- shortly after a military recruiter stopped him outside a Southeast Portland strip mall and complimented him on his black Converse All Stars.


When Jared first started talking about joining the Army, I thought, 'Well, that isn't going to happen,' said Paul Guinther, Jared's father. I told my wife not to worry about it. They're not going to take anybody in the service who's autistic.


But they did. Last month, Jared came home with papers showing that he not only had enlisted, but also had signed up for the Army's most dangerous job: cavalry scout. He is scheduled to leave for basic training Aug. 16.


Officials are now investigating whether recruiters at the U.S. Army Recruiting Station in Southeast Portland improperly concealed Jared's disability, which should have made him ineligible for service.


Jared's story illustrates a growing national problem as the military faces increasing pressure to hit recruiting targets during an unpopular war.


Tracking by the Pentagon shows that complaints about recruiting improprieties are on pace to approach record highs set in 2003 and 2004. The active Army and the Reserve missed recruiting targets last year, and reports of recruiting abuses continue from across the country.


A family in Ohio reported that its mentally ill son was signed up, despite rules banning such enlistments and the fact that records about his illness were readily available.


In Houston, a recruiter warned a potential enlistee that if he backed out of a meeting he would be arrested.


And in Colorado, a high school student working undercover told recruiters he had dropped out and had a drug problem. The recruiter told the boy to fake a diploma and buy a product to help him beat a drug test.


Violations such as these forced the Army to halt recruiting for a day last May so recruiters could be retrained and reminded of the job's ethical requirements.


The Portland Army Recruiting Battalion Headquarters opened its investigation into Jared's case last week after his parents called The Oregonian and the newspaper began asking questions about his enlistment.


Maj. Curt Steinagel, commander of the Military Entrance Processing Station in Portland, said the papers filled out by Jared's recruiters contained no indication of his disability. Steinagel acknowledged that the current climate is tough on recruiters here and elsewhere.


I can't speak for the Army, he said, but it's no secret that recruiters stretch and bend the rules because of all the pressure they're under. The problem exists, and we all know it exists.


Diagnosis and struggle


Jared lives in a tiny brown house in Southeast Portland that looks as worn out as his parents do when they get home from work.


Paul Guinther, 57, labors 50 to 60 hour weeks as a painter-sandblaster at Sundial Marine Tug & Barge Works in Troutdale. His wife, Brenda, 50, has the graveyard housekeeping shift at Kaiser Permanente Sunnyside Medical Center in Clackamas.


The couple got together nearly 16 years ago when Jared was 3. Brenda, who had two young children of her own, immediately noticed that Jared was different and pushed Paul to have the boy tested.


Jared would play with buttons for hours on end, she said. He'd play with one toy for days. Loud noises bothered him. He was scared to death of the toilet flushing, the lawn mower.


Jared didn't speak until he was almost 4 and could not tolerate the feel of grass on his feet.


Doctors diagnosed him with moderate to severe autism, a developmental disorder that strikes when children are toddlers. It causes problems with social interaction, language and intelligence. No one knows its cause or cure.


School and medical records show that Jared, whose recent verbal IQ tested very low, spent years in special education classes. It was only when he was a high school senior that Brenda pushed for Jared to take regular classes because she wanted him to get a normal rather than a modified diploma.


Jared required extensive tutoring and accommodations to pass, but in June he will graduate alongside his younger stepbrother, Matthew Thorsen.


Last fall, Jared began talking about joining the military after a recruiter stopped him on his way home from school and offered a $4,000 signing bonus, $67,000 for college and more buddies than he could count.


Matthew told his mother that military recruiting at the school and surrounding neighborhoods was so intense that one recruiter had pulled him out of football practice.


Recruiters in Portland and nationwide spend several hours a day cold-calling high school students, whose phone numbers are provided by schools under the No Child Left Behind Law. They also prospect at malls, high school cafeterias, colleges and wherever else young people gather.


Brenda phoned her two brothers, both veterans. She said they laughed and told her not to worry. The military would never take Jared.


The Guinthers, meanwhile, tried to refocus their son.


I told him, 'Jared, you get out of high school. I know you don't want to be a janitor all your life. You work this job, you go to community college, you find out what you want. You can live here as long as you want,' Paul said.


They thought it had worked until five weeks ago. Brenda said she called Jared on his cell phone to check what time he'd be home.


I said 'Jared, what are you doing?' 'I'm taking the test,' he said -- the entrance test. I go, 'Wait a minute.' I said, 'Who's giving you the test?' He said, 'Corporal.' I said, 'Well let me talk to him.'


Brenda said she spoke to Cpl. Ronan Ansley and explained that Jared had a disability, autism, that could not be outgrown. She said Ansley told her he had been in special classes, too -- for dyslexia.


I said, 'Wait a minute, there's a big difference between autism and your problem,' Brenda said.


Military rules prohibit enlisting anyone with a mental disorder that interferes with school or employment, unless a recruit can show he or she hasn't required special academic or job accommodations for 12 months.


Jared has been in special education classes since preschool. Through a special program for disabled workers, he has a part-time job scrubbing toilets and dumping trash.


Jared scored 43 out of 99 on the Army's basic entrance exam -- 31 is the lowest grade the Army allows for enlistment, military officials said.


After learning that Jared had cleared this first hurdle toward enlistment, Brenda said, she called and asked for Ansley's supervisor and got Sgt. Alejandro Velasco.


She said she begged Velasco to review Jared's medical and school records. Brenda said Velasco declined, asserting that he didn't need any paperwork. Under military rules, recruiters are required to gather all available information about a recruit and fill out a medical screening form.


He was real cocky and he says, 'Well, Jared's an 18-year-old man. He doesn't need his mommy to make his decisions for him.'


Question of comprehension


The Guinthers are not political activists. They supported the Iraq war in the beginning but have started to question it as fighting dragged on. Brenda Guinther said that if her son Matthew had enlisted, she wouldn't like it, but I would learn to live with it because I know he would understand the consequences.


But Jared doesn't understand the dangers or the details of what he has done, the Guinthers said.


When they asked Jared how long he would be in the Army, he said he didn't know. His enlistment papers show it's just over four years. Jared also was disappointed to learn that he wouldn't be paid the $4,000 signing bonus until after basic training.


During a recent family gathering, a relative asked Jared what he would do if an enemy was shooting at him. Jared ran to his video game console and killed a digital Xbox soldier and announced, See! I can do it!


My concern is that if he got into a combat situation he really couldn't take someone's back, said Mary Lou Perry, 51, a longtime friend of the Guinthers'. He wouldn't really know a dangerous thing. This job they have him doing, it's like send him in and if he doesn't get blown up, it's safe for the rest of us.


Steinagel, the processing station commander, told The Oregonian that Jared showed up after passing his written exam. None of his paperwork indicated that he was autistic, but if it had, Jared almost certainly would have been disqualified, he said.


On Tuesday, a reporter visited the U.S. Army Recruiting Station at the Eastport Plaza Shopping Center, where Velasco said he had not been told about Jared's autism.


Cpl. Ansley is Guinther's recruiter, he said. I was unaware of any type of autism or anything like that.


Velasco initially denied knowing Jared but later said he'd spent a lot of time mentoring him because Jared was going to become a cavalry scout. The job entails engaging the enemy with anti-armor weapons and scout vehicles, according to an Army recruiting Web site.


After he had spoken for a few moments, Velasco suddenly grabbed the reporter's tape recorder and tried to tear out the tape, stopping only after the reporter threatened to call the police.


With the Guinthers' permission, The Oregonian faxed Jared's medical records to the U.S. Army Recruiting Battalion commander, Lt. Col. David Carlton in Portland, who on Wednesday ordered the investigation.


The Guinthers said that on Tuesday evening, Cpl. Ansley showed up at their door. They said Ansley stated that he would probably lose his job and face dishonorable discharge unless they could stop the newspaper's story.


Ansley, reached at his recruiting office Thursday, declined to comment for this story.


S. Douglas Smith, spokesman for the U.S. Army Recruiting Command, in Fort Knox, Ky., said he could not comment on specifics of the investigation in Portland. But he defended the 8,200 recruiters working for the active Army and Army Reserve.


Last year, the Army relieved 44 recruiters from duty and admonished 369.


Everyone in recruiting is let down when one of our recruiters fails to uphold the Army's and Recruiting Command's standards, Smith said.


The Guinthers are eager to hear whether the Army will release Jared from his enlistment. Jared is disappointed he might not go because he thought the recruiters were his friends, they said. But they're willing to accept that.


If he went to Iraq and got hurt or killed, Paul Guinther said, I couldn't live with myself knowing I didn't try to stop it.


©2006 The Oregonian


 


The sicko who shot the army soldier

and murdered him justifies himself by saying it was not a murder; it was a justified killing.......    Our liberal media has been so hush hush about the murder of this solider, maybe they think they same thing!!  They sure have talked about the baby murderer's murder til I'm sick to death of hearing it!!! 


Too bad Obama thought discussing the tiller murder was more important than mentioning a soldier's murder in THIS country due to a sicko islamic convert within our own country....  speaks volumes to me...


The sicko who shot the army soldier

and murdered him justifies himself by saying it was not a murder; it was a justified killing.......    Our liberal media has been so hush hush about the murder of this solider, maybe they think they same thing!!  They sure have talked about the baby murderer's murder til I'm sick to death of hearing it!!! 


Too bad Obama thought discussing the tiller murder was more important than mentioning a soldier's murder in THIS country due to a sicko islamic convert within our own country....  speaks volumes to me...


oops - wherever I say Army I mean all branches of the military service
Not just the Army. The Marines, Air Force, Navy, everyone is included. Just wanted to clarify that.
You fail to note that the Army Corp of Engineers....
is a federal entity and it was THEIR job to fix the levies, too bad W cut all the funding so he could play Monopoly in Iraq.
U.S. Army Intelligence Analyst Accused of Disloyaty for Doubts...

Thousands are rallying behind this guy as the story makes its way around the web.  The story is just below the picture. 


http://www.williambowles.info/gispecial/2006/0806/280806/gi_4h28_280806.html


 


So a FREE society cuts billions from the army corp of engineers....
so, literally, whole cities drown but we can spend trillions on a war based on lies and support corporations like Halliburton. Sure, why not. It has worked very, very well.
Army order soldiers to get rid of better body armor or lose death benefits
Army Orders Soldiers to Shed Dragon Skin or Lose SGLI Death Benefits

By Nathaniel R. Helms

Two deploying soldiers and a concerned mother reported Friday afternoon that the U.S. Army appears to be singling out soldiers who have purchased Pinnacle's Dragon Skin Body Armor for special treatment. The soldiers, who are currently staging for combat operations from a secret location, reported that their commander told them if they were wearing Pinnacle Dragon Skin and were killed their beneficiaries might not receive the death benefits from their $400,000 SGLI life insurance policies. The soldiers were ordered to leave their privately purchased body armor at home or face the possibility of both losing their life insurance benefit and facing disciplinary action.

The soldiers asked for anonymity because they are concerned they will face retaliation for going public with the Army's apparently new directive. At the sources' requests DefenseWatch has also agreed not to reveal the unit at which the incident occured for operational security reasons.

On Saturday morning a soldier affected by the order reported to DefenseWatch that the directive specified that all commercially available body armor was prohibited. The soldier said the order came down Friday morning from Headquarters, United States Special Operations Command (HQ, USSOCOM), located at MacDill Air Force Base, Florida. It arrived unexpectedly while his unit was preparing to deploy on combat operations. The soldier said the order was deeply disturbiing to many of the men who had used their own money to purchase Dragon Skin because it will affect both their mobility and ballistic protection.

We have to be able to move. It (Dragon Skin) is heavy, but it is made so we have mobility and the best ballistic protection out there. This is crazy. And they are threatening us with our benefits if we don't comply. he said.

The soldier reiterated Friday's reports that any soldier who refused to comply with the order and was subsequently killed in action could be denied the $400,000 death benefit provided by their SGLI life insurance policy as well as face disciplinary action.

As of this report Saturday morning the Army has not yet responded to a DefenseWatch inquiry.

Recently Dragon Skin became an item of contention between proponents of the Interceptor OTV body armor generally issued to all service members deploying in combat theaters and its growing legion of critics. Critics of the Interceptor OTV system say it is ineffective and inferior to Dragon Skin, as well as several other commercially available body armor systems on the market. Last week DefenseWatch released a secret Marine Corps report that determined that 80% of the 401 Marines killed in Iraq between April 2004 and June 2005 might have been saved if the Interceptor OTV body armor they were wearing was more effective. The Army has declined to comment on the report because doing so could aid the enemy, an Army spokesman has repeatedly said.

A U.S. Army spokesman was not available for comment at the time DW's original report (Friday - 1700 CST) was published. DefenseWatch continues to seek a response from the Army and will post one as soon as it becomes available. Yesterday the DoD released a news story through the Armed Forces News Service that quoted Maj. Gen. Steven Speaks, the Army's director of force development, who countered critical media reports by denying that the U.S. military is behind the curve in providing appropriate force protection gear for troops deployed to Iraq and elsewhere in the global war against terrorism. The New York Tiimes and Washington Post led the bandwagon of mainstream media that capitalized on DefenseWatch's release of the Marine Corps study. Both newspapers released the forensic information the Army and Marines are unwilling to discuss.

Those headlines entirely miss the point, Speaks said.

The effort to improve body armor has been a programmatic effort in the case of the Army that has gone on with great intensity for the last five months, he noted.

Speaks' assessment contradicts earlier Army, Marine and DoD statements that indicated as late as last week that the Army was certain there was nothing wrong with Interceptor OTV body armor and that it was and remains the best body armor in the world.

One of the soldiers who lost his coveted Dragon Skin is a veteran operator. He reported that his commander expressed deep regret upon issuing his orders directing him to leave his Dragon Skin body armor behind. The commander reportedly told his subordinates that he had no choice because the orders came from very high up and had to be enforced, the soldier said. Another soldier's story was corroborated by his mother, who helped defray the $6,000 cost of buying the Dragon Skin, she said.

The mother of the soldier, who hails from the Providence, Rhode Island area, said she helped pay for the Dragon Skin as a Christmas present because her son told her it was so much better than the Interceptor OTV they expected to be issued when arriving in country for a combat tour.

He didn't want to use that other stuff, she said. He told me that if anything happened to him I am supposed to raise hell.

At the time the orders were issued the two soldiers had already loaded their Dragon Skin body armor onto the pallets being used to air freight their gear into the operational theater, the soldiers said. They subsequently removed it pursuant to their orders.

Currently nine U.S. generals stationed in Afghanistan are reportedly wearing Pinnacle Dragon Skin body armor, according to company spokesman Paul Chopra. Chopra, a retired Army chief warrant officer and 20+-year pilot in the famed 160th Nightstalkers Special Operations Aviation Regiment (Airborne), said his company was merely told the generals wanted to evaluate the body armor in a combat environment. Chopra said he did not know the names of the general officers wearing the Dragon Skin.

Pinnacle claims more than 3,000 soldiers and civilians stationed in Iraq and Afghanistan are wearing Dragon Skin body armor, Chopra said. Several months ago DefenseWatch began receiving anecdotal reports from individual soldiers that they were being forced to remove all non-issue gear while in theater, including Dragon Skin body armor, boots, and various kinds of non-issue ancillary equipment.

Last year the DoD, under severe pressure from Congress, authorized a one-time $1,000 reimbursement to soldiers who had purchased civilian equipment to supplement either inadequate or unavailable equipment they needed for combat operations. At the time there was no restriction on what the soldiers could buy as long as it was specifically intended to offer personal protection or further their mission capabilities while in theater.

Well I can only speak on what I saw.
I didn't see a post about Nan being old and to die in hell, so pardon me on that.

And I didn't say that you had left before. Reread the post. I was walking about Nan having left before basically, and said she wasn't coming back.
Odd, that you should speak for gt SM

One might think she doesn't have a voice of her own.  Or one might think other things. 


Sure, but I can't speak for the others. nm
.
So now you speak for God. Wow, gt. sm
You are more of an elitist pig than I thought possible.  But I mean that in a good way.  Am I fried now?
So now you speak for God.
That was only one of the sites.  And God forbid people are brought to Christ.  
SO WHAT??!! WHERE DOES IT SAY SHE CAN'T SPEAK?!

Nobody told her she doesn't have the right to speak.


That's quite a stretch even for YOU, MT.


as we speak
POTUS is lamenting the state of government -- of course it is all the fault of Congress.  He tries and tries but "they" prevent any movement.  Poor chimpie.
I have a right to speak

out about the incompetency of the supposed "leader" of the free world.  Each episode of ignorance, distortion of facts, and deception needs to be brought into the light and examined repeatedly. It is cumulative.  I brush aside the label of "bush bashing" as another neocon attempt to frame the issue.  I will continue to post as I wish and to refuse to engage in discussion with anyone whose purpose is simply to gain attention, even if negative.  I do feel compassion for those so abused and ignored throughout life that they will take any acknowledgement as life-affirming, but I do not take it upon myself to feed their insatiable desire to be noticed.  I am encouraged by the split in the repub party into small groups of supporters, but the dems have got this pres election in the bag anyway not only due to their fresh, positive approach but the self-destruction of the repubs by their own arrogance and corruption.


 


 


 


I can only speak to myself....
but I pray concerning basically every decision I make. Not because I think the decision is God's will, but that whatever His will will be done. I saw the same clip (I think) and I think that is what Palin meant, not that the pipeline itself was specifically God's will, but to pray for the success of the venture, ask that it go well, but in the end, God's will be done. God is very real to us and praying is just communicating with him. Talking to him. It is a relationship, like with a dear friend. That is the best short description I can give. This is from my experience only. Others may not have the same experience.
speak for yourself
x
Speak for yourself

I have briefly (mercifully) lived in an fabulous neighborhood consisting of a bunch of old guys who only cared about golf and their wives who had faces stretched back to their spine and stapled.  It was really very boring.  Give me the rich vibrancy of a middle-class neighborhood any day.  Just my opinion!


 


 


did he ever speak out against it at all? nm
x
sorry to say, he is on Fox as we speak
with all their promises, which sound just great, but who is going to pay for all these great promises?
Perhaps you would like to speak to.....sm
letters that are being sent to pastors of churches in our area (and maybe nationwide, I haven't researched it yet) that tells them if they mention anything political in the pulpit, then their church will lose its tax-exempt status. While I don't go for politics in the pulpit, I also don't go for the government telling pastors what they can and cannot preach about.

It would seem to me that one side is just as guilty of "crossing party lines" as the other.
Once again, you know not what you speak.....
Indonesian lawyer DOES give the parent the right to renounce the child's citizenship to another country. The U.S. does happen to recognize this with Indonesia, so it was done and the papers were there to prove it. Only when Obama turns of age could he RENOUNCE his citizenship with Indonesia, which he has not done.

The attorney I speak of is in New York and has been doing this for over 30 years. He deals with foreign adoptions every day and each country has its own red tape and laws. Indonesia is one he has spoken of many times with regards to Obama and those attorneys who have dealt one-on-one with Indonesian law know this.

You seem to belive all countries recognize the United States.....they don't. BTW, during the time Obama was in Indonesia and adopted by his stepfather, the laws were clear that no one could go to school in Indonesia unless they were an Indonesian citizen, i.e., Obama.

And, yes, it does matter what Indonesian law says because Obama is Indonesian by adoption. He has NO papers proving his U.S. citizenship in the first place but he does have papers proving INdonesian citizenship, of which he has not renounced as of today.

Matter of fact, the only papers he has proving ANY citizenship is that of Indonesia and Kenya, when his father was alive.

Sorry to disappoint ya......
Maybe you should just speak for yourself...(sm)
instead of assuming that everyone is like you.
The whole 9/11 is being rewritten even as we speak. SM

A lot of new information coming out and guess what!!!! It does not point out, as you and others have said ont his board before, that Bush had anything to do with it.   I am not sure what you hissy fit throwers are gonna do about that.  By the way, I think this post serves as a classic example of what is wrong with the Democratic party of today.  Anti-Americanism in its pure form.  Michael Moore would be so PROUD of you!


You do not speak the truth, either
The truth is different for different folks. What about all the service men and women who 100 percent support the anti-war protests? Do they DARE to speak?

You may not realize it but there are MANY ex-military and current military who DO NOT SUPPORT THIS WAR!!! You need to look beyond what you only want to see.

And if being anti-American means to oppose what is morally wrong, well....I will say no more.

Please do not claim that you support our troops. That is not the truth either. You support the current administration's war/invasion plan, but not the troops.
Don't tell her she doesn't have a right to speak

If Cindy Sheehan had the right to spew her feelings Army Mom has that right too.  Works both ways as bad as you HATE it...


They told her she did not have a right to speak and a lot of other
pretty awful things as well, Democrat.  I am sorry you are so blinded by the hatred that was shown to this poster.  Besides, she never said she spoke for everyone.
Do you always speak of yourself in the third person? sm
I see no difference in your writing style.  Same old stuff.
I was presuming to speak for those ...
Only I know who was included in we and the we I refer to are well aware of who they are are are fine with being included in we. And, sigh...it really does not matter to me if my post does not make sense to you, or if in reading the explanation to you it remains obtuse. Sighhhhhhh.
I can't speak for Lydia. sm
but I don't think it bothers us as much as it disturbs us.  I don't know how old you were during Vietnam.  I was in college when my husband went to war.  My father had just come home. I had rebeled in my late teenage years and decided I most decidedly was not a Republican. I don't know why, just a transition I suppose.  Anyway, I saw first hand the entire face of America change in Vietnam.  I was confronted with the war protesters and the slogans and the chants and the posters daily.  I grew to dislike it.  I saw what it was doing and I moved away from it.  At some point, I realized, it was time to grow up and construct a profit-and-loss statement of my commitments and their consequences.  Some very high profile names had their awakening and taking stock moment at that time and they moved away from the left, as well.   I was never a leftist.  I do believe I was a true Democrat though, at least for a time.  The leftists drove me out. They have taken over the Democratic party and transformed it into something men like Zell Miller no longer recognize.  It's too bad.  There was a time it was a party to be proud of. 
Speak for you own baby...
zzzzzzzzzzzz
You can't speak for all of us. As a woman,
nm
I can't speak for "pubs" ....I'm not one....
and I do have a sense of humor. But attacking someone personally and making them the butt of pretty tasteless jokes is not funny to me. Not funny about Obama, not funny about Biden, not funny about Michelle Obama, not funny about Cindy McCain...not funny about Sarah Palin. You guys go ballistic if someone says ANYthing about Obama. And just yuck it up tearing Sarah Palin to pieces. That goes way past "a sense of humor."
Maybe you'd better speak slower
It's okay for you to talk down to me and insult my intelligence, but it bothers you if I come back with a similar response.  I didn't take kindly to your smart-aleck reply.  If you want to disagree fine, but don't insult someone else and not expect the same treatment back in return. 
Speak of Sam, what happened to her? nm
x
I can't speak for Chele
but I am not against the poor. I am against keeping me down until the poor catch up. I would probably be considered low income as my husband and I brought in $24,000 last year between the both of us. But you know what? I have taken a second job this year, and he finished his degree and graduated. We are WORKING towards bettering ourselves. Not waiting on someone to come by and say "hey, here's a check for being poor."

Most people that are poor are so because of what they have or haven't done. Yes, there are some people who legitimately have bad luck and can't ever get out of the hole. But more often than not, it's the bad choices they made, the drugs they did, the school they dropped out of, etc. Most "poor people" are able-bodied individuals who could go get a job and start to work their way up out of the hole. But they give up, pop out ten babies, and let the government take care of them. I mean it's a sweet deal isn't it?

What makes me sick is driving by the project 8 low income housing in my area and seeing these folks who only pay $60 a month in rent yet they have BMWs and Yukons and all these nice brand new vehicles parked out front.

But, by all means, please lets continue to "take care" of them.

Yes, those people who are rich by illegal means should be taken down. But those who have worked their butts off to get to the top are not evil. They shouldn't be punished for achieving what you couldn't. More than likely you could if you wanted to.

Yes, I am an MT. I enjoy this job, but I want to do something more with my life. Therefore I will work two jobs and take classes online until I can get my degree. Is it going to suck for awhile? Oh yeah. But you know what? In the end, when I have that degree, and I'm one of those comfortable "rich" people you hate so much, I'll be able to look back and know that I got there on my own. I didn't climb up anyone's back or grab onto their coattails to get there.

No one is against the poor. Those who are legitimately in the dumps and need a hand should get it. But only to get on their feet. Then they need to get out and work just like the rest of us!

STOP THE HANDOUTS!
I assume you speak for yourself

I care about it. Speak for yourself, not others
But I guess you think that's how this country should run. 
Yes, I saw him speak today as well
nm
The troops speak

Replying to a post below, I thought this would be a good link in a separate message in case people skip over it below.


The US Military troops speak and here is what they say - 68% for McCain, 23% Obama.  Here is the link below.


http://activemilitaryformccain.blogspot.com/


So if you take that, plus Obama has a 5 point lead over McCain in today's polls, plus the 11% who are not decided it is a very close call.  November 4th is going to be an excited day for sure.


Please do not presume to speak
If you are so frustrated with repeating this paranoia over and over, then DON'T. That would be a welcome relief for us all. The people who voted for him (and those who did not, for that matter) know NOTHING OF THE KIND. There is not a single, solitary grain of truth in this mass delusion and certainly no proof exists to back up any of this BS. If there were, Berg would not have sought his legal action based on "standing." He would have actually been able to present something concrete.

No one here is violating the Constitution, but the loons who insist on pursuing their law suits to nowhere are making a mockery out of our justice system, not to mention the fact that they have now taken to internet extorsion scheme to finance their lunacy.

You are really not dealing with a full deck if you seriously believe your floodgate statement. There is nothing derogatory about the sore/sour epithets, since they accurately describe the motivations behind all the hoop-lah.

A US citizen has been elected, so don't worry your pretty little head about our Constitution. Obama is not strutting around anywhere. He is selecting his cabinet and preparing himself for the unenviable and daunting task of mopping up after W. He holds a 192-electoral vote lead over McCain, so no doubt the process will continue as it is supposed to and the result will reflect the will of the American people. The only possible miscarriage of justice here is the wack jobs' unsuccessful attempts to usurp a clean, legitimate election which has resulted in a very clear mandate for Obama.

No one has to wonder why Obama "skirted up" so fat (whatever that means), but you go ahead and ponder that one a while longer. Who knows, you may actually have a moment of insight that will reveal just how ignorant this birth certificate witch hunt really is. The people who are promoting this stupidity are an embarassment to our entire nation.
It is good to think before you speak!
At least Barack Obama thinks before he speaks, which is something everyone should do, especially our elected officials. I would rather have someone like Barack Obama who thinks carefully about his words than someone like George Bush or Sarah Palin who are barely able to put together a proper sentence, much less make any sense!
Why7 & how to think before you speak.
This is a lesson everyone should learn!

http://www.wikihow.com/Think-Before-Speaking
Thinking before you speak
What masses are you talking about? Who exactly thinks they're going to get freebies? Who worships the ground he walks on?

The guy thinks before he speaks because he's a thinker. He wants to make sure that what comes out of his mouth is exactly what he wants to convey.

It's easy to hurl unfounded insults, isn't it? You don't have to think to do that.

Gimme a break.