Home     Contact Us    
Main Board Job Seeker's Board Job Wanted Board Resume Bank Company Board Word Help Medquist New MTs Classifieds Offshore Concerns VR/Speech Recognition Tech Help Coding/Medical Billing
Gab Board Politics Comedy Stop Health Issues
ADVERTISEMENT




Serving Over 20,000 US Medical Transcriptionists

Articles of impeachment filed on Cheney sm

Posted By: LVMT on 2007-04-24
In Reply to:


Rep. Dennis Kucinich (D-OH), the former mayor of Cleveland who is seeking the 2008 Democratic nomination for president for the second time, introduced articles to impeach Vice President Dick Cheney Tuesday, basing his decision on Cheney's initial push to send the United States into war with Iraq.

The vice president is beating the same drums of war against Iran that he beat against Iraq under false pretenses, and he's doing it all over again, against Iran, Kucinich said. And I say that it's time to stand up to that. Our country couldn't afford this last war. We can't afford to go into another one. And somebody has to challenge the conduct of this Vice President.

See: http://www.cnn.com/POLITICS/blogs/politicalticker/2007/04/kucinich-takes-steps-to-impeach-cheney.html




Complete Discussion Below: marks the location of current message within thread

The messages you are viewing are archived/old.
To view latest messages and participate in discussions, select the boards given in left menu


Other related messages found in our database

Furtherance of Cheney impeachment

House Judiciary Trio Calls for Impeach Cheney Hearings


by John Nichols


Three senior members of the House Judiciary Committee have called for the immediate opening of impeachment hearings for Vice President Richard Cheney.


Democrats Robert Wexler of Florida, Luis Gutierrez of Illinois and Tammy Baldwin of Wisconsin on Friday distributed a statement, “A Case for Hearings,” that declares, “The issues at hand are too serious to ignore, including credible allegations of abuse of power that if proven may well constitute high crimes and misdemeanors under our constitution. The charges against Vice President Cheney relate to his deceptive actions leading up to the Iraq war, the revelation of the identity of a covert agent for political retaliation, and the illegal wiretapping of American citizens.”


In particular, the Judiciary Committee members cite the recent revelation by former White House press secretary Scott McClellan that the Vice President and his staff purposefully gave him false information about the outing of Valerie Plame Wilson as a covert agent as part of a White House campaign to discredit her husband, former Ambassador Joe Wilson. On the basis of McClellan’s statements, Wexler, Gutierrez and Baldwin say, “it is even more important for Congress to investigate what may have been an intentional obstruction of justice.” The three House members argue that, “Congress should call Mr. McClellan to testify about what he described as being asked to ‘unknowingly [pass] along false information.’”


Adding to the sense of urgency, the members note that “recent revelations have shown that the Administration including Vice President Cheney may have again manipulated and exaggerated evidence about weapons of mass destruction — this time about Iran’s nuclear capabilities.”


Although Wexler, Gutierrez and Baldwin are close to Judiciary Committee chair John Conyers, getting the Michigan Democrat to open hearings on impeachment will not necessarily be easy. Though Conyers was a leader in suggesting during the last Congress that both President Bush and Vice President Cheney had committed impeachable offenses, he has been under immense pressure from House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, D-California, to keep Constitutional remedies for executive excesses “off the table” in this Congress.


It is notable, however, that Baldwin maintains warm relations with Pelosi and that Wexler, a veteran member of the Judiciary Committee has historically had an amiable and effective working relationship with Conyers. There is no question that Conyers, who voted to keep open the impeachment debate on November 7, has been looking for a way to explore the charges against Cheney. The move by three of his key allies on the committee may provide the chairman with the opening he seeks, although it is likely he will need to hear from more committee members before making any kind of break with Pelosi — or perhaps convincing her that holding hearings on Cheney’s high crimes and misdemeanors is different from putting a Bush impeachment move on the table.


The most important immediate development, however, is the assertion of an “ask” for supporters of impeachment. Pulled in many directions in recent months, campaigners for presidential and vice presidential accountability have focused their attention on supporting a House proposal by Ohio Congressman Dennis Kucinich, a candidate for the Democratic presidential nod, to impeach Cheney. When Kucinich forced consideration of his resolution on November 7, Pelosi and her allies used procedural moves to get it sent to the Judiciary Committee for consideration. Pelosi’s hope was that the proposal would disappear into the committee’s files.


The call for hearings by Wexler, Gutierrez and Baldwin puts impeachment on the table, at least as far as activists are concerned, creating a pressure point that can serve as a reply when House Democrats who are critical of Bush but cautious about impeachment ask: “What do you want me to do?” The answer can now be: “Back the call for Judiciary Committee hearings on whether to impeach Cheney?”


“Some of us were in Congress during the impeachment hearings of President Clinton. We spent a year and a half listening to testimony about President Clinton’s personal relations. This must not be the model for impeachment inquires. A Democratic Congress can show that it takes its constitutional authority seriously and hold a sober investigation, which will stand in stark contrast to the kangaroo court convened by Republicans for President Clinton. In fact, the worst legacy of the Clinton impeachment - where the GOP pursued trumped up and insignificant allegations - would be that it discourages future Congresses from examining credible and significant allegations of a constitutional nature when they arise,” write Wexler, Gutierrez and Baldwin.


“The charges against Vice President Cheney are not personal,” the House members add. “They go to the core of the actions of this Administration, and deserve consideration in a way the Clinton scandal never did. The American people understand this, and a majority support hearings according to a November 13 poll by the American Research Group. In fact, 70 percent of voters say that Vice President Cheney has abused his powers and 43 percent say that he should be removed from office right now. The American people understand the magnitude of what has been done and what is at stake if we fail to act. It is time for Congress to catch up.”


Arguing that hearings need not distract Congress, Wexler, Gutierrez and Baldwin note that the focus is on Cheney for a reason: “These hearings involve the possible impeachment of the Vice President — not our commander in chief — and the resulting impact on the nation’s business and attention would be significantly less than the Clinton Presidential impeachment hearings.”


They also argue, correctly, that the hearings are necessary if Congress is to restore its position in the Constitutionally-defined system of checks and balances.


“Holding hearings would put the evidence on the table, and the evidence — not politics — should determine the outcome,” the Judiciary Committee members explain. “Even if the hearings do not lead to removal from office, putting these grievous abuses on the record is important for the sake of history. For an Administration that has consistently skirted the constitution and asserted that it is above the law, it is imperative for Congress to make clear that we do not accept this dangerous precedent. Our Founding Fathers provided Congress the power of impeachment for just this reason, and we must now at least consider using it.



 


HJC impeachment/non-impeachment hearings.

The suggestion that the democrats are afraid the HJC hearings will exonerate Bush is absurd, idiotic and preposterous…and that's putting it mildly.  Dream on.  The conservatives have been putting so much energy into denials and obstruction, whatever they think they might have would do nothing but make them look like fools up against the meticulous body of evidence that has been compiled against Bush.  The issues are broad and deep and the committe most definitely does not have to lift a finger to preserve that cloud of suspicion.  This is not a question of intent (to impeach or not to impeach), although you really never know what could turn up along the way.  Actually, none of us will know what they do or do not have unless the process moves forward.  If you are so confident that the republicans can score that laughable slam dunk on Niger, it seems like you would be first in line for that action. 


 


Who pays attention to Bugliosi?  John Conyers, the chairman of the HJC, for one, who came out of his longstanding ambivalence and decided to take it to the next level based on the content of that book.  Heard him say so in the interview.  The link is there.  Give it a listen.  Something about Bugliosi.  No matter how hard you try to discredit him, that obnoxious perfect conviction record of his (21 murder trials, 21 murder convictions) will just keep getting in the way.  The dude is really good at what he does….murder prosecution and conviction.  When he speaks, the legal community listens.  If he has laid out a case against Bush for murder, you can bet the farm it would be a good read.  You may hate his politics, but as a prosecution attorney, he is entirely credible.  He did not put himself out on a limb and risk his stellar reputation to sell books.  This guy is set to sink his teeth into this long after this hearing is over and long after the changing of the guard.  He is relentless, committed and focused and he is not doing this for money or fame…he certainly has enough of that.  It is a matter of deep personal satisfaction. 


 


Besides that, he is certainly not the only instigator.  There is that "near" 50% support for impeachment....another reason Conyers came off the fence about this.  He is also a bulldog with teeth.  Whether the impeachment does or does not happen is not what is motivating either one of them.  Kucinich is big on impeachment, but for him it also boils down to the same thing.  The evidence is compelling and they simply want to get to the truth, whatever it turns out to be, and they believe that the rest of us probably have a vested interest in that as well. 


 


It is up to the committee to call anyone they wish to call who they think might have something of value to bring to the table.  It is a delusion to think this is just about Niger.  That whole episode is almost inconsequential in the grand scheme of it all.  That would almost be funny if it weren't so naive.  If you would like more democratic rant to discredit, Dennis Kucinich is extremely articulate.  His 30-minute interview on C-Span ought to keep you busy until after the election.   


I knew it had been filed....
so now they have been served? Out of curiousity, if he was proven ineligible and had to withdraw...what happens then? Another primary or what? Has that ever happened before? Where a nominee had to withdraw before the election? Does the party just pick another person and that person pick another VP?
GM has NOT filed for bankruptcy.nm
nm
This is not the first time this suit has been filed...
x
A Hillary supporter in Pennsylvania has filed...
a lawsuit about Obama's citizenship. I have read...and I haven't read everything yet...that it alleges Obama was born in Kenya, not in Hawaii. I don't have all the details. I don't know if it has merit...I just know it was filed. Probably just sour grapes, but I think the timing is key...a few days before the convention starts. Will be interesting to see how it plays out.

And yeah, QA'ing posts on a posting board is WAY over the top.
Here's the brief filed in court by several media agencies...including
Was Valerie Plame covert?What's curious is that lawyers representing 36 media organizations argued she wasn't in this amici curiae brief submitted to the US District Court.
(page ii) "In this case, there exists ample evidence in the public record to cast serious doubt as to whether a crime has even been committed under the Intelligence Identities Protection Act (the "Act") in the investigation underlying the attempts to secure testimony from Miller and Cooper. If in fact no crime under the Act has been committed, then any need to compel Miller and Cooper to reveal their confidential sources should evaporate."
And further
(ppg 30,31) "Plame was not given 'deep cover' required of a covert agent...She worked at a desk job at CIA headquarters, where she could be seen traveling to and from, and active at, Langley. She had been residing in Washington — not not stationed abroad-- for a number of years. As discussed below, the CIA failed to take even its usual steps to prevent publication of her name."
And further
(pg 31) Moreover, the government may have "publicly acknowledged or revealed" her intelligence relationship prior to publication of Novak's July 14, 2003 column. "The United States has 'revealed' an intelligence relationship if it has disclosed information which names, or leads directly to the identification of...a covert agent." S. Rep. 97-201, at 23. An article in The Washington Times indicated that Plame's identity was compromised twice prior to Novak's publication. If this information is accurate - another fact a court should explore - there is an absolute defense to prosecution. See 50 U.S.C. § 422(a).

And WHO was one of the media outlets who filed this brief? OMG, say it isn't so....CBS. The same ones who are now trotting Plame out to say she WAS covert.

What a crock, reveille. Really!!



The lawsuit I am talking about was just filed this week...by some Democrat attorney...
in Pennsylvania. It may be the same material Bill and Hillary were going to go to court with...this is the first I heard that they personally were going to do it.

And Rendell said just this morning...saw it on the news...that he was "ashamed" of the way the press and fawned over Obama during the primaries much more than on Clinton. He did not say anything against Obama per se...just harangued the press for its biased coverage.

Also just heard a guy, and can't remember for the life of me what his organization is called...basically disgruntled Hillary supporters...who says that some 30% of her supporters are firmly deciding to support McCain...according to him, that's almost 3 million people. If that many Dems vote for McCain...don't know if Obama can overcome that.

I still say Hillary may say she supports Obama to the public, but in private I am thinking she is behind these people making waves because she wants Hillary in 2012.

It is really fascinating how this is playing out.
Impeachment

I was not aware New Mexico had passed a resolution. I know Maine has one in the works, Alaska has passed one - NR7, Calif has passed 3, Colorado 1, Mass and New Hampshire 1 each. I think Wisconsin is close to passing one as well. 


I have no idea how many people were at the March. Any march, if you are for it has zillions of people and if you are against it, it only really had about 25. From watching it I can safely say it had enough people to fill the national mall, however many that is. There were other marches in other states as well. I don't think the marches will change anything especially since we have been told what is going to happen whether we like it or not but if there are enough of us, maybe we can take our country back. I am most worried now about Iran. Bush has already started putting his 21,500 in place..nothing anyone can do about that...but preemptively striking Iran. My worst nightmare is that somehow Iraq will get straightened up enough to have a presentable government (Shi'ia) be armed, trained and technologized by the U.S. and then they will turn on us, instead joining ranks with their Shi'ia brothers and sisters in Iran. God help us all.


It is good to see you on the board again. There are not many regulars anymore. Keep coming back.


Impeachment

The fact of the matter is that Bush is one president who truly, truly deserves to be impeached.  He will not be however because it would be a waste of time now. We have more pressing issues on our plate and as a rule Dems do not hold grudges.  Future infants will grow up and probably be asked in history and civic class to write a paper on listing all the reasons Bush qualified for impeachment and then write their supposition of the reasons he was not.  It would be interesting reading for the elderly.


 


Pelosi - NO impeachment.
See video link.
They would be calling for his resignation, impeachment for sure.sm
The mayor and governor should have evacuated the people from the nursing homes since they knew that the levees were not stable enough to weather a category 4 hurricaine. The federal government should have acted to protect NO citizens as well. This is too sad and we shouldn't allow this to be brushed under the rug.
Republicans Views on Impeachment

(This, of course, pertained to CLINTON.  You can break the law, fake reasons to start a war and illegally spy on Americans, but don't you DARE have sex!!!!  I wonder how many of these holier-than-thou people have the courage or ethics to repeat these words today, pertaining to BUSH.)


 


Rep. Marge Roukema (R-N.J.):
And we all share in the emotional trauma getting back to our subject of this constitutional crisis in which we are ensnared. But this cup cannot pass us by, we can't avoid it, we took an oath of office, Mr. Speaker, to uphold the Constitution under our democratic system of government, separation of powers, and checks and balances.

And we must fulfill that oath and send the articles of impeachment to the Senate for a trial. Now I say personally, and all of you who know me, and a lot of you do, I've been around a long time; I bear no personal animosity towards the president. But we in the House did not seek this constitutional confrontation.

Rep. J.C. Watts (R-Okla.):
How can we expect a Boy Scout to honor his oath if elected officials don't honor theirs? How can we expect a business executive to honor a promise when the chief executive abandons his or hers?

Rep. Richard K. Armey (R-Tex.):
How did this great nation of the 1990s come to be? It all happened Mr. Speaker, because freedom works. . . . But freedom, Mr. Speaker, freedom depends upon something. The rule of law. And that's why this solemn occasion is so important. For today we are here to defend the rule of law. According to the evidence presented by our fine Judiciary Committee, the president of the United States has committed serious transgressions.

Among other things, he took an oath to God, to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. And then he failed to do so. Not once, but several times. If we ignore this evidence, I believe we undermine the rule of law that is so important that all America is. Mr. Speaker, a nation of laws cannot be ruled by a person who breaks the law. Otherwise, it would be as if we had one set of rules for the leaders and another for the governed. We would have one standard for the powerful, the popular and the wealthy, and another for everyone else.

This would belie our ideal that we have equal justice under the law. That would weaken the rule of law and leave our children and grandchildren with a very poor legacy. I don't know what challenges they will face in their time, but I do know they need to face those challenges with the greatest constitutional security and the soundest rule of fair and equal law available in the history of the world. And I don't want us to risk their losing that....

Rep. James Sensenbrenner (R-WI):
The framers of the Constitution devised an elaborate system of checks and balances to ensure our liberty by making sure that no person, institution or branch of government became so powerful that a tyranny could be established in the United States of America. Impeachment is one of the checks the framers gave the Congress to prevent the executive or judicial branches from becoming corrupt or tyrannical.

Rep. Lamar Smith (R-Texas):
When someone is elected president, they receive the greatest gift possible from the American people, their trust. To violate that trust is to raise questions about fitness for office. My constituents often remind me that if anyone else in a position of authority -- for example, a business executive, a military officer of a professional educator -- had acted as the evidence indicates the president did, their career would be over. The rules under which President Nixon would have been tried for impeachment had he not resigned contain this statement: The office of the president is such that it calls for a higher level of conduct than the average citizen in the United States.

Rep. Charles Canady (R-Fla.):
Many have asked why we are even here in these impeachment proceedings. They have asked why we can't just rebuke the president and move on. That's a reasonable question. And I certainly understand the emotions behind that question. I want to move on. Every member of this committee wants to move on. We all agree with that.

But the critical question is this: Do we move on under the Constitution, or do we move on by turning aside from the Constitution? Do we move on in faithfulness to our own oath to support and defend the Constitution, or do we go outside the Constitution because it seems more convenient and expedient?

Why are we here? We are here because we have a system of government based on the rule of law, a system of government in which no one -- no one -- is above the law. We are here because we have a constitution.

A constitution is often a most inconvenient thing. A constitution limits us when we would not be limited. It compels us to act when we would not act. But our Constitution, as all of us in this room acknowledge, is the heart and soul of the American experiment. It is the glory of the political world. And we are here today because the Constitution requires that we be here. We are here because the Constitution grants the House of Representatives the sole power of impeachment. We are here because the impeachment power is the sole constitutional means granted to Congress to deal with the misconduct of the chief executive of the United States.

In many other countries, a matter such as this involving the head of government would have been quietly swept under the rug. There would, of course, be some advantages to that approach. We would all be spared embarrassment, indignity and discomfort. But there would be a high cost if we followed that course of action. Something would be lost. Respect for the law would be subverted, and the foundation of our Constitution would be eroded.

The impeachment power is designed to deal with exactly such threats to our system of government. Conduct which undermines the integrity of the president's office, conduct by the chief executive which sets a pernicious example of lawlessness and corruption is exactly the sort of conduct that should subject a president to the impeachment power.

Rep. Bob Ingliss (R-S.C.):
I think is important to point out here is that we have a constitutional obligation, a constitutional obligation to act. And there are lots of folks who would counsel, Listen, let's just move along. It's sort of the Clinton so-what defense. So what? I committed perjury. So what? I broke the law. Let's just move along. I believe we've got a constitutional obligation to act.

Rep. Bob Goodlatte (R-Va.):

Mr. Chairman, this is a somber occasion. I am here because it is my constitutional duty, as it is the constitutional duty of every member of this committee, to follow the truth wherever it may lead. Our Founding Fathers established this nation on a fundamental yet at the time untested idea that a nation should be governed not by the whims of any man but by the rule of law. Implicit in that idea is the principle that no one is above the law, including the chief executive

Since it is the rule of law that guides us, we must ask ourselves what happens to our nation if the rule of law is ignored, cheapened or violated, especially at the highest level of government. Consider the words of former Supreme Court Justice Louis Brandeis, who was particularly insightful on this point. In a government of laws, the existence of the government will be imperiled if it fails to observe the law scrupulously. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. If government becomes a lawbreaker, it breeds contempt for the law. It invites every man to become a law unto himself.

Mr. Chairman, we must ask ourselves what our failure to uphold the rule of law will say to the nation, and most especially to our children, who must trust us to leave them a civilized nation where justice is respected.

Rep. Steve Buyer (R-Ind.):
You know, there are people out all across America every day that help define the nation's character, and they exercise common-sense virtues, whether it's honesty, integrity, promise-keeping, loyalty, respect, accountability, they pursue excellence, they exercise self-discipline. There is honor in a hard day's work. There's duty to country. Those are things that we take very seriously.

So those are things that the founders also took seriously. Yet every time I reflect upon the wisdom of the founding fathers, I think their wisdom was truly amazing. They pledged their lives, their fortunes and their sacred honor to escape the tyranny of a king. They understood the nature of the human heart struggles between good and evil.

So the founders created a system of checks and balances and accountability. If corruption invaded the political system, a means was available to address it. The founders felt impeachment was so important it was included in six different places in the Constitution. The founders set the standard for impeachment of the president and other civil officers as treason, bribery, and other high crimes and misdemeanors.

The House of Representatives must use this standard in circumstances and facts of the president's conduct to determine if the occupant of the Oval Office is fit to continue holding the highest executive office of this great country.

Rep. Asa Hutchinson (R-Ark.):
In the next few days I will cast some of the most important votes of my career. Some believe these votes could result in a backlash and have serious political repercussions. They may be right. But I will leave the analysis to others. My preeminent concern is that the Constitution be followed and that all Americans, regardless of their position in society, receive equal and unbiased treatment in our courts of law. The fate of no president, no political party, and no member of Congress merits a slow unraveling of the fabric of our constitutional structure. As John Adams said, we are a nation of laws, not of men.

Our nation has survived the failings of its leaders before, but it cannot survive exceptions to the rule of law in our system of equal justice for all. There will always be differences between the powerful and the powerless. But imagine a country where a Congress agrees the strong are treated differently than the weak, where mercy is the only refuge for the powerless, where the power of our positions govern all of our decisions. Such a country cannot long endure. God help us to do what is right, not just for today, but for the future of this nation and for those generations that must succeed us.

Rep. Henry Hyde (R-Ill.):

I suggest impeachment is like beauty: apparently in the eye of the beholder. But I hold a different view. And it's not a vengeful one, it's not vindictive, and it's not craven. It's just a concern for the Constitution and a high respect for the rule of law. ... as a lawyer and a legislator for most of my very long life, I have a particular reverence for our legal system. It protects the innocent, it punishes the guilty, it defends the powerless, it guards freedom, it summons the noblest instincts of the human spirit.

The rule of law protects you and it protects me from the midnight fire on our roof or the 3 a.m. knock on our door. It challenges abuse of authority. It's a shame Darkness at Noon is forgotten, or The Gulag Archipelago, but there is such a thing lurking out in the world called abuse of authority, and the rule of law is what protects you from it. And so it's a matter of considerable concern to me when our legal system is assaulted by our nation's chief law enforcement officer, the only person obliged to take care that the laws are faithfully executed.

AND LAST, BUT NOT LEAST: 



Rep. Tom DeLay (R-Tex.):
I believe that this nation sits at a crossroads. One direction points to the higher road of the rule of law. Sometimes hard, sometimes unpleasant, this path relies on truth, justice and the rigorous application of the principle that no man is above the law.

Now, the other road is the path of least resistance. This is where we start making exceptions to our laws based on poll numbers and spin control. This is when we pitch the law completely overboard when the mood fits us, when we ignore the facts in order to cover up the truth.

Shall we follow the rule of law and do our constitutional duty no matter unpleasant, or shall we follow the path of least resistance, close our eyes to the potential lawbreaking, forgive and forget, move on and tear an unfixable hole in our legal system? No man is above the law, and no man is below the law. That's the principle that we all hold very dear in this country.


 


Conyers said that they were not impeachment hearings....
I don't see where that is coming off the fence. I am apparently not the only one in denial...you cannot make me believe with Dem majority in Congress, if they thought they had any goods on Bush they would not go forward.

There are just too many if's. And there is that pesky Iraq Liberation Act that Clinton and the dems made law while he was President. Tough to explain that one away, when the same intelligence was used to arrive at that as was used to go into Iraq under Bush. How are the impeachers going to explain "yeah we believed it when Clinton was President and he was telling the truth and we made a law stating regime should change in Iraq, but then we changed our minds and along came that nasty George Bush and fooled us into believing it again." See, all of that would come out in an impeachment hearing. How do you explain your way out of that? That is probably the question they are asking themselves. If they impeach him, the next thing would be to recall all of them because they are incompetent. If one man, especially one man who Dems en masse say is a bumbling fool himself, could pull that off...fool Congress, the nation and the world...the whole thing is so contradictory it is ludicrous. Best thing for the Republicans WOULD be for them to impeach Bush, right before the election. Oh yeah...GO for it. Sheesh. That is exactly why they won't. Which makes me distrust them all even more. Because if they really do have something impeachable on him and don't go forward just because they don't want to lose the election...that pretty much nullfies integrity and wanting to do the right thing. Which, we ALL know, is not why they are doing this anyway. It is not a big deal, that is why you are not hearing about it. The mainstream media who swoon every time Obama opens his mouth would be ALL over this if there was something there. There just isn't. Sorry; the blood lust will just have to be assuaged in some other way.
I don't remember there being *a lot* of dems for Clinton's impeachment...sm
but then again so much has happened since then I'd have to go back and read up on that.

The photo ops and paparazzi I can deal with. After all, Clinton was a politician. That's no different than Bush flying into Louisianna long enough to take a few pictures with a ladle in his hand. I know we all fall short, but you defend a *Christian pornstar*. Those two words just don't gel right. Then, she's donating her pornography earnings to the republican party and they say *so what we're using it.*

You know why, because they don't care where the money comes from. Maybe neither party does.

If you got the info on why this lady is so great, other than her movies, share it with us??
Total climbing in favor of impeachment sm
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10562904/
Do You Believe Bush's Actions Justify Impeachment? sm

The results are amazing - 380,341 yes (86%). 


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10562904/


Righties - I do not care if it is not scientific, the American people have spoken.


Former CIA Analyst Says Evidence Abounds for Impeachment

Former CIA Analyst Says Evidence Abounds for Impeachment


by Gretyl Macalaster


PORTSMOUTH - The evidence for impeachment of the president and vice president is overwhelming, former CIA analyst and daily presidential briefer Ray McGovern told a room full of people at the Portsmouth Public Library Monday night.


McGovern, who provided daily briefings for former presidents Ronald Reagan and George H. W. Bush as well as other high ranking officials during his 27 year CIA career, said he has witnessed a "prostitution of his profession" as the Bush administration lied to the American people about the evidence of weapons of mass destruction in Iraq.


"Don’t let anyone tell you the President was deceived by false intelligence … they knew," McGovern said.


For the next 40 minutes, he relayed a series of events leading up to 9/11 which illustrate the President’s desire to go to war with Iraq well before 9-11, that reliable CIA evidence showed that Iraq did not have weapons of mass destruction and was presented to the administration and the "facts were fixed" in order to legitimize the invasion.


"The estimate which said Iraq had weapons of mass destruction was prepared to the terms of reference laid down by Cheney in a speech on Aug. 26, 2002. It was the worst estimate of intelligence and came to the wrong conclusions, but it was designed to do that," McGovern said.


McGovern has been an outspoken commentator on intelligence-related issues since the late 1990s and since 2002 has been publicly critical of Bush’s use of government intelligence in the lead-up to the war.


The recent report detailing Iran’s stopping its nuclear weapons program four years ago, is an example of how the administration knows it can no longer hide such "incontrovertible evidence" from the American people in the fallout from the misinformation they received on the Iraq War, McGovern said. He added that he had almost given up on believing their were people still working at the top with a conscious and enough people at the top willing to let analysts do their job and accept independent analysis.


In late 2005, Congress requested an estimate on Iranian nuclear capabilities.
"My former colleagues got really good, incontrovertible evidence that the program, such as it was, has been ordered stopped since 2003. The evidence was such that not even Cheney could deny it. That’s why the report was not produced until three weeks ago," McGovern said, adding that the Bush administration has been putting "spin" on their rhetoric ever since.


McGovern also addressed the reasoning he believes is behind the threat of war with Iran. He said he believes Israel thinks they have a pledge from the White House to deal with Iran before Bush leaves office and relayed the story of the U.S.S. Liberty, which was attacked by the Israelis in 1967 and covered up by the United States. Thirty-four U.S soldiers were killed and about 170 were seriously injured.


"It seems to me, that on June, 8, 1967, Israel realized it could literally get away with murder," McGovern said.


McGovern said he also believes Congress will be of little help. Recently House Speaker Nancy Pelosi admitted to learning about torture and illegal eavesdropping in briefings, but said it was her understanding when briefed, that she will not share the information with anyone else, including other members of the House Intelligence Committee.


McGovern called Pelosi out on violating her oath to uphold the Constitution "against enemies, foreign or domestic" by allowing acts in violation of the Constitution to continue by not saying "diddly."


He added that although an impeachment bill currently in Congress is gaining more support, Democrats are shying away because of the influence of lobbies and political analysts telling them to "wait it out" until the election.


Charges in the impeachment bill sponsored by Dennis Kucinich, are very detailed and "as good as any," McGovern said, and referenced the illegal eavesdropping of American citizens. He added that the President has "admitted" to this "demonstrably impeachable offense."


"The argument for impeachment is overwhelming," Randy Kezar of Kingston said after the event. "Impeachment is constitutionally required."


McGovern’s visit was co-sponsored by NH Codepink, Seacoast Peace Response, NH Peace Action, NH American Friends Service Committee, Seacoast 9-11 Questions Group, NH Veterans for Peace and Witness for Peace-N.E.


Poll MSNBC 87% in favor of impeachment for Bush.sm

Really popular guy - 283,513 polled 87% said yes.


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10562904/


kyoto, one of many articles
INDEPTH: KYOTO
Kyoto Protocol FAQs
 April 13, 2005

Depending on who you talk to, the Kyoto Protocol is either a) an expensive, bureaucratic solution to fix a problem that may not even exist; or b) the last, best chance to save the world from the time bomb of global warming.

Those are the extremes in what has become a polarizing debate that has engaged governments, consumers, environmental groups and industry all over the world for more than 20 years.

The problem the Kyoto Protocol is trying to address is climate change, and more specifically, the speed at which the earth is warming up. Whether Kyoto can accomplish this is very much a matter of debate.

For the record, the Kyoto Protocol went into effect Feb. 16, 2005, with 141 countries signing on, including every major industrialized country – except the United States, Australia and Monaco. The U.S. is responsible for about a quarter of the emissions that have been blamed for global warming.

Two of the world's biggest – and growing – polluters also have not signed on. India and China don't have to – they're considered developing countries and are outside the protocol's framework.

First, the science behind Kyoto.


Is the climate changing?

The United Nations certainly thinks so. And so do most (but not all) scientists who study climate. The UN's Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) summarizes the work of 2,000 of the world's top climate experts. Its latest report (2001) makes for some sobering reading.

Yes, the world is getting warmer, the report concludes. The IPCC says the average global surface temperature has risen by about 0.6 degrees Celsius since 1900, with much of that rise coming in the 1990s – likely the warmest decade in 1,000 years.

The IPCC also found that snow cover since the late 1960s has decreased by about 10 per cent and lakes and rivers in the Northern Hemisphere are frozen over about two weeks less each year than they were in the late 1960s. Mountain glaciers in non-polar regions have also been in noticeable retreat in the 20th century, and the average global sea level has risen between 0.1 and 0.2 metres since 1900.

Simply put, the world is getting warmer and the temperature is rising faster than ever.

What are the very long-term climate predictions?

The IPCC predicts more floods, intense storms, heat waves and droughts. Its study forecasts a rise of 1.4 to 5.8 degrees Celsius in the global mean surface temperature over the next 100 years, with developing countries most vulnerable.

Other studies are even more apocalyptic. A report commissioned by the World Wildlife Fund predicts dangerous warming of the earth's surface in as little as 20 years, with the Arctic warming so much that its polar ice could melt in the summer by the year 2100, pushing polar bears close to extinction.

The Arctic Climate Impact Assessment predicts that caribou, musk ox and reindeer would find their habitats severely reduced. Northern aboriginal peoples around the world would find their way of life changed forever, the study said.

What is causing the world to warm up?







The 6 greenhouse gases Kyoto targets
Carbon dioxide.

Methane.

Nitrous oxide

Sulphur hexafluoride.

Hydrofluorocarbons.

Perfluorocarbons.

Most scientists blame industrialization. Since the 19th century, the richer countries of the Northern Hemisphere have been pumping out ever-increasing volumes of heat-trapping greenhouse gases like carbon dioxide. Industrial societies burn fossil fuels in their power plants, homes, factories and cars. They clear forests (trees absorb carbon dioxide) and they build big cities.

Greenhouse gases allow solar radiation to pass through the earth's atmosphere. But after the earth absorbs part of that radiation, it reflects the rest back. That's where the problem lies. Particles of greenhouse gas absorb the radiation, heating up, and warming the atmosphere. The increasing levels of greenhouse gases are causing too much energy to be trapped – the so-called greenhouse effect.







Greenhouse gas emissions targets apply to 38 industrialized countries and economies in transition
For a list of these countries and their emissions targets, click here:

UNFCCC

Isn't there a lot of debate over the whole issue of climate change?

While scientists tend to agree that the earth is warming, not all agree that rising greenhouse gas emissions are the culprits. A vocal minority say the earth's climate warms and cools in long cycles that have nothing to do with greenhouse gases.

Some dispute the data concerning rising sea levels and rising temperatures. Others dispute the projections, which are based on computer models. But again, those views are those of a minority. Most climatologists agree that global warming is causing unprecedented climate change…and that things will get worse unless something is done.

What does the Kyoto Protocol require?

The Kyoto Protocol was adopted in late 1997 to address the problem of global warming by reducing the world's greenhouse gas emissions. It is considered a first step and is not expected to solve the world's climate change problems by the time its first commitment period ends in 2012.

Kyoto sets out an agenda for reducing greenhouse gas emissions by 5.2 per cent from 1990 levels (although economies in transition, like Russia, can pick different base years). Some reports say the lower target is to be met by 2010. But that's shorthand for the actual target date, which is to achieve those emission cuts over a five-year average (2008 to 2012).

All countries are not treated equally by Kyoto. Canada, for instance, has committed to chopping its greenhouse gas emissions by six per cent. The U.S. target was a seven per cent reduction. But in 2001, one of the first acts of newly-elected President George W. Bush was to formally withdraw the U.S. from Kyoto. Bush said the U.S. would not ratify the treaty because it would damage the U.S. economy and major developing nations like China and India were not covered by its provisions.

Kyoto also allows some industrialized countries to make no cuts, or even to emit more greenhouse gases that they did in 1990. Russia's and New Zealand's emission levels are capped at their 1990 levels. Iceland can emit up to 10 per cent more greenhouse gases, Australia eight per cent more. (Like the U.S., Australia has announced it won't ratify Kyoto). Developing nations are not subject to any emissions reduction caps under Kyoto.

Much of the criticism around the Kyoto Protocol is over political realities and the limitations of the treaty. Critics say a five per cent cut will accomplish little, especially with the United States not on board. Some Canadian critics say our economy will pay a heavy price for meeting our Kyoto commitments because we'll have to compete with an American economy that faces no such restrictions. Many doubt that Canada's target cuts can be reached in Kyoto's first phase that ends in 2012.

Others say the money to implement Kyoto would be much better spent on improving land usage and infrastructure in poor countries.

How are emission targets met?

Emission targets can be met several ways. The most obvious way is to actually reduce greenhouse gas emissions – more fuel-efficient cars, fewer coal-fired power plants. But Kyoto also allows for three other mechanisms.

Countries can buy emissions credits from countries that don't need them to stay below their emissions quotas. A country can also earn emissions credits through something called joint implementation, which allows a country to benefit by carrying out something like a reforestation project in another industrialized country or economy in transition. There's also what's called a clean development mechanism that encourages investment in developing countries by promoting the transfer of environmentally-friendly technologies.

Each developed country must develop its own strategy to meet its Kyoto commitments. Industrial countries that ratify Kyoto are legally bound to see that their emissions do not exceed their 2008/2012 targets.

What happens if a country fails to reach its Kyoto emissions target?

The Kyoto Protocol contains measures to assess performance and progress. It also contains some penalties. Countries that fail to meet their emissions targets by the end of the first commitment period (2012) must make up the difference plus a penalty of 30 per cent in the second commitment period. Their ability to sell credits under emissions trading will also be suspended.

Articles 39 and 42 of the U.N. Charter
permit the Security Council to determine the existence of any threat to the peace, breach of the peace, or act of aggression and to authorize the use of force to maintain or restore international peace and security.
I read your articles - all of them - and...
In the first link you provided, the fourth paragraph in the gray box says, "Both Mr. Kahl and a senior Obama campaign adviser reached yesterday said the paper does not represent the campaign’s Iraq position."

Also, in this article it clearly states that Obama still plans to withdraw in the 6th paragraph:
http://blog.washingtonpost.com/thefix/2008/07/mccain_obama_position_on_iraq.html

Also, Obama's website still states the same information of 16 months -
http://www.barackobama.com/issues/iraq/
There are several articles...goggle it....see inside...
this is just one.

http://www.bostonherald.com/news/opinion/op_ed/view/2008_09_13_Obama_s_female_staffers_shortchanged:_He_s_no_great_equalizer/
Many interesting articles on this site...
http://clintondems.com/2008/09/obama-admits-dual-citizenship-with-kenya/
There have been numerous news articles......sm
stating that Obama's mother was a self-proclamed atheist. You can find them if you Google and check out news web sites.

The beliefs of the Catholic church are very different in some respects than those of most Christian denominations. Catholics, as I understand, believe that without baptism (infant christening) that even a baby is not saved. Most mainstream Christian denominations believe that a person makes a choice to believe in Christ and accept him as Savior once they reach the age where they have the capability of making that decision. I am not saying all this to get into a long theological discussion with you but simply to point out the differences between the two. If you want to discuss religion, we have been asked to use the Faith board to do that.
Oh please. We just post articles of Obama
x
There are all sorts of articles; just google
x
I won't read these articles - the last time I did so,
No thanks!
I read articles on this fellow......... sm
during the campaigns before the election.  His predictions are not very promising and I believe we are in for a long, rocky ride.  The government bailouts are just the beginning of government owning America, lock, stock and barrel. 

I live in a rural, rather economically depressed area now and wonder how quickly my area will start seeing these changes.  I wonder if it will be one of the first and hardest hit or if the more affluent areas of the country that enjoy a wider variety of jobs and better paying jobs will be more adversely affected first. 

My 18-year-old son and I were discussing his future last night.  Although he is a junior in high school, I told him that it is time that he started looking at the job markets in our area and deciding on a job that would pay well and would be in demand for a few years, at least.  He won't be going to college, partly because of financial issues, but mainly because he is just not "college material" but I do want him to investigate trades-type schools and trades jobs in which he will be able to provide for himself as an adult in an economy where blue-collar workers struggle at best. 

Personally, I am not spending any more than is absolutely necessary to survive at this point.  I guess I'm being "unAmerican" by not stimulating the economy, but right now I'm more concerned about what my future holds and whether I will be able to keep my home than whether I have a big-screen TV or an iphone.  Times are indeed getting scary. 
Excuse me. Did you bother to read the articles and
In every single reference I provided for you, the phrase "OFFICE of the President Elect" appears....in 1969, 1989, 2000 as well as in the language of the Act. Don't care what your fringe sites say....especially Malkin. Wouldn't be the first time they invented phoney outrage over fairy tales they spin, and it won't be the last. Read the language of the ACT that created the OFFICE of the President Elect, then the articles I provided, and you might see what I mean....or NOT. You seem to have an affinity for make-believe.

BTW, I know my history, but I believe you were trying to ask me specifically about civics. The electoral college makes the election official. However, it has always been customary to refer to the successful candidate on the Nov 4 election as the President Elect. The media is not the driving force behind this...tradition is.
She posted articles about the big 3 in Europe, not European car cos.....(nm)

Lots of articles on Churchill and Henry Ford and sm
Jews and communism.  It doesn't matter if the pillars were made of salt (of course, history tells us that they were eventually).  It matters that historically this was what Hitler built his Reich on.  This is indisuptable and absolute.  Henry Ford's hatred for Jews was legendary, BECAUSE of communism. 
Excuse me, but you will not dictate whether or not I include articles in my post.

I post articles here in order to encourage a debate about the articles.  In your limited Israel-is-always-right-and-anyone-who-questions-that-is-worthy-of-a-rabid-attack attitude, you can't see that and once again wish to control everything, even how people communicate with each other.


All you want to do is tear down, not build anything.  I gave my reasons for posting this article.  In those reasons I expressed some skepticism about Hezbollah's sincerity.  Instead of offering an intelligent response to those reasons, you once again slammed the door of dialogue and showed that your abilities to communicate are so limited that all you can do is berate and insult.  To call me anti-American only highlights your ignorance.  I am absolutely pro-American, and I'm very fearful where President Bush is leading us.  It's the duty of every American to question what he or she sees as failures or inadequacies in the administration that is in power regardless of party affiliation.  I felt the same way during the Clinton administration, and I feel the same way now.


If I were to come on here and say that Hezbollah is rebuilding Lebanon and now the Bush administration wants to compete with them, I would get responses that demand I provide my source, and rightly so.  That is the reason I post the entire article itself.  I want to gauge if it brings the same questions to the minds of other (repeat once again) LIBERALS as it does to me.


You're free to have your opinion of me, but you come off as pompous and controlling, demanding that everyone bow down and kiss Israel's feet.  The mere suggestion that Israel may be even slightly wrong elicits anger and rage from you, and you have shown that repeatedly.


No, you are not obligated to engage in debate with anyone here, but don't whine and complain that you're unable to when someone offers you the opportunity.  Your failure to do so when invited only proves how angry and full of rage you are.


For the record, I have never said you were sent to shut down the board.  It's laughable to even imagine you have the power to do that.  You are no more important or influential than I am or than any other poster on this board is.  Get over yourself already.


And, no, I have no idea which sentence of the original article you find disturbing.  I personally found several of them disturbing, but I refuse to engage in any guessing games with you.


Am I paranoid?  I sure am these days.  I'm pro-peace and I'm living in a country run by a President who is trigger happy and who has done nothing but incite the world.


If looking at Israel objectively is anti-Israel according to your definition, then so be it.  You said previously on this board that just because Israel didn't bother to send any troops to Iraq didn't mean they're an ally.  Please enlighten me.  With the BILLIONS of dollars we give Israel every year, along with weapons, we are definitely an ally to Israel.  Please explain how Israel is an ally to us.  Is it because they grace us with their agreement to take our money and then spy on us?  (I could post a number of articles regarding the spying, but since you don't like it when I do that, feel free to Google it on your own.)  What have they done for us in return?


I have always believed Israel was the underdog in the Middle East and have always favored them.  This is the first time I have ever questioned their actions.  We here in America still have freedom of thought and speech, whether you like it or not.  You know nothing of me, including how I believe.  Your assessment of me is not only wrong, it's absurd and only proves how you interact with people who disagree.  I am very relieved that you are not representative of all Israelis, as it gives me a small sense of hope. 


I doubt your sincerity in stating that I'm not worth the time to answer, considering all the time you spent doing just that.  Another example of your hypocrisy.  No doubt you will waste your time once again responding to this with more hatred and insults, only this time I will let you have the last word, since you are now no longer worth the time it takes to respond.


It means you're good at paraphrasing articles others
nm
Lies? What we show are facts, links, articles.
What about poor Palin?  She is a human being and look at the ATTACKS on her.  By the way, she is a republican and I would say Dem's are bashing.  We are not bashing Obama, we try to show you articles, links from CNN who by the way supported Obama, and you state we are bashing Obama.   
A very intelligent and honorable man, but the articles leans severely to the right.....sm
I tipped over twice reading it. I am not trying to be mean or facetious, I think sometimes people feel so strongly in their beliefs,and I agree with many of his beliefs, that they comes get "tunnel vision", they lose their peripheral vision for that part of humanity that has been good and honest, but has been dealt some very bad, unfair blows and needs help. In my own heart and opinion, there is a difference between radical, fundamentalist Muslims, and mainstream, peaceful, truly religions Muslims, and have have met and worked with many with lovely families. Basically, the author seems to want to cling onto an idealistic life where everything is fair, the good guys always win, and there is only black and white. Well, there are lots of shades of gray in between, and like it or not (and I grew up in the Beaver Cleaver generation), the earth has moved on, time has moved on, and we have to deal effectively with WHAT IS. Yup, I am tired too, especially since my husband and I both have health issues, we certainly aren't kids anymore, and retirement is looking more and more like a pipe dream, even though we invested, sacrificed, and saved. But whining or wishing will not solve anything, as Americans we are famous for pulling ourselves up by the bootstraps and getting the job done, and our job now is to work together, search out viable answers, care for each other, and pull through this depression INTACT AND WHOLE. Off my ratty soapbox now!
Yes, let's post articles to mother's of military. So helpful. Geez. nm

I found several opposition articles and will post the high points....
and actually I was surprised to see that there were some common concerns and actually very little concerning *a move toward socialized medicine.* This is what I found:

Proposals to expand coverage to children from families earning three or four times the federal poverty limit ($61,940 and $82,600, respectively, for a family of four) also highlights the question of just how many should be subsidized, necessarily at others' expense. The $61,940 eligibility limit would cover median-income families in 14 states, and the $82,600 limit would do so in 42 states. Parents earning such incomes do not need additional subsidies for their children to get health care.
************************
Baucus, Grassley Comment
Senate Finance Committee Chair Max Baucus (D-Mont.) and the committee's ranking Republican Chuck Grassley (Iowa) jointly requested the CBO study but "had divergent views of its findings," according to CQ Today.

Baucus, who supports spending $50 billion over five years to expand SCHIP, said the report validates the program. CQ Today reports that Baucus "expressed little concern" that people would leave private insurance plans to enroll in SCHIP, saying that every public health insurance program provides coverage to some people who might be able to obtain private health insurance (CQ Today, 5/10). Baucus said, "The fact that uninsurance for children in higher-income families has stayed about the same means that SCHIP is helping the lower-income families it's meant to serve."

Grassley said the report supports his argument that SCHIP eligibility should not be expanded beyond 200% of the poverty level. He said, "This report tells us that Congress needs to make sure that whatever it does, it should actually result in more kids having health insurance, rather than simply shifting children from private to public health insurance" (CongressDaily, 5/10).
****************************
SCHIP is a joint state-federal program that provides health coverage to 6.6 million children from families that live above the poverty line but have difficulty paying for private insurance. Already, the program is generous. A family of four with an income of more than $72,000 (350% of the federal poverty level) is eligible for SCHIP's subsidized insurance. Now, Congress wants to expand coverage even further, to families making up to 400% of the federal poverty level ($82,600 for a family of four). But, according to the Congressional Budget Office, 89% of families earning between 300% and 400% of the federal poverty level already have coverage. The CBO estimates that some 2 million kids already covered under private insurance would be switched over to government insurance. The only purpose of all of this seems to be to turn children's health insurance into an outright entitlement — part of the Democrat's broader push to move all of America's health-care industry under government control.
Along with expanding SCHIP coverage to include people higher and higher up in the middle class, the Democrats' bill would also give states incentives to sign up aggressively new "clients," by loosening requirements to join the program and encouraging states to market the program (anyone who rides the New York City subway knows how active the Empire State is already being on this front). How is all of this to be funded? Well, the bill would impose a 61-cent increase in the 39-cent a pack federal cigarette tax, bringing it up to an even dollar. We've written before on how corrupt is the government's interest in the cigarette business. It turns out that the government needs to keep people smoking; the Heritage Foundation estimates the government would need to sign up some 22 million more Americans to take up smoking by 2017 to fund this increase in SCHIP. To add to the irony, most smokers are low-income Americans, meaning that the poor essentially will be funding the health insurance of the middle class. Mr. Bush would be right to veto it while working to increase access to private insurance through tax breaks and deregulation.
****************************
So, it would appear to me that the major problems some have against it are: it will shift children who are now covered by private insurance onto a program unncessarily; it will allow for more adults on the program, something that was never intended; that paying for it with a tobacco tax targets the very people who need the assistance, the lower income families as statistically that is where the most smokers are...essentially shifting the burden for adding middle class families to the lower income families...and I think we can all agree that is not a good thing.

In my research I also found something VERY interesting...
I am sorry to say I did not know the particulars of the President's proposal regarding insuring children...only his proposal extends to everyone, not just children...sure have not seen the media report it....

Opposing view: President's plan is better

Extend SCHIP program without spending billions to expand it.

By Mike Leavitt
We all want to see every American insured, and President Bush has proposed a plan to see that everyone is. Congress, instead, is pushing a massive expansion of the State Children's Health Insurance Program (SCHIP) that grows government without helping nearly as many children.
The president's plan, announced last January, would fix our discriminatory tax policy so that every American family received a $15,000 tax break for purchasing health insurance. If Congress acted on the president's plan, nearly 20 million more Americans would have health insurance, according to the independent Lewin Group.
In contrast, Democrats in Congress would more than double government spending on SCHIP and extend the program to families earning as much as $83,000 a year. But their plan would add fewer than 3 million children to SCHIP, and many of the newly eligible children already have private insurance. So instead of insuring nearly 20 million more Americans privately, Congress would spend billions of dollars to move middle-income Americans off private insurance and onto public assistance.
The Democrats' plan has other problems. It would fund SCHIP's expansion with a gimmick that hides its true cost. It would allocate billions of dollars more than is needed to cover eligible kids. And it would allow states to continue diverting SCHIP money from children to adults. This is a boon for the states but costs the federal government more.
Ideology is really behind the Democrats' plan. They trust government more than the free choices of American consumers. Some in Congress want the federal government to pay for everyone's health care, and expanding SCHIP is a step in that direction.
SCHIP is part of the fix for low-income children, and Congress should put politics aside and send the president a clean, temporary extension of the current program. Expanding SCHIP is not the only way or the best way to insure the uninsured. The president's plan is better. It would benefit many more Americans. It would focus SCHIP on the children who need help most. And it would move us more sensibly toward our common goal of every American insured.

I don't know about the rest of you, but I think a $15,000 tax break would help more American families afford health insurance, thereby covering more kids AND adults, which is the goal, right? And no raising of taxes or targeting the lower income families with a tobacco tax...sounds like a win-win. I don't care if it is Bush's idea or the Democratic Congress' idea...it is a good idea. This time it happened to be Bush's.

Just my take on it.

If you want to find the articles, just put *expanding SCHIP* in a Google search. I read several articles in support of both sides. I did not see much about the income leveling, except in one article, which did mention that New York had a "sliding scale." It did not define it, but I am thinking it is at the purview of the states, and if New York did it others probably could too?
Don't jump on me...jump on the attorney who filed it...
good grief.
We already have Cheney.
Cheney has the warmth and personality of a dead fish.
Cheney

Judge to review Cheney interview in CIA leak case


Libby told the FBI in 2003 that it was possible that Cheney ordered him to reveal Plame's identity to reporters. The prosecutor in that case, Special Counsel Patrick Fitzgerald, said in his closing remarks at Libby's trial that there was a "cloud" over Cheney's role in the case.


Fitzgerald told members of Congress who also sought the information that Cheney set no conditions about the use of his interview with investigators.


CREW argued that the public has a right to know the role that Cheney played in the leak and why he was not prosecuted.


A Cheney spokeswoman declined to comment on the case.


 


I hope Cehney will also be prosecuted about the Abu Ghraib torture case when Obama decides that the TIME IS RIGHT.


 


Cheney

Judge to review Cheney interview in CIA leak case


Libby told the FBI in 2003 that it was possible that Cheney ordered him to reveal Plame's identity to reporters. The prosecutor in that case, Special Counsel Patrick Fitzgerald, said in his closing remarks at Libby's trial that there was a "cloud" over Cheney's role in the case.


Fitzgerald told members of Congress who also sought the information that Cheney set no conditions about the use of his interview with investigators.


CREW argued that the public has a right to know the role that Cheney played in the leak and why he was not prosecuted.


A Cheney spokeswoman declined to comment on the case.


 


I hope Cehney will also be prosecuted about the Abu Ghraib torture case when Obama decides that the TIME IS RIGHT.


 


Cheney

Judge to review Cheney interview in CIA leak case


Libby told the FBI in 2003 that it was possible that Cheney ordered him to reveal Plame's identity to reporters. The prosecutor in that case, Special Counsel Patrick Fitzgerald, said in his closing remarks at Libby's trial that there was a "cloud" over Cheney's role in the case.


Fitzgerald told members of Congress who also sought the information that Cheney set no conditions about the use of his interview with investigators.


CREW argued that the public has a right to know the role that Cheney played in the leak and why he was not prosecuted.


A Cheney spokeswoman declined to comment on the case.


 


I hope Cheney will also be prosecuted about the Abu Ghraib torture case when Obama decides that the TIME IS RIGHT.


 


Cheney

Judge to review Cheney interview in CIA leak case


Libby told the FBI in 2003 that it was possible that Cheney ordered him to reveal Plame's identity to reporters. The prosecutor in that case, Special Counsel Patrick Fitzgerald, said in his closing remarks at Libby's trial that there was a "cloud" over Cheney's role in the case.


Fitzgerald told members of Congress who also sought the information that Cheney set no conditions about the use of his interview with investigators.


CREW argued that the public has a right to know the role that Cheney played in the leak and why he was not prosecuted.


A Cheney spokeswoman declined to comment on the case.


 


I hope Cheney will also be prosecuted about the Abu Ghraib torture case when Obama decides that the TIME IS RIGHT.


 


Hmmm, since Cheney is
perhaps Fitzgerald could use electrodes on Scooter (a grown man with that name should be a crime in itself..LOL), Rove and Cheney himself and see how he likes information extracted in this manner.
Agree 100%. Cheney is the
one of the masterminds of this adminstration.  As I said, but screwed up the post, that if they impeach Bush, they better darn well take Cheney out with him.  He is far more dangerous than Bush could ever hope to be, but will Cheney be called to task for his evildoings?  How in the United States of America did torture become a topic of conversation? Why has not anyone been called out on these things they have done in the guise of national security?  And what really gets me is that people are WILLING to give away their freedoms and rights to be safe.  So who are the cowards?  Also, and I have heard no one mention this, that after 9/11, Bush said we will not cower to the terrorists, not to change our way of life, our celebrations, to go about as we were, etc.   Hmmm, so instead, our rights and freedoms have been violated.  Now we have unauthorized NSA spies on our phone calls, emails, whatever else they want to peer into, and now the filthy Patriot Act is up, thank Goodness, but what's next?  Scary.
Yes, I was joking about Cheney. sm
I agree the bill is nuts. I can get you a link to that. It actually passed.
Cheney on warpath again?
This is a long article written by Dan Froomkin of The Washington Post, Apr. 11, 2008.


It goes to Cheney's warmongering concerning Iran (if such be the case), the difference of opinion on Iran (Gates and Rice v Cheney), clarification on the "wipe Israel off the map" comment, Cheney's recent visit to Israel, and much more. Page 5 goes into other topics; one of special interest being torture approved from the WH basement by Bush aides and Cheney.


Excellent article that covers recent comments being made by Cheney about Iran (you may recall he and Rumsfeld did the same prior to the fantisized reasons to invade Iraq).


I bring it for edification and perhaps for discussion.

Cheney deja vu all over again nm

xx


 


Maybe Cheney is a closet dem
He knows many people hate him, including me. He could be trying to lose McC's election since McC spoke out against Bush and Cheney.
D@ck Cheney was the man in the wheelchair
and wow I don't think booing is appropriate, D@ck Cheney doesn't get a free pass just because he is in a wheelchair.

Had to edit because I can't use the VP's first name