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Everyone has already made up their minds

Posted By: OMG on 2008-10-13
In Reply to: What do you find viscious and nasty? - nm

Why berate the point? There are no undecideds here.


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We do have minds of our own
I have a mind of my own. I listen to the politicians and decide who I feel is a better candidate for me. When you put Obama up against the other two candidates it isn't hard for me to decide who I want in the white house and as a representative of our country. Yes it's true that most politicians do lie and most politicians are crooks, but some are good. Not once in my lifetime has there been a candidate that's been for the middle class. They all say they are going to get rid of tax cuts for the most wealthiest but they don't (both sides are guilty). They all promise us everything and never deliver once they are in. I too am sick of crooked politicians, but I just don't get that feeling from Obama. Out of any of them I believe he will do the most good for the country and the citizens of the country. I like his ideas and his plans. I like his family and he's got a good sense of humor. There is no way I'll vote for McCain, and the Clintons should be in jail for half the stuff they've pulled in their careers (both of them).

While one side of me says to protest bad candidates and not vote, my conscience tells me I should vote for who I think would be the better candidate and would do the best job in there and have compassion for the middle class. Someone who is concerned and has the best plan about education, the economy, security at our borders, illegal immigration, health care, and the list goes on.

To say that everyone who votes for Obama is voting for him just because everyone else is voting for him is an insult to everyone who believes in him. So if you don't want to vote then don't. However, most of us do have a brain and can think for ourselves. What you said is just rude and insulting to us.
Only in the minds of the
x
Only in the minds of the
x
A lot is on our minds

With this election, there's a lot on most people's minds right now and most are scared beyond words that can be expressed.  As I sit here I seriously imagine what our country would be like with Obama as a president, after all polls are in his favor, right? so most assume he has already won. On a more uplifting note though the polls are now changing in McCains favor and that is hopeful for people like me and others who care so deeply to preserve this great country.  As I sit and think what our country would be like if he gets in just really hits a nerve and is so frightening I'm glad a lot of my loved ones have passed on so they will not have to face what lies ahead if he gets in.  Of course the liberals will come back with "give me a break" or "please", and they will not see this post the same as a lot of us do.  And most will not even read this whole post, but will cut it down anyway without knowing the full content of it.  But why don't you sit and imagine what the country would be like with McCain and you will understand what we feel with Obama (or maybe you won't).  However, our fears are based on facts.  The most important issues for me is is the safety of our country, our economy, and upholding our constitution and preserving the freedoms our founding father's risked their lives for.  I'll attach a link at the end of this that describes what happened to them.  But know this...they risked their lives and they were scared beyond words.  If you ever watched the HBO series John Adams the actors portrayed those men very well, and the looks on their faces and what they must have felt when they were creating the Declaration is the same way I feel as I sit and think about an Obama presidency.  It scares me beyond all imaginings.  I think back to our founding father's and what they must have gone through to sign The Declaration.  Here is a quote I found from an article which I will put the link below.  The link is not a verification of anything, I just found it just a very interesting article and I wanted to pass it on.  The article states (I'm copying and pasting so please forgive if the spacing or alignment is off):


So, on July 4th, 1776, our Continental Congress dared to declare that we 13 colonies, the United States of America, must be and are free and independent of King George.  They knew that this was a treasonous act.  They knew that signing the Declaration of Independence meant a death sentence for every one of them if they were caught. 


          Where did these 56 men get the courage to sign the Declaration of Independence? "


If Obama is elected (and we do not know yet if he will be), but if he is our lives will change dramatically (and not for the better).  First and most importantly to me and others is that you will have the first president ever who was able to change the constitution to allow a person born on foreign soil to "rule" our country.  But that should not surpirse a lot because Obama does not believe in the constitution.  His words are "The constitution reflected the fundamental flaw of this country that continues to this day".  Then if by some chance we have all 3 branches of the government democrat, no doubt in many's mind is that he will change the constitution.  Everything our founding fathers did to make this a free country for all will be gone.  The truth about Obama is out for many to see, but many who have been mesmerized by his good looks and calming voice they have a hard time differentiating what is real from what Obama tells you what you want to hear. 


So between him not being American born and refusing to provide proof, him refusing to release his medical records, his relationship ship with Ayers, Weather Underground, Wright (which I'm sure a lot of people don't know that Obama said in an interview that he went twice a month for 20 years, which meant that he sat through hate-filled sermons twice a month for 20 years and never got up and walked out), his redistribution of weath, his ties to radical muslims, receiving money for his campaign from the enemies who want us wiped off the planet, ACORN, voter fraud, buying votes, etc., etc., those are just a few of the many worries I think about when I imagine what it will be like if Obama gets in.


While I know most of the posters on this board are set in their minds on who they will vote for (or have already voted for), maybe there are a few that are just not quite sure.  So while this post will not pursuade anyone for or against Obama it is just to express my fears (though no words can express the feelings). 


Anyway...here are a couple good links I found below.


http://asburyerie.org/files/sermon%20written/Our%20Country,%20'Tis%20of%20Thee%20-%20July%206,%202008.doc


http://swordattheready.wordpress.com/2008/10/27/obama-says-constitution-is-a-charter-of-negative-liberties/


http://keelynet.com/4th99.htm


http://www.americasright.com/2008/10/update-update.html


 


He's probably trying to win the *hearts and minds*
of the Iranians........before he nukes 'em. 
No need to make up our minds.
nm
You got that right...there is nothing you can say to change our minds!
:D
WOW! You read minds, too? sm
Amazing!!!!

I'm thinking of a number between 1 and 10. C'mon, I know you can do this.
I think you underestimate the young minds...sm
Thought I'll agree the walkout probably was not for political reasons so much so as for what they believe is right. Do you think they probably have a lot of respect for this teacher? Maybe. It is possible to be passionate about something other than cutting class as a teenager. I know I was, and so is my daughter who just turned 13.

I also have to give you the point that the teacher should have stayed on the subject matter of the class. If you're hired to teach geography then teach geograpy BUT we don't have the privlege of seeing the course outlines, book, etc. It may not be so cut and dry as capitols, states, and what have you. So before you call for his head on a plank you should at least know that much. Whose to say that this course was not comingled with history and this teacher was within his right to bring up subjects to provoke thought. I don't see the problem with that.

Listening to the message in a whole, I don't see a problem in what the teacher said excpt that he may have deviated from the subject matter. And the fact still remains that we don't know the totality of the course description.
Okay....then let's just say neither of them are liars. They just changed their minds.
I'll go with that. My entire point is that you can't really call one of them a liar and say the other just "changed his/her mind."
And only those with completely closed minds would
Years ago, it might have seemed ridiculous and been dismissed as a conspiracy theory that there were terrorists living amongst us right here in the USA, learning how to fly our planes, and being groomed for YEARS to attack and kill us on 9/11. Based on that alone, I would not for one second put it past a crazed bunch to groom someone from birth to serve their purpose.

Things that make you go hmmmm....
No one is trying to change your closed minds...
we are discussing, just like you are. O, as you call him, is the candidate of change...right down the slippery slope further into socialism. That is change I DON'T believe in. No amount of spin on his part is going to change that fact.
Great minds think alike! LOL ; )
nm
People who use their minds to decide what they do
*
Only in the minds of the deluded partisans
unable to justify McSame's own evil associations, the W being top of the heap.
Tiny minds = easily boggled...nm
nm
He sure is, the far libbies minds kind of weed that out.

Closed minds don't get nourished and thus can't grow. nm

Truman and Johnson both had sharp minds.

They may not have been polished but they could think on their own and put an entire sentence together all on their own. Truman, I believe, said **The buck stops here.*** Being a war time president, he took full responsibility for what was going on on his watch for which he was much admired, here and abroad. Johnson gave us civil rights. I did not much like Johnson personally but I admired what he did. He said **I have just given the south to the Republicans** when he signed civil rights into law, but, he had the courage of his convictions and did the right thing, control or no control, votes or no votes. I cannot say the same about the current administration. To them the buck stops anywhere but with them and they would do ANYTHING  to keep their party in control, sacrifice a few seats here and there in order to do the right thing, not in this lifetime, not if it means losing control.


Interesting you should mention 2 Democrats as unpolished but (I assume) decent presidents.


It IS important that our president can express himself well. We as a nation look more and more weakened because our leader does not read and  cannot produce a complete sentence to save his soul; and he was elected to be OUR president and the leader of the free world. What does that say about all of us. The more situations deteriorate the more inarticulate he becomes.  America has always been the mediator in the Middle East but this time, the Italians and the French OMG showed up first.  Norway and Greece were the first on the scene to move Americans out of Lebanon. When asked if they were surprised that the first to show up were not Americans, the Americans in Lebanon said ***NO, I mean, look at Katrina. We thought we would be here a long long time.***  I know that many on the right don't care what the world thinks of us but I do and I think it is always best to have allies. This administration just burns bridges. Scary Scary Stuff.


 


I agree. I do not post to change minds that...
cannot be changed. However, a lot of people come here to read and never post, and I think people should see both sides of an issue posted. You can't make an informed decision with only one side of things...or you shouldn't. That is what America is about. Thanks for your post!
In other words, they speak their minds like Keith
and every other idjit liberal news outlet out there? What's the big deal. CNN sent out a whacko nutjob reporter who provoked and harrassed and accused protestors who were just minding their business. Don't see you on here ranting about that.....
Great minds think alike...I'll be watching as well.nm
x
Involving is one thing....not allowing them to make up their own minds...
is quite another. Called indoctrination. It worked on you, I have to admit.
Americans have lost their minds or just dont care.
nm
You mean, it's impossible to change intelligent people's minds!
You can call us what you want; however, intelligent people are not fazed by the comments of those who live in fear and enjoy wallowing in their own misery.
Yes, I agree, let's try a juicier subject, as the political minds
of the Republicans showed to be confined to a CAGE.

Maybe in this subject they have more experience and can contribute better.
Look, I offered to leave once and gt asked me to stay. So which is it? Make up your minds. SM
You all are doing plenty of bashing on the conservative board right now, but that probably isn't YOU.  wink wink nod nod.. I don't want to destroy the collective consciousness that is putting our soldiers lives at risk so I'll leave, but only cuz you asked so nice. 
Look I offered to leave and gt asked me to stay. Make up your minds. nm

Simple minds, shriveled old souls who get their jollies stirring up muck.
nm
Yes I do have it made.
I do have it made, and it is well earned.  How much military service do you have under your belt?  How many political action committees have you served on? 
I don't think she has made this

decision without thinking about all she might miss with her kids.  My mom was at a lot of the things I did in school.  However, my dad was at work.  He was supporting his family by making a living.  He was making our situation better by working that overtime so we could afford stuff.  Would I have liked my dad to be at my tennis match.....sure.  But the reality is that even though he wasn't there watching, he still was literally the one supporting me and I appreciated and loved him for that.


As for Palin, did you ever think that maybe....just maybe she is willing to sacrifice time with her kids to make a better country for them as well as all of us?  Have they asked Obama about sacrificing time with his kids?  No....because we all just assume Michelle will take care of the kids. 


Al would have made sure we were . . .
not kissing (notice I did not say kicking) butt over in Iraq to get that oil.  This country would have been a lot further along with alternative energy sources!!!
I made my own
NObama pin which I alternated with an Obama pin (with the red slash through the O as in a no smoking sign). 
thank you SO much, made my day!!
That was truly worth the seven minutes!!
Please tell me you just made that up!!!
Because if you didn't, you're right, that is much more sick.
Please tell me you just made that up!!!
Because if you didn't, you're right, that is much more sick.
NO vaccines are made in the U.S. now???

Or is that another conservative "fact"? 


And, yes, those dang whacko liberals like Robert F. Kennedy and those of his ilk should be ashamed of themselves for connecting the presence of thimerosal in vaccines and resultant autism and attempting to STOP it.  Who cares about the children who are already here?  The most important thing is that we make sure not to hurt those inanimate cells in a petrie dish.


And, yes, it's certainly has been proven that there can be side effects associated with the smallpox vaccine where a small percentage of people might get sick and die.  We COULD maybe let the people CHOOSE whether they want the vaccine or not (if enough of it ever actually EXISTED to protect the entire country), but, no, free choice isn't a very "red" thing to do.  So the only logical thing to do is make sure that we deny the vaccine to all Americans so we can ALL die if terrorists decide to use that as a form of bio warfare. (By the way, I truly doubt that lawsuits will be much of an issue if we're all DEAD.)


Right?  I mean, you "red" guys know what should be allowed and denied in the life of every single American, don't you?  You've got some kind of special "divine knowledge" where you know what I should be "allowed" to do with my own personal body, who I'm "allowed" to love, how I'm "allowed" to plan my family, when I decide I'm "allowed" to die, and which God I'm "allowed" to worship without being doomed to eternal damnation?


 


wow, you made that assumption of me HOW? sm
by the way, the immaturity and silliness of your answer just makes you look like a fool.  Might want to work on that.
Yep, made a mistake, should have been why would anyone BAN you. SM
People do that all the time on the board, don't make a big deal out of it and I am perfectly FINE here.  Why.....feeling uncomfortable?   It's not like you guys don't take pot shots on the Conservative board now is it?
No, only the ones made by liberals.
xox
SOY was the one who made it personal anyway.
**This fits many on THIS board...To fear the LORD is to hate evil; I hate pride and arrogance, evil behavior and perverse speech.**

Maybe you missed that because you've stereotyped, judged and sentenced the liberals already.


Yes! You made my point exactly
They just keep shipping the jobs out until eventually we'll be left with millions of doctors and lawyers!! And who wants that?! :)

Seriously, something has to be done about this. Unfortunately, quite a few politians are paid by these big companies that make profits by off-shoring. We have to start putting major pressure on them to stop.
But who and how would that decision be made
From a legal perspective? Say "convenience" abortions are made illegal. I get pregnant and decide I want to have a "convenience" abortion. However, I know these are illegal, so I say the guy raped me. Who gets to pick in which cases abortion is permitted and in which cases it's not?

This is my main concern. You're preaching to the choir on the rest of it, because it used to disgust me when I would type reports and a woman would've had 15 abortions. I do not agree with that at all, and I don't think there are many who do. But, logistically speaking, again, it's either legal or illegal.
I only made it through the first two paragraphs
I had a nauseating sense of deja vu.
Its me again - you all made me laugh
Just had to write back to let you all know I enjoyed reading all your posts to my "rant" this morning. It's nice that other people see her for what she really is, and sad that others do not. Sure we all want to just up and leave when things don't go our way and nothing seems fair, but as my mama used to say "who ever told you that life was fair", and no I'm not rich like the hollywood people who can leave country at the drop of a hat. So, just to let you know my feelings have not changed about how I feel for her. No, I don't hate her, but I do see her for what she is and I don't like it. Well yeah, maybe deep inside I do hate her. I just wish she would just go away and I wouldn't have to see her anymore, but somehow they always find their way out from under the rocks (Bush & Cheney is included). Anyway....I have calmed down since posting (not not with medication, but with a good dose of reality from all who commented) :-) I don't have anything to worry about anyways though because even if she pulls some of her "maneuvers" and knocks out Obama she will never win over McCain - just a fact. (if by chance she does, then in November I will come back and tell you all I'm eating crow. HA HA HA. I'm also not worried bout it anymore -after all I do have a "mute" and "channel changer" on my remote control. :-)
This one's too easy. Just made my day.

Title of you post is lifted straight out of TT112OldTimer's post responding to Free Speech Rocks.  When spinning soooo out of control that the brain becomes blank, you can always resort to plagiary.  Hello.  Are you listening?  Vitriol out, vitriol in.  You might be shocked by how much respect you earn with just the simple gesture of extending some.  Respect is NOT a 4-letter word. 


 


Common sense is exactly what I used when I decided to attack my own bigoted tendencies back when I was still a teenager.  I did not learn any of that from books or courses I took in school.  I took it to the streets and reaped benefits beyond measure from those lessons. 


 


Au contraire.  The bluster of bigots is easy to bury under fact and logic.  No need to be thwarted by that.  Their reservoir of insults runs very shallow, but the intellect is a well that one can dig as deep as is necessary.  Fact/truth is another arch-enemy of the bigot.  You at least had the wisdom not to attempt to ridicule the context post since you knew you would be in way over your head and besides, you are allergic to the other side of the coin.  As they say, if you can’t stand the heat, get out of the kitchen.   It can’t be much fun to find yourself dumbfounded by your own narrow mind.  Frustrating too...remember it well. 


 


On the shortcut post:  That was your snipe, not mine.  Snipe begets tripe.  Vtriol out/vitriol in.  Garbage out/garbage in.  Is there an echo in here? 


 


Not the slightest bit interested in agreement, validation or vindication.  I am secure enough by now not to need all of that.  But in political contexts, the journey down the road to consensus will never begin in the absence of flexibility, open-mindedness and a good dose of patience.        


 


What part of my posts reflect your tactics do you not understand?  You absolutely refuse to look at yourself in the mirror, but you do know enough to be outranged when someone sends you your own reflection.  It’s not a pretty sight and furthermore, you become every bit as enraged as you seem to think I am.  You are constitutionally incapable of seeing what a spiteful little vixen you become when your brick-wall logic is thrown back in you face. 


 


No surprise there.  Bigotry is always blind.  Here’s another example you are bound to ignore:  You are so driven by your hatred of illegals that you would actually weigh in on the side of transnationals and cast your vote for the party who empowers them to outsource your profession overseas and drive your own wages into the ground.  


 


Well shut my mouth!  Could it be that you have finally run out of insults in the face of the realities of logic and have arrived on the threshold of the next level where most other right-wingers eventually find themselves...running for the hills and back into the open arms of the choir members?  You are big on cliché.  Here’s one for you...you can run, but you can’t hide.  Have a safe journey and I am “sending up a prayer” that you find the sanctuary you seek. 


no, my mind is already made up
I have been catching some of it (busy with MT and all) but what I really want to see is political commentary by someone who can say these were the good things about the speech and these are the things that weren't good or they should have talked about. Watching Democrat commentary they mostly say everything is wonderful and great speeches, and wathcing Republican commentary they mostly say the speech was lame or ineffective or whatever. Isn't anyone impartial? I'm really missing Tim Russert now.. :(
It would not be an issue if he had not made it one. nm
nm
The only guy that made a mess is
So the ends justify the means when it come to rebpulicans, abuse of power and the ethically challenged ethics maid? Said it once, will say it again. Divorce/custody issues are typically played out in family courts without interference and manipulation of the Governor's office. Marginalized? Is that the best spin you can think of for cold, hard fact? No backs up against the wall here. You see, JM has made life a whole lot easier by his latest senior moment. This decision smacks of "he just doesn't get it." Alienated women with his token showcase and moved the party straight back to the far right. If there were any doubt that he would be 4 more years of the same before, now it is plain as the nose on his face. We knew he would self destruct sooner or later, but noone expected it would come in the form of his VP pick. Nothing petty and vindictive about it, but if you feel the need to insult, bash and vent a little, by all means, knock yourself out. You, like your candidates, are underestimating the Clintons, their supporters and their party. She may have the same genitalia, but she is about as far from Hillary as it gets.
No, you are. I'm saying judgments will be made
For those who feel SP was insensitive to her daughter's situation and right to privacy during her pregnancy and childbirth, right or wrong, SP's judgment and priorities might come into question, especially since she has been pregnant 5 times herself. Her ability to balance her political responsibilities with her family obligations will likely be examined as well.

As a feminist, I do not think this is particularly fair, but it is STILL done in the work place when women are being considered for high positions in companies. Female leaders of childbearing years are measured by different standards than their male counterparts in this respect, regardless of whether you or I think this is fair. Mothers are held to higher standards than fathers when it comes to protecting their children. As a political candidate, she will be in a position to answer a whole lot of questions not posed to those of us in the private sector.

If they really did discuss this issue ahead of time, she and McCain both might have anticipated this kind of fallout if the Bristol's pregnancy were to come to light and could made have decisions accordingly. It may appear to some, if not many, that the interest of the party or the country was NOT their first consideration, and Bristol, her baby and the 4-month old infant son ranked under electability when this decision was made. That is what I am saying.
You seem to have your mind made up
You'll believe what you want to believe. But, I just wanted to comment on tax breaks for companies that stay in this country. The reason they left was because they had exorbitant taxes placed on them to the point they basically said, enough!

BTW, no matter how anyone tries to justify things, these are the same companies who were providing jobs for millions of Americans. They paid their share of insurance premiums for thousands or millions, their share of payroll taxes, had to comply with environmentalists (which was basically a tax), had to meet all kinds of other standards that were expensive, etc. The insatiable giant govt machine (Congress) who wanted to extract more and more are the ones to blame for that fiasco. Now I see they're wanting to offer tax cuts to the ones who remained!! It seems they can learn a lesson or two after all, if we believe they'll actually do it.

As for the big oil companies, yes they make a lot of money, but they're producing a product and they won't do that without paying well, like any other successful company that provides a multitude of jobs. There are great costs to produce that product, and they're taxed at an exorbitant tax rate as it is.

And as for their profits, considering what they actually make off of a gallon of gas for instance, a huge amount of that goes to their investors, including teacher's pension portfolios, just to name one. And they're already paying billions more in taxes than they make in profits, and now some in congress want to tax their profits with another windfall profits tax! Just incredible. Where does it end!!

But, Congress does control the purse-strings, so they'll do whatever they want, and they'll continue to tax, tax, and tax some more, every "big" business that provides incredible jobs into non-existence.

One day, those of us who work our tails off, will just sit down and give up and let Uncle Sam take care of us with their tax money they get from.....