Involving is one thing....not allowing them to make up their own minds...
Posted By: sam on 2008-10-01
In Reply to: encouraging young people to - MissiLink
is quite another. Called indoctrination. It worked on you, I have to admit.
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No need to make up our minds.
nm
Look, I offered to leave once and gt asked me to stay. So which is it? Make up your minds. SM
You all are doing plenty of bashing on the conservative board right now, but that probably isn't YOU. wink wink nod nod.. I don't want to destroy the collective consciousness that is putting our soldiers lives at risk so I'll leave, but only cuz you asked so nice.
Look I offered to leave and gt asked me to stay. Make up your minds. nm
Not a thing because I don't make enough
money to support 2 people and buy anything.
My living room furniture is 21 years old. My bedroom furniture is my DH's mother's furniture from the ཤs. My kitchen dining set was bought from a friend 20 years ago. Our car, ྙ Buick, was bought for $100 because it needed an engine and my ྙ Olds (which I loved and only had 84,000 miles on it) had frame problems but the engine fit in the Buick. My other bedroom still has my mom's hospital bed and it's not going anywhere 'cause I'll need it some day.
Our 25-yo Sylvania TV died in 1999 (25 years old) and we bought a 32" Toshiba, still running strong this year so far (don't want to jinx myself)..
I spend most of my money on groceries. I don't think twice about the cost of a good steak, lobster, or crab legs. That's our thing. We enjoy food and we eat well....so far, and that's all that matters to us. DH had a medical problem and cannot eat normal every day food, so seafood (which includes fish) and meat is all he can eat unless he wants to go the vegetarian route (which he refuses).
To heck with material things. We no longer have AM /FM radio with tape player and CD because it crapped out 2 years after I bought it (paying almost $200 for it), but I did save the speakers just in case we find something the speakers will fit some day. DH has a tape/record,AM/FM stereo I bought at a flea market for $10, still working strong.. I bought a 6-changer CD/AM/FM/tape player/radio at a yard sale for $30 and it was crap and crapped out after 6 months (just my luck!). I will not replace it.
If I had money, I would definitely replace my fridge and dishwasher. They are both from late 1999. I never liked my fridge but it was all I could afford. My dishwasher was also all I could afford and it was the noisiest thing I ever owned, plus the fact that the one arm broke off 2 years ago. Hey, still works, and I turn up the TV when I run it.
Yesterday we had to buy another water tank for our well. Not something we relished doing since we can't drink the water and DH isn't workingt, but we can use it for washing clothes, taking showers, etc., but without the water tank, we couldn't get water at all. We haul water from a spring 5 miles away instead of buying water at $.25 a gallon or grocery store water for drinking. Our water is contaminated with E. Coli and another infectious disease so....
Sure wish I could buy what you want, but material things are not in our agenda.
Let's make one thing crystal clear....
Obama was not "forced" to denounce his preacher of 20 years. He threw him under the bus for political expediency with a lame excuse that in all his 20 years there he never "heard a sermon like that." Frankly I don't believe it and my guess is that Jesse Jackson and the Reverend Wright don't believe it either. He holds the same beliefs Wright does, he just knows if he openly espouses them he will not get elected. Going on the record with a preacher who said "God Da_ America" from the pulpit will not get you elected in this country. So much for supporting your mentor.
Back to Jackson's first gaffe..not an unfortunate slip of the tongue. He said "cut his nu_s off" and made the cutting motion with his wrist. Saw it with my own eyes. That comes from a place of deep dislike, my friend. Jesse Jackson does not like Barack Obama. Why he can't just say so to the man's face and move on is beyond me. And when he used the N word regarding Obama I don't think it was meant in a "nice" way, for that very reason. Freedom of speech, sure. But when you get caught, spin, spin, deny, deny.
Excuse me, but if someone in the pulpit screeches "God Da_ America" at me...and that is mild to some of the things he says...I believe indignation is in order and I will not hesitate to say so...to Wright or Obama or anyone else, exercising MY right of free speech and to disagree. Again...no one forced Obama to do anything. I didn't see a gun to his head. His advisors just told him the truth...distance yourself or you won't get elected. He had a choice and he made one...support his mentor, a man he called a close friend, pastor of 20 years...or get elected. He made his choice. Threw the rev under the bus. But don't kid yourself, friend...in his heart of hearts he does believe the doctrine of that church. THAT is the real Barack Obama. Search the internet and read some of the things Michelle Obama has written. She is on the same page. That is who they are. Certainly their right to do or say what they want. But they should be honest about it. And they are not. Whenever they slip and show what they really are, then they have to backpedal because the advisors are screeching and then come the apologies. Sometimes you just can't keep up the pretense and who you really are comes out. Inevitable. That is why they need the spinmeisters. That is why ALL politicians need the spinmeisters.
Allowing us to choose
which charities to support gives us too much control. Much better for government to grab our money and distribute it ''fairly'' to causes and individuals we would never approve of on our own. It goes right along with plans to eliminate individual choice in health care, eliminate school vouchers, bailouts, millions to ACORN, proposed limitations on first and second amendment rights.
Do you remember Peter Falk as Columbo? ''Oh, and just one more thing....'' In an interview, Falk said that being investigated by Columbo was ''like being nibbled to death by ducks.'' Pretty good analogy to what's happening in our government.
The courts aren't allowing it - the
REPUBLICAN leaning Supreme Court denied this today, so hopefully the ones clinging to this nonsense will open their eyes and see that it was baseless all along.
I blame the Catholic church for allowing this to go on for so very long. SM
I have a lot of conservative friends and I seriously doubt they would condone this. I knew there was a reason I stayed away from these boards. As the poster above said, your post came up in a headline or I would never have come here.
House Passes Bill Allowing Government-Funded Religious Discrimination
House Passes Bill Allowing Government-Funded Religious Discrimination
Immediate Release
The Interfaith Alliance
September 22, 2005
Contact: Jon Niven or Don Parker 202.639.6370
House Passes Bill Allowing Government-Funded Religious Discrimination
Washington, September 22 – Today, The U.S. House of Representatives passed an amendment and a bill to allow government-funded religious discrimination
The School Readiness Act (H.R. 2123), a bipartisan bill to reauthorize the Head Start program, was passed 48-0 in committee. However, during floor debate Thursday, Rep. Charles Boustany Jr. (R-LA) added an amendment allowing Head Start providers to exercise religious discrimination in choosing teachers and volunteers. As a result, the final vote on the bill (231-184) was stripped of the unanimous, bipartisan support displayed in committee.
The Interfaith Alliance is very disappointed in the members of Congress who insist on reacting to one crisis by beginning another one, said the Rev. Dr. C. Welton Gaddy, President of The Interfaith Alliance. The Boustany amendment is a prime example of political opportunists taking advantage of a national tragedy to institute policies that are unconstitutional and have been previously rejected by the Congress.
The Interfaith Alliance was joined by more than 50 organizations in opposition to the bill's passage if it contained the Boustany amendment. The National Head Start Association, which represents more than 2.5 million children and families, program staff and volunteers that comprise the Head Start and Early Head Start community, came out against the entire bill if the Boustany Amendment was attached saying:
In spite of its positive provisions, if HR 2123 contains a religious discrimination amendment, we must reluctantly oppose the bill.
This amendment will subsidize religious discrimination with tax dollars, turning back civil rights protections that currently apply to nearly 200,000 Head Start teachers and over 1.4 million parent volunteers.
In the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina, the levees protecting religious liberty are being breached, and the wall between church and state is cracking, Gaddy said. If those in Congress who seek to repeal religious liberty safeguards are successful, thousands of children, teachers and parent volunteers who have dedicated themselves to this program could find themselves no longer welcome at religiously-affiliated Head Start programs because they are of a different faith than the sponsoring organization.
The Senate passed a similar bill, but without the Boustany amendment, so the House version will now go to a House-Senate conference committee. Members of The Interfaith Alliance will urge Senators to strip the bill of the Boustany amendment in conference.
Initiated in 1965 in the wake of the landmark Civil Rights Act of 1964, Head Start has been widely recognized as one of the most successful government programs ever created. It has provided early childhood education and development programs that have helped millions of low-income families overcome inequities for more than forty years.
We do have minds of our own
I have a mind of my own. I listen to the politicians and decide who I feel is a better candidate for me. When you put Obama up against the other two candidates it isn't hard for me to decide who I want in the white house and as a representative of our country. Yes it's true that most politicians do lie and most politicians are crooks, but some are good. Not once in my lifetime has there been a candidate that's been for the middle class. They all say they are going to get rid of tax cuts for the most wealthiest but they don't (both sides are guilty). They all promise us everything and never deliver once they are in. I too am sick of crooked politicians, but I just don't get that feeling from Obama. Out of any of them I believe he will do the most good for the country and the citizens of the country. I like his ideas and his plans. I like his family and he's got a good sense of humor. There is no way I'll vote for McCain, and the Clintons should be in jail for half the stuff they've pulled in their careers (both of them).
While one side of me says to protest bad candidates and not vote, my conscience tells me I should vote for who I think would be the better candidate and would do the best job in there and have compassion for the middle class. Someone who is concerned and has the best plan about education, the economy, security at our borders, illegal immigration, health care, and the list goes on.
To say that everyone who votes for Obama is voting for him just because everyone else is voting for him is an insult to everyone who believes in him. So if you don't want to vote then don't. However, most of us do have a brain and can think for ourselves. What you said is just rude and insulting to us.
Only in the minds of the
x
Only in the minds of the
x
A lot is on our minds
With this election, there's a lot on most people's minds right now and most are scared beyond words that can be expressed. As I sit here I seriously imagine what our country would be like with Obama as a president, after all polls are in his favor, right? so most assume he has already won. On a more uplifting note though the polls are now changing in McCains favor and that is hopeful for people like me and others who care so deeply to preserve this great country. As I sit and think what our country would be like if he gets in just really hits a nerve and is so frightening I'm glad a lot of my loved ones have passed on so they will not have to face what lies ahead if he gets in. Of course the liberals will come back with "give me a break" or "please", and they will not see this post the same as a lot of us do. And most will not even read this whole post, but will cut it down anyway without knowing the full content of it. But why don't you sit and imagine what the country would be like with McCain and you will understand what we feel with Obama (or maybe you won't). However, our fears are based on facts. The most important issues for me is is the safety of our country, our economy, and upholding our constitution and preserving the freedoms our founding father's risked their lives for. I'll attach a link at the end of this that describes what happened to them. But know this...they risked their lives and they were scared beyond words. If you ever watched the HBO series John Adams the actors portrayed those men very well, and the looks on their faces and what they must have felt when they were creating the Declaration is the same way I feel as I sit and think about an Obama presidency. It scares me beyond all imaginings. I think back to our founding father's and what they must have gone through to sign The Declaration. Here is a quote I found from an article which I will put the link below. The link is not a verification of anything, I just found it just a very interesting article and I wanted to pass it on. The article states (I'm copying and pasting so please forgive if the spacing or alignment is off):
So, on July 4th, 1776, our Continental Congress dared to declare that we 13 colonies, the United States of America, must be and are free and independent of King George. They knew that this was a treasonous act. They knew that signing the Declaration of Independence meant a death sentence for every one of them if they were caught.
Where did these 56 men get the courage to sign the Declaration of Independence? "
If Obama is elected (and we do not know yet if he will be), but if he is our lives will change dramatically (and not for the better). First and most importantly to me and others is that you will have the first president ever who was able to change the constitution to allow a person born on foreign soil to "rule" our country. But that should not surpirse a lot because Obama does not believe in the constitution. His words are "The constitution reflected the fundamental flaw of this country that continues to this day". Then if by some chance we have all 3 branches of the government democrat, no doubt in many's mind is that he will change the constitution. Everything our founding fathers did to make this a free country for all will be gone. The truth about Obama is out for many to see, but many who have been mesmerized by his good looks and calming voice they have a hard time differentiating what is real from what Obama tells you what you want to hear.
So between him not being American born and refusing to provide proof, him refusing to release his medical records, his relationship ship with Ayers, Weather Underground, Wright (which I'm sure a lot of people don't know that Obama said in an interview that he went twice a month for 20 years, which meant that he sat through hate-filled sermons twice a month for 20 years and never got up and walked out), his redistribution of weath, his ties to radical muslims, receiving money for his campaign from the enemies who want us wiped off the planet, ACORN, voter fraud, buying votes, etc., etc., those are just a few of the many worries I think about when I imagine what it will be like if Obama gets in.
While I know most of the posters on this board are set in their minds on who they will vote for (or have already voted for), maybe there are a few that are just not quite sure. So while this post will not pursuade anyone for or against Obama it is just to express my fears (though no words can express the feelings).
Anyway...here are a couple good links I found below.
http://asburyerie.org/files/sermon%20written/Our%20Country,%20'Tis%20of%20Thee%20-%20July%206,%202008.doc
http://swordattheready.wordpress.com/2008/10/27/obama-says-constitution-is-a-charter-of-negative-liberties/
http://keelynet.com/4th99.htm
http://www.americasright.com/2008/10/update-update.html
He's probably trying to win the *hearts and minds*
of the Iranians........before he nukes 'em. 
Everyone has already made up their minds
Why berate the point? There are no undecideds here.
You got that right...there is nothing you can say to change our minds!
:D
WOW! You read minds, too? sm
Amazing!!!!
I'm thinking of a number between 1 and 10. C'mon, I know you can do this.
I think you underestimate the young minds...sm
Thought I'll agree the walkout probably was not for political reasons so much so as for what they believe is right. Do you think they probably have a lot of respect for this teacher? Maybe. It is possible to be passionate about something other than cutting class as a teenager. I know I was, and so is my daughter who just turned 13.
I also have to give you the point that the teacher should have stayed on the subject matter of the class. If you're hired to teach geography then teach geograpy BUT we don't have the privlege of seeing the course outlines, book, etc. It may not be so cut and dry as capitols, states, and what have you. So before you call for his head on a plank you should at least know that much. Whose to say that this course was not comingled with history and this teacher was within his right to bring up subjects to provoke thought. I don't see the problem with that.
Listening to the message in a whole, I don't see a problem in what the teacher said excpt that he may have deviated from the subject matter. And the fact still remains that we don't know the totality of the course description.
Okay....then let's just say neither of them are liars. They just changed their minds.
I'll go with that. My entire point is that you can't really call one of them a liar and say the other just "changed his/her mind."
And only those with completely closed minds would
Years ago, it might have seemed ridiculous and been dismissed as a conspiracy theory that there were terrorists living amongst us right here in the USA, learning how to fly our planes, and being groomed for YEARS to attack and kill us on 9/11. Based on that alone, I would not for one second put it past a crazed bunch to groom someone from birth to serve their purpose.
Things that make you go hmmmm....
No one is trying to change your closed minds...
we are discussing, just like you are. O, as you call him, is the candidate of change...right down the slippery slope further into socialism. That is change I DON'T believe in. No amount of spin on his part is going to change that fact.
Great minds think alike! LOL ; )
nm
People who use their minds to decide what they do
*
Only in the minds of the deluded partisans
unable to justify McSame's own evil associations, the W being top of the heap.
Tiny minds = easily boggled...nm
nm
He sure is, the far libbies minds kind of weed that out.
Closed minds don't get nourished and thus can't grow. nm
Truman and Johnson both had sharp minds.
They may not have been polished but they could think on their own and put an entire sentence together all on their own. Truman, I believe, said **The buck stops here.*** Being a war time president, he took full responsibility for what was going on on his watch for which he was much admired, here and abroad. Johnson gave us civil rights. I did not much like Johnson personally but I admired what he did. He said **I have just given the south to the Republicans** when he signed civil rights into law, but, he had the courage of his convictions and did the right thing, control or no control, votes or no votes. I cannot say the same about the current administration. To them the buck stops anywhere but with them and they would do ANYTHING to keep their party in control, sacrifice a few seats here and there in order to do the right thing, not in this lifetime, not if it means losing control.
Interesting you should mention 2 Democrats as unpolished but (I assume) decent presidents.
It IS important that our president can express himself well. We as a nation look more and more weakened because our leader does not read and cannot produce a complete sentence to save his soul; and he was elected to be OUR president and the leader of the free world. What does that say about all of us. The more situations deteriorate the more inarticulate he becomes. America has always been the mediator in the Middle East but this time, the Italians and the French OMG showed up first. Norway and Greece were the first on the scene to move Americans out of Lebanon. When asked if they were surprised that the first to show up were not Americans, the Americans in Lebanon said ***NO, I mean, look at Katrina. We thought we would be here a long long time.*** I know that many on the right don't care what the world thinks of us but I do and I think it is always best to have allies. This administration just burns bridges. Scary Scary Stuff.
I agree. I do not post to change minds that...
cannot be changed. However, a lot of people come here to read and never post, and I think people should see both sides of an issue posted. You can't make an informed decision with only one side of things...or you shouldn't. That is what America is about. Thanks for your post!
In other words, they speak their minds like Keith
and every other idjit liberal news outlet out there? What's the big deal. CNN sent out a whacko nutjob reporter who provoked and harrassed and accused protestors who were just minding their business. Don't see you on here ranting about that.....
Great minds think alike...I'll be watching as well.nm
x
Americans have lost their minds or just dont care.
nm
You mean, it's impossible to change intelligent people's minds!
You can call us what you want; however, intelligent people are not fazed by the comments of those who live in fear and enjoy wallowing in their own misery.
Yes, I agree, let's try a juicier subject, as the political minds
of the Republicans showed to be confined to a CAGE.
Maybe in this subject they have more experience and can contribute better.
Simple minds, shriveled old souls who get their jollies stirring up muck.
nm
NOBODY can make Saddam look good. But Bush seems to be the ONLY one who can make him look less
If you can't make abortion illegal, just make it impossible (sm)
That's right, Bush is still alive and well. Check this out.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26315908/#28024676
Yeah, I know it's MSNBC, but how many other people are doing a lame duck watch?
Just because you make a statement does not make it true...
.
But valuing over the price of a dollar is a right thing wing thing, so you are on the wrong board. n
x
Those who make you believe absurdities can make
I never said it's a bad thing, it is a good thing....nm
nm
Perhaps we can make a
between lying because he was a husband caught with a bimbo and lying to even the score with Wilson who knew of the intelligence manipulation for going to war and jeopardizing national security issues. You really don't see the difference here? If Hillary can stand her husband for being a cad, that's hers and Bill's business, not mine. Whereas this administration has lied about Iraq. Clinton lied--nobody died. Bush lied--2000+ died, not to mention the *collateral damage* of innocent Iraqis as pointed out by Democrat above. And you don't see the difference?!
This is what I make of it...sm
Supposedly if the insurgents lay down their arms and come over to the good side they will be allowed amnesty. Info leaked from Iraqi prime minister, al-Maliki, office that he was considering giving amnesty to insurgents and terrorist who have not killed Iraqi citizens. His office later added US soldiers into the equation.
Supporters of said amnesty believe it will lead to further isolating the *bad* terrorist and be inclusive of the *good* terrorist, allowing them become a functioning part of the new Iraq. Bring them over to the good side so to speak.
We can't make it here.
http://sheergoldenhooks.blogspot.com/2006/05/james-mcmurtry-we-cant-make-it-here.htm
don't mean to make any
one more nervous, but visualize this scenario, McCain falls down and breaks a hip. The vice president who has stated "I have not thought much about foreign policy" (despite having HER OWN SON going to Iraq soon) has to make a crucial decision that does not involve a rogue moose, her brother-in-law's behavior, or what to wear at a beauty pageant. Scary. Since she has not thought much about foreign policy, what group of Washington people are going to be instructing her on foreign policy soon? The Karl Rove group who is advising them on all issues. If you have enjoyed the last 8 years, you're gonna l-o-v-e the next 4 if McCain wins.
Exactly. And the DNC will make him pay for it, too.
Sadly.
You have to make up your own
mind. If you are curous as to what he studied, you can look that up. Why ask some stranger to get that info for you? He was a constitutional law professor, but as for specific classes, I don't know. I like him for his ideas, his honesty, his humor, his obvious love for his family, his unique time spent in both the black and white communities. His past has been thoroughly reviewed and shows only integrity. The fact that he is attacked only for people he has known actually shows me that he has an immaculate record. I don't know many who could stand up to that kind of scrutiny. I think he is a once-in-a-lifetime leader - he has the ability to inspire and the humbleness to listen to different views about issues along with a brillant intellect. His life shows his principals and I can find not one false note. That is my opinion of him. I am sure to be attacked over silly stuff for this post, but I can give it right back, so that's okay.
Make that 15
15. GLOBAL WARMING: Biden said that he knows what is causing global warming when in fact, even the best scientists in the country can't agree on what is causing global warming.
Does that make 2 now?
.
Now, whatever would make YOU
that???
I want him to make sure that the
US is the leader in development of alternative energy sources. This would solve so many problems in one fell swoop: Creating new industries thereby creating thousands of new jobs, address the global warming issue, helping us move away from our addiction to fossil fuels and foreign oil. If the US would come out as a leader in this, then many other nations would follow. He also stated that our infrastructure was in sore need of updating, that our power grid in this country is one of our major weaknesses making us more vulnerable to terrorist attacks. I have never heard anyone else address this issue. Makes so much sense!
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