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Hillary supporter's take on fannie/freddie....

Posted By: sam on 2008-09-25
In Reply to:

I hope you haven’t just eaten, because what you are about to read will disturb you–and well it should. It’s proof that John McCain foresaw the Freddie Mac, Fannie Mae disaster in 2006– and tried against all Obama-Like minds to ward it off.


Below are John McCain’s remarks urging the passage of the Federal Housing Enterprise Regulatory Reform Act of 2005, which he co-sponsored and which was rendered “Dead” in Congress.


Guess who prevailed and didn’t take heed? Or more appropriately, guess who deliberately “looked the other way”?


This is all we need to know to understand exactly WHICH candidate in this election is willing to break some eggs when it comes to Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac–two organizations that, with the help of certain Democrats, deliberately redistributed wealth the easy way. Now we are all paying for it, as intended all along. Just as John McCain warned below.


As we view the carnage, this is all we need to know to understand exactly WHICH candidate foresaw this carnage we are witnessing,  and which candidate worked to convince the other candidate to help avoid it. It is all we need to know to recognize exactly WHICH candidate had the right judgment and was looking out for the rest of us.


Joe Biden? It’s time for US to be Patriotic? No. It’s time for YOU to be patriotic. In fact, it’s too late. As for you saying, “It’s time to be part of the deal”. We want no part of this “deal”. And what a “deal” it was!


May 26, 2006


Mr. President, this week Fannie Mae’s regulator reported that the company’s quarterly reports of profit growth over the past few years were “illusions deliberately and systematically created” by the company’s senior management, which resulted in a $10.6 billion accounting scandal.


The Office of Federal Housing Enterprise Oversight’s report goes on to say that Fannie Mae employees deliberately and intentionally manipulated financial reports to hit earnings targets in order to trigger bonuses for senior executives. In the case of Franklin Raines, Fannie Mae’s former chief executive officer, OFHEO’s report shows that over half of Mr. Raines’ compensation for the 6 years through 2003 was directly tied to meeting earnings targets. The report of financial misconduct at Fannie Mae echoes the deeply troubling $5 billion profit restatement at Freddie Mac.


The OFHEO report also states that Fannie Mae used its political power to lobby Congress in an effort to interfere with the regulator’s examination of the company’s accounting problems. This report comes some weeks after Freddie Mac paid a record $3.8 million fine in a settlement with the Federal Election Commission and restated lobbying disclosure reports from 2004 to 2005. These are entities that have demonstrated over and over again that they are deeply in need of reform.


For years I have been concerned about the regulatory structure that governs Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac–known as Government-sponsored entities or GSEs–and the sheer magnitude of these companies and the role they play in the housing market. OFHEO’s report this week does nothing to ease these concerns. In fact, the report does quite the contrary. OFHEO’s report solidifies my view that the GSEs need to be reformed without delay.


Quick Info


S-90 Federal Housing Enterprise Regulatory Reform Act of 2005


Last Action: Committee on Banking, Housing, and Urban Affairs. Ordered to be reported with an amendment in the nature of a substitute favorably.


Status: Dead


I join as a cosponsor of the Federal Housing Enterprise Regulatory Reform Act of 2005, S. 190,to underscore my support for quick passage of GSE regulatory reform legislation. If Congress does not act, American taxpayers will continue to be exposed to the enormous risk that Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac pose to the housing market, the overall financial system, and the economy as a whole.


I urge my colleagues to support swift action on this GSE reform legislation.


Update: Well looky here. Here’s a glowing Wall Street piece on Obama, written in June 2008. You would think Mr. “Regulator” Obama really is Jesus looking out for us! But…..here’s the paragraph that hooked me–the paragraph that haunts today:


He characterized the senator as a quick study on financial services, citing his early support of efforts by Senate Banking Committee Chairman Chris Dodd and House Financial Services Committee Chairman Barney Frank to empower the Federal Housing Administration to help struggling homeowners.


Oh they “empowered” all right. The Democrats killed this bill while Dodd, Frank and Obama fiddled and helped Fannie and Freddie cook their books, continue to tank, all the while keeping the regulators out of their way. These are the guys who killed the bill that McCain fought for. The bill that would have avoided the financial disaster we witnessed during the past two weeks. In the meantime, take a look at which senators were feeding at the Fannie Mae/Freddie Mac trough. My party is not what it used to be. My party has not only let me down, but it has also screwed me and my country in the process.


Note:  All of these facts can be independently confirmed if you are interested in the truth of this matter.




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More on Fannie Mae/Freddie Mac...

Freddie found itself in Justice Department crosshairs in 2003, after it finally admitted to years of accounting schemes to underreport its earnings...to the tune of $5 billion.  Freddie paid a $125 million fine to federal regulators, more than $400 million in shareholder lawsuit settlements, and $3.8 million in civil fines to settle Federal Election Commission charges of improper political fundraising.


Freddie's creative accounting was nothing compared to Fannie's.  As determined by two separate federal reports in 2004 and 2006, Fannie Mae out-and-out cooked the books so the bigwigs at the top could rake in millions in windfall profits.  The Washington Post reports that Fannie misstated its earnings by about $10.6 billion from 1998 through 2004.  all so fraudulent multimillion dollar bonuses could kick in for Fannhie's bigwigs.


Those Fannie Mae bigwigs who cashed in on the cooked books?  Chairman Franklin Raines, Bill Clinton's OMB director...A whopping $52 million.  Vice Chair Jamie Gorelick (remember her from the 9-11 Commission hearings), Clinton's deputy ATTORNEY GENERAL, $15 million.    Chairman and Chief Executive James A. Johnson, liberal lobbyist (the one who was kicked off Obama's VP vetting committee...looks like they should have vetted their committee) due to his role in the Countrywide financial scandal...$1.9 million.  Raines and the CFO of Fannie Mae were ousted.


Dems, loathe to clean up Fannie and Freddie houses even though Greenspan said preventitive action needed to be taken "sooner than later," came up with a "reform bill" in early 2005.  The Department of Housing and Urban Development (HUD) mandated that Fannie and Freddie had to start handing out mortgages to "minority and moderate income buyers."  Whether these new customers were creditworthywas of little concern; Congress had race and bean-counting to achieve.  And now they basically owned half of the US housing market.


And now the American taxpayer is bailing out BOTH of these companies.


Is Fannie Mae/Freddie Mac the Democrat's Enron?  Sure looks like it to me.


And incidentally, Franklin Raines has been advising the Obama campaign on the mortgage and housing issues....ahem.


We own AIG, Fannie and Freddie

Maybe the international community wants their money back now.  Maybe that is why credit markets are frozen.  Since AIG and Fannie and Freddie are backed by the full faith and credit of the United States, the world is lining up for their securitized mortgages to be repaid. 


Maybe this bailout is not to buy up bad debt, but to pay off bad debt the government has already bought, insured, and now needs to ask us money for to pay.  WE ARE BEING LIED TO AGAIN! 


freddie and fannie

SHOT IN THE FANNIE MAE


The History of a Financial Disaster


1997



Fannie Mae is a GSE (Govt. Sponsored Entity) regulated by Congress.


Fannie Mae buys mortgages from other companies.


It is backed by the taxpayers for all losses, but keeps all profits.


President Clinton loosens Home Loan Requirements.


1998



Banks begin making thousands of bad loans,0 down, no documentation, for 120%! (1998 – 2008).


Executives at Fannie receive huge bonuses if loan targets are met.


Franklin Raines and Jamie Garelick from the Clinton Administration are appointed to run Fannie Mae.


2003



President Bush proposes a new oversight committee to clean up Fannie Mae, but Democrats derail the effort.






Rep. Melvyn Watt, (D-NC) Committee on Financial Institutions & Consumer Credit. stated, "I don’t see much other than weakening the bargaining power poorer families to get affordable housing."


1999 - 2004



Raines earns $100 million in bonuses.


Garelick earns $75 million in bonuses.


In 2004, Enron collapses, congress investigates, Executives Skilling & Lay go to jail, for fraudulent bookkeeping.


Congress responds with the Sorbanes-Oxley Act, more heavy regulation of corporations.


2004



An OMB investigation finds massive fraudulent bookkeeping at Fannie Mae.


False numbers triggered executive bonuses every year.


Congress holds no hearings, no one goes to jail, or is punished.


WHY NOT?


1999 -2005



Fannie Mae gives millions to Democratic causes, examples: Jesse Jackson & ACORN.


Fannie Mae pays millions to 354 congressmen and senators, from both parties.


Who got the most money?


Top 4 Recipients


Top 4 Recipients


2005



Franklin Raines & top execs are forced to resign from Fannie Mae.


They do not go to jail.


There is no media "perp. walk."


They keeps all of their bonuses


They finally pay $31.4 million in civil fines.


2005



The Federal Housing Enterprise Regulatory Reform Act is sponsored by:


2005



None of the top 4 recipients support the legislation.


The reform act is blocked by Democrats, never even making it out of committee.


None of the politicians return any of the money, tainted by fraud.


2008



Fannie Mae & Freddie Mac go bankrupt and the govt. takes them over completely.


Lehman Brothers, goes bankrupt from investing in bad mortgages.


AIG get $85 million in loan guarantees, after insuring bad loans & projects.


Taxpayers will ultimately pay BILLIONS.


2008



Franklin Raines is now an advisor to the Obama Campaign which wants the govt. to take over more of the economy.


Did government involvement in the mortgage market work out?


How will even MORE government involvement make it better? Do you want to be Sweden?


McCain favors revising regulations & loan standards, selling off Fannie & Freddie.


SOURCES



Congressional Record, 5/25/06


"Hannity & Colmes," Fox News, 9/16-9/17/08


Herald Tribune, 4/18/08


New York Times, 9/13/03


www. govtrack.com, 9/17/08


Obama on Freddie and Fannie
http://my.barackobama.com/page/community/post/stateupdates/gG5WlF
McCain and Fannie and Freddie
Contributions from Fannie and Freddie's boards of directors and lobbyists, who are technically not employees. That analysis found Fannie and Freddie-related contributors gave $169,000 to John McCain and his related committees, compared with $16,000 to Obama and his related committees.

The other money Obama received was from employees and their families, not the corporation.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/727/
Dems and the Fannie Mae/Freddie Mac fiasco...

Collapse or the Democrat Swindle of the U.S. Taxpayer


In 2006 an election year, the Democrats were still trying to lay the Enron scandal on Bush and the Republicans. With the help of the press a cover up of a larger financial scandal was taking place. A scandal that we are paying for today. In 2006 a 3 year investigation into fraud at Fannie Mae was concluded. It revealed a level of financial misconduct by Franklin Raines, Jamie Gorelick, and others that grossly overstated earnings by 10.6 Billion dollars. To gain bonuses.


 For those who don't know both Raines and Gorelick were high ranking officials in the Clinton Administration.


http://www.opensecrets.org/news/2008/07/top-senate-recipients-of-fanni.html


http://eddriscoll.com/archives/013595.php


More on Barney Frank and fannie/freddie...
http://www.businessandmedia.org/printer/2008/20080924145932.aspx
Fannie/Freddie going to cost 7 billion...
if we are lucky.
Thank the dems for defending Freddie, Fannie,etc.
nm
Freddie and Fannie were questioned years ago for
nm
Dems are the real cause of Fannie and Freddie
nm
That's because Fannie and Freddie are in his back pocket
He received a lot of money from both places. Would you go against them if you get large election donations and low housing costs with cheap mortages? I don't think so. That's why he has to go. He is just as corrupt as the others.
McCain saw Fannie/Freddie coming in 2005...
and sponsored legislation which the Democrats blocked.

John McCain did anticpate the problems with GSEs and see them as a systemic financial problem. He even sponsored legislation to deal with it, and this is what he said:

"I join as a cosponsor of the Federal Housing Enterprise Regulatory Reform Act of 2005, S. 190, to underscore my support for quick passage of GSE regulatory reform legislation. If Congress does not act, American taxpayers will continue to be exposed to the enormous risk that Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac pose to the housing market, the overall financial system, and the economy as a whole."

McCain deserves credit for being on the right side of this. Meanwhile, Obama in just four years in the Senate raked more contributions from Fannie and Freddie than any other Senator in the last 19 years — save Chris Dodd, who's pretty demonstrably in the pocket of Big Mortgage.

Fannie and Freddie....Barney Frank, Chris Dodd...
you left them off your list. The two MAJOR players. Who got the most donations from fannie/freddie? Barack Obama and Chris Dodd. Obama got more from them in his 3 years than other senators did in 20. You do the math and follow the money.

A Hillary supporter in Pennsylvania has filed...
a lawsuit about Obama's citizenship. I have read...and I haven't read everything yet...that it alleges Obama was born in Kenya, not in Hawaii. I don't have all the details. I don't know if it has merit...I just know it was filed. Probably just sour grapes, but I think the timing is key...a few days before the convention starts. Will be interesting to see how it plays out.

And yeah, QA'ing posts on a posting board is WAY over the top.
Voting McCain, and still a Hillary supporter...nm

Best friend to Hillary, a democratic supporter and financial contributer,
a member of the DNC's (Democrat) platform committee has decided to endorse John McCain.  Lynn DE Rothchild is best friends of Hillary and gave her 100,000 for Hillary compaign.  She had not even spoke to Hillary yet about her news, but Lynn announced on CNN today that she was resigning the DNC and voting for McCain.  Lynn stated that our country is divided due to the Democrats and Congress.  She also stated that we need to vote only for the president who will get us through what is going on with our country (which is a lot of things currently) and she stated the only one would be McCain and Palin.  She stated, "I care more about my country right now than I do my democratic party."  Wolf Blitzer stated to Lynn "You know you are are going to get a lot of flack from this?"  Lynn stated that she knew this and just cares more about our country.  Even Joe Lieberman endorses McCain who used to be AL Gore's running mate.  I am sorry, but I agree that our country is divided.     
I am not a John SYDNEY McCain supporter either. Nor do I support Hillary DIANE Rodham Clinton.
I merely put out what I have read. My opinion is just that. My opinion. Whether you believe it or not is not the point. I put in the link so that those who think differently than I do could look for themselves. It is not that difficult to understand. So does using his full name mean something bad? I don't think so. I use my full name when necessary. If it makes you feel better, then I will repost everything saying Barack Obama. Basically what the article says is that if the Global Poverty bill is passed then you will be paying $8,500 in taxes to a government entity who serves no useful function other than to line it's pockets with the money of the American taxpayers. That is US....you and me.

Personally, I don't want the government to get anymore of my money than they already do regardless of the need. I work too hard for what salary I make to give it away because it is the "feel good" thing to do.

This is my opinion and you are entitled to your opinion also.

PS: I do know what his names mean but thank you for sharing that anyway.
Former CEO of Freddie Mac is a pub, had to return millions he thieved

http://www.reuters.com/article/bankingfinancial-SP/idUSN0642989720071107


http://www.nndb.com/people/222/000163730/


Emanuel Was Director of Freddie Mac During Scandal...

http://www.abcnews.go.com/Blotter/story?id=6201900&page=1



Emanuel Was Director Of Freddie Mac During Scandal



New Obama Chief of Staff, Others on Board, Missed "Red Flags" of Alleged Fraud Scheme




November 7, 2008






President-elect Barack Obama's newly appointed chief of staff, Rahm Emanuel, served on the board of directors of the federal mortgage firm Freddie Mac at a time when scandal was brewing at the troubled agency and the board failed to spot "red flags," according to government reports reviewed by ABCNews.com.


According to a complaint later filed by the Securities and Exchange Commission, Freddie Mac, known formally as the Federal Home Loan Mortgage Corporation, misreported profits by billions of dollars in order to deceive investors between the years 2000 and 2002.


Emanuel was not named in the SEC complaint (click here to read) but the entire board was later accused by the Office of Federal Housing Enterprise Oversight (OFHEO) (click here to read) of having "failed in its duty to follow up on matters brought to its attention."


In a statement to ABCNews.com, a spokesperson said Emanuel served on the board for "13 months-a relatively short period of time."


The spokesperson said that while on the board, Emanuel "believed that Freddie Mac needed to address concerns raised by Congressional critics."


Freddie Mac agreed to pay a $50 million penalty in 2007 to settle the SEC complaint and four top executives of the Federal Home Loan Mortgage Corporation were charged with negligent conduct and, like the company, agreed to settle the case without admitting or denying the allegations.


The actions by Freddie Mac are cited by some economists as the beginning of the country's economic meltdown.


The federal government this year was forced to take over Freddie Mac and a sister federal mortgage agency, Fannie Mae, pledging at least $200 billion in public funds.


Freddie Mac records have been subpoenaed by the Justice Department as part of its investigation of the suspect accounting procedures.


Emanuel was named to the Freddie Mac board by President Bill Clinton in 2000 and resigned his position when he ran for Congress in May, 2001.




Freddie Mac Misrepresented Income, Says SEC


During the years 2000, 2001 and 2002, according to the SEC, Freddie Mac substantially misrepresented its income to "present investors with the image of a company that would continue to generate predictable and growing earnings."


The role of the 18-member board of directors, including Emanuel, was not addressed in the SEC's public action but was heavily criticized by the oversight group (OFHEO) in 2003.


The oversight report said the board had been apprised of the suspect accounting tactics but "failed to make reasonable inquiries of management."


The report also said board members appointed by the President, such as Emanuel, serve terms that are far too short "for them to play a meaningful role on the Board."


As a Congressman, Emanuel recused himself from any votes dealing with Freddie Mac until just this year.


In dealing with the nation's economic crisis, the new White House chief of staff will almost certainly be involved in discussions about the house and mortgage markets.


Emanuel's spokesperson said, "As White House chief of staff he will work with President-elect Obama and his economic advisers to help ensure we protect taxpayers and homeowners."


Fannie Mae's CEO & Obama
Fannie Mae's CEO (Daniel Mudd) calls Obama and the Democrats the "Family" and "Conscience" of Fannie Mae.

The recent bank failures were caused by the Housing Crisis, which was caused by Mortgage Lenders handing out BILLIONS of Dollars in bad loans and the biggest offenders: Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac.

The "Family" and "Conscience" of Fannie Mae and Congress, THE DEMOCRATS, failed miserably and now WE the Tax Payers are stuck paying for their screw-ups.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=usvG-s_Ssb0

Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac are semi-private lending institutions crated by the Clinton administration and the Congressional Democrats, designed to make mortgages available and more affordable to more people and to act as moderators for the mortgage industry. They DO NOT follow the same STRICT government regulations that other lenders must follow. They have huge MULTI-MILLION dollars budgets to lobby congress and to pay large political contributions to keep regulators off their backs.


The TOP THREE U.S. Senators getting BIG political contributions from Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac are DEMOCRATS and the #2 recipient was none other than BARACK OBAMA.

    1. Sen. Christopher Dodd (D-CT).. $165,400 (Chairman of Senate Banking Committee)
    2. Sen. Barack Obama (D-IL)....... $126,349 (Only 4 yrs in the Senate)
    3. Sen. John Kerry (D-MA).......... $111,000
What is it about Barack Obama that makes him the #2 recipient of pay-offs even ahead of John Kerry and others, even though he is only a Freshman in the Senate?

Many Washington Democrats have gone to work at Fannie and Freddie after leaving Washington and have mad MILLIONS of Dollars in the process.

As early as 2005 the Congressional Black Caucus and Barack Obama KNEW that Fannie Mae was failing but "THE FAMILY" Democrats and OBAMA took payoffs to do NOTHING about it.

Obama was in the room during this speech. He heard about the problems that faced Fannie Mae and yet he did NOTHING about it.

During the THREE years following the day when he heard this speech about Fannie Mae's problems, Obama received $126,349 in payoffs from Fannie Mae to keep quiet and DO NOTHING about their disastrous lending practices. Now Obama blames John McCain for the Housing Crisis and the bank failu res and says that HE can fix it.

Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac got a Federal bailout when it became obvious that they were bankrupt. Yet the Federal Government allowed Lehman Brothers to collapse pushing our economy over the edge.

Obama has been attacking McCain and Republican policies for the current financial turmoil. However,
"...Senator Obama was at the head of the line when the piggies lined up at the Fannie and Freddie trough for campaign bucks."
__________________

Fannie Mae/NY Times
Check out the date on this. Of course, this came as no surprise to me. It's surprising to ever find an objective article from the NY Times, but sometimes they surprise us.

Fannie Mae Eases Credit To Aid Mortgage Lending
By STEVEN A. HOLMES

Published: September 30, 1999
In a move that could help increase home ownership rates among minorities and low-income consumers, the Fannie Mae Corporation is easing the credit requirements on loans that it will purchase from banks and other lenders.

The action, which will begin as a pilot program involving 24 banks in 15 markets -- including the New York metropolitan region -- will encourage those banks to extend home mortgages to individuals whose credit is generally not good enough to qualify for conventional loans. Fannie Mae officials say they hope to make it a nationwide program by next spring.

Fannie Mae, the nation's biggest underwriter of home mortgages, has been under increasing pressure from the Clinton Administration to expand mortgage loans among low and moderate income people and felt pressure from stock holders to maintain its phenomenal growth in profits.

In addition, banks, thrift institutions and mortgage companies have been pressing Fannie Mae to help them make more loans to so-called subprime borrowers. These borrowers whose incomes, credit ratings and savings are not good enough to qualify for conventional loans, can only get loans from finance companies that charge much higher interest rates -- anywhere from three to four percentage points higher than conventional loans.

''Fannie Mae has expanded home ownership for millions of families in the 1990's by reducing down payment requirements,'' said Franklin D. Raines, Fannie Mae's chairman and chief executive officer. ''Yet there remain too many borrowers whose credit is below what our underwriting has required who have been relegated to paying significantly higher mortgage rates in the so-called subprime market.''

Demographic information on these borrowers is sketchy. But at least one study indicates that 18 percent of the loans in the subprime market went to black borrowers, compared to 5 per cent of loans in the conventional loan market.

In moving, even tentatively, into this new area of lending, Fannie Mae is taking on significantly more risk, which may not pose any difficulties during flush economic times. But the government-subsidized corporation may run into trouble in an economic downturn, prompting a government rescue similar to that of the savings and loan industry in the 1980's.

''From the perspective of many people, including me, this is another thrift industry growing up around us,'' said Peter Wallison a resident fellow at the American Enterprise Institute. ''If they fail, the government will have to step up and bail them out the way it stepped up and bailed out the thrift industry.''

Under Fannie Mae's pilot program, consumers who qualify can secure a mortgage with an interest rate one percentage point above that of a conventional, 30-year fixed rate mortgage of less than $240,000 -- a rate that currently averages about 7.76 per cent. If the borrower makes his or her monthly payments on time for two years, the one percentage point premium is dropped.

Fannie Mae, the nation's biggest underwriter of home mortgages, does not lend money directly to consumers. Instead, it purchases loans that banks make on what is called the secondary market. By expanding the type of loans that it will buy, Fannie Mae is hoping to spur banks to make more loans to people with less-than-stellar credit ratings.

Home ownership has, in fact, exploded among minorities during the economic boom of the 1990's. The number of mortgages extended to Hispanic applicants jumped by 87.2 per cent from 1993 to 1998, according to Harvard University's Joint Center for Housing Studies. During that same period the number of African Americans who got mortgages to buy a home increased by 71.9 per cent and the number of Asian Americans by 46.3 per cent.



Fannie CEO is Daniel Mudd
http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5gPfdSGL82ufTASVrfgCbKslcCYPgD92M2NI03
Bush orchestrated Fannie Mae F-up
The former chief executive officer of Fannie Mae says the Bush administration helped orchestrate an accounting scandal that cost him his job and that he wants to use White House documents to defend himself in a shareholder lawsuit.

Franklin Raines, who served as President Clinton's budget director, argues in court documents that the Bush administration felt the government-chartered agency wielded too much power in the mortgage industry. His attorneys say the White House pushed regulators to weaken Fannie Mae and triggered a $6 billion accounting scandal.


Raines subpoenaed the White House for documents in July. Justice Department lawyers will go before a federal judge Thursday to fight it.


Relying primarily on articles by financial journalists and the testimony of industry analysts, Raines describes in court documents an unofficial task force dubbed "Noriega" that was formed to weaken Fannie Mae and drive down its stock price.


Fannie Mae is the largest U.S. buyer and backer of home loans. It was created by Congress but is publicly traded. Raines says the Bush administration wanted to undermine confidence in the agency so it could push for tighter government controls.


You think O is a good guy? He profited from Fannie
nm
you tube video on freddy and fannie

 

ex-O supporter
Okay, so I have been reading a lot on Obama.  Not his policies.  I did happen to support a lot of his ideas.  But the whole messiah thing really got me.  My conclusion about the whole thing is this:  I do believe in separation of church and state, however, O says he is a Christian.  If that is true, he could not sit by and let people imply in any way that he is from God or the Messiah.  This should be something he would speak about at some point in time, being God fearing and God following.  This would go against a Christian's belief.  So far, I havent heard him address this at all.  Anyone else?  I am not saying he is the antichrist, because according to my father, who is a preacher, and many other people the antichrist has to come out of Europe/Middle East?  Anyway, something sure isnt right about all the fanfare. 
I too am ex-O supporter
I too am an ex-O supporter. I voted for him in the primaries. Sure wish a lot of this stuff came out before hand, then Hillary would have won and even if she were to get in it would not be as bad as what is trying to get in.

I'm not a "geography" expert, but you said your dad said the antichrist comes from Europe/Middle east. Is Africa considered the Middle East? If Africa is not the middle east then, no I would not imagine its him. Needless to say he has the support and funding of many countries in the middle east.

I did read that Michael Savage is supporting McCain. He has a great radio talk show and by all means he is NO Bush fan. He is an idependent. He cuts Bush down all the time. So taking it from him who despises Bush (he has said some really negative things against Bush on his show) I would take what he says into consideration. Here are a couple things he said (I will post the link to the actual article afterwards). After that is another link to a preacher my husband had me listen to. The preacher is very knowledgable about Obama, Obama's family, Wright, and what is going on, etc. Very interesting and learned a lot listening to him. I'm looking for more of his sermons on other things besides Obama. I'm not religious (I'm a very spiritual person, just not religious) but I enjoyed his sermons so much want to hear him more.

On Michael Savage - the article says....

“You may say, oh, who listens to that guy Savage? What does an endorsement from him mean?

“It means more than you may imagine.”

Savage said his endorsement means more than the backing of a dozen newspapers he mentioned, including the Los Angeles Times, Newsday, Chicago Tribune and New York Post, because his “daily circulation is larger than any one of these newspapers.

“I have millions of listeners,” he continued, “most of whom, by the way, are independents. In case you don’t know it, they’re not all conservatives. Most of my audience are independents and they have been waiting for some kind of a signal…

“They despise what Bush has done to this country as much as you do.

“And I understand that John McCain is not really that much different in so many ways, that it’s hard to endorse him.

“I have put my own ego aside and I have to say what’s best for America.

“I’ll take my chances with the old war horse and even with Sarah Palin, who I’m not really a big fan of, by the way, over this naked Marxist revolutionary, because I don’t want to see what the next Pol Pot’s liable to do to the world.”

http://www.newsmax.com/insidecover/savage_endorses_mccain/2008/10/28/144993.html

Here's the preacher - well worth the time to listen to.

http://www.pyrabang.com/contenteditor.php?pd=4057&ps=4121&org=3955&target=http://www.atlah.org/broadcast/ndnr10-17-08.html

Anyway...welcome to the world of the awakened.

On one other note, what also makes me leery about Obama is that Farrakan (sp?) is telling all his followers that Obama is the Messiah. Just a bit too creepy and cultish for me.
ex O supporter
I wonder why the LA Times, who admitted they had a tape and refuse to release it to the public stating that they promised confidentiality to their source, would not want to release it?  I can safely say that IF the video was in good favor for Obama, they would gladly release it.  I am quite sure given the fact of its secrecy, it is quite negative about his connections.
As a supporter
I have yet to hear a gay?/no-way! supporter explain why gay marriage opens the door to polygamy any more than straight marriage does. The same "tools" that gay?/no-way! proponents strive to use to keep gays from marrying could be used to keep polyamorous couples of marrying.
I'm an Obama supporter, but...

...I think Hillary should stay in the race as long as it takes for every American to be able to participate in the voting process.  Obama has said the very same thing, even though Hillary's been lying about it and saying he wants her to drop out.


Trust is the main issue I won't be voting for her.  If she somehow "wins" the primary, I'll probably write in Senator Obama's name, but I could never vote for her with a clear conscience.


I'm an uninsured American with a terminal illness, and this may very well be the last election in which I'll be able to participate.  This is the first time in my entire life that I don't feel my choice involves voting for the "least worst" person.  It's the first time in my life I've actually been excited about voting for a candidate, and I'm grateful I had the opportunity to know what that feels like.


Different if it comes from a supporter or the campaign....
neither McCain or Obama can control what supporters do...but this ad was from the Obama campaign. And it flies in the face of everything Obama said he was NOT going to do.
I am an Obama supporter and I think
what he has done is not forgetable, and am not sweeping anything under the rug. Are you sweeping under the rug that in his 26 years in the Senate all but 2 of them McCain has been for deregulation. Do you acknowledge his or any of the other Rep. part in this too. There will be plenty of crises as a President what will he do then?
I AM an Obama fan and supporter
Like I said, you really need to read the posts that you are responding to better.
I'm a McCain/Palin supporter, sm
And I think it's pretty silly to be focused on this so late in the game. I for one, am a woman and a republican (sigh and a poor one at that) and I for one don't think Obama was calling Palin a "pig", it was just his choice of phrases. Many have used it before.
I'm still waiting for ONE Obama supporter on this

The news that he intentionally hid the 800K plus he donated to ACORN.  His camp has admitted to it but said it was an "oversight".....yea, right!  Obama knew what ACORN is mostly all about and he's all for that........ya know, voter fraud?!!!  I'm still waiting for someone to post a fact to refute that statement made by his own spokesperson.   Where is it?   So many underhanded, deviant, illegal characters he has contact with......this is a dem that will NOT be voting for him. 


Yes, these O supporter are "a joke". The hatred
nm
I am a firm supporter of the military, but --
My exhusband was a soldier the entire 20 years we were married and is in fact in Iraq right now; my son, whom I love dearly, is graduating from basic training on Friday. I support the military wholeheartedly, but that does not mean I have to support McCain.

I don't believe that our soldiers should be where they are and I don't believe they should have ever been where they are. And I believe that when they come home, they should have better support and better care than they are getting.

But I have the utmost respect for the military and their families and would always hope and pray the best for them. They did after all fight to give me the right to disagree on who their commander-in-chief should be.

That being said, I also do not think that serving in the military should be experience that counts in running the country. Just because McCain is a a war hero and former POW does not make him entitled to be the leader of the United States of America. That would be the same as saying my ex-husband could have that job; he has just as much experience in the military as McCain, not as a POW, but he has served many more years than McCain did.


She's not an Obama supporter so no concern
@
Foreign investors. China and Russia insisted on Fannie Mac bail out.
dd
Ron Paul supporter? Not wanting to fight, just asking.
nm
I should have mentioned I was a loyal Ron Paul supporter.
If that makes any difference.
i agree - i am a lover and supporter of the obvious
x
Does anyone here speak McCain supporter incoherence?
nm
Ok, how about he was a "closet Obama supporter" until now..IMHO...nm

the response didn't come from an obama supporter
If you're referring to my response to the OP about scraping the bottom of the barrel. FYI I'm voting for McCain.
typical O supporter, can't take the facts, so switch
to something else...your kool aid should wear off in about 6 to 8 months.
AR, that is a compliment, coming from a supporter of murderous statements.
And, you can take your right wing rationalizations and put them where the sun don't shine. I am passionate about what I believe but in no way irrational. You might have a coherent argument to make if you thought you could best me or anyone else here logically or rationally, but I haven't seen you try. You're invited right now to express your political opinion and should you do so with dignity and respect, you'll be treated that way in return by the majority of people here, including me. Keep up the personal sniping like a spoiled child and that is exactly how you'll be treated in return.
I didn't miss the point - I have been a McCain supporter
I have been on this board arguing over and over why McCain is the better choice. I used to support Obama until a few weeks ago after he beat out Hillary and then all this stuff about his life and the people he associates with (forget Rev. Wright- I could care less about that little dweeb), but his affiliations with the worst of the worst, his voting record, his lies about how he will not tax us, yet has consistently voted to raise taxes on who? The middle income (around $42,000 - if you would call that middle income anymore). His not cutting back on any of the programs he wants to fund. The list goes on and on and on about what I don't like about Obama.

As for McCain - I think he's a decent guy. I think he's way more decent than many of the politicians in Washington. I think he has always been on the side of the people and has shown that by consistently arguing against both dems and pubs if it doesn't benefit the people. I strongly supported the ticket mainly because of Palin. She is certainly one of the most qualified out of the other 3. She has consistently balanced the budget as governer, cut back pork filled bills, stopped wasteful spending, and has done nothing but good things for the people of her state and I believe that will carry over if the republicans win.

I was so expecting a really good debate and believed Gov. Palin helped him tremendously with her outstanding debate outcome, so was expecting nothing but good with McCain. There were so many issues people were talking about with what McCain would need to do to win the debate. I didn't see any of it last night and left me wondering, who does he meet with before debates and speeches and does he listent to any of them. To me his performance last night was so bad shuffling around the stage. I was sitting here typing and heard loud and clear McCain say "that one" not only saying it, but the tone of his voice just hit a raw nerve with me. DH and I just looked at each other and shook our heads. As I stated earlier I was very disappointed as I have been on this board arguing over and over and over for McCain and against Obama. But I don't know what was worse. His saying "that one" or him overusing "my friends". Why hasn't anyone told him to knock it off. He uses it in almost every single sentance he says. Like I say, I got disgusted and turned off the debate. Right now I don't care anymore who wins the election. I'm voting for the constitutional party, if I do even vote at all.
I knew it was a matter of time before we would hear from a McCain supporter
I guess you must figure if you use his middle name enough times people are going to think what? That he's Saddam reincarnated? You really do not give America enough credit to know a name does not make a person who they are, the goodness they do and what they believe in make them a good person. So...when you post about John McCain do you write John Sydney McCain? And do you write Hillary Diane Rodham Clinton? No. You don't even know what Hussein means. Here's a bit of background of the origin of his name. Barack means "To bless" and Hussein means "to be good". Both are beautiful names. I know exactly what you are trying to do. You believe that if you say his name enough times in full people will think of Saddam Hussain. But there are many more good people with the name. For instance...King Hussein of Jordan. The person who wrote the Kite Runner is Khaled Hossain and many more. In fact there are more good people named Hussein than are bad.
Hussein is a very common name in Bangladesh just like Smith or Jones. His middle name honors his grandfather. In case you don't realize this, he was born in America and raised in a Christian home, went to christian churches. To incite feelings of "fear" because his middle name is Hussein? Well just shows what kind of person you are.
Also, you didn't show the good things he has done working in government. And the stuff you did write I don't think a lot of people know what all this means. I read it and its just mumbo jumbo. If you want to talk about bad records and bad things people have done while in government, lets post about Hillary Diane Rodham Clinton. There's enough reading material to last a lifetime.
I agree, and am not an Obama supporter. Just tired of all the racial conflict sm
tired of everything being all about race. If they were both black candidates, then people could all just vote their conscience without even thinking about race.