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Last minute house keeping by Bush & Co.

Posted By: sm on 2008-11-13
In Reply to:

It’s something of a tradition– administrations using their final weeks in power to ram through a slew of federal regulations. With the election grabbing the headlines, outgoing federal bureaucrats quietly propose and finalize rules that can affect the health and safety of millions.


The Bush administration has followed this tradition and expanded it. Up to 90 proposed regulations could be finalized before President George W. Bush leaves office Jan. 20. If adopted, these rules could weaken workplace safety protections, allow local police to spy in the “war on terror” and make it easier for federal agencies to ignore the Endangered Species Act.


What’s more, the administration has accelerated the rule-making process to ensure that the changes it wants will be finalized by Nov. 22.


That’s a key date, Nov. 22. It is 60 days before the next administration takes control — and most federal rules go into effect 60 days after they have been finalized. It would be a major bureaucratic undertaking for the Obama administration to reverse federal rules already in effect.


“The Bush administration has thought through last-minute regulations much more than past administrations,” said Rick Melberth, director of OMB Watch, a nonprofit group that tracks federal regulations. “They’ve said, ‘Let’s not only get them finalized; let’s get them in effect.’”


So what are the new rules?


The Washington Independent has highlighted five regulations notable for their potential effect and the way they slipped through the regulatory process. Four could to be finalized by Nov. 22. One was already — on Election Day.


1) The Dept. of Labor proposed a regulation Aug. 30 that changes how workplace safety standards are met. Labor experts contend that the administration, which previously issued only one new workplace safety standard and that under court order, is trying to make it a bureaucratic nightmare for future administrations to make workplace safety rules.


Here’s what it would do:


Currently, if the Occupational Safety and Health Admin. or the Mine Health and Safety Admin. want to introduce a new safety standard on, say, the level of exposure to toxic chemicals, it issues what is called a notice of proposed rule-making. This notice is published in the Federal Register and then debated by labor, business and relevant federal agencies.


The new regulation would add an “advanced notice of proposed rule-making,” meaning OSHA and MSHA would have prove that, say, the said chemical was seriously harming workers.


This would open the door for industry to challenge the validity of the risk assessment and then, if necessary, the actual safety standard that may come from that risk assessment.


“The purpose of this sort of rule is to require agencies to spend more time on a regulation which gives them less of a chance to actually regulate,” said David Michaels, a professor of workplace safety at George Washington University, “You’re adding at least a year, maybe two years, to the process.”


The regulation has not been finalized.


2) The administration proposed a rule that changes the employer-employee relationship laid out in the 1993 Family and Medical Leave Act.


Here’s what it would do:


The Family and Medical Leave Act says that employers must give their workers 12 weeks of unpaid leave if they are sick or need to take care of a family member or newborn. The employer’s health-care staff can check the legitimacy of the family or medical leave claim with the employee’s doctor or health-care provider.


The proposed regulation would allow the employer to directly speak with the employee’s doctor or health-care provider. The employer could also ask employees to provide more medical documentation of their conditions.


Why such a rule — which may threaten an employee’s privacy– is needed is unclear. The only study the Labor Dept. has done on the act was in 2000. The department collected comments from employers before issuing the proposed regulation, but a report analyzing the comments was never issued.


The regulation also would gives employees the right to waive their rights under the Family and Medical Leave Act, making it the first national labor law to be optional. A worker, for instance, cannot waive his right to earn a minimum wage or get paid more for overtime.


The regulation was finalized on Election Day.


3) The Dept. of Health and Human Services proposed a rule Sept. 26 that would expand the reasons that physicians or health care entities could decline to provide any procedure to include moral and religious grounds. The language of the regulation says the department hopes to correct “an attitude toward the health-care profession that health-care professionals and institutions should be required to provide or assist in the provision of medicine or procedures to which they object, or else risk being subjected to discrimination.”


Here’s what it would do:


The rule change seems to apply to abortion. But they are already several rules that say physicians or health-care entities can deny an abortion request. Some women’s health advocates contend that the proposed regulation’s broad language is meant to increase the number of physicians who not only don’t provide abortions but don’t provide contraception.


“Contraception is certainly the target of this rule,” contends Marylin Keefe, director for Reproductive Health at the National Partnership for Women and Families. “The moral and religious objections of health-care workers are now starting to take precedence over patients.”


The regulation is notable for another reason. A rule involving an employee’s religious rights must be referred to the Equal Employment and Opportunity Commission, yet the commission was never told of this proposed regulation.


A bureaucratic battled erupted when EEOC’s legal counsel, Reed Russell, wrote a regulation comment (pdf) blasting both the substance of the proposed rule and its disregard for the rule-making process.


The regulation has not been finalized.


4) On July 31, the Justice Dept. proposed a regulation that would allow state and local law enforcement agencies to collect “intelligence” information on individuals and organizations even if the information is unrelated to a criminal matter.


“This is a continuum that started back on 9/11 to reform law enforcement and the intelligence community to focus on the terrorism threat,” said Bush homeland security adviser Kenneth L. Wainstein in a statement.


Critics say it could infringe on civil liberties.


Here’s what it would do:


“It expands local law enforcement’s ability to investigate criminal activity that it deems suspicious,” said Melberth of OMB Watch. “But what’s suspicious to you may not be suspicious to me. They could be investigating community organizations they think are two or three steps away from a terrorist group.”


The regulation has not been finalized.


5) Before a federal agency approves any construction project– anything from building a dam to a post office — government officials must consult the Fish and Wildlife Service and the National Marine Fisheries Service. These two agencies enforce the Endangered Species Act, and they can veto any project that adversely affects an animal on the endangered species list.


Here’s what it would do:


A regulation proposed by the Interior Dept. Aug. 12 would end this approval process. “It destroys a system of checks and balances that have been in place for two decades,” claimed Bob Davison, senior scientist at Defenders of the Wildlife. “[A federal agency] wants to go forward with a project that [it wants] to do. So you need an independent agency to look at the decision.”


Davison is not the only conservation advocate up in arms. The Interior Dept. has received 200,000 public comments, which may affect the final rule.


Or not — the department shortened the comment period from 60 to 30 days in its effort to get the regulation finalized.


In May, White House Chief of Staff Josh Bolten vowed that the administration would propose no regulations after June 1. He and White House spokesman Tony Fratto have repeatedly stated their contempt for what they call “midnight regulations.”


Yet with the exception of the Family and Medical Leave changes, each of these regulations were proposed after June 1. And if finalized, they will effect worker’s safety, women’s health-care choices, local police powers and endangered species.


“It was a pretty resounding election,” said Keefe of the National Partnership for Women and Families. “But this administration acts like it still has a mandate.”





LINK/URL: http://washingtonindependent.com/17813/11-hour-regulations


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Thank you, President Bush, for your service and especially for keeping us safe at home. nm

Bush house
That neighborhood was pricey 50 years ago.
Bush is out of the White House.

This has nothing to do with Bush.  My whole point of this was not to worship Bush here.  My whole point was that I was blindsided by our government and I refuse to sit back and not be informed with Obama as president.  I want to stay in the know so I can make my own decisions and keep tabs on things.  I just think that President Obama has made A LOT of promises already and the man hasn't even been pres for a whole week yet and he has already broken some of his promises.  I am going to hold this president and any future president's feet to the fire from now on.  I don't care if they are dem, pub, or whatever......


White House denies Bush God claims (name of article)
White House denies Bush God claims

James Sturcke
Friday October 7, 2005



A senior White House official has denied that the US president, George Bush, said God ordered him to invade Afghanistan and Iraq.

A spokesman for Mr Bush, Scott McClellan, said the claims, to be broadcast in a TV documentary later this month, were absurd.

In the BBC film, a former Palestinian foreign minister, Nabil Shaath, says that Mr Bush told a Palestinian delegation in 2003 that God spoke to him and said: George, go and fight these terrorists in Afghanistan and also George, go and end the tyranny in Iraq.




During a White House press briefing, Mr McClellan said: No, that's absurd. He's never made such comments.

Mr McClellan admitted he was not at the Israeli-Palestinian summit at the Egyptian resort of Sharm el-Sheikh in June 2003 when Mr Bush supposedly revealed the extent of his religious fervour.

However, he said he had checked into the claims and I stand by what I just said.

Asked if Mr Bush had ever mentioned that God had ordered him into Afghanistan and Iraq, Mr McClellan said: No, and I've been in many meetings with him and never heard such a thing.

The claims are due to be broadcast in a three-part BBC documentary which analyses attempts to bring peace to the Middle East.

Mr Shaath, the Palestinian foreign minister in 2003, claims Mr Bush told him and other delegates that he was spoken to by God over his plans for war.

He told the film-makers: President Bush said to all of us: 'I'm driven with a mission from God. God would tell me, George, go and fight those terrorists in Afghanistan. And I did, and then God would tell me, George, go and end the tyranny in Iraq... And I did.

'And now, again, I feel God's words coming to me, Go get the Palestinians their state and get the Israelis their security, and get peace in the Middle East. And by God I'm gonna do it.'

The Palestinian leader, Mahmoud Abbas, who attended the June 2003 meeting as well, also appears on the documentary series to recount how Mr Bush told him: I have a moral and religious obligation. So I will get you a Palestinian state.

Mr Bush, who became a born-again Christian at 40, is one of the most overtly religious leaders to occupy the White House, a fact that brings him much support in middle America.

History is littered with examples of people doing the most bizarre and sometimes wicked things on this basis, said Andrew Blackstock, director of the British-based Christian Socialist Movement. If Bush really wants to obey God during his time as president he should start with what is blindingly obvious from the Bible rather than perceived supernatural messages.

That would lead him to the rather less glamorous business of prioritising the needs of the poor, the downtrodden and the marginalised in his own country and abroad.

When we see more policies reflecting that, it might be easier to believe he has God on his side. And more likely that God might speak to him.

The TV series, which starts on Monday, charts recent attempts to bring peace to the Middle East, from the former US president Bill Clinton's peace talks in 1999-2000, to Israel's withdrawal from the Gaza Strip this year. It seeks to uncover what happened behind closed doors by speaking to presidents and prime ministers, along with their generals and ministers, the BBC said.


Abramoff Attended staff-level meetings at Bush White House
White House Silent on Abramoff Meetings

WASHINGTON, Jan. 18, 2006


(AP) The White House is refusing to reveal details of tainted lobbyist Jack Abramoff's visits with President Bush's staff.

Abramoff had a few staff-level meetings at the Bush White House, presidential spokesman Scott McClellan said Tuesday. But he would not say with whom Abramoff met, which interests he was representing or how he got access to the White House.

Since Abramoff pleaded guilty two weeks ago to conspiracy, mail fraud and tax evasion charges in an influence-peddling scandal, McClellan has told reporters he was checking into Abramoff's meetings. I'm making sure that I have a thorough report back to you on that, he said in his press briefing Jan. 5. And I'll get that to you, hopefully very soon.

McClellan said Tuesday that he checked on it at reporters' requests, but wouldn't discuss the private staff-level meetings. We are not going to engage in a fishing expedition, he said.

Senate Minority Leader Harry Reid, along with three other Democratic senators, wrote Bush a letter Tuesday asking for an accounting of Abramoff's personal contacts with Bush administration officials and acts that may have been undertaken at his request. The American people need to be assured that the White House is not for sale, they wrote.

McClellan has said Abramoff attended three Hanukkah receptions at the White House, but corrected himself Tuesday to say there were only two _ in 2001 and 2002.

McClellan said Bush does not know Abramoff personally, although it's possible the two met at the holiday receptions.

Abramoff was one of Bush's top fundraisers, having brought in at least $100,000 for the Bush-Cheney '04 re-election campaign and earning the honorary title pioneer. The campaign took $6,000 of the contributions _ which came directly from Abramoff, his wife and one of the Indian tribes he represented _ and donated it to the American Heart Association. But the campaign has not returned the rest of the money Abramoff raised.


Keeping God out of it is your right
Me?  I prefer to be on the winning side.
Who was keeping us safe before
9/11? So tired of hearing this crap. This was the first time ever (not this present president on watch) that the US was attacked on its own land and yet you talk about since 9/11. Why not even before then?? I think the attitude of most on here sucks. All chicken littles, scared. booooooo. See, made you jump.
Thanks for keeping the facts straight - NM
//
Having a hard time keeping up.
The numbers of Iraqi deaths that is. Today, 93 Shi'ite pilgrims were killed and 147 injured in a suicide bombing in Hilla. Two bombings in Baghdad killing 18 to 20 and I don't know how many injured, 9 American soldiers killed on this one day. This is all just so wrong, all of it, and the numbers just keep on climbing.
anybody would be dog tired with the schedules they were keeping then! nm
x
actually he says he will tax credit them for keeping jobs here... nm
x
Thought you were keeping a tally... nm
xxx
He's keeping his campaign of "change" - that's for sure
Change? Yeah he keeps changing his mind. I've been saying it all along with others that there is no way he can do everything he wants to and spend, spend, spend without taxing us. This is coming right out of the democrats mouth, 250, 200, 150, and now 120. It keeps going lower and lower.

Sure he wants you to go out and vote early. He keeps pushing it as hard as he can because as each hour goes by we keep learning what more of a "sleeze-bag" he really is and the truth is coming out.

Why do people want someone with his character and already the blatant lies he puts out. Have people taken a break from reality? Do people want to live in socialism and fear?

You are definitely not offending us. These fears you express are so much like mine and many others while.

As far as I'm concerned he is NOT NOT NOT eligible to be president. He has not passed the #1 criteria. "American-born citizen". If he wins it will be a stolen election and illegal and lets just see how many people who believe in the constition will be happy about that.
So what! - How about keeping your mind on what is happening now
And if you want to start prosecuting Clinton better be right at the top.

That time has passed. Obama better not decide that there is a right time to prosecute anyone. If so Clinton and himself should go down the tubes along with the rest of them.

This is now old news. Lets stick to the problems we are facing currently. There is enough to keep our minds busy for the duration of the term (4 years - well actually 3 and 1/2 now).

We don't need this type of distraction. That is where there is American Idol an Survivor - keeps poeple dumbed down.
Keeping the glass half full SM

isn't about any of the things you name.  It comes from inside, a peace of spirit and soul. It needs no outside influence except, in my case, my love for God and his for me.  My glass has always been half full.  And it always will be because He is with me always.


Obama is calling for keeping troops in Iraq....
for how long he does not say, but that we need MORE in Afghanistan. He does not differ from McCain on that stance. Diplomacy does not work with terrorists (the Taliban were in charge there when bid Laden was parading around in the open after 9-11). Taliban = terrorists. With all due respect...you cannot negotiate with terrorists. Do you remember the horrific images of 9-11? I do. Of the Khobar Towers bombing? I do. The first World Trade Center bombing? I do... the bombing of the marine barracks in beirut? I sure remember those images.
My goodness. O witch hunt sure is keeping you busy.
It is in its 3rd day. No comments on the discussions regarding party revamp? How about today's agenda? Keep your eye on Jindel. He did a great job in Louisiana with disaster mgmt...and GOP will be neding plenty of that in the 2008 election aftermath. Seriously, as a left-wing commie Marxist terrorist unAmerican anti-patriot, he has GOP leadership written all over him. Mayb you should take a hate break and take a look at him.
Keeping information quiet because we worry about the pirates??????
That never stopped the MSM from giving out troop movements, information etc during the height of the Iraqi war did it? What about the "embedded" journalists over there. And I use the word journalist loosely.
So how did the Cheney comment fit in except to say that Obama was not keeping us safe from this flu?
x
It's just too easy -- the idea that keeping American jobs in America actually helping the economy

Nope, let's spend a few million and buy new furniture for homeland security and a few million more to buy hybrids for congress. 


Can they not deduce that keeping corporate America from offshoring jobs will actually create more jobs, thereby lower the unemployment rate, and put more money in American's pocket for them to spend?  Cut all tax cuts given to companies for offshoring and give the tax cuts to companies to strive to keep jobs in America?


And here's another V8 moment -- how about we buy American?  Maybe increase tariffs on imported goods to discourage American companies from importing so much crapy and thereby necessitating said crap be sold at higher prices in an effort to discourage Americans from buying imports? 


The ONLY way to help the American economy is to employ Americans and buy American!  It's that simple!


Just think about that for a minute...
Think what that would mean to Americans. Death penality if you do not follow one religion. Hands cut off for stealing. Stoned to death for adultery. Stoned to death or worse for homosexuality. No TV other than state TV. No western music. No abortions. No living together outside marriage. Girls killed by their own families for premarital sex. No divorce. Women in total subjection in a society totally dominated by males. Some of the practices and lifestyles this country has come to accept in the name freedom, whether good or bad, gone in a heartbeat. The scary thing is that a good part of this country will go on thinking that can't happen here...and unfortunately that may be the death knell of America as we know it. I shudder to think. All Christians no matter what denomination need to hit their knees and pray hard that that does not happen to our country, and we need to support our country's efforts in Iraq and support the men and women who are there trying to keep just this thing from happening. We are losing the will to fight, and in so doing are rolling onto our backs to expose our belly to the wolves. Sorry to be so graphic, but that is about what it amounts to. Some things ARE worth fighting for. God bless us all!
don't believe it for a minute

This man has changed his mind (that's a nice way of saying he lies) as much as Biden did in the debate last PM.  Keep in mind that literally anything that is "gov't-sponsored" is actually YOU sponsored.  You take home less money (less than you do now, that's for sure), you hand over even more control to "the gov't," etc.


If nothing else, look how everything "the gov't" does gets more screwed up every time "they" touch it.  The bailout they just signed had thousands of pages added to it.  That's the name of that tune.  Hope this helps. 


Incidentally, I don't give anyone a free pass.  That's something I've never understood.


Let us for a minute consider this

in a different way.


Let us say that your son or daughter are in school.  They are very good students.  They do their homework, study, and get good grades.  In fact, they get an A.  However, another little girl or boy didn't do so well in class.  Instead...they got a D.  Now an A is above average and a D is below average as I'm sure all of you aware of.  So the A student can afford to lose part of their grade right because they are above average.  So let us say that we take a bit of the A grade to up the unfortunate child who received a D so that way they get a C.  That would make the unfortunate child have an average grade.  Now the child earning the A but having it taken away is very upset.  They worked so hard for that A but because others felt she could afford to give up part of her A so another child could bring a below average grade up to an average grade would make the whole school a happy place because everyone would be average.  No one would be below average.  But the A student gets very down and stops trying because what is the point.  The A they earned will be taken away any way.  The D student continues to get below average grades because....hey...no big deal...teacher will just take it from an A student and I'll be average.  No harm done except now the A student is getting lower grades because their hard work has been penalized and they have stopped trying.


If this were happening in our school systems each and every one of us would have an absolute fit but that is exactly what Barrack Obama is wanting to do to us.  Instead he is doing it with our hard-earned money. 


Think about this for a minute s/m
Think anchor babies............they are natural born babies aren't they?  You want to see a child of  ILLEGAL ALIEN parents become president?  That would be a fine example of our Constitution since it would give them every right to run for the presidency.  Well, wake up, that is very likely to happen!
Let's look at this a minute

First, $60,000 per year is not exactly in the wealthy category but even in this day it is or should be enough to pay for the necessities with some money left over.


Do I pay for everything with cash?  You betcha!  We have done so for years while we scrimped and saved to pay off the mortgage, get the cars paid off, etc.  Then that money instead of going into finer living went into savings.  We still live frugally because we fully expect that we will have to help our kids who are not yet old enough to have followed our advice...I might add that of 4 only 1 (Joe the real life plumber) has the desire to follow in our footsteps.  People these days want bigger houses, newer cars, more "stuff" to keep up with the Jones and have kept buying what they can't afford...when their credit runs out then what?  Bankruptcy?  Bush pretty well took that option off the table.  I fully expect debtor's prison to be the next thing on the agenda.


Use your head.  If the middle class does well everyone does well.  Where's the middle class now?  But the greed is still there and that includes greedy people as well as greedy big business.


As for the rebates.....I was NOT in favor of the rebates and said they would do no good........they didn't.  Mine went into the mattress and I'd gladly give it back if it would help this economy.  I imagine the majority of people threw money at the credit card bill collectors hoping to stave them off another day or so.  So who benefited from that?


 


This is getting better every minute, MT. You claim to know who's AGAINST you when you can't

even figure out who's WITH you, as evidenced by the little hissy fit above between you and another CON!!!


Please keep posting.  You're getting whackier with each post and revealing yourself for the nut case you truly are!!!


Plus, I'm intrigued by all the different voices in your head who surface at different times.  I guess tonight TM is doing the talking, and TM seems to be even more rude and angry and hateful than you usually are.


Why so angry, MT?  Roberts was confirmed today.  Why aren't you happy?  Or do you just have a terminal case of chronic bitterness, no matter what? Have you ever been nice to ANYONE?


PLEASE keep posting.  You're quite entertaining, even if in a pathetic sort of way.


wait a minute there
if you are wealthy and repub, drug addiction is an ILLNESS.  If you are middle class or poor and perhaps a person of color, it is CRIME.  Get your facts straight.
Not me for a minute!!! Foolish old man. nm
x
There's one born every minute.
You seem to have bought the Dem's propaganda hook, line and sinker. What a sucker.

There is none so blind as he who will not see.
i was lost for a minute. thank you
x
I don't believe this story for one minute!
The "B" carved in this young lady's cheek is more like scratch, and it is backwards. Have you ever looked at writing in a mirror? It's backwards! This young lady may have been mugged, but she scratched the "B" in her cheek all by herself. She is also a college Republican field representative, which makes this story even more fishy and explains her motive for doing this. Talk about stooping low...this is as low as it gets!
Oh now, wait a minute
Isn't it the dems that hate rich old white folks. But, of course, you can't hate rich old black folks, right?

What a hypocrit!
So did anyone watch the 30-minute

Just think of what he spent on that.  That could be your hard-earned dollars at work in his big spending.  2 million bucks per station.  For 30 minutes of the same old stuff. 


Yeah, he's going to cut your taxes after he reverses Bush's tax cuts.  You will end up paying more than you do now, that is for sure. 


I wonder where he was sitting in the ad?  It looked like it could have been.....the Oval Office....


 


One minute inside, the next outside
My personal opinion is abortion would not be taking a life IF it could be done when it is still just cells (and not organs, limbs, and the like). The problem would be to catch it that quickly.

My thought for those who think it the baby is not "alive" until it is born ... well a couple minutes before it is born, it is still the same baby ... just in a different place. You are still just as alive when you are inside your house as when you are out in public. Same thing.
Wait a minute!!!!
So now it's unpatriotic to bash the president? Seriously?
Wait a minute now
I have always been a Republican, but I have to say I am very disappointed by what I see.  The news is getting worse and worse everyday because we have 24/7 news!  Everyone under the sun has a 1 hour news show where they have to talk about something and the economy is what they focus on.  I never see any good news anymore.  It seems they are more worried about what Fox is saying and Fox is worried about what so-and-so said on another station.  A bunch of little boys trying to see who has the bigger penis (sorry, but true).  So it is an all out slamming war.  I always thought Republicans/Conservatives were patriotic - oh not so now!!  They are the ones throwing the tantrum and being negative about EVERYTHING!   They aren't supporting the president or who is in charge.   Where is the hope?  Where is the proud American attitude?  The dems won, it's their turn, stop listening to the "doom" messages and wait to see what happens.  GEEZ!   Like I said, I am a Repubican, and I will accept this plan for the economy and I will support my president.  Just because most of the plans don't improve my life, doesn't mean they don't improve the life of someone else who deserves it and our country.  Call me crazy, but I still believe in supporting my country no matter what because, well, I like living here.  Talk about what you believe in and disagree with, but quit saying we are going down the drain.  That's being a little dramatic! 
wait one minute
I do not believe homosexuality to be a "disability." don't go twisting my words. that is not what I said and you know it.
Now wait a minute
You cannot lump all republicans in with one moron like that. You're stereotyping.

Some of our government's biggest problems is that the Democrats have become liberals (our last true Dem was Kennedy) and the Republican party seems to have forgotten what it is supposed to stand for. Reagan, IMO, was our last true Republican prez. The president should be a highly respected position and the media should not be asking questions like "do you wear boxers or briefs?" Thanks to that, I have images of Clinton in his underwear and it makes me want to sear out my corneas.

Our country has lost a lot of its values. There's no excuse for what that woman did and it was especially stupid for her to E-mail it ("Oh, lookey at the stupid thing I just did") but please don't lump us all together.

My only biased bones in my body are toward the terrorists who have attacked our country. And even with that, I pray to God to help me, because I don't want to dislike anyone.
Wow....whew. The coldness of that hit me for a minute....

Okay, I get it.  The wholesale slaughter of babies does not bother you.  You have no care for them whatsoever.  Better they are sliced and diced than to add to the population problem.  What if some of them were serial killers?  Sheesh.  What if some of the dead Iraqis were going to be terrorists?  Good grief!


Talk about oversimplification.  Are you saying that every war that has been fought was for naught and should not have been fought?  Is that your stand?  Or is it just Iraq you are concerned about?  I have asked numerous times and you have never answered.  Should we never for any reason go to war? 


Personally I think Roe vs Wade SHOULD be overturned, because it is unconstitutional on its face.  It was enacted by activist judges overturning a state law ad taking it nationwide, which they have no right to do.  Only Congress at state or local level can enact law.  For that reason alone it should be overturned.   Then, if individual states want to change/stop/whatever abortion law they should be able to do it.  We are talking about killing of human beings here.  You can shoot someone in your house who is a danger to you in some states and face jail time for it...yet we slice and dice innocent babies in the womb who are defenseless and say no harm, no foul?  How contradictory is that may I ask?  And when, oh when, can we just ask people to show more responsibility?  With all the birth control methods there are available, we should not be seeing half a million abortions a year that are second, third, and fourth abortions.  That is just nuts.  And, though it probably does not matter a hoot to you, my work is done with women who find themselves in a situation where a choice has to be made, and work with organizations who offer a different choice.   I would like to change minds because that is where the true answer is.


All that being said, my active work is not going toward overturning Roe v Wade, though it should be for the reasons stated above.  Judges need to be reined in.  At least then if people are going to condone abortion (pro choice) then let them go to the polls and put their vote where their mouth is, so that we know the true will of the people.  If, as you say, over half the country does agree that abortion should be legal, that thought should not scare you and I don't know why it does.  And if abortion remained the law of the land, then I would continue the work I am doing, and that is trying to change minds and hearts, and give women in that situation a choice different from abortion.  Because I do believe in following the law of the land.  Hence, no picketing of abortion clinics, no bombings, no shooting doctors, no demonizing women in that situation.  I want to offer a different choice, to give them time to think about what they are doing and the long-reaching effects.  And I see nothing wrong with that.  If a woman decides to go ahead with an abortion, she is certainly able to do so and receives no condemnation from us.  It saddens us, of course.  But the women/girls we work with are not sent away with ridicule and condemnation and if they return later with regret they are welcomed and counseled.  And we see a fair amount of those as well.  And, wonderfully, we are beginning to see more women making a choice for life, whether keeping the child herself or choosing adoption.  I realize on the national level it is a tiny, tiny drop in the bucket...but one life saved, to me, is worth it.  I cannot concentrate on the many who are lost, or I would never get anything done.  I have to concentrate on the ones saved.


The real purpose of an abortion law is to encourage responsibility, because obviously something is haywire when half a million abortions a year are repeat abortions.  If that is not using abortion as birth control, kindly tell me what is.


And as a final note....the June Cleaver thing is a really old chestnut.  You can't tell me that 1.2 million women a year would turn into horrible mothers and the child would be better off dead than alive with their mothers.  There are far more success stories than not, and there are many, many families looking to adopt newborns.    There are many stories of girls/women who make that hard choice, and instead of the their lives being ruined, the child is the impetus for change in their lives.  The good stories far outweigh the bad.  And like I said...I am a glass half full kind of person.  If we can save even a portion of those 1.2 million lives, then I believe the efforts are worth it.  I certainly cannot just stand by and act like it does not matter to me.  Because it does.


We are never going to agree on this subject.  You can't understand why I would want to save babies and still think defending this country is okay, and I can't understand how you feel such empathy for casualties of war and feel none for aborted babies.  I certainly feel empathy for casualties of war.  However, I feel that war is sometimes necessary.  I have no trouble with that decision.  And I cannot equate the two...abortion and war.  And I don't know how you can. 


I personally don't make the decision to go to war.  You don't personally make the decision to get an abortion.  Either way, people die, although the numbers dying are much higher on the one side.  And, frankly, I don't think even with the war the number of dead Iraqis has caught up to what Saddam did when he was in power.  And that was not collateral damage, that was planned wholesale murder...very similar to abortion.  Gas them all, men women and children, defenseless and unable to fight back.  Line them up on the side of a pit, shoot them all, cover them up.  Torture, beheading.  Slice and dice, partially born, suck their brains out.  There is a similarity.  Murder.  Barbarism.  Same result.  Dead human beings.  When all is said and done, if a free Iraq emerges and that sort of behavior does not occur again, then I am willing to bet the Iraqis, down the road, will believe that it was worth it.  They thought so when they were waving American flags and hugging soldiers and toppling Saddam statues.   Just like we believed after the Revolutionary War and the Civil War, horrible and bloody though they were, were worth it. 


I sleep well at night and am comfortable with my decisions.  I assume you do too. So at least I will agree to disagree.


:)


Forgotten the minute you took you last best shot.
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Don't know. It was just a 1 minute report on the news (nm)
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Wait a minute...we don't need GW, cuz we have McSAME!!!
Hurray, hurray!!!!! We will all be saved. Our wallets will get fat. Interest rates will go down. We'll get to see other parts of the world as we are fighting wars in Russia, Iran and Korea on our big screen HD TVs - right in the comfort of our own living rooms!!!! Our veterans will continue killing themselves (so let's ban abortion so we can create a whole new batch of cannon fodder). I am just GIDDY with excitement. It's going to be a whole NEW WORLD!!! Maybe we'll even get to see some action on our own turf since our military is shattered. Onward Christian Soldiers........
Wait a minute what about the guy? Condoms are...sm
easily accessible to anyone.
Wait a minute. What's that I see trailing behind me?
Well, I suwannee, what d'ya know about that.
Wow. List growing by the minute.
by hate mail after daring to have his own opinion and is leaving the National Review, the magazine founded by his dad. So much for family tradition.
Whoa, wait just 1 minute s/m

My husband gets a pretty good retirement check each month so I would argue they didn't QUITE steal all the pension money.


Wait a minute while I get out my sickness bag
"He's doing it simply for the love of his country". On pulleese.

Try, power, ambition, money, control, racial motives, or any other number of reasons.

As much as I didn't like McCain (and did not vote for him), he also said he was running for the love of his country and because he cared about the people. If he would have won would you have said "bless him"?

No politician runs for office because they love their country. They run for the sheer money and power it brings them.
Let's jump over to reality for a minute....(sm)
What Obama is doing is rescinding the Bush bill.  He's not putting out a new law that MAKES people do procedures they consider unethical.  So basically if you work in the medical field and you didn't do abortions before this bill, chances are that noone is going to MAKE you do them in the future.  I think Bush's bill was more targeted towards support services -- for example people who work at a pharmacy who don't believe in the morning after pill.  The point I get from all this is that if you don't want to do abortions, don't work in an abortion clinic.  The way you guys are describing it, I could make an orthodontist do brain surgery.  Let's try reality for a while.
No they didn't.....FOX covered it from minute one....
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Might find the 15 minute video of Palin
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Just wait a minute. The flags were reported
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