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O has already provided valid evidence and

Posted By: the courts should not allow.....sm on 2008-12-08
In Reply to: How do you know Obama has nothing to hide? sm - ms

fanatics to hound and stalk him like hunted prey. Fanatics also unsuccessfully tried to use the guilt by association argument to win the election. It did not work then and is will not help them now.


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You are right on - that's all we ask for. If he would have provided it
But because he has not and instead of providing he has it legally sealed goes to show you there is something to hide. This is one of the reasons the SC will be taking on this case.


Links provided
The words were witnessed by two McCain aides and three reporters who did not report it at the time.

If it wasn’t true there would be lawsuits (which there are not). And with him running for president you KNOW he would be denying it as he is denying other things, but he is not denying it.

Here are the links below where this information can be found. Many more links but I think five are enough.

http://blogcritics.org/archives/2008/05/02/194648.php

http://www.thepost.ohiou.edu/Articles/Opinion/Columns/2008/04/15/23789/

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/4/8/17456/91972/887/492360

http://agonist.org/schecter/?p=8571

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=536_1210293502


They've already provided the BC, but some
just are not "satisfied" with it & insist on wasting the courts time & money, only to lose repeatedly because the whole thing is baseless.
UN provided GPS coordinates and has
has issued numerous statements that dispute this lie. If you watched the interview between the UN rep and Israel's spokesperson, you can see the Israeli skirt the issue and state the rockets were coming "from the vicinity" of the school. It's not like this would be the first time Israel has lied about their reasons for bombing schools.

It's beside the point. If they KNEW this was a UN school (the the GPS coordinates AND the fact that it is clearly marked with the UN flag on its roof), that civilian refugee families had sought refuge there and they were putting large numbers of children at risk (they had been informed of this), the humane thing to do would have been to decide NOT TO BOMB IT.
UN provided GPS coordinates and has
has issued numerous statements that dispute this lie. If you watched the interview between the UN rep and Israel's spokesperson, you can see the Israeli skirt the issue and state the rockets were coming "from the vicinity" of the school. It's not like this would be the first time Israel has lied about their reasons for bombing schools.

It's beside the point. If they KNEW this was a UN school (the the GPS coordinates AND the fact that it is clearly marked with the UN flag on its roof), that civilian refugee families had sought refuge there and they were putting large numbers of children at risk (they had been informed of this), the humane thing to do would have been to decide NOT TO BOMB IT.
Yeah, because he provided SO MUCH
Bush was a fool. History has shown that. Obama's history is not written yet, even though there are those on this board who like to think they can see into the future.
My *teacher* has provided the Bible...
the same Bible that says Do Unto Others is very clear about homosexuality. It is called an abomination. Not too many ways you can take that. Therefore, the twinge you feel about homosexual marriage probably was not caused by bad cheese. But, as we all know, no one but you will have to explain your decisions when you stand before Him, and no one but me will have to explain my decisions when I stand before Him.

God bless.
Where did I say McC camp provided this information?
the word "fodder." With Webster at your fingertips, you might try looking it up next time before you leap to unfounded conclusions.
the exmilitary man is on the link I provided -
I did not hear him say he had to "push" through them - he just said they were there and he was not going to let them intimidate him.
Did you even read the link you provided?
Obama is requiring community service not military service. Community service is a constructive way to spend time and energy. War is a destructive way to spend time and energy.

Obama also said that he would provide a college education to anyone who volunteers to do community service. This can only help make the United States a stronger and better nation. It sounds like a wonderful plan to me!

The following is from the link you provided:

The Obama Administration will call on Americans to serve in order to meet the nation’s challenges. President-Elect Obama will expand national service programs like AmeriCorps and Peace Corps and will create a new Classroom Corps to help teachers in underserved schools, as well as a new Health Corps, Clean Energy Corps, and Veterans Corps. Obama will call on citizens of all ages to serve America, by developing a plan to require 50 hours of community service in middle school and high school and 100 hours of community service in college every year. Obama will encourage retiring Americans to serve by improving programs available for individuals over age 55, while at the same time promoting youth programs such as Youth Build and Head Start.
I did - and I'm the one who provided the actual quote
Look. Just get this straight. If you know anything about Boehner at all, you will know perfectly well that he does not support the notion that cold rooms, sleep deprivation and caterpillars add up to torture.

Intellectual honesty is a wonderful thing. Waiting to "pounce" on any fortuitous language that suits your purpose when you know very well that's what you're doing is NOT intellectual honesty and speaks ill of the character of those who practice this form of charade. I certainly don't respect you for it, although I do respect honesty in political discourse. I wish it weren't so rare.
Poster asked for the link and I provided it.
As far as preying, the articles and examples of that are, as they say in laboratory terminology, "too numerous to count."  And that is unfortunate. 
If you copy the link I provided, paste it...

into your browser and click "go," the page will come up with the entire article.  If you scroll down a bit, you will see the video screen which will work if you click on it.


I just tried it, and it works fine.  I will try again to post the link below under "URL/Link." 


I personally believe that your husband and all other soldiers who are placed in harm's way deserve so much better, whether it's safe food/water, safe electricity, better vehicles to protect them against IEDs, etc.  They are doing their best for us, and they deserve the best FROM us, IMHO.


Employer provided medical insurance

originated, I believe, during FDR's New Deal.  When wages were capped, employers found a way to circumvent this by providing ''sickness insurance'' for their employees, thus giving them a raise without violating the wage caps. 


Another example of government meddling.  Had they not imposed wage caps, employers would have been able to keep paying their employees and give raises to enable them to afford their own healthcare.  But instead, we grew the employer-provided healthcare system we have now and people experience ''job lock,'' unable to move to another employer because of pre-existing conditions which may not be covered by a new company's insurance plan. 


Of course it's income, always has been.  Same as use of a company car, or executive housing provided by a company (both of which are taxable to the extent they are used outside of actual business activities.)   I'm amazed nobody until now has taxed insurance.


Does this constitute a new tax on people earning under $250 thousand (or $235 thousand, or whatever the new number is?) 


I will, provided courtesy is held on the conservative board as well.
/
Where is the evidence
and invisible WMD in Iraq? Link, please? Show me the documentation. The Iraqi highjackers were Saudis, but you probably don't want to talk about that 'cause chimpy has a thing for those Saudi guys enough to hold their hand in public in broad daylight on camera. It is you and the chimp boy's defenders who want it both ways. A bazillion dollars later we have 1900 dead soldiers, untold numbers of dead innocent Iraqis with their country on the brink of civil war and a breeding ground for more highjackers. Boy, I sure feel safer now.
What evidence do you have
been riding a snowball to hades since Roe vs. Wade*? How do you figure that? What morals exactly are you talking about...promiscuity?

Do you believe in the death penalty or is it your assertion that none of the people on death row are *innocent*?

If you are an advocate of personal privacy, how is it any of your/my/the government's business if Terry Schiavo did or did not get IV fluid, etc.?



the evidence

mounts.  Can't wait till this breaks.  Lying about your promiscious daughter.  That counts for 2 sins, does it not? Sometimes breeding with people too close in your family tree can produce birth defects.  I' m just sayin . . .


 


Look at the evidence.....
First, black liberation theology. Decidedly Marxist. Practiced Marxist policy in his community organization efforts. Wants to apply Marxist theory (redistribution of wealth).

Do me a favor. Go anywhere on the internet and read what Marxist theory is. Then apply it to first, black liberation theology, which he followed for 20 years in his church. The apply it to redistribution of wealth, which he already proposed. Then apply it to having the son of the premier Marxist in this country saying what a good job he did in learning good old dad's theories.

Look at all of that, and if it doesn't cause you at least as much concern as Sarah Palin's pregnant 17-year-old, there is something rotten in Denmark.

I am not a Republican, and I am not a Democrat, but I can put 2 and 2 together, and this bears looking at.

That is ALL I am saying.
If you would just look at the evidence....
Republicans tried to pass legislation to stop this very thing in 2006, and Bush Admin several times as well. These are McCain's words on the senate floor in May 2006:

Mr. President, this week Fannie Mae’s regulator reported that the company’s quarterly reports of profit growth over the past few years were “illusions deliberately and systematically created” by the company’s senior management, which resulted in a $10.6 billion accounting scandal.
The Office of Federal Housing Enterprise Oversight’s report goes on to say that Fannie Mae employees deliberately and intentionally manipulated financial reports to hit earnings targets in order to trigger bonuses for senior executives. In the case of Franklin Raines, Fannie Mae’s former chief executive officer, OFHEO’s report shows that over half of Mr. Raines’ compensation for the 6 years through 2003 was directly tied to meeting earnings targets. The report of financial misconduct at Fannie Mae echoes the deeply troubling $5 billion profit restatement at Freddie Mac.
The OFHEO report also states that Fannie Mae used its political power to lobby Congress in an effort to interfere with the regulator’s examination of the company’s accounting problems. This report comes some weeks after Freddie Mac paid a record $3.8 million fine in a settlement with the Federal Election Commission and restated lobbying disclosure reports from 2004 to 2005. These are entities that have demonstrated over and over again that they are deeply in need of reform.
For years I have been concerned about the regulatory structure that governs Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac–known as Government-sponsored entities or GSEs–and the sheer magnitude of these companies and the role they play in the housing market. OFHEO’s report this week does nothing to ease these concerns. In fact, the report does quite the contrary. OFHEO’s report solidifies my view that the GSEs need to be reformed without delay.
I join as a cosponsor of the Federal Housing Enterprise Regulatory Reform Act of 2005, S. 190, to underscore my support for quick passage of GSE regulatory reform legislation. If Congress does not act, American taxpayers will continue to be exposed to the enormous risk that Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac pose to the housing market, the overall financial system, and the economy as a whole.
I urge my colleagues to support swift action on this GSE reform legislation.

Allen Greenspan and John Snow
(The Fed and the treasury secretary) also on video trying to tell the Dem committee (Barney Frank, Chris Dodd, et al) the same thing, basically begging them to fix it. Barney Frank said he did not see the problem. And turned right around during this congress and passed legislation to push Fannie to give even MORE of those questionable mortgages to those people who could not afford them with little credit or no credit.

Dems ignored it, blocked the legislation. And those same people are still in charge of banking and finance, accepting no responsibility whatsoever.

They should be removed from those committees. And registered Democrats should be demanding it. And I don't understand why they aren't.
See link...not saying whether it is valid or not - asking you sm
http://www.religioustolerance.org/jud_abor.htm
You have a very valid point........
I've noticed on this board alone that if anything is said against Obama, you MUST be a racist! So, unfortunately, on this board at least and probably over the country, if anything is said that opposes Obama, you will be called a racist because that's all they know to do.

Obama wants you to be dependent on the government for all your needs, as so many already do where I live. He will do absolutely nothing to help you, but will only make it worse. Most of us with any common sense know full well you can't help anyone by continuing to keep them down. Obama has every intentio of not only doing just that but bringing in the middle class as well to become dependent on the government, thereby empowering government to become more powerful.......

Unfortunately, I have noticed so many on this board actually believe the government's job is to POLICE their lives. They don't have a clue what their constitution says, what it means, and they actually believe BIGGER government means a better life for them. Most of those that scream racist on this board are just plain lame and very sad indeed and they know nothing else! Working hard to pay your bills seems to fall on deaf ears with those that think free handouts are a blessing. They don't have a clue about the American spirit and no doubt couldn't recite the pledge of allegiance or sing the star spangled banner without looking at the words......

and I say the same....go ahead and flame away. I truly couldn't care less.
I do think these are valid concerns...(sm)

and ones that have to be addressed.  However, I don't see anything wrong with setting a goal, which is what Obama has done by saying it should be closed in 1 year.  I think he purposely left himself some leeway by saying a year, and at the same time let people like me who support him that it will get done.


Personally I think they should be tried in a military court, which would avoid a lot of the bureaucracy that is associated with the regular US court system.  They may want to go by the world court rules when trying them?  You're right.  Noone knows exactly how this is going to be done yet, but we all know that something has to be done.


As far as housing them here, I don't see a problem with that.  Right now we house murderers, rapists, and some of the worst criminals immaginable.  I don't think that these prisoners from Gitmo would pose anymore of a threat that some that are already there.  However, I do think that Gitmo prisoners would have a really hard time in a prison here because of other prisoners. 


Obviously, there is a lot to be worked out, especially when it comes to those in Gitmo who are actually guilty, but there has to be something done soon about the ones who aren't.


That is a valid point to consider

but what about those pregnant woman who are murdered and they are pregnant and the murderer is charge with double homicide.  Why is the killing of a fetus okay in one circumstance but considered murder in another.  LOL!  It starts to get confusing when you look at every little thing.


I just think abortion is something that does need some form of guidelines. 


That is a valid argument. Thank you

much evidence to the contrary
The original author has recanted that garbage and several other soldiers have written their accounts of how friendly Obama was, talking to the troops, thanking them for their service, etc. The author of that email wasn't even there. There are some pictures of Obama with the troops at the link below, about 2/3 of the way down the page. Was it a photo op? Oh, sure, but it proves the email author is a liar.

http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/afghanistan.asp
well once there is evidence for creationism
but it's hard for me to believe in such a huge fairy tale!
evidence.......hmmmmm
Not everyone who believes in Jesus Christ learned so as a child. They were taught nothing as a child, let alone indoctrinated/brainwashed as you think. They came to know Jesus as an adult, while all the time questioning, denying, wondering, finding fault with everything God stands for.....you name it. There are many children in the Christian family who do not grow up to believe they were brainwashed and some that do. They question the Lord, which is exactly what God says to do.....to question Him. If you don't believe, then ask Him. So many don't and why?....because I think they're afraid they might get an answer. Then what would they do? You have nothing to lose and everything to gain.

Sometimes the evidence is right in front of us...we just fail to believe. Why do you think Jesus said to have faith the size of a mustard seed?
I see sam has yet to provide us with evidence

are going to be given to people who are not paying tax.  Show me what in his plan describes a refundable (AKA non-wastable) tax credit.  So far, all I can see is that sam does not understand the basic concepts of socialism, Marxism, tax cuts and tax credits.  Tax cuts are a reduction in taxes, based on lowering a tax rate.  You cannot reduce a rate on tax in the absence of tax due.  Tax credits for the most part are paid against TAXES DUE.  The 2 exceptions in the US are the earned income tax credit and the child tax credit 


So show me where Obama has said that his tax credit would be a refundable/non-wastable credit.  Also, naturally, I am still waiting for sam's answer to my original question on how it is that progressive tax reform is only socialist when it is Obama reform but no other president who has reformed the tax structure is a socialist?  Please answer that question and the one about the refundable tax credit.  Direct answers would be very much appreciated. 


What evidence do you have to back that up?
If you are bold enough to make a statement like that, at least be bold enough to back it up with some concrete evidence, not just your opinion!
What evidence do you have to back
If you are bold enough to make a statement like that, at least be bold enough to back it up with some concrete evidence, not just your opinion!
Anecdotal evidence
This is not a flame. You've declared that "...families that have babies they can't afford do so just to get on the welfare system. As long as they have babies, they won't have to work and live off the system..." and your evidence is your husband's cousin. If you want to know the particulars of the program, why don't you look it up instead of attributing statements to Nancy Pelosi that have absolutely no bearing on the truth?
more evidence that the prez

really does need that teleprompter to get it right . . . What's this I hear about him being such a great orator?  Sorry, but I think not.   


Obama apologizes for gaffe on Special Olympics


WASHINGTON (Reuters) – President Barack Obama has apologized for a gaffe in which he described his bowling skills as akin to participants in the Special Olympics, a sports program for people with intellectual disabilities.




Obama made the mistake during an interview on Thursday night on "The Tonight Show" with host Jay Leno, the first time a sitting U.S. president had been on the show.


Talking about living in the White House, Obama said he had been practicing his bowling in the home's bowling alley and had scored a 129 out of a possible 300.


It was an improvement on the embarrassing 37 he had rolled during a stop on the presidential campaign trail a year ago.


"It's like -- it was like Special Olympics or something," Obama said.


The Special Olympics is a global nonprofit organization serving some 200 million people with intellectual disabilities, with a presence in nearly 200 countries worldwide. They compete in sporting events like the real Olympics.


Soon after the Jay Leno interview, Obama telephoned Special Olympics chairman Tim Shriver to apologize.


Shriver told ABC's "Good Morning America" television show that Obama had apologized "in a way that I think was very moving" and that he said "he did not intend to humiliate the population, didn't want to embarrass or give anybody any more reason for pain or kind of suffering."


Shriver said people should gain a lesson from the incident.


"I think it's important to see that words hurt. Words do matter. And these words in some respect, can be seen as humiliating or a put-down to people with special needs, do cause pain. And they do result in stereotypes," Shriver said.


White House spokesman Bill Burton said Obama "made an offhand remark making fun of his own bowling that was in no way intended to disparage the Special Olympics."


"He thinks that the Special Olympics are a wonderful program that gives an opportunity to shine to people with disabilities from around the world," Burton said.


Shriver said he knows of a Special Olympian in the Detroit area who has bowled three perfect games of 300 and "he said he would be more than welcome to find the time to come to the White House and teach the president."


(Reporting by Caren Bohan and Steve Holland, editing by Vicki Allen)



More evidence of right-wingers
.
What's missing is a valid premise.
nm
It is a valid political issue.
"We people" do not consider it a bunch of tissue. We believe, as does YOUR VP candidate, that life begins at conception.
you posed some valid points
I honestly have to tell you I read your post with an open mind and I understand what you are saying. I don't think we can go to war with everyone and I don't think we should. But on the other hand I think there has to be a better way of just thinking your going to be able to sit down with the most extreme who hate Americans and want to see our country destroyed and believe that by just talking with them they'll become our friends and say, "yes your right, we've been wrong all along, what can we do to help you" (well not exactly in those words), but I just think that for someone to think your going to be able to sit and reason with them is a little naive. Look what happened when we tried to reason with Saddam Hussein. He would not reason and threatened us with nuclear and biological weapons. He destroyed wildlife, oceans, and set his own oil fields ablaze. I think we do have to be strong and we need other countries to stand with us. To tell you the truth I don't know what a good solution would be, and I'll tell you one thing I do know is that whether John McCain or Barack Obama gets elected they are going to have one big mess to try and fix.
Four years ago makes it no less valid and...
You are operating under the false assumption that we have had a "free market" over the past four years.
email petitions are not valid - nm
x
Please provide factual evidence of this...

....but MUST be from a nonpartison source absolutely.  Actually I thought it was just as much the case with the Republican party, but I freely admit that I have no concrete statistics at this point to back that up. 


 


Did you examine the evidence, or is article enough? nm
zz
Starcat made a very valid point.

You don't tolerate irresponsibility when it comes to pet owners (which I agree with, by the way), yet you seem to welcome it when it comes to your political party.  One has to ask why you continue to sing the praises of and support the most irresponsible administration in US history, yet you express outrage about a cat owner.  Just doesn't make sense.


And as far as you being tolerant, one only needs to take a quick look at the conservative board to see how laughable that really is.  You and your cohorts post the most intolerant posts I've ever seen anywhere on the internet.


I do agree with you about pet owners being responsible.  I am a pet owner and keep my pets under control simply because I love them and want to keep them safe. 


I agree - it's a valid issue - for the WOLF.
.
I think I meant to say you "posted" some valid points
It's late and I'm tired and been typing since 7:30 am, so fingers are getting tired.
valid points and YES, people are buying
concerning, huh?
What? She has a valid question and stating facts.
nm
Make sure your complaints are valid before spewing them.
nm
Like lack of a valid birth certificate and that he...sm
would absolutely in no uncertain terms allow pork barrel projects? I could go on and on about the FACTS as the liberals see it, but by my dictionary - and without regard to news media or the channels thereof - these are NOT facts! Just wait - you'll find out for yourself. I'll be right here to tell you "I tried to tell you so!"
What you say is true, but if relevant evidence is denied sm
or falsified, an objective approach is impossible. This is what the family members faced. They had to force Bush to form that commission to investigate. Coulter is now attacking them for that. They had a list of 400 questions, and got no answers. I agree with you on the wacky theories. I became interested in doing some research on the issue after hearing things around the area I live - Colorado Springs. This is the neocon capital of the United States, and home to Norad and Space Command, Ft. Carson, USAFA, Peterson AFB, Falcon AFB. They live and breathe Bush & military. At first, I thought they were only rumors. Norman Mineta's testimony to the 911 Commission confirmed them to be true. The second question I had was about WTC building 7. This building only had small fires and was not hit by an airplane. It came straight down like the other 2 into a nice neat pile. The owner of the building Silverstein said they made a decision to pull it. This is a demolition term for demolishing the building. Well, this is something that takes careful planning weeks in advance, not several hours. I am also hearing bizarre stories from troops returning from Irag and their family members. Mineta's testimony was shown on C-Span and here is the link. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bDfdOwt2v3Y&search=mineta

I never saw the movie The Siege. Not a Bruce Willis fan. Anything with Matt McConaughey in it, I have seen.

Former CIA Analyst Says Evidence Abounds for Impeachment

Former CIA Analyst Says Evidence Abounds for Impeachment


by Gretyl Macalaster


PORTSMOUTH - The evidence for impeachment of the president and vice president is overwhelming, former CIA analyst and daily presidential briefer Ray McGovern told a room full of people at the Portsmouth Public Library Monday night.


McGovern, who provided daily briefings for former presidents Ronald Reagan and George H. W. Bush as well as other high ranking officials during his 27 year CIA career, said he has witnessed a "prostitution of his profession" as the Bush administration lied to the American people about the evidence of weapons of mass destruction in Iraq.


"Don’t let anyone tell you the President was deceived by false intelligence … they knew," McGovern said.


For the next 40 minutes, he relayed a series of events leading up to 9/11 which illustrate the President’s desire to go to war with Iraq well before 9-11, that reliable CIA evidence showed that Iraq did not have weapons of mass destruction and was presented to the administration and the "facts were fixed" in order to legitimize the invasion.


"The estimate which said Iraq had weapons of mass destruction was prepared to the terms of reference laid down by Cheney in a speech on Aug. 26, 2002. It was the worst estimate of intelligence and came to the wrong conclusions, but it was designed to do that," McGovern said.


McGovern has been an outspoken commentator on intelligence-related issues since the late 1990s and since 2002 has been publicly critical of Bush’s use of government intelligence in the lead-up to the war.


The recent report detailing Iran’s stopping its nuclear weapons program four years ago, is an example of how the administration knows it can no longer hide such "incontrovertible evidence" from the American people in the fallout from the misinformation they received on the Iraq War, McGovern said. He added that he had almost given up on believing their were people still working at the top with a conscious and enough people at the top willing to let analysts do their job and accept independent analysis.


In late 2005, Congress requested an estimate on Iranian nuclear capabilities.
"My former colleagues got really good, incontrovertible evidence that the program, such as it was, has been ordered stopped since 2003. The evidence was such that not even Cheney could deny it. That’s why the report was not produced until three weeks ago," McGovern said, adding that the Bush administration has been putting "spin" on their rhetoric ever since.


McGovern also addressed the reasoning he believes is behind the threat of war with Iran. He said he believes Israel thinks they have a pledge from the White House to deal with Iran before Bush leaves office and relayed the story of the U.S.S. Liberty, which was attacked by the Israelis in 1967 and covered up by the United States. Thirty-four U.S soldiers were killed and about 170 were seriously injured.


"It seems to me, that on June, 8, 1967, Israel realized it could literally get away with murder," McGovern said.


McGovern said he also believes Congress will be of little help. Recently House Speaker Nancy Pelosi admitted to learning about torture and illegal eavesdropping in briefings, but said it was her understanding when briefed, that she will not share the information with anyone else, including other members of the House Intelligence Committee.


McGovern called Pelosi out on violating her oath to uphold the Constitution "against enemies, foreign or domestic" by allowing acts in violation of the Constitution to continue by not saying "diddly."


He added that although an impeachment bill currently in Congress is gaining more support, Democrats are shying away because of the influence of lobbies and political analysts telling them to "wait it out" until the election.


Charges in the impeachment bill sponsored by Dennis Kucinich, are very detailed and "as good as any," McGovern said, and referenced the illegal eavesdropping of American citizens. He added that the President has "admitted" to this "demonstrably impeachable offense."


"The argument for impeachment is overwhelming," Randy Kezar of Kingston said after the event. "Impeachment is constitutionally required."


McGovern’s visit was co-sponsored by NH Codepink, Seacoast Peace Response, NH Peace Action, NH American Friends Service Committee, Seacoast 9-11 Questions Group, NH Veterans for Peace and Witness for Peace-N.E.


facts, evidence, science, and reason
Hasn't worked so well lately, has it?