it was 1973, Union Square Park in NYC..
Posted By: Pro-Choice march...I was there as were...sm on 2007-11-15
In Reply to: Pro-life? Pro-Choice? Religous? Pagan? - piglet
as were all these Pro-Lifers kept back behind Bob's Barricade wooden horses....I was there, hundreds were there on 14th Street that day prior to Roe vs Wade being passed....
I was very young....and I remember having this thought....If they are SOOOO interested in what is going on in my and other's uteruses/uteri....why do they NOT take some responsibility for the orphaned/fostered/forgotten children left in this country? Again, I had that thought in 1973....and 35 years have passed and I STILL have the same thought.......my politics never changed......I am that same person I was then, only more mature, somewhat wiser, and very thankful....and I HAVE taken responsibility for MANY children in this country as I adore children....always have...
wonder just how many prolifers have adopted or fostered children left in fostercare/orphanages in this country.....over the same 35-40 year time frame......
that's not to them, they are entitled to feel what they feel...even though I just reread my post and it could be interpreted that way (and sorry for that) -
just get out of our bodies......our bodies, ourselves....(and Our Bodies, Ourselves is a book read way back then too)...and try to think about kids already here, abandoned or given up with no mentoring.....there are thousands of them in the USA.
Peace to all.....
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You don't have to square it Mary.
You need not square it because whether one supports Israel or not has nothing whatever to do with Jews going to heaven. You know and so do I. This is the strangest most convoluted ridiculous conversation I think I have ever seen. Were I you, I would bail on it now. Somehow, in the midst of all of this, a very sinister point will be made which will made sense to no one but the one asking you to equate supporting Israel with Jews going to heaven.
I can square it because they are questions not statements.
Biblically, only those who accept Jesus as their savior will go to heaven. That is a CHRISTIAN view. Jews have their own Messiah and their own belief as to heaven. As for me, I would gladly welcome all to heaven. But I am not God.
You hit the nail square on the head.
x
You hit that one out of the park!
Good analysis of the situation.
Just another walk in the park.
I simply transferred my post from a thread so long it was beginning to disappear and combined 2 responses in 1 when guess who appeared under one shot. Next time, look before you pounce...rule of the jungle, survival of the fittest and all that good stuff.
You, on the other hand, cannot bear to let a single chance pass you by when it comes to imposing your obnoxious comments where they don’t belong. Juvenile name calling...waste of time (WOT)...a new short cut for you to try to wrap you brain around. Besides, denial is your game, not mine.
Careful, your intolerance is showing, for the umpteenth million time. Zzzzzzzzzzz, so boring.
So, you want to take their park bench away from them and...
have them sit on the curbside?
You can take the woman out of the trailer-park, but
!
He's a walk in the park at a Sunday picnic
nm
my mamma played recorders in the park
I call it the scruffy generation, but we are tough bunch of people. Hard working. No handouts for us. We are not complainers.
I am biased.
And perhaps in a related story: Enron Witness Found Dead In Park
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/5173228.stm
Enron witness found dead in park A body found in north-east London has been identified as that of a banker who was questioned by the FBI about the Enron fraud case.
Police said they were treating the death in Chingford of Neil Coulbeck, who worked for the Royal Bank of Scotland until 2004, as unexplained.
He had been interviewed by the FBI as a potential witness.
Three ex-workers of RBS subsidiary NatWest are being extradited to the US on Thursday to face fraud charges.
The extradition has sparked a political row, with opposition parties and human rights groups claiming the treaty under which they are being sent to the US is one-sided as the Americans are yet to ratify it.
'Highly regarded'
Prime Minister Tony Blair has rejected calls to renegotiate the extradition terms.
Mr Coulbeck's body was found in a park near Newgate Street, Chingford, on Tuesday.
Mr Coulbeck's wife had reported him missing last Thursday. Police have yet to formally identify the body, which was removed from the parkland on Wednesday afternoon.
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One day when this is all over I'm going to be coming home to my wife and children and some poor guy is not
David Bermingham
Former NatWest banker
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Mr Coulbeck had worked at the Royal Bank of Scotland until 2004, most recently as head of group treasury, the bank confirmed.
Neil was highly regarded by his colleagues here in RBS and was a respected, capable and hard working member of our senior management team.
The fraud case centres on a NatWest transaction under which it sold off part of its Enron unit.
RBS said: There is no evidence that Mr Coulbeck was involved in the approval of the transaction under investigation.
RBS has co-operated fully with all the appropriate authorities and made them fully aware of all the relevant facts in our possession.
The FBI said it would not comment while the case was ongoing.
'Appalling'
One of the so-called NatWest three, David Bermingham, said he had been knocked sideways by the news of Mr Coulbeck's death.
It is awful, appalling. One day when this is all over I'm going to be coming home to my wife and children and some poor guy is not and my heart goes out to his wife and family, he said.
He described Mr Coulbeck as a superstar, a thoroughly decent, honest professional guy and a very experienced banker.
Mr Coulbeck was among NatWest staff who made witness statements about the extradition, Mr Bermingham, of Goring, Berkshire, said.
Neil's statement was no more than a page and a half saying who he was and his role, he said.
Fellow accused Giles Darby, speaking from his home in Lower Wraxall, Somerset, said he was absolutely shocked by the death.
It's an utter tragedy. I'm struggling to take it in, really.
Of course, my thoughts are now with Neil's family and friends.
In 2002, US prosecutors issued arrest warrants for the three men, accusing them of conspiring to defraud their employers and investors in energy giant Enron, which had collapsed a year earlier.
It is alleged that the three British bankers - Mr Bermingham, Gary Mulgrew and Mr Darby - advised their employer Greenwich NatWest to sell off its stake in an Enron unit at well below its market value.
MPs' protest
They then left the bank and purchased a $250,000 (£135,000) stake in the unit - which they sold on at a much higher price, making a profit of $7.3m (£3.9m).
They deny any wrongdoing.
Their extradition was debated by MPs in an emergency session of Commons on Wednesday.
After a three-hour debate they voted by a majority of 242 to adjourn the Commons early in symbolic protest at the government's extradition arrangements.
On Tuesday, peers had voted in favour of suspending extradition agreements with the US until the UK-US treated had been ratified there.
Robertson to build theme park in Israel; Jews unwilling to convert
Plans for Holy Land theme park on Galilee shore where Jesus fed the 5,000
· Evangelical groups and Israel on brink of deal
· Some Israelis fear motives of US Christian right Conal Urquhart in Tel Aviv
Wednesday January 4, 2006
Guardian The Israeli government is planning to give up a large slice of land to American Christian evangelicals to build a biblical theme park by the Sea of Galilee where Jesus is said to have walked on water and fed 5,000 with five loaves and two fish.
A consortium of Christian groups, led by the television evangelist Pat Robertson, is in negotiation with the Israeli ministry of tourism and a deal is expected in the coming months. The project is expected to bring up to 1 million extra tourists a year but an undeclared benefit will be the cementing of a political alliance between the Israeli rightwing and the American Christian right.
However, the alliance has not been welcomed by all Israelis, including some who fear the ultimate aim of the evangelicals is the conversion of the Jews to Christianity rather than support for Israel.
Jonathan Pulik, a spokesman for the Israeli ministry of tourism, said the Christian market was very important for Israel's tourism industry. We would like to give them more of a reason to come here. We would be willing to lease the land to them free of charge and they would finance the construction.
The site of the centre, covering nearly 50 hectares (125 acres) and provisionally called the Galilee World Heritage Park, would be north-east of the Mount of the Beatitudes where Jesus delivered the Sermon on the Mount, and Capernaum which was described as the town of Jesus in the Bible. It would feature a garden and nature park, an auditorium, a Holy Land exhibition, outdoor amphitheatres, information centre and a media studio.
The ministry of tourism estimates the total cost would be $48m (£28m). Mr Pulik also pointed out that the project would bring large numbers of jobs to the area. Mr Robertson said in a statement that he was fully cooperating with the project but no deal had been formalised. He said he was thrilled that there will be a place in the Galilee where evangelical Christians from all over the world can come to celebrate the actual place where Jesus Christ lived and taught.
The Sea of Galilee is more reminiscent of the Scottish Highlands than the Middle East, particularly in winter and spring when the hills are green. The existing Christian sites are picturesque and understated oases of calm and there is even a Church of Scotland hotel and church in Tiberias, the main town in the area.
A major part of the shore of the Sea of Galilee was Syrian until it was conquered by Israel in 1967. Syria and Israel are still officially in a state of war and Syria insists the return of the Golan Heights and the Galilee shore is a prerequisite for peace.
Uri Dagul, the project coordinator, said the land issues would be concluded within a few weeks and then the final details would be agreed between the Israeli government and the Christian communities which are primarily American evangelical churches.
The American Christian right, best known for television evangelism and its stars such as Mr Robertson and Jerry Falwell, has been among the strongest supporters of Israel in the US.
The primary reason is that according to the Old Testament, Israel was given to the Jews by God. Fundamentalist Christians believe that in order for Jesus to return, two preconditions are Jewish control of the land of Israel and the conversion of the Jews to Christianity.
Yossi Sarid, a former government minister and member of the Knesset, said he was wary of the friendship of the American Christian right and projects such as the Galilee centre. He said: I am not enthusiastic about this cooperation because I have no desire to be cannon fodder for the evangelists.
As a Jew, they believe I have to vanish before Jesus can make his second appearance. As I have no plans to convert, as an Israeli and a Jew, I find this a provocation. There is something sinister about their embrace.
Avraham Hirschson, the Israeli tourism minister, said: I'm not a theologian, I'm the minister of tourism, and I'm not interested in the politics of our tourists as long as they come here. They come here as tourists, and they're friends of Israel.
Guardian Unlimited © Guardian Newspapers Limited 2006
if you had a union....
you would have no job at all because they would have convinced you all to strike, MQ would have said "too bad for you," and you would now be unemployed. that is what unions do.
Yes, I would. These union members...
need to realize that the free ride and good ol' days are over. The days of high wages, job banks, and guaranteed employment have ended. No wonder Toyota, Honda and the like do so well as compared to their American counterparts.
What about the union busters?
We all know who they are. This was totally predictable. Start at the bottom when assigning blame and put the onus on the ones who turn the wheels of the factories and earn the LEAST, then expect them to sacrifice the most and carry the weight of the management and CEOs who earn anywhere from 10 to 100 times more than they do.
Watch them start whining if they decide to use TARP funds, thus depriving the banks of all those funds they have been hoarding, forcing workers to stage round-the-clock sit-ins just to get paid.
My husband is union....
He works for a trucking firm and told me this morning the union was talking about them taking a 10% cut in pay. The difference between him (or maybe his company?) is that he thinks no problem- his pay is good as it is and if it keeps the company going, why not? I think the car industry might think the same. Did they not say no cuts in pay??
Union Workers
How does your husband feel about voting out in the open; no more secret ballots? That's quite audacious!
Todd Palin is a card-carrying union guy, too.
And why did the union workers
walk off the job? That's right. For better benefits, health care, retirement and working conditions which ALSO benefited non-union workers, even those scabs who went in and did the jobs. Thanks to Ronald Reagan, the Great (NOT!) the unions have lost their teeth in the ability to even strike and thus to bargain. Ole Ronnie got employers the "right to permanently replace workers." Read up on the history of unions. Ever watch the movie "Jimmy Hoffa?" Yes he made deals with criminals i.e. the mafia but he did much to help workers too. Ultimately he paid with his life. Union/non-union is sort of like arguing democrat/republican. Those for/against don't want to hear any side other than their own.
Right and we don't have a union to stand up for us either. n/m
x
Are you SERIOUS? Here's what the European Union
The EU is a political and economic union of 27 members states, located primarily in Europe, composed of almost 500 million citizens (as compared to 710 million on the total continent of Europe), or 7.3% of the world's total population. The EU generates 30% of the wold's nominal gross domestic product ($16.8 trillion in 2007). There are 23 official and working languages. It is 100% SECULAR in nature
Criteria for membership:
1. Stable democracy which respects human rights and rule of law.
2. Functioning market economy capable of competition within the EU.
3. Acceptance of obligations of membership (EU law).
EU member countries:
1. Austria
2. Belguim
3. Bulgaria
4. Cyprus
5. Czech Rebpulic
6. Denmark
7. Estonia
8. Finland
9. France
10. Germany
11. Greece
12. Hungary
13. Republic of Ireland
14. Italy
15. Latvia
16. Lithuania
17. Luxembourg
18. Malta
19. Netherlands
20. Poland
21. Portugal
22. Romania
23. Slovakia
24. Slovenia
25. Spain
26. Sweden
27. United Kingdom
Three official candidate countries are Croatia, the Republic of Macedonia and Turkey. Western Balkan countries of Albania, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Montenegro and Serbia are officially recognized potential candidates. Kosovo has been granted similar status.
Areas of common shared interests:
1. Governance of institutions, legal system and fundamental rights.
2. Foreign relations including humanitarian aid, military and defense.
3. Justice and home affairs.
4. Economy, consisting of single market, monetary union, competition and budget.
5. Development of agriculture, energy, infrastructure, regional development, environment, education and research.
For more information on its history and details of the above:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Union
The union was also very strong until
the economy started really going under after 9/11. At GM, if you were "laid off" you still received 95% of your pay. They would get the regular unemployment benefits and GM would supplement the rest. This was in their contract, which to me is GMs fault, not the employee.
If it was a permanent layoff, then you went to the job banks, where you would sit for 40 hours a week, receive full pay and schooling if you wanted it. They only allowed so many people in the job banks, but it was numbering in the thousands at one point. These people also had the option of volunteering in the community instead of just sitting there. I know 3 that went on to get their degrees in other lines of work and about 10 that waited there until retirement.
This was set up in the 70s when the first massive layoff hit. This guaranteed that GM would hire back the employees that were laid off instead of hiring people off the streets. Another union thing.
I think Amanda is right from below. They made a lot of money over time and now that things are bad again, they didn't plan ahead and budget their money. No one is going to bail me out, pay my mortgage, feed my family, electric bill, etc. I know that having them go down is going to hurt many people and that is not what I want, but the bailouts that have already happened have not shown the execs to be responsible in any way. My father will be one of those losing their health benefits as well and he has medical conditions too as well as my mom. My husband works for one of their suppliers so we are affected as well. My husband busts his rear day in and day out for $17 an hour with no benefits. Overtime is not allowed. I guess I just want them to show responsibility.
No. I just wish we could get some union control
nm
AAMT is not a workers' union.
x
it doesn't take a union to get a pay raise
puhleez lighten up. I do not and will not support unions. At first unions were good. then they got too large and too powerful, corrupt and greedy, and unions were no longer a good thing. They stopped working for the people they were supposed to represent and started working for the benefit of the union itself. My father worked for a company where he had to be in the union. That union wanted more and more of the company (as they always did). Even though many, many of the employees voted against strike, some people did, and the union declared the strike and people walked off their jobs. My dad wanted to work; he was physically assaulted and our car destroyed when he tried to work. Don't call my father a "scab." He was a fine man raising three kids and wanting to work at his own job, which he loved and was proud of. Period. The strike lasted a long time, and the company finally closed its doors when the union would not concede to anything. All of the employees lost their jobs whether they were union supporters or not because of the actions of that union. Now that's why I don't like unions and never will. There used to be a large manufacturing sector here in the midwest. Unions destroyed much of it. They just keep demanding more and more, and many companies simply closed, thus placing 1000s on unemployment. And do you honestly think corruption in the union is okay as long as "he also benefitted American workers?" I never belonged to a union as an MT for 30'some years, and do you think I never got a raise? The hospitals and companies I worked for always paid well and we didn't need a union to do it for us. Actually, I think fear of unions was one of the reasons why. But let's not forget this, union membership is often mandatory so people who work for the organization are forced to be members whether they want to or not. That right there is just wrong. People outside of the union are denied the right to work in many areas. So don't tell me what to "b**ch about." The two items are no mutually inclusive. One can say that their pay has fallen behind and still not want a union involved. Have a little respect for opinions other than yours.
The Real State of the Union sm
http://www.rstu.org/index.php/about/
union people will still get paid for doing nothing.
NORTH AMERICAN UNION
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T74VA3xU0EA
marriage vs civil union
As a nation, we did not used to spend so much time splitting hairs over words.
What if back when the 19th amendment was enacted, they had said: Women having the right to 'vote' would upset men. So instead of 'voting' we're going to call it 'ballot casting.' That way, women can have the same rights as men, but only men can be 'voters' and won't feel they're losing their special status.
How about if during the civil rights movement, when segregation was eliminated, instead of integration they had called it: 'The right to attend the same schools and go to the same restaurants and ride in the front of the bus'? Calling institutions 'integrated' would upset the southern states.
How about when women began to demand 'equal pay for equal work'? What if they had said: Okay, you can have the money and the responsibility, maybe even the corner office, but only a man can be called VP of Sales. Instead, your title will have to be something else, maybe Sales Coordinator, othewise the men who are VPs will get angry.
I suppose a fair number of women or blacks would have considered this a win, because they were gaining the benefit, if not the exact status of the changes. But a fair number of folks rightly would have said: Huh? Aren't these silly distinctions? A lot of people would have wondered why they didn't just shut up and 'settle.'
If a civil union conveys such benefits as inheritance rights, parental rights, credit rights, insurance rights, the right to make medical decisions for a spouse then, really, what's in a name?
Civil union rights.
"If a civil union conveys such benefits as inheritance rights, parental rights, credit rights, insurance rights, the right to make medical decisions for a spouse then, really, what's in a name?"
I understand your point.
But why, then, is so important for same-sex couples to use the word "marriage" if - as you pointed out - it's just a word.
Why aren't people fighting to have all the rights of marriage applied to civil unions? Seems to me that, while most Americans are against gay marriage, most Americans are actually FOR civil unions.
Marriage is supposed to be a sacred union
but unfortunately many see it as a temporary situation. Some people honestly cannot help their marriages dissolve, however, even if you throw the religion aspect out of it homosexuality doesn't even make sense in Darwin's theory. Homosexuals would naturally die out, because they aren't procreating.
I've not had children either, but just because I haven't and you haven't doesn't make a case for homosexual marriages.
Misstatement of the Union - Fact Check
The President burnishes the State of the Union through selective facts and strategic omissions.
February 1, 2006
Modified: February 1, 2006
The President left out a few things when surveying the State of the Union:
He proudly spoke of writing a new chapter in the story of self-government in Iraq and Afghanistan and said the number of democracies in the world is growing. He failed to mention that neither Iraq nor Afghanistan yet qualify as democracies according to the very group whose statistics he cited.
Bush called for Congress to pass a line-item veto, failing to mention that the Supreme Court struck down a line-item veto as unconstitutional in 1998. Bills now in Congress would propose a Constitutional amendment, but none have shown signs of life.
The President said the economy gained 4.6 million jobs in the past two-and-a-half years, failing to note that it had lost 2.6 million jobs in his first two-and-a-half years in office. The net gain since Bush took office is just a little more than 2 million.
He talked of cutting spending, but only non-security discretionary spending. Actually, total federal spending has increased 42 percent since Bush took office.
He spoke of being on track to cut the federal deficit in half by 2009. But the deficit is increasing this year, and according to the Congressional Budget Office it will decline by considerably less than half even if Bush's tax cuts are allowed to lapse.
Bush spoke of a goal of cutting dependence on Middle Eastern oil, failing to mention that US dependence on imported oil and petroleum products increased substantially during his first five years in office, reaching 60 per cent of consumption last year.
Analysis
We found nothing that was factually incorrect in the President's Jan. 31 State of the Union address to Congress and the nation. However, we did note some selective use of statistics. We also found that Bush omitted some relevant facts that tended to make the state of the union look less rosy than he presented.
the folly is in giving all the power to a union...
The union may not be a thing of the past but their concern for the average worker is and their usefulness is. Now they are greedy and selfish entities in and of themselves.
By all means give the union workers a pay cut S/M
http://www.bls.gov/news.release/archives/ocwage_05092008.htm
Going way down the page you will find the median pay for medical transcriptionists is approximately $15.02 per hour. This being the case, if you are one of those fortunate enough to be making $20 or more per hour, I assume you will be recommending a pay cut for yourself and all others who are making more than the median in order to bring pay more in line with other workers. Translated that means leaving more in the coffers for the big CEOs. I don't know whether some of you are BDD or what.
Right. A friend of mine belonged to a union recently.
nm
Think gain.... Soviet Union went waaaay past
--
GOP alert memo states intent to bust the union
With 3 million jobs hanging in the balance.
Countdown has obtained a memo entitled "Action Alert - Auto Bailout," and sent Wednesday at 9:12am, to Senate Republicans. The names of the sender(s) and recipient(s) have been redacted in the copy Countdown obtained. The Los Angeles Times reported that it was circulated among Senate Republicans. The brief memo outlines internal political strategy on the bailout, including the view that defeating the bailout represents a "first shot against organized labor." Senate Republicans blocked passage of the bailout late Thursday night, over its insistence on an immediate union pay cut. See the entire memo after the jump.
Subject: Action Alert -- Auto Bailout
Today at noon, Senators Ensign, Shelby, Coburn and DeMint will hold a press conference in the Senate Radio/TV Gallery. They would appreciate our support through messaging and attending the press conference, if possible. The message they want us to deliver is:
1. This is the democrats first opportunity to payoff organized labor after the election. This is a precursor to card check and other items. Republicans should stand firm and take their first shot against organized labor, instead of taking their first blow from it.
2. This rush to judgment is the same thing that happened with the TARP. Members did not have an opportunity to read or digest the legislation and therefore could not understand the consequences of it. We should not rush to pass this because Detroit says the sky is falling.
The sooner you can have press releases and documents like this in the hands of members and the press, the better. Please contact me if you need additional information. Again, the hardest thing for the democrats to do is get 60 votes. If we can hold the Republicans, we can beat this.
http://thenewshole.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2008/12/12/1713569.aspx
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