Annoying phone call

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to come here to get different perspectives from other Democrats and have Conservatives constantly trying to force their views down my throat. I recognize you have a right to be here, but obviously neither one of us is ever going to agree 100% with the other, so I would rather get opinions primarily from other Democrats that I could actually learn from than someone that I just fundamentally disagree with on almost every political level.

I have friends that are Republicans, and some of them are great people, but I don't normally talk to them about politics because I don't want to offend them or get into a big fight, which is what it is every time. It's pretty much inevitable, and sometimes I would just like viewpoints from other liberals without having to defend every single view I have to someone who thinks my views are wrong in every way. Maybe I just shouldn't come to the board, but I do like to discuss politics and learn new things, so I will probably continue to come here.

Looks like one of your own started the modern NSA wiretaps. I think the Democrats fail to realize there's this thing out there called the Internet and not just the bullhorn of the leftist media to give the peasants amnesia to what they've done in the past.

In 1994 Sen. Pat Leaky Leahy co-wrote a law that forced telecommunications carriers to build convenient wiretap features into their networks enabling the kind of telephone records collection now at the heart of the controversy over the National Security Agency's terrorist surveillance operation.

In recent days Leahy has called the NSA's actions troubling and potentially illegal - saying they show that the Bush administration is treating Americans like terrorists.

'The secret collection of phone call records of tens of millions of Americans? he exclaimed after USA Today blew the lid off the program last week. Are you telling me that tens of millions of Americans are involved with al-Qaeda?

But according to the Rutland Herald, Leahy was singing a different tune 12 years ago, when he was pushing the Senate to pass his bill, the Communication Assistance for Law Enforcement Act [CALEA].

I suggest to senators if anybody does want to hold [CALEA] up, I hope that at this time next year, neither they nor their constituents, nor anybody they know, is a kidnap victim or victim of a terrorist, and have somebody ask why nothing can be done, and be told because a law that had probably 99 percent support in the House and the Senate did not pass.

Contacted by the Herald earlier this week, Leahy said there was an important difference between what his law authorized and the actions taken by the Bush administration.

That law talks of the technology of the interception and what technology can be used to intercept and it assumes very clearly that it can only be done with a warrant, the Vermont Democrat insisted.

Some legal experts say, however, said that assumption is not as clear as Leahy claims. Analyzing CALEA in 2003, the Rutgers Computer & Technology Law Journal explained:

CALEA requires a telecommunications provider to make 'its equipment, facilities, or services ... capable of ... enabling the government ... [without a warrant] to intercept ... all wire and electronic communications carried by the carrier.'

The secret search and wiretap provisions could lead to an age of Big Brother-like surveillance, the American Civil Liberties Union complained in the same Law Journal report. Americans who oppose U.S. policies and who are believed to have ties to foreign powers could find their homes broken into and their telephones tapped.

By LARRY MARGASAK, Associated Press WriterMon Apr 10, 4:55 PM ET

Key figures in a phone-jamming scheme designed to keep New Hampshire Democrats from voting in 2002 had regular contact with the White House and Republican Party as the plan was unfolding, phone records introduced in criminal court show.

The records show that Bush campaign operative James Tobin, who recently was convicted in the case, made two dozen calls to the White House within a three-day period around Election Day 2002 � as the phone jamming operation was finalized, carried out and then abruptly shut down.

The national Republican Party, which paid millions in legal bills to defend Tobin, says the contacts involved routine election business and that it was preposterous to suggest the calls involved phone jamming.

The Justice Department has secured three convictions in the case but hasn't accused any White House or national Republican officials of wrongdoing, nor made any allegations suggesting party officials outside New Hampshire were involved. The phone records of calls to the White House were exhibits in Tobin's trial but prosecutors did not make them part of their case.

Democrats plan to ask a federal judge Tuesday to order GOP and White House officials to answer questions about the phone jamming in a civil lawsuit alleging voter fraud.

Repeated hang-up calls that jammed telephone lines at a Democratic get-out-the-vote center occurred in a Senate race in which Republican John Sununu defeated Democrat Jeanne Shaheen, 51 percent to 46 percent, on Nov. 5, 2002.

Besides the conviction of Tobin, the Republicans' New England regional director, prosecutors negotiated two plea bargains: one with a New Hampshire Republican Party official and another with the owner of a telemarketing firm involved in the scheme. The owner of the subcontractor firm whose employees made the hang-up calls is under indictment.

The phone records show that most calls to the White House were from Tobin, who became President Bush's presidential campaign chairman for the New England region in 2004. Other calls from New Hampshire senatorial campaign offices to the White House could have been made by a number of people.

A GOP campaign consultant in 2002, Jayne Millerick, made a 17-minute call to the White House on Election Day, but said in an interview she did not recall the subject. Millerick, who later became the New Hampshire GOP chairwoman, said in an interview she did not learn of the jamming until after the election.

A Democratic analysis of phone records introduced at Tobin's criminal trial show he made 115 outgoing calls � mostly to the same number in the White House political affairs office � between Sept. 17 and Nov. 22, 2002. Two dozen of the calls were made from 9:28 a.m. the day before the election through 2:17 a.m. the night after the voting.

There also were other calls between Republican officials during the period that the scheme was hatched and canceled.

Prosecutors did not need the White House calls to convict Tobin and negotiate the two guilty pleas.

Whatever the reason for not using the White House records, prosecutors tried a very narrow case, said Paul Twomey, who represented the Democratic Party in the criminal and civil cases. The Justice Department did not say why the White House records were not used.

The Democrats said in their civil case motion that they were entitled to know the purpose of the calls to government offices at the time of the planning and implementation of the phone-jamming conspiracy ... and the timing of the phone calls made by Mr. Tobin on Election Day.

While national Republican officials have said they deplore such operations, the Republican National Committee said it paid for Tobin's defense because he is a longtime supporter and told officials he had committed no crime.

By Nov. 4, 2002, the Monday before the election, an Idaho firm was hired to make the hang-up calls. The Republican state chairman at the time, John Dowd, said in an interview he learned of the scheme that day and tried to stop it.

Dowd, who blamed an aide for devising the scheme without his knowledge, contended that the jamming began on Election Day despite his efforts. A police report confirmed the Manchester Professional Fire Fighters Association reported the hang-up calls began about 7:15 a.m. and continued for about two hours. The association was offering rides to the polls.

Virtually all the calls to the White House went to the same number, which currently rings inside the political affairs office. In 2002, White House political affairs was led by now-RNC chairman Ken Mehlman. The White House declined to say which staffer was assigned that phone number in 2002.

As policy, we don't discuss ongoing legal proceedings within the courts, White House spokesman Ken Lisaius said.

Robert Kelner, a Washington lawyer representing the Republican National Committee in the civil litigation, said there was no connection between the phone jamming operation and the calls to the White House and party officials.

On Election Day, as anybody involved in politics knows, there's a tremendous volume of calls between political operatives in the field and political operatives in Washington, Kelner said.

If all you're pointing out is calls between Republican National Committee regional political officials and the White House political office on Election Day, you're pointing out nothing that hasn't been true on every Election Day, he said.

You're making dinner and trying to sit down with your family to eat after an exhausting work week and pouring over your 401K loss report. You have just found out that the $42,000 you had accumulated as of last spring is now worth $26,040. You've just turned off the burner under the hot veggies when, BRRRINNNGGGG, the phone rings. It's the McCain campaign delivering an urgent message to you in the privacy of your own home, assuming you never listen to network news, read a paper or go on line and are unaware of their latest breaking news....telling you that Barack Obama is a terrorist who hangs with other terrorists, on the off chance that it might capture your previously uncommitted vote. If it happened to me, I would be up with the chickens Monday morning at the early voting polls telling every single peson within earshot that I had just voted a straight Dem ticket. How dare they?

yourself a saint, for all I care. How do you get your arm back there to pat yourself on the back? You are more sensitive than others. Thanks for letting us know. If you hadn't told us we might have missed it.

the fact is that he is actually doing something (as opposed to the party of NO and hip hop) that will actually help the economy. What's funny to me is that you guys seem to be terrified that he might actually manage to help someone who you would consider beneath you in the process. Yet another example of republican greed. Hey, maybe Steele can bust a few rhymes with that....

My name is Michael -- My game is to stifle -- We keep peons hungry -- And we keep all the money....Everybody in the house say Hey!...say Ho!

Con means to deceive or mislead. That's how they communicate, from Bush right on down to his peon worshippers. They deceive, lie, mislead, twist, manipulate. They do everything except speak the truth. This is a perfect example. You asked them above to see the post. You didn't get a response, did you?

Now they'll just continue to troll this board with more outrageous fictional tales conceived in their tiny little minds, all for the purpose of demeaning and attacking liberals.

It's really sad, irritating and definitely bothersome, but they are their own worst enemy because they are getting more and more out of control every day. In a way, I guess I will really be worried if it stops. If I no longer see those angry hateful posts here, I will fear that they finally snapped in real life and either hurt someone else or got hurt themselves.

Describing George W. Bush as the most stupid president in U.S. history, the Al Qaeda leader reached out to the Muslim world and said his group was winning faster than expected in Iraq.

The U.S. president's policy had enabled the militant group to achieve their goal of fighting more Americans, said the Al Qaeda leader.

We call the lame duck (Bush) not to hurry up in escaping the same way the defense minister did, he said, referring to the removal of Donald Rumsfeld as Defense Secretary following the Democrats' victory in Midterm elections.

They are getting ready to leave, because they are no longer capable of staying, the Al Qaeda leader said.

If this does not chill your blood, with all due respect, there is something terribly wrong. These people are focused on the destruction of the United States. They get their information from the New York Times and CNN, and they are heartened that the majority of this country who voted espouse the cut and run theory on Iraq. They seek to divide us from within and for the country to turn on the President (and they have done that successfully it would seem). They think (and it would appear that they are right in many cases) that the US as a whole has no stomach for the fight. In their eyes, we are weak and not willing to fight for what we believe in like they are, and in their eyes that makes us cowards. We are in a WAR, yes a WAR, like no other. And if you do not think us pulling out of Iraq prematurely will not fire the jihad you are very sadly mistaken. They will view it as a major victory and I shudder to think what will follow it. The very reason we have not had more major attacks on our soil, in my opinion, is that these people, with all their bluster, are afraid of George Bush and what he might do. They are afraid that if they pull something like that again Iraq might be a walk in the park and would mean even more American boots on the ground in places they don't want them. They just can't be sure of what the US might do under his leadership, and that is why they are biding their time. If we get a dovish adminstration, it could, and most likely would, get ugly real fast. All it will take is the first (and probably homegrown) jihadist to blow himself up in a mall somewhere and take several innocent American lives with him....and then it will be too late. It could happen, do not think for a moment it could not. They want dead Americans. They would prefer dead American citizens on our own ground. They prefer the cowardly fight. They do not prefer having to face our military. But they will, because they are dedicated to their belief, no matter how perverse it is, while all the time trying to get back on the playing field they prefer...cowardly suicide attacks. We will learn what Israel has had to live with for years, the hard way. Do you see where I am going with this? We NEED for them to remain afraid of what we might do if they start something like that. We need for them to respect our willingness to stand toe-to-toe for what we believe in. We need to demonstrate that we are willing to do so and not waver. We need to demonstrate a belief in our country and our way of life as strong as theirs is. We are already wavering as a country, and we need to suck it up and stand up straight again. It is time to wake up. We are not acting as the World police in Iraq. We are in a fight for our survival, the survival of a free country where we are not afraid to go into a mall or get in a car or go anywhere we wish without fear of suicide bombers, car bombs, being grabbed off the street and found without a head a week later. We do not need to join the hunker down and be quiet and maybe they will leave us alone club. That does not work. They are not going to leave us alone. No one is safe, for these people there is only one way....their way. They are not going to stop and go quietly away. That should be patently obvious. This is the most important issue that faces us. None of the rest of it will matter if we lose in Iraq. Take a moment to look at history, all the precursors of 9-11. Had we not gone into Iraq, and swept yet another incident under the rug (with Khobar Towers, the Cole, the Achille Lauro, Tanzania, Somalia, and on and on and on) there is no telling where we would be right now or what other awful things might have occurred. For those of you who cannot grasp that, who think that if we pull out of Iraq and pander to these people that everything will be all right....God help you. God help us all.

Great article and on target! It also should chill the blood of the get out of Iraq now crowd, because what this article describes is precisely what would happen. But, they have blinders on. Iran in control of Iraq's oil .... think on that for a minute. With their nuclear ambitions .... think on that for a minute, people. It is still hard for me to believe that we actually have leaders, members of our own Congress, who are ready and willing to turn our belly up to be ripped out by these fanatics. Sorry if that is graphic, but that is exactly what they want to do. How can anyone in their right mind support a party who would rather go after the man who had guts enough to fight for this country, than to go after the terrorists? If they would focus the hatred of George Bush and the energy trying to bring him down on terrorism instead we might be a lot closer to defeating them. How did their thinking get that screwed up? How did it become acceptable to screw over your fellow Americans, your own country, to have power? And how were they able to sell that garbage to a portion of the American people? I ask the question and I know the answer. Because a great portion of the American people have strayed from core values, moral stands, and the black and white of right and wrong to the gray area of appeasement and whatever makes ME feel good, to heck with what is best for the country. The REALLY sad part of it is that they are going to drag us all down with them. As I said in another post....as THEY sow, so shall WE all reap. It is heartbreaking. We cannot give up, however. We still have a mighty sword and that is prayer. And not to sit down nor shut up. God Bless!