I meant recession, not depression. nm

• A little hopeful - DW
  • Hillary has gone from supporting to decrying the war. sm - MT
    • A lot of politicians on both sides changed their views on the war once the truth came out. nm - schwing
      • yes, but she has done it time and time again and yet. sm - MT
    • I meant recession, not depression. nm - MT

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has anything to do with it?  Hey, that's what republicans want, big business to grow fast--no regulation--me, me, me...

How about all those families that are going to suffer from this.  Did they ask for it too?

homes, natural disasters unattended to, collapsing bridges, earmark bridges. Address those first, save flag for later.

With the "bubble bursting" in regards to the housing market and rising fuel prices, do you think a major recession is on the horizon in the US?

I definitely think so, but was wondering what others think?

    When the labor market weakens, workers have less bargaining power with their employers. As a result, wages are trailing more than 2 percentage points behind inflation over the last year.

    Wages are virtually the entire income for most workers. If the purchasing power of their wages falls by 2 percent, this is the equivalent of a 2 percentage point increase in their tax rate.

    This is worth thinking about. Most workers in the country have just seen the equivalent of a 2 percentage point increase in their tax rate, and it has gotten almost no attention. By contrast, Senator McCain is claiming that the economy will collapse if we increase the tax rate by 3.6 percentage points for people who can't remember how many homes they own.

    It is easy to understand how a typical family experiences real hardship when their wages don't keep up with the price of food, gas, and heating oil. It's a bit harder to understand how the folks who can't keep track of their homes will suffer by restoring tax rates to the Clinton-era levels.

    This brings us to the other important point about the Friday jobs numbers. The economy is in bad shape and getting worse. This disaster is happening while we are experimenting with the tax policies advocated by Senator McCain. We have an economy that is now shedding jobs at the rate of almost 100,000 a month. There is no prospect of turnaround in sight. We could have half a million fewer jobs by the time the next president is sworn into office than we do today.

    This is the Bush-McCain economy. Senator McCain may have forgotten, but President Bush already tried his economic policies and the results are not good. We have just been through a business cycle in which the wage of the typical worker and the typical working family fell. This is the first time that has ever happened.

    As bad as the situation is, it will surely get worse as the recession deepens. Wages and incomes will fall further behind inflation as the unemployment rate continues to rise. By contrast, the Clinton-era tax rates were associated with the most prosperous period since the early seventies.

    As I have written many times, Clinton's policies do not deserve all the credit for the prosperity of the late 90s, and President Bush's polices do not deserve all the blame for the economy's poor performance in the current decade.

    However, it strains credulity to argue that the Clinton-era tax rates are a recipe for stagnation, while the Bush-McCain tax cuts for the rich are the road to prosperity. When he pushes his tax cuts as a remedy for the economy's ills, Senator McCain is effectively imitating Groucho Marx's famous line: "what are you going to believe, me or your lying eyes?"

    At this point, McCain should be embarrassed to even say that tax cuts for the rich help the economy. Tax cuts for the rich help the rich, they don't help the economy. It's that simple.

    This economic catastrophe was many years in the making. There is no painless way to recover from the collapse of the housing bubble and the correction from an over-valued dollar. We do know that Senator McCain's plan to keep giving the rich more money is not a road to prosperity because that is exactly what we have been doing.

    We can't know exactly how Senator Obama will address the economy's problems if he takes office in January in part because we don't know exactly where the economy will be. However, a plan that focuses on supporting ordinary workers and promoting clean technologies, is likely to produce much better results than policies that are focused on redistributing even more income to the wealthy.

http://www.truthout.org/article/the-whiners-recession

was coming long before the "experts" knew it.  All they had to do was to be Americans who were trying to fill up their gas tanks, feed their families and try to hang on to their jobs.  I just read an article the other day where someone in the government finally admitted that we've been in a recession that they believe will last another 14 months.  (Can't remember who said it; will try to find the link.)  This is after months and months of denials, although most everday folks felt like they were in a recession long before hearing it "officially."

If they are only now admitting to a recession, that tells me that we're in the beginnings of a full-fledged DEPRESSION. 

Add terror threats, a war between Iran and Israel and the USA, perhaps provoking a terror attack (real or "false flag"), people becoming so poor in this country that their fear is replaced with anger, and voila!!  The US soldiers that are lying in wait for us to "misbehave" as tensions arise so they can keep us in line, just might have their work cut out for them...especially if we suffer another attack on our soil.

We've got crooks running the Treasury Department, all chosen from the same failing companies for which they worked. 

The Wall Street "crisis" came on so quickly and so urgently that nobody knew what to do.

Well, Bush knew what to do.  First, he hired Henry Paulson of Goldman Sachs fame, the company that received a $3 billion payout, who then went on to appoint Michael Alix to "oversee things."  This is the same Michael Alix who was in control of "overseeing things" at Bear Stearns (we remember how well that whole Bear Stearns thing worked out.)  Paulson then went on to appoint Neel Kashkari (another Goldman Sachs graduate).

Bush has selected these men, either personally or through Paulson, because he knows that THEY know how to play the system and accentuate the greed.  He hired people who aren't on America's side at all.  They're part of Bush's "Haves," and the rest of average Americans -- the "have nots" -- aren't even in the picture, except as it pertains to how much money has been stolen from our accounts.  Bush has always has been about greed.  He still is.  When a government begins to buy banks, it's at the very least socialism (if not, more accurately, fascism).  For all intents and purposes, this money could easily be in Bush's pockets.  We don't and won't know this because this particular sweetheart deal came with NO oversight and NO transparency as conditions on the part of Bush.  By the way, Bush bought a ranch in Paraguay. 

Basically, Bush had a lot of knowledgeable, independent people who had NO conflict of interest from having been senior executives of the failed companies from which he could have chosen.

Instead, he chose those who were at the very top to the crooks (if not the crooks themselves.)

In short, Bush hired the foxes to watch the hen houses.  No doubt in my mind that Bush's pockets are going to be pretty full soon if they're not already.

The arrogance with which these auto executives presented their testimony is reminiscent of all the arrogant people who surround themselves with the Arrogant-In-Chief.

In the middle of all this, though, I do see somewhat of a silver lining.  The less money people have to spend, the lower prices will be forced to go -- all that supply and demand stuff. 

Enter Obama's "bottom-up" theory.  Once the lives of the least of us can improve a bit, that will hopefully trickle up to everyone else.

I also heard an excellent idea on TV recently:  That every single CEO of a company should NEVER earn more than the President of the United States.  I kind of liked that one. 

P.S.  I apologize if this post doesn't make any sense.  I'm very heavily medicated right now and probably shouldn't even be at the computer.  I've tried to write this as coherently as I could.  If I failed, I apologize. 

Hope you all have a great evening.

With Recession Looming, Bush Tells America To ‘Go Shopping More’

Today, President Bush held a news conference where he discussed the “way forward” for the economy in 2007. Renowned Morgan Stanley economist Steven Roach says the the “odds of the U.S. economy tipping into recession are about 40 to 45 per cent.” New York Times columnist Paul Krugman notes that “the odds are very good — maybe 2 to 1,” that the U.S. will teeter toward a recession in 2007. Bush’s solution? “Go shopping more.”

This isn't terribly reassuring!

Government website now offers 'suicide warning signs' for victims of recession

John Byrne
Published: Tuesday March 31, 2009

When the government starts warning you not to commit suicide, you know things have gotten bad.

The US Department of Health and Human Services now has a webpage for the current recession, "Getting Through Tough Economic Times." Headlined under the Substance Abuse & Mental Health Services Administration (www.samhsa.gov/economy/), the guide offers tips on "how to deal with the effects financial difficulties can have on your physical and mental health." The site went public Tuesday.

The remainder of the story is at:  http://rawstory.com/news/2008/Government_website_offers_suicide_warning_signs_0331.html

So, this "man of the people" who funds the loony left and wants all the rest of us to be communists rakes in $billions from the recession.  He's out there picking up stuff at bargain-basement prices just like JP Morgan and his kind did.

Disgusting.

Unemployment rate soars to 8.1 percent
Employers resort to even bigger layoffs as they scramble to survive
BREAKING NEWS
The Associated Press
updated 8:02 a.m. CT, Fri., March. 6, 2009

WASHINGTON - The nation's unemployment rate bolted to 8.1 percent in February, the highest since late 1983, as cost-cutting employers slashed 651,000 jobs.

Both figures were worse than analysts expected and the Labor Department's report shows America's workers being clobbered by a relentless wave of layoffs.

The net loss of jobs in February came after even deeper payroll reductions in the prior two months, according to revised figures. The economy lost 681,000 jobs in December and another 655,000 in January.

Since the recession began in December 2007, the economy has lost 4.4 million jobs, more than half of which occurred in the past four months.

Employers are shrinking their work forces at alarming clip and are turning to other ways to slash costs — including trimming workers' hours, freezing wages or cutting pay — because the recession has eaten into their sales and profits. Customers at home and abroad are cutting back as other countries cope with their own economic problems.

With employers showing no appetite to hire, the unemployment jumped to 8.1 percent from 7.6 percent in January. That was the highest since December 1983, when the jobless rate was 8.3 percent.

All told, the number of unemployed people climbed to 12.5 million. In addition, the number of people forced to work part time for "economic reasons" rose by a sharp 787,000 to 8.6 million. That's people who would like to work full time but whose hours were cut back or were unable to find full-time work.

Meanwhile, the average work week in February stayed at 33.3 hours, matching the record low set in December.

Job losses were widespread in February.

Construction companies eliminated 104,000 jobs. Factories axed 168,000. Retailers cut nearly 40,000. Professional and business services got rid of 180,000, with 78,000 jobs lost at temporary-help agencies. Financial companies reduced payrolls by 44,000. Leisure and hospitality firms chopped 33,000 positions.

The few areas spared: education and health services, as well as government, which boosted employment last month.

A new wave of layoffs hit this week.

General Dynamics Corp. said Thursday it will lay off 1,200 workers due partly to plummeting sales of business and personal jets that forced it to cut production. Defense contractor Northrop Grumman Corp., and Tyco Electronics Ltd., which makes electronic components, undersea telecommunications systems and wireless equipment, also are trimming payrolls.

"This is basically cleaning house for a lot of firms," said John Silvia, chief economist at Wachovia. "They are using the first quarter to cut back employment and figure out what they want."

Disappearing jobs and evaporating wealth from tanking home values, 401(k)s and other investments have forced consumers to retrench, driving companies to lay off workers. It's a vicious cycle in which all the economy's negative problems feed on each other, worsening the downward spiral.

"The economy is in a tailspin. Businesses are jettisoning jobs at an unprecedented pace," said Richard Yamarone, economist at Argus Research.

The country is getting bloodied by fallout from the housing, credit and financial crises_ the worst since the 1930s. And there's no easy fix for a quick turnaround, economists said.

President Barack Obama is counting on a multipronged assault to lift the country out of recession: a $787 billion stimulus package of increased federal spending and tax cuts; a revamped, multibillion-dollar bailout program for the nation's troubled banks; and a $75 billion effort to stem home foreclosures.

Even in the best-case scenario that the relief efforts work and the recession ends later in 2009, the unemployment rate is expected to keep climbing, hitting 9 percent or higher this year. In fact, the Federal Reserve thinks the unemployment rate will stay elevated into 2011. Economists say the job market may not get back to normal — meaning a 5 percent unemployment rate — until 2013.

Businesses won't be inclined to ramp up hiring until they are sure any economic recovery has staying power.

The economy contracted at a staggering 6.2 percent in the final three months of 2008, the worst showing in a quarter-century, and it will probably continue to shrink during the first six months of this year.

Fed Chairman Ben Bernanke told Congress earlier this week that recent economic barometers "show little sign of improvement" and suggest that "labor market conditions may have worsened further in recent weeks."

Consumers’ growing frugality has hammered automakers, among other industries. General Motors Corp.'s auditors on Thursday raised "substantial doubt" about the auto giant’s ability to continue operations, and the company said it might have to seek bankruptcy protection, sending its shares below $2.

Bill Hampel, chief economist for the Credit Union National Association, said his group’s members are reporting record increases in deposits. Government figures show the savings rate jumped to 5 percent in January from zero last spring. That’s the highest rate since 1995 and a much faster shift than he had expected, Hampel said.

Consumer spending makes up about 70 percent of the economy. It topped out at 71 percent in 2005, Hampel said, but will likely drop by 2 to 3 percentage points over the next few years.

Increased savings can actually lower economic growth. Economists call it the “paradox of thrift”: What’s good for each of us individually — being thrifty, limiting our spending — can worsen a recession when everyone does it all at once.

Hoffman said about half the 6.2 percent drop in economic output last quarter was attributable to lower consumer spending.

Obama is your man.

regardless of which idea they go with.  I really don't think there is anyway out of this. 

You know what really bugs me....and this is kind along the lines of the topic of equal pay........

If a caucasian male is making more money for doing the same job as an african american, by law the african american has the right to sue for legal pay.  I'm cool with that.  If you do the same job and think you deserve the same pay....more power to you.  If an african american is making more money for doing the same job as a caucasian, the caucasian has no legal rights to sue for equal pay.  I'm sorry, but that doesn't sound equal to me.

This sounds familiar:

http://eh.net/Clio/Publications/unemployment.html

I am paying off debt.  Made my garden bigger.  Planted some fruit trees.  Stocked my pantry.  But I don't want to take in any relatives......I would rather pass out free zuchini.

Gee, and when was the last time this country saw tent cities like this? The Great Depression.

The unemployment rate in California is over 10% and has risen to 15% in some of the hardest hit states in the country. To say that this has been fabricated and that there is no crisis is just more of the republican elitist socially darwinistic pile of horse @!$%# that has been pervading the GOP.

It's time for all of you hard right conservatives to pull your head out of the sand and take a really good look at what YOUR republican president did to this country in the course of 8 years. Obama inherited one of the biggest messes in this country's history, and you are pssed off that he hasn't "fixed" it yet?!! Are you kidding!? He's been in office for not even two months. It took the Great Depression over a decade to be resolved, and your screaming over 2 MONTHS!!!!!!????

There are a lot of people hurting. And guess what, the CEO @!$%#s that helped cause the mess are laughing all the way to their bank accounts in Grand Cayman and couldn't give a @!$%# about the rest of the country. And who helped them get their egregious bonuses and compensation? Hmmmm, couldn't be the republicans that were in power for HOW LONG!!?? I'll tell you: from 1994-2006. Hmmmm, just long enough to deregulate the banks and lower the taxes on the wealthy enough to create the largest income gap in this country since the Industrial revolution.

The republicans f'd up big time. That is why they lost control. And they are continuing on that same wretched path with NO IDEAS on how to fix the mess they are mostly responsible for creating. Except tax cuts for the wealthy. The GOP mantra. It's BS and you all need to stop buying into the rhetoric.

I am hoping with all my heart that Obama is a successful president and is doing what needs to be done to rectify this nation. Yes, he may fail. That is a risk you take with ANY president. But if any of you have even half a functioning brain you would wish for success as well. His failure will mean the failure of our country. And I don't know about you, but I certainly hope I never see that day.

and additionally says that we are a nation of "whiners.' McCains top economic advisor is Phil Gramm.

How do you feel about these remarks? Additionally have you or someone you know been experiencing tough times in the last year?

BOOK:  The Crisis Of The Old Order  By:  Arthur Schlesinger, Jr.

In 1928 and 1929, the nation had reached, it seemed, a permanent plateau of prosperity.  Businesses expanding.  Foreign trade growing.  The stock market was continuing to rise.  And national leadership could not now be in more expert or safer hands.  "I have no fears for the future of our country," said Herbert Hoover in his inaugural address in March 1929.  "It is bright with hope."

There remained a few discordant voices, anxious in the main over the stock market boom.  In spring 1929, Hoover summoned a special session of Congress to deal with these issues.  The session was not a success.  The Board's purpose was to control the flow of commodities to the market; one provision was to control temporary surpluses.  The session adjourned from April to November without taking action on the tariff.  Hoover wanted state public lands and reclamatin projects and related irrigation matters be withdrawn from national control and states to manage these affairs then Federal Government.  President's attitude toward utilities regulation was similar. 

Yet most Americans remained more interested in teh stock market than economic question and the few interest as now beginning to turn into concern. 

Early 1929, Federal Reserve Board under pressures of NY Federal Reserve Bank, finally consented to warn member banks that they should not lend money for speculative purposes.  But did not work.  Some argued that a restrictive policy might well induce deflation.  The board felt it created "a state of mind which breeds depression."  It was certainly true that reducing the interest rate was a clumsy way of combatting THE BOOM.  As long as the stock market offered highest returns, it was bound to have first call on funds.  Higher interest rate would have slowed down investment, cause capitalization process and bring down prices of ALL CAPITAL ASSETS and thus discourage investment.  President Hoover did nothing as he was preoccupied with his own mind and watched the Board run the course.

CHECK THIS OUT!!!  Finally by summer 1929, some danger signs were apparent, STARTLING DECLINE IN BULIDING CONTRACTS.  Residential construction for the entire year SANK.  CONSUMER SPENDING WAS SLACKENING.  By midsummer 1929, building began to fall off, wholesale commodity prices dropped.  In August, Federal Reserve Board finally agreed to raise to 6 percent. In September Stock Exchange price were at the highest.  On October 23, PRICES STARTED FALLING.  WALL STREET WAS SHAKEN.  Anxiety was suddenly infectious.  As panic spread, stocks dropped.  Hoover stated, "The fundamental business of the country, that is production and distribution of commodities is a sound and prosperous basis."  As prices held for a week, bankers QUIETLY fed back into the stock market that they had bought on Black Thursday for further future storms.  

Banks protected themselves against their customers.  On Monday, new explosion of gloom and panic happend.  General Motors stock lost nearly 2 million.  It soon was an avalanche, vast numbers rushing to get out of the market.  By noon, 8 million shares traded hands and by closing time, Exchange had broken all records with 16 million shares.  By mid November the financial community began to survey the wreckage.  New York Stock Exchange had fallen 40 percent in value. 

CAUSE OF THE CRASH:  Management's disposition to maintain prices and inflate profits while holding down wages and raw material prices meant that workers and farmers were denied benefits of increases in their own productivity.  Decline of mass purchasing power (like our real estate in 2005?) as goods flowed out of expanding capital plant in ever greater quantities, less and less cash in the hands of buyers to carry goods off the market.  Seven years of fixed capital investment at high rates had overbuilt productive capacity and had thus saturated the economy.  The slackening of the automotive and building industries.  Businessmen trying TO SAVE THEMSELVES COULD ONLY WRECK THEIR SYSTEM.  Representing the financiers, it had ignored irresponsible practices in the securities of the markets.  Ignored the weight of private debt.  Result was both class and national disaster. 

He should have said "no comment" first thing when he addressed the American people - when he said the whole "I did not have sexual relations with that woman" thing.  At that point he was not obligated to comment, and he shouldn't have.

I am not a "Clintonite" or whatever you said.  I just think he was a more intelligent person than Bush.  Although I despise Bush, I really do like his wife Laura.  I think she seems like a very caring, very genuine person.

I do NOT plan to vote for Hilary.  I plan to vote for Barack Obama if he makes it that far.  I think he could really improve the health insurance crisis in America.  I never hear Republican candidates talking about making healthcare more affordable, and therefore I will probably vote for a Democrat.

What I meant was that I hope he has the opportunity to serve out the full four years and/or that this election isn't contested for some reason resulting in the involvement of the Supreme Court.  For example, I see the GOP is filing a lawsuit against Obama, alleging he used campaign funds when he visited his grandmother for the last time.

I hope we can all get along and not be as divided as we have been for the past few years, and I hope that nothing happens that would cause such division. 

Again, I thought the post you wrote was very classy.  Thanks.