I never believed he was there to begin with - nm
Posted By: Amanda on 2009-04-07
In Reply to: Probably because he never left his original faith - uhhhhhh
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And, where's the WMD that they believed in...sm
which the chief UN inspector urged more time before a preemptive war because he could not find any. Indeed the inspections had been working, indeed the Clinton bombings had been working, indeed America invaded Iraq to get rid of Saddam and throw that country into a civil war that could prove to have further destabilized the region instead of add stability.
Did we believe there was WMD? I didn't.
Do we believe that the war in Iraq is making America safe? I don't.
I don't think he understood or believed a word he said.
And how can I believe him when he has done nothing but lied before? Boy who cried wolf? I s'pose I'm putting my trust, whatever trust is left, in congress. 
Sure he did. But it'll never be believed by you. But I'd believe my husband before I would
He lies every day, but no one will call him on it.
No one is allowed to criticize. Ever. Or point out flaws. Ever. Or point out inconsistencies. Ever.
You get my drift, I'm sure, so why bother trying to give you a real source in your eyes? You'll just blast it down, as you've done me.
Case in point....anyone opposing any of you Obama people on this board.
What a sad state of affairs.
Pat Tillman: Believed War on Iraq Was Ilegal
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This article can be found on the web at
http://www.thenation.com/doc/20051024/zirin
Pat Tillman, Our Hero
by DAVE ZIRIN
[from the October 24, 2005 issue]
I don't believe it, seethed Ann Coulter.
Her contempt was directed at a September 25 San Francisco Chronicle story reporting that former NFL star and Army Ranger war hero Pat Tillman, who was killed in Afghanistan last year, believed the US war on Iraq was f***ing illegal and counted Noam Chomsky among his favorite authors. It must have been quite a moment for Coulter, who upon Tillman's death described him in her inimitably creepy fashion as an American original--virtuous, pure and masculine like only an American male can be. She tried to discredit the story as San Francisco agitprop, but this approach ran into a slight problem: The article's source was Pat Tillman's mother, Mary.
Mary and the Tillman family are relentlessly pushing for answers to the questions surrounding Pat's death in Afghanistan. They want to know why it took the Pentagon five weeks to tell them he died in a tragic case of friendly fire. They want to know why they were unwitting props at Pat's funeral, weeping while lies were told by eulogizing politicians. Mary is now hoping that a new Pentagon inquiry will bring closure. There have been so many discrepancies so far that it's hard to know what to believe, she said to the Chronicle. There are too many murky details.
The very private Tillmans have revealed a picture of Pat profoundly at odds with the GI Joe image created by Pentagon spinmeisters and their media stenographers. As the Chronicle put it, family and friends are now unveiling a side of Pat Tillman not widely known--a fiercely independent thinker who enlisted, fought and died in service to his country yet was critical of President Bush and opposed the war in Iraq, where he served a tour of duty. He was an avid reader whose interests ranged from history books...to works of leftist Noam Chomsky, a favorite author. Tillman had very unembedded feelings about the Iraq War. His close friend Army Spec. Russell Baer remembered, I can see it like a movie screen. We were outside of [an Iraqi city] watching as bombs were dropping on the town.... We were talking. And Pat said, 'You know, this war is so f***ing illegal.' And we all said, 'Yeah.' That's who he was. He totally was against Bush. With these revelations, Pat Tillman the PR icon joins WMD and Al Qaeda connections on the heap of lies used to sell the Iraq War.
Tillman's transition from one-dimensional caricature to critically thinking human being is a long time coming. The fact is that in death he was far more useful to the armchair warriors than he had ever been in life. When the Pro Bowler joined the Army Rangers, the Pentagon brass needed a loofah to wipe their drool: He was white, handsome and played in the NFL. For a chicken-hawk Administration led by a President who loves the affectations of machismo but runs from protesting military moms, this testosterone cocktail was impossible to resist. The problem was that Tillman wouldn't play their game. To the Pentagon's chagrin, he turned down numerous offers to be its recruitment poster child.
But when Tillman fell in Afghanistan the wheels once again started to turn. Now the narrative was perfect: War hero and football star dies fighting terror. The Abu Ghraib scandal was about to hit the press, so the President found it especially useful to praise Tillman as an inspiration on and off the football field, as with all who made the ultimate sacrifice in the war on terror. His funeral was nationally televised. Bush even went back to the bloody well during the presidential campaign, addressing his team's fans on the Arizona Cardinals' stadium Jumbotron.
We now know, of course, that this was all a brutal charade. Such callous manipulation is fueling the Tillman family's anger. As Mary Tillman said this past May, They could have told us up front that they were suspicious that [his death] was a fratricide, but they didn't. They wanted to use him for their purposes.... They needed something that looked good, and it was appalling that they would use him like that. A growing number of military families, similarly angered, are criticizing the war in Iraq through organizations like Military Families Speak Out.
As for Chomsky, whom Ann Coulter would undoubtedly label treasonous, Mary Tillman says a private meeting was planned between him and Pat after Pat's return--a meeting that never took place, of course. Chomsky confirms this scenario. This was the real Pat Tillman: someone who, like the majority of this country, was doubting the rationale for war, distrusting his Commander in Chief and looking for answers. The real Pat Tillman, the one with three dimensions, must stick in the throat of the Bush-Coulter gang, a pit in the cherry atop their bloody sundae.
If a doctor truly believed his hippocratic oath he would not be...
killing babies for ANY reason other than to save the life of the mother.
Poster below believed this to be a false statement
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I didn't say I believed it, just posted an article
I wouldn't be too quick to put words in someones mouth just for the sake of mocking them. I never said I believed it. I know it happened in Nazi Germany (holocaust). I only posted the article because when I started searching on welfare, government takeovers, and other topics, that topic kept popping up.
Do I believe it could happen. Not really. Just thought it was interesting. So,...all I said I believed was the plan to put the country on welfare. If you want to mock me for something at least mock me for what I said.
Bill Clinton believed it, so did Hillary and so did John Kerry.
So did a great many in the congress else they would not have said so! How is it possible that you have such selective memory? I wish I could do that.
This is where it will begin
Any remark not directly supporting Obama is immediately construed as hate speech. Neither McCain nor Palin ever accused Obama falsely of anything, but since they brought up something questionable about him, you consider that hate speech.
This is where it will begin. It won't be long (at this rate, probably within months) before there is no freedom of speech, no freedom of the press; anything negative said about Obama will be called hate speech and racist.
Where do I begin?? sm
No pork!
No lobbists in my White House!
I will bring the troops out of Iraq (maybe he will but he's just sending them to Afghanistan instead)!
I believe that if a person will lie about one thing, they will generally lie about anything.
You cannot begin to understand the
he saw it coming, gave the pubs just enough rope to hang themselves with, had a plan and launched it. This must may be the October surprise we have all been waiting for. I am thrilled beyond words.
When does life begin? sm
You state that you apparently have a different view of when life begins as opposed to others, Shelly and myself for example.
My stance is that life begins in full at the moment of conception. Why? Because cell division begins at that point and body organs and systems begin forming very shortly thereafter. It is quite an amazing process, really. At 5 weeks, the neural tube has formed. At 6 weeks, the heart bulge has begun to form as well as the jaws and the buds that will become arms and legs. At 7 weeks, we have eyelids and elbows and fingers. At 8 weeks, we have a brain and hands and knees. At 9 weeks, earlobes appear as well as shoulders. At 10 weeks, the fetus is fully recognizable as a baby and at 11 weeks bones have begun to form. At 16 weeks, your baby has started to grow toenails. And on and on it goes that this living viable BABY grows. Can an inanimate lifeless object do that? Can your computer monitor grow fingers? Do the cells of your car multiply? No. A baby is something that is living and growing from the moment of conception and to take its life is murder and robs it of its civil rights as a human being.
That is how wrong abortion is.
Do you think that people will begin to take any job?
I was just wondering if you feel like with the economy the way it is that American workers will begin to take any job that is offered to them and that will make it harder for illegals to find work and therefore they will go home?
I just thought about it. A lot of the jobs that the illegal people have now are jobs that Americans really do not want to do. Well, it is beginning to look like if people want to eat, they are going to have to do whatever they can and may decide that those jobs are not so bad after all.
What do you think?
And the excuses begin....
any republican would have been castigated. Your bias is showing. Mine, at least, is out in the open!
Maybe you could begin in another thread.
Day of Prayer and the absolute vicious lies about Obama's faith.
Just because you believe he lied about other things does not automatically make him a Muslim.
Excuse me, but for you to begin the *debate* by asking if we would rather
have our *backs patted* is, in and of itself, confrontational. Back-patting is what happens routinely on the conservative board, and they've even brought that to this board, as well, as any objective person can see below.
Obviously, you don't find your comments rude and confrontational. I respectfully disagree.
And I seriously wish you a wonderful day, as well. 
I mean, REALLY !?! Arrogance doesn't even begin
It borders on psychopathic.
Anything could happen - pigs may begin to fly too
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Where do I begin about Palin flaws?
Lately I really hate how she is inflaming the crowds and trying to paint Barack as a terrorist. That's just plain wrong. I hate that she lies. I hate that she abused power. I hate that she could put our country and security at risk by having a high power. I hate that she is against abortion. I hate that she is against educating kids on sex issues, I hate that she is so backwards, I hate her 1980s blush, I hate her voice, I hate that her husband belongs to a fringe group trying to get Alaska to secede from teh union. I hate that she went to teh fundraiser with her husband for getting alaska to secede from the union. I hate that we are supposed to think she is worthy of Hillary supporters when all they have in common is a vagina. I hate the way she won't be interviewed. I hate the way she lowers herself to only go on Fox or talk to Rush and I cannot believe that repubs don't see the blunders of these moves. I hate that people say "she is a woman" as if that alone makes it progress even though she basically is not helping women at all. I hate that she left Wasilla with a pile of taxes and debt when she had gone in to a debt free town. I hate all the meth labs in her tiny town that nobody talks about. I hate how she pretends that only she and mccain supporters are patriotic. I hate how ...oh gosh... i can't talk about it anymore. I hate how she says she has a gay friend when she is against gay unions. I hate the way she attacks Barack. She is really really dangerous and way too right wing.
I can't begin to imagine what the parents must feel.
I would be so enraged if I were in their position that I'm not sure what I'd do. I hope I would remember that keeping my family together and supporting my child (or children if there are siblings) has to be a priority, but on the other hand, to know that this monster is free to walk the streets and do this to other children... I'm not sure I wouldn't do whatever was necessary to put him either behind bars or underground. I certainly couldn't condemn a parent in that situation who made that choice.
I really hope there is enough uproar over this to change things. Otherwise, what choice do people have to protect their children but to take the law into their own hands? These judges (and legislators, for that matter) need to realize that, like guards in a prison, government rules by consent of the governed. Fail to protect the governed or to enforce reasonable laws in a just manner, and the governed will assume control one way or another. I am not an anarchist by any means, but law and order is one of the most basic governmental responsibilities. We can argue til the cows come home about everything else we would or wouldn't like the government involved in, but if they fail on too large a scale in this most basic duty, vigilantism and anarchy become inevitable.
Hopefully, moderates in both parties will begin to assert themselves.
We've swung far to the right and now far to the left. It will be a good thing if the true majority of Americans re-take control of their government, and I think you'll begin to see that happening in the 2010 Congressional election cycle. With any luck, Obama will be a one-term President unless he can manage to once again hoodwink the American voters into believing he's a moderate. Can we be fooled twice? I hope not. Let's get a true moderate into the White House in 2012 - of either party, I don't care which.
This article does not begin to address the problems.
Going forward not but a few years, Social Security is a grave problem, but Medicare is a true crisis, and we won't be able to tax our way out of either, although the idiots will try.
These things ARE coming:
1. Tax increases. These will be of many different varieties, and from all levels of government.
2. Reduced SS benefits. This might be disguised in the form of raising the eligibility age, etc., but it will still be a reduction in benefits.
3. Healthcare rationing. We simply will not be able to pay the bill to provide everyone with the level of care that medical science is technically capable of delivering. Rationing will be done in two ways - by restricting access on some sort of a cost-benefit basis (if you're 80, you won't get that triple bypass), and by increasing the waiting times while forcing people to go through a series of less-effective but cheaper forms of treatment.
I continue to be amazed at the number of people - in government and out - who continue to stick their heads in the sand over these realities while we pile up debts that even China can't bail us out of.
Life doesn't begin 'til the cord it cut and the
Until then, it's just a fetus/piece of tissue/etc., and has no rights.
Obama didn't wait for his term to legally begin, he started on Nov. 5th.
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