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I thank God Bush stopped having war on US soil after 911! nm

Posted By: middle class on 2008-11-02
In Reply to: Dictatorship...you mean like Bush? - Just the big bad

x


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So tell me - what other atrocity on US soil has happened
since the towers. I can't think of a single one.

America is safer because of the policies in place.
Interestingly, other atrocities on US soil...(sm)

since 9/11 have not come from the usual suspects, but rather from our own government.  I'm going to go with the patriot act that pretty much killed the constitution, an unjust war that has not only killed numerous Americans but has also destroyed any credibility of the US, and then there's Gitmo and torture, all perpetrated right here in the good ol USA.


If those aren't atrocities, I don't know what is.


I've already experienced martial law on American soil

(I think the article is over the top, and wishful thinking by the author, BTW)


So, after Katrina in Gulfport, MS, here's what martial law was like:


1.  When the troops moved in, they took over and started ordering us around like cattle.  Offered to shoot us for even trying to ask 'em a question.  Rude and mean to everyone.  The skies were full of helicopters - felt like living in a MASH rerun.  Jeeps raced up and down my street at double the speed limit, nearly running me over if I stuck a toe in the road.  Nobody lifted a finger to help me clear the debris in my yard - in fact they were irritated that I dared set foot outside at all.


2.  They commandeered any resource that was left, for the powers that be.  They took over every airport, every gas station, every Walmart still standing, every hotel or restaurant that had a generator, jammed all the phone lines (and yes, folks, MINE STILL WORKED until the troops arrived, then suddenly it did not).  All that stuff was appropriated for whoever they deemed important - the county officials, the media, rubbernecking senators they flew in.  Woe unto you if you tried to get a drop of gas, a cold drink, or speak to anyone about why you could not - a gun gets stuck in your face.


3.  Curfew makes you feel like a little kid when its given by your parents.  It makes you feel like a criminal when its set by your government.  Yeah, they offered to shoot me because I forgot something in my car and tried to leave my house to go get it.  They had roadblocks on every corner.  I worked at a hospital nights and daily had to show my ID just to get to work and back.  People that didn't have a good reason to be out and about got turned back and threatened.  They roadblocked all the highway exits to our town and turned away anybody that came offering help - saying it wasn't needed.  Actually, they just weren't organized enough to accept donations or direct would-be heros where they could help - so they just turned them away, rudely.  If you wanted to leave town after Katrina, forget it - they had taken all the gas away and didn't want us on the roads.


4.  They sectioned off parts of our town with barbed wire and told us it was unsafe.  Sorry, I walked through it right after the storm and knew it was no worse than the rest of the town.  They threw residents that had survived the storm off their property and wouldn't let them come back without an armed escort and government permission.  Sometimes they bulldozed their houses flat before letting them come back into the protected zone.  All in the name of protecting them.


5.  The majority of the soliders raced around acting important.  Never saw any lift a finger to help anyone in any type of distress.  I guess their orders were to stand around and wait for more orders, while intimidating us (obviously that's what the confused, scared, and needful survivors required from their government?).  They also took over our local radio and had them tell us to just sit isolated in our houses and wait for help, and discouraged us from helping one another or traveling across town to help a friend.  Nobody ever knocked on our door and asked us if we needed anything - so if I'd obeyed orders and believed help was coming I would have waited until I died.  I suppose they wanted us to just sit there and die, so we'd be less hassle.


6.  The only help we received were from average citizens brave enough to argue their way through the military road blocks. Not the government.  Their function was to take over, snatch whatever comforts still existed, and isolate and scare us.


I was shocked I could be treated the way I was on American soil, and I realized it can happen anywhere to anyone, if and when the powers that be decide to take over an area for whatever reason they deem necessary.  I suddenly realized this happens all over the world in wartime, when our troops move in to occupy their country - and I realized I felt like those people must have felt at the sight of the soldiers.  Most people just don't think it can happen here - well trust me, it can and it does.  Maybe next time, in your neighborhood.


I've already experienced martial law on American soil

(I think the article is over the top, and wishful thinking by the author, BTW)


So, after Katrina in Gulfport, MS, here's what martial law was like:


1.  When the troops moved in, they took over and started ordering us around like cattle.  Offered to shoot us for even trying to ask 'em a question.  Rude and mean to everyone.  The skies were full of helicopters - felt like living in a MASH rerun.  Jeeps raced up and down my street at double the speed limit, nearly running me over if I stuck a toe in the road.  Nobody lifted a finger to help me clear the debris in my yard - in fact they were irritated that I dared set foot outside at all.


2.  They commandeered any resource that was left, for the powers that be.  They took over every airport, every gas station, every Walmart still standing, every hotel or restaurant that had a generator, jammed all the phone lines (and yes, folks, MINE STILL WORKED until the troops arrived, then suddenly it did not).  All that stuff was appropriated for whoever they deemed important - the county officials, the media, rubbernecking senators they flew in.  Woe unto you if you tried to get a drop of gas, a cold drink, or speak to anyone about why you could not - a gun gets stuck in your face.


3.  Curfew makes you feel like a little kid when its given by your parents.  It makes you feel like a criminal when its set by your government.  Yeah, they offered to shoot me because I forgot something in my car and tried to leave my house to go get it.  They had roadblocks on every corner.  I worked at a hospital nights and daily had to show my ID just to get to work and back.  People that didn't have a good reason to be out and about got turned back and threatened.  They roadblocked all the highway exits to our town and turned away anybody that came offering help - saying it wasn't needed.  Actually, they just weren't organized enough to accept donations or direct would-be heros where they could help - so they just turned them away, rudely.  If you wanted to leave town after Katrina, forget it - they had taken all the gas away and didn't want us on the roads.


4.  They sectioned off parts of our town with barbed wire and told us it was unsafe.  Sorry, I walked through it right after the storm and knew it was no worse than the rest of the town.  They threw residents that had survived the storm off their property and wouldn't let them come back without an armed escort and government permission.  Sometimes they bulldozed their houses flat before letting them come back into the protected zone.  All in the name of protecting them.


5.  The majority of the soliders raced around acting important.  Never saw any lift a finger to help anyone in any type of distress.  I guess their orders were to stand around and wait for more orders, while intimidating us (obviously that's what the confused, scared, and needful survivors required from their government?).  They also took over our local radio and had them tell us to just sit isolated in our houses and wait for help, and discouraged us from helping one another or traveling across town to help a friend.  Nobody ever knocked on our door and asked us if we needed anything - so if I'd obeyed orders and believed help was coming I would have waited until I died.  I suppose they wanted us to just sit there and die, so we'd be less hassle.


6.  The only help we received were from average citizens brave enough to argue their way through the military road blocks. Not the government.  Their function was to take over, snatch whatever comforts still existed, and isolate and scare us.


I was shocked I could be treated the way I was on American soil, and I realized it can happen anywhere to anyone, if and when the powers that be decide to take over an area for whatever reason they deem necessary.  I suddenly realized this happens all over the world in wartime, when our troops move in to occupy their country - and I realized I felt like those people must have felt at the sight of the soldiers.  Most people just don't think it can happen here - well trust me, it can and it does.  Maybe next time, in your neighborhood.


I've already experienced martial law on American soil

(I think the article is over the top, and wishful thinking by the author, BTW)


So, after Katrina in Gulfport, MS, here's what martial law was like:


1.  When the troops moved in, they took over and started ordering us around like cattle.  Offered to shoot us for even trying to ask 'em a question.  Rude and mean to everyone.  The skies were full of helicopters - felt like living in a MASH rerun.  Jeeps raced up and down my street at double the speed limit, nearly running me over if I stuck a toe in the road.  Nobody lifted a finger to help me clear the debris in my yard - in fact they were irritated that I dared set foot outside at all.


2.  They commandeered any resource that was left, for the powers that be.  They took over every airport, every gas station, every Walmart still standing, every hotel or restaurant that had a generator, jammed all the phone lines (and yes, folks, MINE STILL WORKED until the troops arrived, then suddenly it did not).  All that stuff was appropriated for whoever they deemed important - the county officials, the media, rubbernecking senators they flew in.  Woe unto you if you tried to get a drop of gas, a cold drink, or speak to anyone about why you could not - a gun gets stuck in your face.


3.  Curfew makes you feel like a little kid when its given by your parents.  It makes you feel like a criminal when its set by your government.  Yeah, they offered to shoot me because I forgot something in my car and tried to leave my house to go get it.  They had roadblocks on every corner.  I worked at a hospital nights and daily had to show my ID just to get to work and back.  People that didn't have a good reason to be out and about got turned back and threatened.  They roadblocked all the highway exits to our town and turned away anybody that came offering help - saying it wasn't needed.  Actually, they just weren't organized enough to accept donations or direct would-be heros where they could help - so they just turned them away, rudely.  If you wanted to leave town after Katrina, forget it - they had taken all the gas away and didn't want us on the roads.


4.  They sectioned off parts of our town with barbed wire and told us it was unsafe.  Sorry, I walked through it right after the storm and knew it was no worse than the rest of the town.  They threw residents that had survived the storm off their property and wouldn't let them come back without an armed escort and government permission.  Sometimes they bulldozed their houses flat before letting them come back into the protected zone.  All in the name of protecting them.


5.  The majority of the soliders raced around acting important.  Never saw any lift a finger to help anyone in any type of distress.  I guess their orders were to stand around and wait for more orders, while intimidating us (obviously that's what the confused, scared, and needful survivors required from their government?).  They also took over our local radio and had them tell us to just sit isolated in our houses and wait for help, and discouraged us from helping one another or traveling across town to help a friend.  Nobody ever knocked on our door and asked us if we needed anything - so if I'd obeyed orders and believed help was coming I would have waited until I died.  I suppose they wanted us to just sit there and die, so we'd be less hassle.


6.  The only help we received were from average citizens brave enough to argue their way through the military road blocks. Not the government.  Their function was to take over, snatch whatever comforts still existed, and isolate and scare us.


I was shocked I could be treated the way I was on American soil, and I realized it can happen anywhere to anyone, if and when the powers that be decide to take over an area for whatever reason they deem necessary.  I suddenly realized this happens all over the world in wartime, when our troops move in to occupy their country - and I realized I felt like those people must have felt at the sight of the soldiers.  Most people just don't think it can happen here - well trust me, it can and it does.  Maybe next time, in your neighborhood.


You know....if we actually stopped

and looked at all the money these politicians spend on travel and other expenses that we the taxpayers pay for......we would want to beat them all with a baseball bat. Then you have people like Gore talking about global warming and then jumping on his personal jet and flying away.... LOL!  So for them to go after Palin like that is just ridiculous.  At least she is giving the clothes the RNC bought to charity when she is done.  Not like Palin is a millionaire like McCain, Obamarama, and sticks foot in mouth often Biden.  As for her family flying on taxpayers expense....they fly commercial airlines and not by personal jet.  Remember....she is the one that sold the personal jet Alaska had for the previous governor because it was wasteful. 


I'm so tired of people ragging on Palin on the time.  There are many flaws that the other candidates have as well.  Rag on them for a while.  If you are going to tear the candidates apart....at least tear them all apart and not just one.


You should have stopped with your
of you post is pure incomprehensible babble. Just accept the facts.
That has never stopped anyone here from
They keep whining about the same old s**t over and over. Even when a subject is talked out ad infinitum...
You should have stopped at *I blame.* sm
Figures that someone giving a pep talk would turn you off.  Might take the edge off that HATRED and RAGE.  You are beginning to look more and more like the crowds who are looting, raping and shooting, out of control, full of a sense of entitlement and more than a little full of hysterical rage. 
It's too bad you stopped reading...sm
Sam brings up valid, positive points, and those on the left turn her off, rather than listen to the truth, because it comes from her.

She isn't bitter at all. It always sounds like the left is, when dealing with her, rather than listen to the truth, even when you expounded so much on the facts. If the facts bear up the right, they must not be facts, are therefore ignored.



McCain DID do something...he stopped...
politicking and went back to Washington to do the job the American taxpayers are paying him for, as a sitting senator (both he and Obama are still sitting senators). I would think Obama would want to know FIRST HAND what is going on and not get his info from pings on his blackberry. I would think he would want to be in the thick of this, considering the economy is on the brink of failure. A debate can wait a few days. Can the economy? This whole thing seems pretty silly to me. It looks to me like McCain his his priorities in order.
Of course and isn't it about time it stopped? n/m
x
WC stopped when she was pregnant -
at least that is what I remembered hearing on TV.
You should have stopped at Not Tolerant. Period.
/
If you had stopped at stating it was from Newsmax...
and not followed that with conservative propaganda in the body of your post...obviously said in an effort to discredit whatever was in the article. I can read between the lines, as can other posters, right and left, I feel sure.
Stopped believing in the boogey man when I was 5.
x
Definately time it stopped
Unfortunately, no matter who wins, it's not going to any time soon. Obama would tax those companies to death, so they would move out of the country anyway, while McCain would help them pack. "God have mercy is correct," 'cause we're screwed either way.

And what credible plots were stopped by
Please give one plausible, legitimate terrorist plot targeting our nation that was stopped by his policies.


Maybe if you stopped yawning, you could actually learn
@@
You misunderstand. I don't want this thing to be stopped.
Once this train gets going, it won't be stopped where the loony liberals imagine it will stop. It will go all the way to the end of the line, and that is a prospect that positively fills me with joy because it will take a lot of slimeball Democrats like Obama, Pelosi, Reid and others down with it. You know - the co-conspirators and the liars.

You're the ones who had better act fast. Last time I heard, you guys had an awful lot of criminals to go after. We'll start with Feinstein and her most recent financial corruption and work our way back.

Bring it on, and let's really clean house!
You remind me why I stopped voting democrat....(nm)
.
maybe they just stopped writing that calendar at that point
because it seemed like a good place to stop. I mean, they had to stop at some point, right?
even brittany stopped giving interviews
She is under no obligation to stay in the spotlight and should decline all further interviews. seriously.
Unfortunately, many politicians stopped caring a looong
xx
good point.....this one bans if you don't agree with them....or maybe this has stopped since the
.
We stopped reading your posts a long time ago!


McCain just stopped talking to reporters when he got the nomination
But in the middle of the summer, the McCain campaign took a series of steps that appeared on their face to be at odds with the candidate’s gold-plated brand. In the interest of greater message discipline, his advisers eliminated his running back-of-the-bus (or front-of-the-plane) bullshit sessions with reporters. And they turned sharply negative in their approach to Obama, hammering him with a series of ads—seen by some as trivial and trivializing, by others as racially coded, and eventually by most as unexpectedly effective—focused on his status as a celebrity unqualified to be commander-in-chief.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=109x34923
Who honestly cares, as long as the terrorist threat was stopped. sm
Until all of you stop your Bush rabid hatred, the terrorist threat is not only lost on you, you look for something more sinister and it all has to point to Bush.  This is really disturbing.
Bush aides challenge Biden's boasts of Bush slapdowns.
Aides to former President George W. Bush are challenging the veracity of Vice President Joe Biden's claim this week of having privately castigated Bush, who does not remember the incident or an earlier episode in which Biden claims to have similarly rebuked Bush.

Biden spokesman Jay Carney declined to specify the dates of his boss's purported Oval Office scoldings of Bush. Nor would he provide witnesses or notes to corroborate the episodes.

"The vice president stands by his remarks," Carney told FOX News without elaboration.
Those remarks include a shot that Biden took at Bush on Tuesday.

"I remember President Bush saying to me one time in the Oval Office," Biden told CNN, "'Well, Joe,' he said, 'I'm a leader.' And I said: 'Mr. President, turn and around look behind you. No one is following.'"

That exchange never took place, according to numerous Bush aides who also dispute a similar assertion by Biden in 2004, when the former senator from Delaware told scores of Democratic colleagues that he had challenged Bush's moral certitude about the Iraq war during a private meeting in the Oval Office. Two years later, Biden repeated his story about dressing down the president.

"When I speak to the president - and I have had plenty of opportunity to be with the president, at least prior to the last election, a lot of hours alone with him. I mean, meaning me and his staff," Biden said on HBO's "Real Time with Bill Maher" in April 2006. "And the president will say things to me, and I'll literally turn to the president, say: 'Mr. President, how can you say that, knowing you don't know the facts?' And he'll look at me and he'll say - my word - he'll look at me and he'll say: 'My instincts.' He said: 'I have good instincts.' I said: 'Mr. President, your instincts aren't good enough.'"

Bush aides now dispute the veracity of both assertions by Biden.

"I never recall Biden saying any of that," former White House press secretary Ari Fleischer said after reviewing detailed notes of Bush's White House meetings with Biden, which include numerous direct quotes from Biden. "I find it odd that he said he met with him alone all the time. I don't think that's true."

Fleischer said that whenever Bush met with Sen. Biden, the meeting also included a congressional counterpart so as to not "antagonize" the House.

Karl Rove, former White House political adviser, also was skeptical of Biden's claim to have spent "a lot of hours alone" with Bush.

"I remember checking on such a Biden exaggeration while at the White House and no one witnessed the meeting and his comments in remotely the same way," Rove said.

Candida P. Wolff, Bush's White House liaison to Capitol Hill, said the only meetings she remembered between Bush and Biden also included other lawmakers. She said such meetings were held in the Cabinet Room or the Eisenhower Executive Office Building, not the Oval Office, and certainly did not last for "hours."

"The president would never sit through two hours of Joe Biden," Wolff said. "I don't ever remember Biden being in the Oval. He was such a blowhard on all that stuff - there wasn't a reason to bring him in."

Andy Card, former White House chief of staff, reviewed the two Biden claims and said: "This does not ring true to me. I doubt that it happened."

A spokesman for Bush declined comment, although a person close to the former president said Bush does not remember either episode.

This is not the first time the veracity of Biden's assertions has been challenged. In 1988, he dropped out of the presidential race after being accused of plagiarizing British Labor Party leader Neil Kinnock. The Washington Post also cited "the senator's boastful exaggerations of his academic record."

Last year, liberal Slate magazine recalled that "Biden's misdeeds encompassed numerous self-aggrandizing thefts, misstatements, and exaggerations that seemed to point to a serious character defect."

Also last year, Biden came under fire for telling a questionable story about being "shot at" in Iraq.

"Let's start telling the truth," Biden said during a presidential primary debate sponsored by YouTube in July. "Number one, you take all the troops out -- you better have helicopters ready to take those 3,000 civilians inside the Green Zone, where I have been seven times and shot at. You better make sure you have protection for them, or let them die."

But when questioned about the episode afterward by the Hill newspaper, Biden backpedaled from his claim of being "shot at" and instead allowed: "I was near where a shot landed."

Biden went on to say that some sort of projectile "landed" outside a building in the Green Zone where he and another senator had spent the night during a visit in December 2005. The lawmakers were shaving in the morning when they felt the building shake, Biden said.

"No one got up and ran from the room-it wasn't that kind of thing," he told the Hill. "It's not like I had someone holding a gun to my head."

Seven weeks after claiming to have been "shot at" in Iraq, Biden again raised eyebrows with another story about his exploits in war zones -- this time on "the superhighway of terror between Pakistan and Afghanistan, where my helicopter was forced down."

"If you want to know where AL Qaeda lives, you want to know where bin Laden is, come back to Afghanistan with me," Biden bragged to the National Guard Association. "Come back to the area where my helicopter was forced down, with a three-star general and three senators at 10,500 feet in the middle of those mountains. I can tell you where they are."

But it turns out that inclement weather, not terrorists, prompted the chopper to land in an open field during Biden's visit to Afghanistan in February 2008. Fighter jets kept watch overhead while a convoy of security vehicles was dispatched to retrieve Biden and fellow Sens. Chuck Hagel and John Kerry.

"We were going to send Biden out to fight the Taliban with snowballs, but we didn't have to," joked Kerry, a Democrat, to the AP. "Other than getting a little cold, it was fine."
Bush aides challenge Biden's boasts of Bush slapdowns.
Aides to former President George W. Bush are challenging the veracity of Vice President Joe Biden's claim this week of having privately castigated Bush, who does not remember the incident or an earlier episode in which Biden claims to have similarly rebuked Bush.

Biden spokesman Jay Carney declined to specify the dates of his boss's purported Oval Office scoldings of Bush. Nor would he provide witnesses or notes to corroborate the episodes.

"The vice president stands by his remarks," Carney told FOX News without elaboration.
Those remarks include a shot that Biden took at Bush on Tuesday.

"I remember President Bush saying to me one time in the Oval Office," Biden told CNN, "'Well, Joe,' he said, 'I'm a leader.' And I said: 'Mr. President, turn and around look behind you. No one is following.'"

That exchange never took place, according to numerous Bush aides who also dispute a similar assertion by Biden in 2004, when the former senator from Delaware told scores of Democratic colleagues that he had challenged Bush's moral certitude about the Iraq war during a private meeting in the Oval Office. Two years later, Biden repeated his story about dressing down the president.

"When I speak to the president - and I have had plenty of opportunity to be with the president, at least prior to the last election, a lot of hours alone with him. I mean, meaning me and his staff," Biden said on HBO's "Real Time with Bill Maher" in April 2006. "And the president will say things to me, and I'll literally turn to the president, say: 'Mr. President, how can you say that, knowing you don't know the facts?' And he'll look at me and he'll say - my word - he'll look at me and he'll say: 'My instincts.' He said: 'I have good instincts.' I said: 'Mr. President, your instincts aren't good enough.'"

Bush aides now dispute the veracity of both assertions by Biden.

"I never recall Biden saying any of that," former White House press secretary Ari Fleischer said after reviewing detailed notes of Bush's White House meetings with Biden, which include numerous direct quotes from Biden. "I find it odd that he said he met with him alone all the time. I don't think that's true."

Fleischer said that whenever Bush met with Sen. Biden, the meeting also included a congressional counterpart so as to not "antagonize" the House.

Karl Rove, former White House political adviser, also was skeptical of Biden's claim to have spent "a lot of hours alone" with Bush.

"I remember checking on such a Biden exaggeration while at the White House and no one witnessed the meeting and his comments in remotely the same way," Rove said.

Candida P. Wolff, Bush's White House liaison to Capitol Hill, said the only meetings she remembered between Bush and Biden also included other lawmakers. She said such meetings were held in the Cabinet Room or the Eisenhower Executive Office Building, not the Oval Office, and certainly did not last for "hours."

"The president would never sit through two hours of Joe Biden," Wolff said. "I don't ever remember Biden being in the Oval. He was such a blowhard on all that stuff - there wasn't a reason to bring him in."

Andy Card, former White House chief of staff, reviewed the two Biden claims and said: "This does not ring true to me. I doubt that it happened."

A spokesman for Bush declined comment, although a person close to the former president said Bush does not remember either episode.

This is not the first time the veracity of Biden's assertions has been challenged. In 1988, he dropped out of the presidential race after being accused of plagiarizing British Labor Party leader Neil Kinnock. The Washington Post also cited "the senator's boastful exaggerations of his academic record."

Last year, liberal Slate magazine recalled that "Biden's misdeeds encompassed numerous self-aggrandizing thefts, misstatements, and exaggerations that seemed to point to a serious character defect."

Also last year, Biden came under fire for telling a questionable story about being "shot at" in Iraq.

"Let's start telling the truth," Biden said during a presidential primary debate sponsored by YouTube in July. "Number one, you take all the troops out -- you better have helicopters ready to take those 3,000 civilians inside the Green Zone, where I have been seven times and shot at. You better make sure you have protection for them, or let them die."

But when questioned about the episode afterward by the Hill newspaper, Biden backpedaled from his claim of being "shot at" and instead allowed: "I was near where a shot landed."

Biden went on to say that some sort of projectile "landed" outside a building in the Green Zone where he and another senator had spent the night during a visit in December 2005. The lawmakers were shaving in the morning when they felt the building shake, Biden said.

"No one got up and ran from the room-it wasn't that kind of thing," he told the Hill. "It's not like I had someone holding a gun to my head."

Seven weeks after claiming to have been "shot at" in Iraq, Biden again raised eyebrows with another story about his exploits in war zones -- this time on "the superhighway of terror between Pakistan and Afghanistan, where my helicopter was forced down."

"If you want to know where AL Qaeda lives, you want to know where bin Laden is, come back to Afghanistan with me," Biden bragged to the National Guard Association. "Come back to the area where my helicopter was forced down, with a three-star general and three senators at 10,500 feet in the middle of those mountains. I can tell you where they are."

But it turns out that inclement weather, not terrorists, prompted the chopper to land in an open field during Biden's visit to Afghanistan in February 2008. Fighter jets kept watch overhead while a convoy of security vehicles was dispatched to retrieve Biden and fellow Sens. Chuck Hagel and John Kerry.

"We were going to send Biden out to fight the Taliban with snowballs, but we didn't have to," joked Kerry, a Democrat, to the AP. "Other than getting a little cold, it was fine."
Bush aides challenge Biden's boasts of Bush slapdowns.
Aides to former President George W. Bush are challenging the veracity of Vice President Joe Biden's claim this week of having privately castigated Bush, who does not remember the incident or an earlier episode in which Biden claims to have similarly rebuked Bush.

Biden spokesman Jay Carney declined to specify the dates of his boss's purported Oval Office scoldings of Bush. Nor would he provide witnesses or notes to corroborate the episodes.

"The vice president stands by his remarks," Carney told FOX News without elaboration.
Those remarks include a shot that Biden took at Bush on Tuesday.

"I remember President Bush saying to me one time in the Oval Office," Biden told CNN, "'Well, Joe,' he said, 'I'm a leader.' And I said: 'Mr. President, turn and around look behind you. No one is following.'"

That exchange never took place, according to numerous Bush aides who also dispute a similar assertion by Biden in 2004, when the former senator from Delaware told scores of Democratic colleagues that he had challenged Bush's moral certitude about the Iraq war during a private meeting in the Oval Office. Two years later, Biden repeated his story about dressing down the president.

"When I speak to the president - and I have had plenty of opportunity to be with the president, at least prior to the last election, a lot of hours alone with him. I mean, meaning me and his staff," Biden said on HBO's "Real Time with Bill Maher" in April 2006. "And the president will say things to me, and I'll literally turn to the president, say: 'Mr. President, how can you say that, knowing you don't know the facts?' And he'll look at me and he'll say - my word - he'll look at me and he'll say: 'My instincts.' He said: 'I have good instincts.' I said: 'Mr. President, your instincts aren't good enough.'"

Bush aides now dispute the veracity of both assertions by Biden.

"I never recall Biden saying any of that," former White House press secretary Ari Fleischer said after reviewing detailed notes of Bush's White House meetings with Biden, which include numerous direct quotes from Biden. "I find it odd that he said he met with him alone all the time. I don't think that's true."

Fleischer said that whenever Bush met with Sen. Biden, the meeting also included a congressional counterpart so as to not "antagonize" the House.

Karl Rove, former White House political adviser, also was skeptical of Biden's claim to have spent "a lot of hours alone" with Bush.

"I remember checking on such a Biden exaggeration while at the White House and no one witnessed the meeting and his comments in remotely the same way," Rove said.

Candida P. Wolff, Bush's White House liaison to Capitol Hill, said the only meetings she remembered between Bush and Biden also included other lawmakers. She said such meetings were held in the Cabinet Room or the Eisenhower Executive Office Building, not the Oval Office, and certainly did not last for "hours."

"The president would never sit through two hours of Joe Biden," Wolff said. "I don't ever remember Biden being in the Oval. He was such a blowhard on all that stuff - there wasn't a reason to bring him in."

Andy Card, former White House chief of staff, reviewed the two Biden claims and said: "This does not ring true to me. I doubt that it happened."

A spokesman for Bush declined comment, although a person close to the former president said Bush does not remember either episode.

This is not the first time the veracity of Biden's assertions has been challenged. In 1988, he dropped out of the presidential race after being accused of plagiarizing British Labor Party leader Neil Kinnock. The Washington Post also cited "the senator's boastful exaggerations of his academic record."

Last year, liberal Slate magazine recalled that "Biden's misdeeds encompassed numerous self-aggrandizing thefts, misstatements, and exaggerations that seemed to point to a serious character defect."

Also last year, Biden came under fire for telling a questionable story about being "shot at" in Iraq.

"Let's start telling the truth," Biden said during a presidential primary debate sponsored by YouTube in July. "Number one, you take all the troops out -- you better have helicopters ready to take those 3,000 civilians inside the Green Zone, where I have been seven times and shot at. You better make sure you have protection for them, or let them die."

But when questioned about the episode afterward by the Hill newspaper, Biden backpedaled from his claim of being "shot at" and instead allowed: "I was near where a shot landed."

Biden went on to say that some sort of projectile "landed" outside a building in the Green Zone where he and another senator had spent the night during a visit in December 2005. The lawmakers were shaving in the morning when they felt the building shake, Biden said.

"No one got up and ran from the room-it wasn't that kind of thing," he told the Hill. "It's not like I had someone holding a gun to my head."

Seven weeks after claiming to have been "shot at" in Iraq, Biden again raised eyebrows with another story about his exploits in war zones -- this time on "the superhighway of terror between Pakistan and Afghanistan, where my helicopter was forced down."

"If you want to know where AL Qaeda lives, you want to know where bin Laden is, come back to Afghanistan with me," Biden bragged to the National Guard Association. "Come back to the area where my helicopter was forced down, with a three-star general and three senators at 10,500 feet in the middle of those mountains. I can tell you where they are."

But it turns out that inclement weather, not terrorists, prompted the chopper to land in an open field during Biden's visit to Afghanistan in February 2008. Fighter jets kept watch overhead while a convoy of security vehicles was dispatched to retrieve Biden and fellow Sens. Chuck Hagel and John Kerry.

"We were going to send Biden out to fight the Taliban with snowballs, but we didn't have to," joked Kerry, a Democrat, to the AP. "Other than getting a little cold, it was fine."
Bush aides challenge Biden's boasts of Bush slapdowns.
Aides to former President George W. Bush are challenging the veracity of Vice President Joe Biden's claim this week of having privately castigated Bush, who does not remember the incident or an earlier episode in which Biden claims to have similarly rebuked Bush.

Biden spokesman Jay Carney declined to specify the dates of his boss's purported Oval Office scoldings of Bush. Nor would he provide witnesses or notes to corroborate the episodes.

"The vice president stands by his remarks," Carney told FOX News without elaboration.
Those remarks include a shot that Biden took at Bush on Tuesday.

"I remember President Bush saying to me one time in the Oval Office," Biden told CNN, "'Well, Joe,' he said, 'I'm a leader.' And I said: 'Mr. President, turn and around look behind you. No one is following.'"

That exchange never took place, according to numerous Bush aides who also dispute a similar assertion by Biden in 2004, when the former senator from Delaware told scores of Democratic colleagues that he had challenged Bush's moral certitude about the Iraq war during a private meeting in the Oval Office. Two years later, Biden repeated his story about dressing down the president.

"When I speak to the president - and I have had plenty of opportunity to be with the president, at least prior to the last election, a lot of hours alone with him. I mean, meaning me and his staff," Biden said on HBO's "Real Time with Bill Maher" in April 2006. "And the president will say things to me, and I'll literally turn to the president, say: 'Mr. President, how can you say that, knowing you don't know the facts?' And he'll look at me and he'll say - my word - he'll look at me and he'll say: 'My instincts.' He said: 'I have good instincts.' I said: 'Mr. President, your instincts aren't good enough.'"

Bush aides now dispute the veracity of both assertions by Biden.

"I never recall Biden saying any of that," former White House press secretary Ari Fleischer said after reviewing detailed notes of Bush's White House meetings with Biden, which include numerous direct quotes from Biden. "I find it odd that he said he met with him alone all the time. I don't think that's true."

Fleischer said that whenever Bush met with Sen. Biden, the meeting also included a congressional counterpart so as to not "antagonize" the House.

Karl Rove, former White House political adviser, also was skeptical of Biden's claim to have spent "a lot of hours alone" with Bush.

"I remember checking on such a Biden exaggeration while at the White House and no one witnessed the meeting and his comments in remotely the same way," Rove said.

Candida P. Wolff, Bush's White House liaison to Capitol Hill, said the only meetings she remembered between Bush and Biden also included other lawmakers. She said such meetings were held in the Cabinet Room or the Eisenhower Executive Office Building, not the Oval Office, and certainly did not last for "hours."

"The president would never sit through two hours of Joe Biden," Wolff said. "I don't ever remember Biden being in the Oval. He was such a blowhard on all that stuff - there wasn't a reason to bring him in."

Andy Card, former White House chief of staff, reviewed the two Biden claims and said: "This does not ring true to me. I doubt that it happened."

A spokesman for Bush declined comment, although a person close to the former president said Bush does not remember either episode.

This is not the first time the veracity of Biden's assertions has been challenged. In 1988, he dropped out of the presidential race after being accused of plagiarizing British Labor Party leader Neil Kinnock. The Washington Post also cited "the senator's boastful exaggerations of his academic record."

Last year, liberal Slate magazine recalled that "Biden's misdeeds encompassed numerous self-aggrandizing thefts, misstatements, and exaggerations that seemed to point to a serious character defect."

Also last year, Biden came under fire for telling a questionable story about being "shot at" in Iraq.

"Let's start telling the truth," Biden said during a presidential primary debate sponsored by YouTube in July. "Number one, you take all the troops out -- you better have helicopters ready to take those 3,000 civilians inside the Green Zone, where I have been seven times and shot at. You better make sure you have protection for them, or let them die."

But when questioned about the episode afterward by the Hill newspaper, Biden backpedaled from his claim of being "shot at" and instead allowed: "I was near where a shot landed."

Biden went on to say that some sort of projectile "landed" outside a building in the Green Zone where he and another senator had spent the night during a visit in December 2005. The lawmakers were shaving in the morning when they felt the building shake, Biden said.

"No one got up and ran from the room-it wasn't that kind of thing," he told the Hill. "It's not like I had someone holding a gun to my head."

Seven weeks after claiming to have been "shot at" in Iraq, Biden again raised eyebrows with another story about his exploits in war zones -- this time on "the superhighway of terror between Pakistan and Afghanistan, where my helicopter was forced down."

"If you want to know where AL Qaeda lives, you want to know where bin Laden is, come back to Afghanistan with me," Biden bragged to the National Guard Association. "Come back to the area where my helicopter was forced down, with a three-star general and three senators at 10,500 feet in the middle of those mountains. I can tell you where they are."

But it turns out that inclement weather, not terrorists, prompted the chopper to land in an open field during Biden's visit to Afghanistan in February 2008. Fighter jets kept watch overhead while a convoy of security vehicles was dispatched to retrieve Biden and fellow Sens. Chuck Hagel and John Kerry.

"We were going to send Biden out to fight the Taliban with snowballs, but we didn't have to," joked Kerry, a Democrat, to the AP. "Other than getting a little cold, it was fine."
Yeah right. Served under Reagan, Bush I and Bush II
x
Stop bringing up Bush - this post was not about Bush
I even said we have had some good presidents and some bad ones, but this post was not about Bush. It was about Obama. Yes Bush was one of the worst presidents I'm not arguing with you on that one, but everytime anyone brings up something about our current president they are shot back with Bush this or Bush that and on things that have nothing to do with what the current topic is about. Again, this was not about Bush. It was about Obama.
Oh, more "blame Bush" - except Bush didn't send these out, now did he?
Here's a news flash for you since you apparently haven't heard: BUSH IS NOT IN OFFICE and just today Gallup did a poll showing that THE MAJORITY OF AMERICANS THINK OBAMA SHOULD START TAKING RESPONSIBILITY FOR WHAT HAPPENS ON HIS WATCH.

G E T A C L U E.
Bush is gone, YEA!!! and yeah, it could darn well be Bush! LOL.
Chimp boy!! But, the cartoon is NOT about Bush, now is it?  Give me a break. 
George Bush HIMSELF makes it so easy to make fun of George Bush!!!! oh where would I start, so litt
nm
Yes, Bush and Bush alone did this whole mess all my himself
Your speaking as though nobody else had a hand in this, just Bush nobody else. Last I knew we had a democratic congress and they are the ones who got us into this mess. Time to put fault where it belongs - congress. Bush is only a talking head.
Bush....they will still blame Bush.
nm
Corporation owned media does not bash Bush, they bash those that bash Bush.sm
Google Bush and vote fraud and there is tons of information about how many Americans 'voted' for Bush. Poor us and poor troops.
bush says....
bush says we are safer cause of our Iraq war..No way..we have created a culture of American haters.a culture of terrorists against America due to this so wrong war..hopefully the Downing Street Memo and the people now realizing we have sacrified too much will be the downfall for the warmonger in the White House..
Bush
He is shrub, chimp boy and many other names I cant post here but which I call him at home and among friends..oh yeah, dufus, jerk, imbecile...
As soon as Bush went from

"Anyone in my office involved with a leak will be fired" to "Anyone who is found guilty of leaking," I figured he had a handle on what the decision is going to be by the special prosecutor, who, incidentally, was appointed by BUSH.


I guess time will tell if justice truly does prevail.


Bush makes Nixon look like a choir boy.


Bush's oil? sm
Well, you all have blamed Bush for everything except original sin.  I guess that is next. Thank the environmentalists partly for the mess we are in with oil. And stop deifying Chavez.  He is not a good person.
No, Bush, you certainly are no FDR!
No One Can Say They Didn't See It Coming
    By Sidney Blumenthal
    Salon.com

    Wednesday 31 August 2005


In 2001, FEMA warned that a hurricane striking New Orleans was one of the three most likely disasters in the U.S. But the Bush administration cut New Orleans flood control funding by 44 percent to pay for the Iraq war.


















A New Orleans resident waded through floodwaters coated with a fine layer of oil in the flooded downtown area on Tuesday, August 30, 2005.
    Biblical in its uncontrolled rage and scope, Hurricane Katrina has left millions of Americans to scavenge for food and shelter and hundreds to thousands reportedly dead. With its main levee broken, the evacuated city of New Orleans has become part of the Gulf of Mexico. But the damage wrought by the hurricane may not entirely be the result of an act of nature.


    A year ago the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers proposed to study how New Orleans could be protected from a catastrophic hurricane, but the Bush administration ordered that the research not be undertaken. After a flood killed six people in 1995, Congress created the Southeast Louisiana Urban Flood Control Project, in which the Corps of Engineers strengthened and renovated levees and pumping stations. In early 2001, the Federal Emergency Management Agency issued a report stating that a hurricane striking New Orleans was one of the three most likely disasters in the U.S., including a terrorist attack on New York City. But by 2003 the federal funding for the flood control project essentially dried up as it was drained into the Iraq war. In 2004, the Bush administration cut funding requested by the New Orleans district of the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers for holding back the waters of Lake Pontchartrain by more than 80 percent. Additional cuts at the beginning of this year (for a total reduction in funding of 44.2 percent since 2001) forced the New Orleans district of the Corps to impose a hiring freeze. The Senate had debated adding funds for fixing New Orleans' levees, but it was too late.


    The New Orleans Times-Picayune, which before the hurricane published a series on the federal funding problem, and whose presses are now underwater, reported online: No one can say they didn't see it coming ... Now in the wake of one of the worst storms ever, serious questions are being asked about the lack of preparation.


    The Bush administration's policy of turning over wetlands to developers almost certainly also contributed to the heightened level of the storm surge. In 1990, a federal task force began restoring lost wetlands surrounding New Orleans. Every two miles of wetland between the Crescent City and the Gulf reduces a surge by half a foot. Bush had promised no net loss of wetlands, a policy launched by his father's administration and bolstered by President Clinton. But he reversed his approach in 2003, unleashing the developers. The Army Corps of Engineers and the Environmental Protection Agency then announced they could no longer protect wetlands unless they were somehow related to interstate commerce.


    In response to this potential crisis, four leading environmental groups conducted a joint expert study, concluding in 2004 that without wetlands protection New Orleans could be devastated by an ordinary, much less a Category 4 or 5, hurricane. There's no way to describe how mindless a policy that is when it comes to wetlands protection, said one of the report's authors. The chairman of the White House's Council on Environmental Quality dismissed the study as highly questionable, and boasted, Everybody loves what we're doing.


    My administration's climate change policy will be science based, President Bush declared in June 2001. But in 2002, when the Environmental Protection Agency submitted a study on global warming to the United Nations reflecting its expert research, Bush derided it as a report put out by a bureaucracy, and excised the climate change assessment from the agency's annual report. The next year, when the EPA issued its first comprehensive Report on the Environment, stating, Climate change has global consequences for human health and the environment, the White House simply demanded removal of the line and all similar conclusions. At the G-8 meeting in Scotland this year, Bush successfully stymied any common action on global warming. Scientists, meanwhile, have continued to accumulate impressive data on the rising temperature of the oceans, which has produced more severe hurricanes.


    In February 2004, 60 of the nation's leading scientists, including 20 Nobel laureates, warned in a statement, Restoring Scientific Integrity in Policymaking: Successful application of science has played a large part in the policies that have made the United States of America the world's most powerful nation and its citizens increasingly prosperous and healthy ... Indeed, this principle has long been adhered to by presidents and administrations of both parties in forming and implementing policies. The administration of George W. Bush has, however, disregarded this principle ... The distortion of scientific knowledge for partisan political ends must cease. Bush completely ignored this statement.


    In the two weeks preceding the storm in the Gulf, the trumping of science by ideology and expertise by special interests accelerated. The Federal Drug Administration announced that it was postponing sale of the morning-after contraceptive pill, despite overwhelming scientific evidence of its safety and its approval by the FDA's scientific advisory board. The United Nations special envoy for HIV/AIDS in Africa accused the Bush administration of responsibility for a condom shortage in Uganda -- the result of the administration's evangelical Christian agenda of abstinence. When the chief of the Bureau of Justice Statistics in the Justice Department was ordered by the White House to delete its study that African-Americans and other minorities are subject to racial profiling in police traffic stops and he refused to buckle under, he was forced out of his job. When the Army Corps of Engineers' chief contracting oversight analyst objected to a $7 billion no-bid contract awarded for work in Iraq to Halliburton (the firm at which Vice President Cheney was formerly CEO), she was demoted despite her superior professional ratings. At the National Park Service, a former Cheney aide, a political appointee lacking professional background, drew up a plan to overturn past environmental practices and prohibit any mention of evolution while allowing sale of religious materials through the Park Service.


    On the day the levees burst in New Orleans, Bush delivered a speech in Colorado comparing the Iraq war to World War II and himself to Franklin D. Roosevelt: And he knew that the best way to bring peace and stability to the region was by bringing freedom to Japan. Bush had boarded his very own Streetcar Named Desire.

    --------

    Sidney Blumenthal, a former assistant and senior advisor to President Clinton and the author of The Clinton Wars, is writing a column for Salon and the Guardian of London.


Bush's war
We are going to deal with the homecoming veterans of Iraq, their mental and physical troubles, for decades to come.  I remember when I was a teenager, there was a man who lived down the street from my best friend where we all hung out..He would sit on his stoop.  We would go up to the fence and ask him questions..He was spaced out, shaking, stared into space..We, as punky kids, thought it was funny..Later I found out, he was suffering from *shell shock*, post traumatic stress disorder..FROM WWII..He had never recovered..This was in the 1960's and he still was suffering..OMG..I also have a friend who was in Vietnam and he has never been the same after he came home in 1969..These returning vets are gonna experience hell on earth and we along with them..This war did not have to happen..this was an unnecessary war..a war of convenience, of profit and we will pay the price..Not Bush or his cronies, they will be insulated, locked away in their gated communities counting their money..We the working and caring American people, both democrat and republican, will pay the price..The only difference is democrats will admit it, republicans will still try to make excuses for Bushs war.
What? Not Bush?
Nobel Peace Prize 2005: Venezuelan President Hugo
Chavez makes the final list

VHeadline commentarist Carlos Herrera writes: The
Nobel Commission for the Peace Prize has received 199
nominations including Colin Powell, the U2 singer Bono
and Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez.
It's Bush's

I wonder how much Bush (i.e. you and

me as TAXPAYERS) pays Faux News for its' *fair and balanced* reporting. 


Ya gotta laugh at the morons who actually BELIEVE this nitwit, though!


Bush
Is he president Bush or dictator Bush? How can he expect to form a democracy in Iraq when at the very same time tear ours apart? What message is his administration trying to send to the terrorist now? We must make sure this does not slide by and be forgiven, not this time, Mr. Bush has gotten away with so many lies and then said I made a mistake. He is like the boy who cried wolf. When we let him get away with this illegal spying, and not even in the least way seeking a legal solution for doing it over 4 years! This is not acceptable, this is the highest disgrace of all of his disgraces done to our country. This is one nation under God, not George Bush. My new name for him is King George because his mindset is that of a dictator not a president. We need to clean up our own democracy before go around setting examples for other countries to do the same.
Bush
We should all be thankful that Bush was re-elected, I cannot imagine Kerry as President of the U. S.  and now it looks like Hillary Clinton is going to run for President.  If anyone votes for her they would have to be nuts.  Cannot imagine getting Billy living back in the White House.  If Hillary cannot control her own husband, how is she going to run the U.S.???????