Sigh. They pay a higher percentage because they
Posted By: amass hundreds, and in some cases....sm on 2008-10-24
In Reply to: The rich dont deserve a tax cut? They already pay a - much higher percentage. Ignorance is sad.nm
thousands of times more wealth than each average Joe (and I DO NOT mean the plumber). We have a progressive tax system here, American as apple pie, and Obama only wants to adjust the rate back to where it was were 8 years ago....no socialist subversion in that. We all managed to survive the economic boom of the 90s, after all.
Furthermore, before pronoucing any judgements on this issue, check out the disparities in the (here comes that CAPITALIST phrase again) distibution of wealth in the US. If you do not want to research this yourself, just say so and I will post that information for the UMPTEENTH time.
Now, before you go off, Wikipedia is not the Communist Manifesto. Go to the link and scroll down a little better than halfway and read the section on the United States. If you are in the middle class, the information there will make your blood boil.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Distribution_of_wealth
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it's a lot higher percentage than McCain's - nm
x
The percentage I saw was not all that impressive...
considering his income, and for someone who so wants to spread the wealth. I understand that you are not concerned nor alarmed by him. That's fine. To each his own. But I am concerned and alarmed. I guess we leave it at that.
Equal percentage is right, I think....nm
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Start with yourself - did you donate and what percentage?
Bet that is a big no, and $0. Seeing as you're so into helping others who cannot because of no fault of their own.
I don't think anyone on this board ever said we should not help the handicapped who cannot help themselves. Most people here whether they are liberal or conservatives have compassion. It's the ones who can help themselves, who are physically and mentally able to get jobs but they won't because it's easier to sit at home and receive that welfare check. By all means I am not saying everyone on welfare can get a job, but there are a good percentage of those that can (and pay taxes to help those who can't), but why should they when they are getting it for free. And now it will be even easier for them to get something for nothing.
Not everybody is only out for ourselves and screw everyone else. I donate money to a charitable cause - an Indian reservation in Arizona to help provide food and water to them. I wish I could donate more or to more charities, but I'm a one-income three person family, and I send money to my family back east who are having a hard time, which leaves me with nothing left over. Do I want government to take more taxes from me - no way....let me decide for myself which charities I want to donate to.
Not sure what the beef is here. I do not agree that we all are out for only ourselves, but in these economic times and people out of work and losing everything, how can you expect them to want government to take more money out in taxes.
So, I may be misinterpreting this message. Are you for the government taxing us more, or are you just mad at GW and his administration and want to vent. While your venting you should vent about what the Clintons did on their way out to include taking everything not nailed down not only in the WH but also on Air Force One.
What percentage of homes are owned by
Does anyone have numbers?
If someone makes 100 mill a year, you think $20K earner should pay same percentage?
that's just kookoo
Minorities do make up a lopsided percentage of the prison population.
But just stating that as a fact which is self-evident pays no attention whatsoever to the root causes of minority tension in our nation, nor address the fact that rich people with their various crimes tend to be well-connected enough to keep their butts out of jail, thus disproportionately skewing the prison statistics. Many more reasons can be advanced to explain the sad state of America's penal system, but none of that matters in the subject at hand.
Bennett's conclusion (as a member of the wealthy, advataged and least-likely-to-go-to-prison-for-his-crimes club) is that mass genocide would solve our crime problems.
Don't you realize how frightening that is?
My guess is much higher.
I would say at least 100; 25 who can read, another 25 who can comprehend what they read; another 25 to articulate what the ones with reading comprehension can understand and try to express, and another 25 to type and proof, at least.
So much for no higher taxes of
any kind for 95% of the American people. This is just going to kill the people who are already struggling to make ends meet. Not to mention the high prices that will come if they get cap and trade passed. Why don't people in Washington get this? All they talk about are the sacrifices that we are all going to have to make and they do nothing but keep spending. Where is the sacrifice on their end, huh? We need to fix this economy and stop the constant spending by our government.
I'm so sick and tired of this. I work to make money and they are just going to take more and more of what I earn. I've always been responsible with my money and have excellent credit but how I am going to continue to make ends meet if this keeps up? It is pretty sad when responsible people are scared this will bring them down as well. I guess the rich will just have to pay for everything because there won't be a middle class left the rate things are going.
too many people = higher premiums?!
Wow, not that I want to spend all week talking about insurance, but I'm really amazed by things I'm hearing. The whole point of insurance is to lower your individual cost by adding in lots and lots of people. If you and I are the only ones who have insurance, and you have a heart attack, I'm effectively paying half your bill, right? But if we could average that bill over millions and millions of people, it'd be much easier to bear.
The ideal situation, then, would be for everybody in the country to have insurance, so we could average the costs over 300 million people. (This would also lead to a better ability to negotiate drug prices, and encourage hospitals not to spend millions on useless equipment like surgical robots that drive the costs skyward.)
Read Obama's plan, or Baucus', or Kennedy's, or Wyden's, and you'll find that people who can't afford even those new low premiums, are helped out with subsidies, NOT FINED. It's far, far cheaper to help subsidize poor people's premiums, than it is to have them show up to the ER for every cold and flu symptom, you know? Not to mention that they'll then be able to get preventative care, and not so many of them will wind up with horribly costly illnesses down the road, diabetes, heart disease, etc.
Affordable health care isn't just an easy fix, it's a moral one. And it has been tried a million times--I think Truman was actually the first president to suggest it. But you and I don't have the kind of lobbying money that big pharma has, that the doctors have, that every other player has, and they have worked for *decades* to keep Americans from getting the healthcare system they deserve.
you think only 3 have been tortured, I think the number is much higher....sm
That might be the reason that the former administration wanted to keep them forever imprisoned, so that they cannot talk!
Higher taxes are not my interest, neither is giving.
@
Anywhere in Scandinavia. Higher standard of living.
So you think you're exempt from higher taxes?
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yeah, of higher taxes for all -kind of change we can
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JTBB - If you find a higher-level forum where
intellect is respected and informed debate is possible, please post that info a time or 2. I'm looking for a spot like that myself and this sure ain't it.
Combined income or small business making 120,000 or higher
will be taxed big time instead of the 250,000. It could down lower to where anyone making 42,000 or higher will be taxed big time. He keeps changing his mind, but we will for sure see if he wins.
Posible new "boon" to the economy? Higher minimum wages??.....PSM
I was just thinking, we did a lot of discussion yesterday about welfare reform, the bloated welfare roles that we have now, and how to end it. How about passing a DECENT, HONEST, REALISTIC minimum wage act that is based on the present economy, the proposed future economay, and will make it more profitable for an American to get a fair-paying job on which he can feed his family, pay his REASONABLE mortgage, pay his bills, etc., instead of having the minimum wage so low that it is actually more profitable for many families to say on welfare, medicaide, and food stamps, along with subsidised housing AND NOT have to juggle three low-paying jobs to do it? Don't you think that if American workers felt they were more faily paid, were being compensated fairly for their efforts, and would bring home enough wages each week to live within comfortable means, that more and more folk would jump off the roles and into a job (of course, we first need the part of the stimulus package to address keeping our companies solvent and employing). Just a thought!!! 
sigh
Yada..yada..yada..yada..yada..
sigh
Big Enormous Sigh.....whatever
yes, sigh
Yeah..sigh..***heart feeling heavy, soul feeling so heavy***, knowing we cant bring our soldiers back who have died for nothing..***my whole being feeling so heavy***.
sigh
Too bad for you that you are so closed minded..sigh..I pray for you.
Sigh.... I know...
I hope it's something my grandchildren will be able to experience.
Sigh....
Wow, seems like I turned on your spigot of liberal hate.
Yes, I was trying to type doesn't (does not). For some reason, when I type an apostrophe it won't post half of the time hardly justifying the sermon you just preached to me.
You are a mean, hateful person, and I hope you find something more joyful to do than obsess about our president.
MERRY CHRISTMAS TO YOU...
Sigh....
Yes I know Rx drugs for pain are dispensed for pain and if one takes them as prescribed, one does not get a buzz. The medication acts as it was designed to act. If, however, the person begins to self medicate for whatever reasons, i.e. taking more than prescribed dosage for said pain, soon he will be feeling no pain, that is for sure. Soon he will be feeling good, so good in fact that he will continue on this course for as long as it works out for him. I will never agree that anyone and I mean ANYONE who becomes addicted to any substance did not have a choice in the matter. There comes a time when the addict has no more choices, but that comes much later in the disease process. They will tell you they didn't, they will lie, they will deny and be in denial...that is what addicts do...This is not a case of **when bad things happen to good people.** I disagree and I believe you are simplfying things when you try to separate the addicts based on the course of how they got there.
What in the world makes you think I am obsessed with politics. I don't come on this board for weeks at a time. I have become increasingly frightened these last 6 years as I have watched our country change for the worse but I am not obsessed wtih politics.
My gratitude list, they are all on it...the right-wing screamers that is. You don't get it??? It works for me and that is all that matters because it is my list.
I appreciate prayers from anyone anytime so you guys go right on ahead and pray for me. I would never turn away prayer. Thanks.
I have gone to a **dark place.** YIKES, and I didn't even know it. You have a sore spot about abortion, stem cells, etc., for personal reasons. I have a sore spot about addiction and do not appreciate being told I don't know anything about it and that is for my own personal reasons. What is the difference.
And last but not least, none of what this thread has become from my standpoint anyway had anything to do with stem cells. It could have been any personality promoting any politician for any reason. My point is, was and always has been that Rush blew it big time on this. He was cruel and ugly. He did apologize and it should have stopped there, but as I understand it, he has carried on about MJF every day since (something I read, did not hear it from Rush himself as, if you will recall, I don't listen to him). I am done with this thread. I have ended up talking about things I did not intend to talk about. That happens a lot here, getting off track. So, I stand by what I said. Rush behaved badly and addicts have choices. The end. Aho.
sigh....
I appreciate the time spent on your reply but unfortunately you are not seeing the big picture here. I am quite certain there are countries on this planet whose history does not contain genocides or atrocities, there are several that come to mind. However, that is most certainly NOT what I was referring to. As I said, literal micro-analysis was not the point of my posting.
Sigh....
My friend, my faith has NEVER been in politics. If you will read my posts I have begged people to look at this situation as Americans, not as Democrats or Republicans. I have said I don't know HOW many times that right or left up or down liberal or conservative does not matter. Radical Islam hates us ALL equally. And the fact that you and other liberals just pooh-pooh that idea, after what happened on 9-11...boggles the mind. And then, of all things, try to say that whatever happens is God's will. What MT said was correct....God gave us free will and we need to realize how far reaching our actions or inactions are. If there had been more action during Clinton's 8 years against terrorism and not Ms Lewinsky's black dress and cigars, we would be a long way down the road to safety. But he chose inaction, which paved the way for 9-11. Pardon me if I do not want to see the same thing happen again...because no telling what liberal inaction will bring us to the next time. And it has absolutely nothing to do with God's will and everything to do with man's.
sigh...
Did you think that those folks would behave as adults? They are bullying children, after all. You were set up to be mocked and chastised.
Y'know, Teddy, I don't think Lurker needs you to champion her. While I do think she is an intelligent person and gives much thought to her posts and limits personal attacks, which is to her credit, I cannot say the same for you Ms. butt-in-chair use-of-defecation as an adjective....
I do have to say, though, that your posts for the most part have been an eloquent and ethical plea for a more humane world.
Once again, I BEG of you, talk to the terrorists and stop preaching to the choir!
I would think that anyone, no matter their personal ideology, would have been moved, even inspired, to ponder a different manner of viewing our world and our role in it.
When have YOU done that, Teddy? When have you ever viewed the world from a position other than yours? Stop quoting OTHER people and say something ORIGINAL.
This all reminds me of trying to argue/debate with my mother who was a borderline personality (a mental disorder). It's hopeless. You cannot have a straightforward discussion/debate/argument with someone for whom the bounds of reality are constantly shifting as their logic will never be grounded in sane reasoning.
You just described yourself, dear. Do you not read your own posts? Slam your mother on a public board...yep, that tells me a lot about the content of YOUR character.
Sigh...
"The Republican Congress..." Check the yay and nay vote. The Republicans alone could not do it. There are many, MANY Democrat names on it. Otherwise it would not have passed. Even the most partisan should be able to grasp that. That is the basis of democracy...majority rules. And the Republicans could not have passed it without democratic support. Just could not have happened. So like it or not...BOTH sides responsible for the war.
As to the grossly inaccurate information...if the Senate Intelligence Committee (ahem) bought the same inaccurate evidence the President did, and reported such to the Senate...why do I not see the same degree of disdain for them? They somehow are allowed to be fooled and Bush isn't? Would these same things be being said if the President in question was a Democrat? The answer to that is no.
I did not bring up Somalia, but my husband was there and saw that debacle first hand. Don't even get me started on Clinton and Somalia. He cut and ran there and if he had not, AL Qaeda would not be nearly as strong as it is today. By the same token...if Clinton had taken the Sudan up on their offer, bin Laden would have been in an American jail, not plotting 9-11. Even he has said himself that was his biggest mistake. Gee, Bill, ya think?? But I don't hate Bill Clinton or demonize him.
There is plenty of blame to go around on BOTH sides for most things. Trouble is, most folks look at the issue through blinders...can only see one side.
As I stated on the list of books...written for money by Bush haters for other Bush haters. No interest in the truth.
Democrats launched the protests? I would love to see how that idea is supported. From what I remember, my bet is most of them were not registered and never voted. Did someone card them and I missed that?
LOL. I did not say Clinton invented regime change. All I said was he was on board for it. And Richard Clarke was on board for it when his guy was in office. Bush's BIGGEST mistake was not cleaning house after Clinton left. He kept Clarke and Tenet on. He took their advice. They both at first stood behind the "lying" intelligence. The head of the CIA no less. So please....just let the old "lie" thing die. No body lied.....well with the exception of Tenet and Clarke, because they had been on both sides of the issue, depending on who was their "boss" at the time. Or, as I guess they call in politics now....flip-flopped. Yeah, flip-flopped....like a beached whale.
And my friend...the buck for going to war stops at Congress. All the Democrats and Republicans who voted for it. And if you will check the roll vote...a good many Democrats DID vote for it. Otherwise it would not have passed. Sheesh.
sigh
The door is always open.
Sigh.
sm
Sigh...nm
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Sigh. lol. nm
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*sigh*.....nm
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Sigh. nm
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Sigh....nm
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Sigh. (nm)
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Sigh....
John McCain did not invent outsourcing. You need to do some research on Mr. and Mrs. Clinton. China and INDIA were big projects for them. You know..INDIA. Where most of our jobs went.
McCain renegotiated a big defense contract that went to an overseas division of an American company so that the actual work would have to be done in the American division...created thousands of jobs on our side of the water.
Without free trade there are no overseas markets for goods manufactured in this country, and a lot of Americans will lose their jobs. But it is okay to lose THOSE jobs?
sigh...
You aren't going to change my mind, I'm not going to change yours. But, as I said before, I don't think Obama is running around killing babies yet, and I don't think he is going to. I think McCain supporters are getting a little anxious right now, so they have to try bring up crazy crap in hopes of swaying people their way.
Sigh....
........sometimes I wonder why we even try.
yada..sigh
Yada..yada..yada..yada..yada..sigh..
yada..sigh
Yada..yada..yada..sigh..yada..
sigh..so predictable
and the stories of a half a century ago keep coming..sigh..shall I post ALL THE CRAP that Bush and his family have been involved in? Like the stripper who had an abortion and later was murdered in Texas..she was involved with GW..do we need to post the sins and horrors of our politicians..it would fill this board big time..Now, get along little fool, get along and run on back to the conservative board so you all can rip liberals apart and pat each other on the back about what good xtians you are..NOT..
Sigh....you have condescenion down pat....
for this obviously inferior of intellect Native American, please to explain what the point of your post was?
Sigh..........sighhhhhhhh......
If you read the whole thread, I told Teddy and I will tell you...I was being facetious. I am sorry if you do not know it when you read it. And yes, Teddy did most certainly talk down to me, even more once I told Teddy that I was of native american descent. the first post Teddy made had nothing to do with my post anyway. But once the post was up there, I dissented and wanted to discuss. All Teddy did, which many liberals have done to me and others on this board(and this is not a bash, it is an observation), is never answer the questions asked of them and instead talk down(*I appreciate the time spent on your reply but unfortunately you are not seeing the big picture here. I am quite certain there are countries on this planet whose history does not contain genocides or atrocities, there are several that come to mind. However, that is most certainly NOT what I was referring to. As I said, literal micro-analysis was not the point of my posting.*) When I asked her to please enlighten this poor native american of lesser intellect (being facetious because of her pompous talking down post), I get this answer: *You have the nasty cliches down pat, but I generally tend to avoid cliches, as I generally avoid using the racial/ethnic I'm being picked on because of my race/country of origin/gender/you name it cliche also but I'll make an exception in your case.* I made no nasty cliche. And she did not answer my question, again. But another condescending post: *You don't seem to realize there's a written record of all your posts for folks to review. Many of your posts with other folks are quite strange and don't seem to make much sense.* And never DID answer my question. And no matter how much you deny it, it happens quite regularly. I ask a question, ask for clarification, and I get condescension and no answer. To me, the simple thing to do, if you don't have the answer, is just say so or answer the question without all the condescending rhetoric. There is no need to personalize it. Why can't there just be civil debate? And why do I keep asking that question when I know the answer....but it doesn't matter, because you aren't going to read this anyway.
Let me try this one more time...sigh...
you totally missed the point, and I think that Jesus would think it was very hypocritical of this country who murders babies at the tune of millions per year to be so wound up and gung ho about freebie health insurance for the kids who manage to survive. I believe THAT, my friend, is the HEIGHT of hypocrisy!! Kill'em before they are born, that's fine, but when they get here free health care. Pot calling the kettle black.
And, frankly, if a parent has not cared enough about his/her children to provide them with health care, giving them a freebie is not going to help. The program already covered families up to the level of family of 4, 80K. Why on earth expand it? Give those people tax cuts so they get some of the premiums back, but don't reward irresponsibility by saying here, take it, its free. Let's reward responsibility for a change and try to get people OFF programs, not ON them.
I would like to see the figures, the numbers of children who suffer and die because their parents could not/would not give them insurance. With all the access to health care for a child with insurance or not...sorry, I don't believe it.
I doubt you would believe it if YOU saw it. Sigh.
And just because you say it ISN'T so, doesn't make it NOT so, either. :-)
Better to kill it....?? sigh. nm
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Nice. (sigh) nm
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