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it's a lot higher percentage than McCain's - nm

Posted By: Amanda on 2008-10-31
In Reply to: The percentage I saw was not all that impressive... - sam

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Sigh. They pay a higher percentage because they
thousands of times more wealth than each average Joe (and I DO NOT mean the plumber). We have a progressive tax system here, American as apple pie, and Obama only wants to adjust the rate back to where it was were 8 years ago....no socialist subversion in that. We all managed to survive the economic boom of the 90s, after all.

Furthermore, before pronoucing any judgements on this issue, check out the disparities in the (here comes that CAPITALIST phrase again) distibution of wealth in the US. If you do not want to research this yourself, just say so and I will post that information for the UMPTEENTH time.

Now, before you go off, Wikipedia is not the Communist Manifesto. Go to the link and scroll down a little better than halfway and read the section on the United States. If you are in the middle class, the information there will make your blood boil.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Distribution_of_wealth

The percentage I saw was not all that impressive...
considering his income, and for someone who so wants to spread the wealth. I understand that you are not concerned nor alarmed by him. That's fine. To each his own. But I am concerned and alarmed. I guess we leave it at that.
Equal percentage is right, I think....nm
nm
Start with yourself - did you donate and what percentage?
Bet that is a big no, and $0. Seeing as you're so into helping others who cannot because of no fault of their own.

I don't think anyone on this board ever said we should not help the handicapped who cannot help themselves. Most people here whether they are liberal or conservatives have compassion. It's the ones who can help themselves, who are physically and mentally able to get jobs but they won't because it's easier to sit at home and receive that welfare check. By all means I am not saying everyone on welfare can get a job, but there are a good percentage of those that can (and pay taxes to help those who can't), but why should they when they are getting it for free. And now it will be even easier for them to get something for nothing.

Not everybody is only out for ourselves and screw everyone else. I donate money to a charitable cause - an Indian reservation in Arizona to help provide food and water to them. I wish I could donate more or to more charities, but I'm a one-income three person family, and I send money to my family back east who are having a hard time, which leaves me with nothing left over. Do I want government to take more taxes from me - no way....let me decide for myself which charities I want to donate to.

Not sure what the beef is here. I do not agree that we all are out for only ourselves, but in these economic times and people out of work and losing everything, how can you expect them to want government to take more money out in taxes.

So, I may be misinterpreting this message. Are you for the government taxing us more, or are you just mad at GW and his administration and want to vent. While your venting you should vent about what the Clintons did on their way out to include taking everything not nailed down not only in the WH but also on Air Force One.
What percentage of homes are owned by
Does anyone have numbers?
If someone makes 100 mill a year, you think $20K earner should pay same percentage?
that's just kookoo
Minorities do make up a lopsided percentage of the prison population.
But just stating that as a fact which is self-evident pays no attention whatsoever to the root causes of minority tension in our nation, nor address the fact that rich people with their various crimes tend to be well-connected enough to keep their butts out of jail, thus disproportionately skewing the prison statistics. Many more reasons can be advanced to explain the sad state of America's penal system, but none of that matters in the subject at hand.

Bennett's conclusion (as a member of the wealthy, advataged and least-likely-to-go-to-prison-for-his-crimes club) is that mass genocide would solve our crime problems.

Don't you realize how frightening that is?
My guess is much higher.
I would say at least 100; 25 who can read, another 25 who can comprehend what they read; another 25 to articulate what the ones with reading comprehension can understand and try to express, and another 25 to type and proof, at least.
So much for no higher taxes of

any kind for 95% of the American people.  This is just going to kill the people who are already struggling to make ends meet.  Not to mention the high prices that will come if they get cap and trade passed.  Why don't people in Washington get this?  All they talk about are the sacrifices that we are all going to have to make and they do nothing but keep spending.  Where is the sacrifice on their end, huh?  We need to fix this economy and stop the constant spending by our government. 


I'm so sick and tired of this.  I work to make money and they are just going to take more and more of what I earn.  I've always been responsible with my money and have excellent credit but how I am going to continue to make ends meet if this keeps up?  It is pretty sad when responsible people are scared this will bring them down as well.  I guess the rich will just have to pay for everything because there won't be a middle class left the rate things are going.


too many people = higher premiums?!
Wow, not that I want to spend all week talking about insurance, but I'm really amazed by things I'm hearing. The whole point of insurance is to lower your individual cost by adding in lots and lots of people. If you and I are the only ones who have insurance, and you have a heart attack, I'm effectively paying half your bill, right? But if we could average that bill over millions and millions of people, it'd be much easier to bear.

The ideal situation, then, would be for everybody in the country to have insurance, so we could average the costs over 300 million people. (This would also lead to a better ability to negotiate drug prices, and encourage hospitals not to spend millions on useless equipment like surgical robots that drive the costs skyward.)

Read Obama's plan, or Baucus', or Kennedy's, or Wyden's, and you'll find that people who can't afford even those new low premiums, are helped out with subsidies, NOT FINED. It's far, far cheaper to help subsidize poor people's premiums, than it is to have them show up to the ER for every cold and flu symptom, you know? Not to mention that they'll then be able to get preventative care, and not so many of them will wind up with horribly costly illnesses down the road, diabetes, heart disease, etc.

Affordable health care isn't just an easy fix, it's a moral one. And it has been tried a million times--I think Truman was actually the first president to suggest it. But you and I don't have the kind of lobbying money that big pharma has, that the doctors have, that every other player has, and they have worked for *decades* to keep Americans from getting the healthcare system they deserve.
you think only 3 have been tortured, I think the number is much higher....sm
That might be the reason that the former administration wanted to keep them forever imprisoned, so that they cannot talk!
Higher taxes are not my interest, neither is giving.
@
Anywhere in Scandinavia. Higher standard of living.

So you think you're exempt from higher taxes?
nm
yeah, of higher taxes for all -kind of change we can
nm
JTBB - If you find a higher-level forum where
intellect is respected and informed debate is possible, please post that info a time or 2. I'm looking for a spot like that myself and this sure ain't it.
Combined income or small business making 120,000 or higher
will be taxed big time instead of the 250,000.  It could down lower to where anyone making 42,000 or higher will be taxed big time.  He keeps changing his mind, but we will for sure see if he wins.     
Posible new "boon" to the economy? Higher minimum wages??.....PSM
I was just thinking, we did a lot of discussion yesterday about welfare reform, the bloated welfare roles that we have now, and how to end it.  How about passing a DECENT, HONEST, REALISTIC minimum wage act that is based on the present economy, the proposed future economay, and will make it more profitable for an American to get a fair-paying job on which he can feed his family, pay his REASONABLE mortgage, pay his bills, etc., instead of having the minimum wage so low that it is actually more profitable for many families to say on welfare, medicaide, and food stamps, along with subsidised housing AND NOT have to juggle three low-paying jobs to do it?  Don't you think that if American workers felt they were more faily paid, were being compensated fairly for their efforts, and would bring home enough wages each week to live within comfortable means, that more and more folk would jump off the roles and into a job (of course, we first need the part of the stimulus package to address keeping our companies solvent and employing).  Just a thought!!!  
Why are you McCain people so desperate? You are just like McCain. No plan. Just criticism of the
other candidate.  I guess you want the same old thing we have had for the past 8 years.  God forbid McCain win with that wild woman, Palin.
McCain
Not only will he refuse to get out of Iraq unless there is some sort of clear victory, even if it takes "100 years" or "1000 years" (his words), jokes about how to handle Iran is "Bom, bom, bom, bom, bomb Iran" (to the tune of a Beach Boys song), he also wants to kick Russia out of the G8 and not let China or India in. Way to place nice with the up-and-coming superpowers - I'm sure that will do great things for our country in years to come.

There are certain things I like about him (strict belief in Geneva Convention, willing to work across party lines), but his warmongering side scares the you-know-what out of me.
McCain's age
Whether his military uniform helps his image depends on what kind of world we want to be living in tomorrow, not the one we live in now. A lot of people will be showing up at the polls to say that status quo is not acceptable, especially when it comes to solving problems by waging wars. Concerns over his age, senility and/or Alzheimer’s are legitimate if you do the math. Those possibilities are very real and could just as easily happen early in his term as later. He has shown some early signs like his problems with word retrieval, mispronunciation, confusion, forgetting what he is saying and blank staring spells.

The teleprompter comment is also kind of a cheap shot. Besides that, it is not true, unless you believe everything you hear on Fox or YouTube. He is an excellent orator and delivered very spontaneous and inspiring responses in the town hall meetings during the primaries and in news conferences. YHe is a much better speaker than McCain.

McCain....you mean
I can't believe anyone would vote for him after what Bush just did to us for 8 years.
Well, McCain's gas in his car came from
oil from a country that supports terrorism. McCain a supporter of terrorism? You can interpret this any way you like.
if McCain gets in

that will be the tenor of the New Secretary of State.


 


Why McCain?
http://www.johnmccain.com/Undecided/WhyMcCain.htm
McCain looks

like he hurts.  It makes me uncomfortable to watch.  Obama has a significantly larger amt of data in his mind (constitutional law professor, etc) to sort through, gather, and assemble before he responds to a question.  It is to his favor that he does not immediately yelp out an answer like a trained seal. 


 


Thank you. I think McCain's age ... sm
Is what worries me so much about this situation. I mean, people die at different ages, it's true, but if McCain were 20 years younger, I don't think I'd be quite as worried. But he's 72, has had skin cancer several times, and I read (haven't verified) that both his father and grandfather died suddenly of heart attacks when they were younger than he is now. Now that might not mean anything. After all, isnt' his mother in her 90s? But it just worries me. It would be different if he wanted Palin to have a cabinet position where she could, I don't know, hone her skills, cut her teeth in Washington, so to speak, but to put her is a position of leading our country if something happens to McCain? It just makes me very nervous.
Oh, of course. McCain will get the best...sm
Healthcare. Too bad for the rest of us peons though!

Still, the best healthcare in the U.S. can't turn back time and make him young again. He is really getting up there, and the campaign must be wearing on him. I don't know how any of them can stand all the travel that comes with campaigning.

The New McCain!

The Ugly New McCain



 
Wednesday, September 17, 2008; Page


Following his loss to George W. Bush in the 2000 South Carolina primary, John McCain did something extraordinary: He confessed to lying about how he felt about the Confederate battle flag, which he actually abhorred. "I broke my promise to always tell the truth," McCain said. Now he has broken that promise so completely that the John McCain of old is unrecognizable. He has become the sort of politician he once despised.







The precise moment of McCain's abasement came, would you believe, not at some news conference or on one of the Sunday shows but on "The View," the daytime TV show created by Barbara Walters. Last week, one of the co-hosts, Joy Behar, took McCain to task for some of the ads his campaign has been running. One deliberately mischaracterized what Barack Obama had said about putting lipstick on a pig -- an Americanism that McCain himself has used. The other asserted that Obama supported teaching sex education to kindergarteners.


"We know that those two ads are untrue," Behar said. "They are lies."



 

Freeze. Close in on McCain. This was the moment. He has largely been avoiding the press. The Straight Talk Express is now just a brand, an ad slogan like "Home Cooking" or "We Will Not Be Undersold." Until then, it was possible for McCain to say that he had not really known about the ads, that the formulation "I approve this message" was just boilerplate. But he didn't.


"Actually, they are not lies," he said.


Actually, they are.


McCain has turned ugly. His dishonesty would be unacceptable in any politician, but McCain has always set his own bar higher than most. He has contempt for most of his colleagues for that very reason: They lie. He tells the truth. He internalizes the code of the McCains -- his grandfather, his father: both admirals of the shining sea. He serves his country differently, that's all -- but just as honorably. No more, though.


I am one of the journalists accused over the years of being in the tank for McCain. Guilty. Those doing the accusing usually attributed my feelings to McCain being accessible. This is the journalist-as-puppy school of thought: Give us a treat, and we will leap into a politician's lap.


Not so. What impressed me most about McCain was the effect he had on his audiences, particularly young people. When he talked about service to a cause greater than oneself, he struck a chord. He expressed his message in words, but he packaged it in the McCain story -- that man, beaten to a pulp, who chose honor over freedom. This had nothing to do with access. It had to do with integrity.


McCain has soiled all that. His opportunistic and irresponsible choice of Sarah Palin as his political heir -- the person in whose hands he would leave the country -- is a form of personal treason, a betrayal of all he once stood for. Palin, no matter what her other attributes, is shockingly unprepared to become president. McCain knows that. He means to win, which is all right; he means to win at all costs, which is not.


At a forum last week at Columbia University, McCain said, "But right now we have to restore trust and confidence in government." This was always the promise of John McCain, the single best reason to vote for him. America has been cheated on too many times -- the lies of Vietnam and Watergate and Iraq. So many lies. Who believes that in Afghanistan last month, only five civilians were killed by the American military in an airstrike, instead of the approximately 90 claimed by the Afghan government? Not me. I first gave up on the military during Vietnam and then again when it covered up the death of Pat Tillman, the Army Ranger and former NFL player who was killed in 2004 by friendly fire.


McCain was going to fix all that. He was going to look the American people in the eyes and say, not me. I will not lie to you. I am John McCain, son and grandson of admirals. I tell the truth.


But Joy Behar knew better. And so McCain lied about his lying and maybe thinks that if he wins the election, he can -- as he did in South Carolina -- renounce who he was and what he did and resume his old persona. It won't work. Karl Marx got one thing right -- what he said about history repeating itself. Once is tragedy, a second time is farce. John McCain is both.


cohenr@washpost.com


or like when McCain said . . .
Obama called her a pig and then on Monday said he didn't
it has to do with McCain and

Bush systematically deregulating  (savings and loans - Keating 5) and wall street so that the souless corporations can do whatever they want without any limits.  they have removed the safety factors built into the system after the great depression. Well, now we have the situation that deregulation brings.  As Romney said at this years' repub convention - McCain is going to go at all the regulations on industry with a weed wacker. 


 


McCain
Respecting his service to his country is one thing.  He is only one of thousands who have done the same thing. or worse, died for their country, and are just as deserving of being honored as McCain.  Trusting him to lead this country is another thing entirely.
Seeing as McCain may not . . .
live out his term, she is running for the top spot.
Does McCain even know what he is saying.

Maybe he had better hit the beach with the flip-flops.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GEtZlR3zp4c


 


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ioy90nF2anI&feature=PlayList&p=2F671A7FEF92B36B&index=3


 


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pK_9sI7hzAc&feature=PlayList&p=2F671A7FEF92B36B&index=10


 


 


He said, he said. I believe what McCain said,
you believe what Obama said. McCain said he told Obama he was going to suspend his campaign and when Obama spoke just now he stated the same thing, only says "I didn't know he meant it now" or some such. I don't buy that. He just didn't think McCain was serious. Turns out he was.
Can any McCain fan or Rep. tell me why
McCain has supported legislation to give tax breaks to companies that outsource jobs?  I'm asking because I don't know.  I figured you guys have read a lot of his stuff and thought you might know off the top of your head.  I could always try to find it but am finding myself lazy tonight  and thought someone might be in the know without having to Google it.
And you think McCain is going to do any better?

What a mess! 


Oh and saw on the news that this bailout will affect even the people who do live within their means because it means that the Jones' house that gets foreclosed on will reduce the amount my house is worth and therefore I lose too!  Something needs to be done and quick! 


It is not fair to simply point out Obama's plans when you do not mention McCain's either.  What are McCain's plans?  All he seems to do is "knock" Obama.  Oh better consider what Palin has to say too, you know McCain is getting no younger or any healthier for that matter.


McCain

Someone with character....hmm.  You best not vote then. 


McCain

Typo in my name.  Still feel the same way though!  


McCain Ex
Oh, yes, I read what you quoted from the article.  My question is, do you believe EVERYTHING you read?  Might be a good idea to apply some common sense.  I know a lot of ex-wives who had husbands who kicked them to the curb and not ONE of them would speak in such kind and loving terms about the ex 'who dun 'em wrong."  I'm not an ex-wife (widowed) but I can guarantee you that if my husband left me for another woman for ANY reason, he would regret the day he was born. I doubt I'm much different from any other woman.
I don't believe McCain is
trustworthy either, old-timer.
McCain that is nm
x
McCain
McCain seems to be nothing more than the leader of an angry mob.  He and Palin have done nothing constructive for us in this campaign other than incite people's anger.  Something bad is going to happen because of the rehoretic that they are supporting from their base.  I think that they should be very put off by some of the comments that their crowds are shouting and I am ashamed that more of the public is not angered by it.
McCain
I felt some respect for McCain when I saw a few minutes ago an elderly woman questioning him about Obama and he said "he is a decent man, a family man."  The lady asked about him being a "terrorist" and McCain said, "No, No m'am, he's not."  He walked away looking liike an old, defeated man.  I even felt some sympathy for him.  So all this terrorist stuff was obviously a lie, donchaallthink?
What does McCain have to do with this?
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McCain
He was constantly scribbling things on papers, shuffling them around.
He never looked into the camera, addressing also the viewers. Obama did.
Gee, then I must be as bad as McCain for

I was rolling my eyes, grimacing, and ready to blow my top at some of the things the O stated. I also giggled and laughed at some of his outrageous plans.


It's McCain for me. No way do I want to live under the O's vision of "change the world".


Oh, hey! I take that back!!! If O becomes President, I think hubby and I will quit working as then we can have everything handed to us, too. Yeah. That's it! We'll just quit and let the rich people take care of us. Hubby has been working since he was 8, I started when I was 14, and I'm talking 46 years of hard work to get where we are now.  


 


Not according to McCain
http://www.mercurynews.com/breakingnews/ci_10786968

"The use of campaign funds for items which most Americans would consider to be strictly personal reasons, in my view, erodes public confidence and erodes it significantly," he said on the Senate floor in May 1993.

Her's another:
The 2002 campaign finance law that bears McCain's name specifically barred any funds that "are donated for the purpose of supporting the activities of a federal or state office holder" from being used for personal expenses INCLUDING CLOTHING.

McCain
Gee, did you choose YOUR middle name?
A-AGAINST McCain
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McCAIN ALL THE WAY!!!
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