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Thanks Lurker...very good read..Add this too...sm

Posted By: Democrat on 2006-06-12
In Reply to: For liberals only. - Lurker

**And for those who don't know already, Ann Coulter is a Conservative apologist who has just released a new book, and while promoting her future Best Seller, she made some off-the-wall comments just so she could get some publicity for said book. She claimed that the windows of 9/11 are milking their husbands deaths, and called them broads who are enjoying their million dollar status. To me, she isn't an alien, just another person trying to XXXX somebody else over in order to make some chump change. I don't believe for a second she means a word of what she came out with, but is just trying to drum up interest in her new product, which is for sale. And according to Amazon.com's book rankings, she's accomplishing her goal. Shrewd businesswomen? Yes indeed. On her way to becoming Satan, halfway there!**




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I think perhaps you read a different article than the one posted by Lurker.
nm
Good research sam - but a lot to read right now so gotta read it later
I've been goofing off too much from work. I appreciate what you wrote and will read when I'm done with work here.
Good Read...

Why Martin Luther King was Republican


by  Frances Rice
08/16/2006


It should come as no surprise that Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. was a Republican. In that era, almost all black Americans were Republicans. Why? From its founding in 1854 as the anti-slavery party until today, the Republican Party has championed freedom and civil rights for blacks. And as one pundit so succinctly stated, the Democrat Party is as it always has been, the party of the four S's: slavery, secession, segregation and now socialism.

It was the Democrats who fought to keep blacks in slavery and passed the discriminatory Black Codes and Jim Crow laws. The Democrats started the Ku Klux Klan to lynch and terrorize blacks. The Democrats fought to prevent the passage of every civil rights law beginning with the civil rights laws of the 1860s, and continuing with the civil rights laws of the 1950s and 1960s.

During the civil rights era of the 1960s, Dr. King was fighting the Democrats who stood in the school house doors, turned skin-burning fire hoses on blacks and let loose vicious dogs. It was Republican President Dwight Eisenhower who pushed to pass the Civil Rights Act of 1957 and sent troops to Arkansas to desegregate schools. President Eisenhower also appointed Chief Justice Earl Warren to the U.S. Supreme Court, which resulted in the 1954 Brown v. Board of Education decision ending school segregation. Much is made of Democrat President Harry Truman's issuing an Executive Order in 1948 to desegregate the military. Not mentioned is the fact that it was Eisenhower who actually took action to effectively end segregation in the military.


Democrat President John F. Kennedy is lauded as a proponent of civil rights. However, Kennedy voted against the 1957 Civil Rights Act while he was a senator, as did Democrat Sen. AL Gore Sr. And after he became President, Kennedy was opposed to the 1963 March on Washington by Dr. King that was organized by A. Phillip Randolph, who was a black Republican. President Kennedy, through his brother Atty. Gen. Robert Kennedy, had Dr. King wiretapped and investigated by the FBI on suspicion of being a Communist in order to undermine Dr. King.

In March of 1968, while referring to Dr. King's leaving Memphis, Tenn., after riots broke out where a teenager was killed, Democrat Sen. Robert Byrd (W.Va.), a former member of the Ku Klux Klan, called Dr. King a "trouble-maker" who starts trouble, but runs like a coward after trouble is ignited. A few weeks later, Dr. King returned to Memphis and was assassinated on April 4, 1968.

Given the circumstances of that era, it is understandable why Dr. King was a Republican. It was the Republicans who fought to free blacks from slavery and amended the Constitution to grant blacks freedom (13th Amendment), citizenship (14th Amendment) and the right to vote (15th Amendment). Republicans passed the civil rights laws of the 1860s, including the Civil Rights Act of 1866 and the Reconstruction Act of 1867 that was designed to establish a new government system in the Democrat-controlled South, one that was fair to blacks. Republicans also started the NAACP and affirmative action with Republican President Richard Nixon's 1969 Philadelphia Plan (crafted by black Republican Art Fletcher) that set the nation's fist goals and timetables. Although affirmative action now has been turned by the Democrats into an unfair quota system, affirmative action was begun by Nixon to counter the harm caused to blacks when Democrat President Woodrow Wilson in 1912 kicked all of the blacks out of federal government jobs.

Few black Americans know that it was Republicans who founded the Historically Black Colleges and Universities. Unknown also is the fact that Republican Sen. Everett Dirksen from Illinois was key to the passage of civil rights legislation in 1957, 1960, 1964 and 1965. Not mentioned in recent media stories about extension of the 1965 Voting Rights Act is the fact that Dirksen wrote the language for the bill. Dirksen also crafted the language for the Civil Rights Act of 1968 which prohibited discrimination in housing. President Lyndon Johnson could not have achieved passage of civil rights legislation without the support of Republicans.

Critics of Republican Sen. Barry Goldwater, who ran for President against Johnson in 1964, ignore the fact that Goldwater wanted to force the Democrats in the South to stop passing discriminatory laws and thus end the need to continuously enact federal civil rights legislation.

Those who wrongly criticize Goldwater also ignore the fact that Johnson, in his 4,500 State of the Union Address delivered on Jan. 4, 1965, mentioned scores of topics for federal action, but only 35 words were devoted to civil rights. He did not mention one word about voting rights. Then in 1967, showing his anger with Dr. King's protest against the Vietnam War, Johnson referred to Dr. King as "that Nigger preacher."

Contrary to the false assertions by Democrats, the racist "Dixiecrats" did not all migrate to the Republican Party. "Dixiecrats" declared that they would rather vote for a "yellow dog" than vote for a Republican because the Republican Party was know as the party for blacks. Today, some of those "Dixiecrats" continue their political careers as Democrats, including Robert Byrd, who is well known for having been a "Keagle" in the Ku Klux Klan.

Another former "Dixiecrat" is former Democrat Sen. Ernest Hollings, who put up the Confederate flag over the state Capitol when he was the governor of South Carolina. There was no public outcry when Democrat Sen. Christopher Dodd praised Byrd as someone who would have been "a great senator for any moment," including the Civil War. Yet Democrats denounced then-Senate GOP leader Trent Lott for his remarks about Sen. Strom Thurmond (R.-S.C.). Thurmond was never in the Ku Klux Klan and defended blacks against lynching and the discriminatory poll taxes imposed on blacks by Democrats. If Byrd and Thurmond were alive during the Civil War, and Byrd had his way, Thurmond would have been lynched.

The 30-year odyssey of the South switching to the Republican Party began in the 1970s with President Richard Nixon's "Southern Strategy," which was an effort on the part of Nixon to get Christians in the South to stop voting for Democrats who did not share their values and were still discriminating against their fellow Christians who happened to be black. Georgia did not switch until 2002, and some Southern states, including Louisiana, are still controlled by Democrats.

Today, Democrats, in pursuit of their socialist agenda, are fighting to keep blacks poor, angry and voting for Democrats. Examples of how egregiously Democrats act to keep blacks in poverty are numerous.

After wrongly convincing black Americans that a minimum wage increase was a good thing, the Democrats on August 3 kept their promise and killed the minimum wage bill passed by House Republicans on July 29. The blockage of the minimum wage bill was the second time in as many years that Democrats stuck a legislative finger in the eye of black Americans. Senate Democrats on April 1, 2004, blocked passage of a bill to renew the 1996 welfare reform law that was pushed by Republicans and vetoed twice by President Clinton before he finally signed it. Since the welfare reform law expired in September 2002, Congress had passed six extensions, and the latest expired on June 30, 2004. Opposed by the Democrats are school choice opportunity scholarships that would help black children get out of failing schools and Social Security reform, even though blacks on average lose $10,000 in the current system because of a shorter life expectancy than whites (72.2 years for blacks vs. 77.5 years for whites).

Democrats have been running our inner-cities for the past 30 to 40 years, and blacks are still complaining about the same problems. More than $7 trillion dollars have been spent on poverty programs since Lyndon Johnson's War on Poverty with little, if any, impact on poverty. Diabolically, every election cycle, Democrats blame Republicans for the deplorable conditions in the inner-cities, then incite blacks to cast a protest vote against Republicans.

In order to break the Democrats' stranglehold on the black vote and free black Americans from the Democrat Party's economic plantation, we must shed the light of truth on the Democrats. We must demonstrate that the Democrat Party policies of socialism and dependency on government handouts offer the pathway to poverty, while Republican Party principles of hard work, personal responsibility, getting a good education and ownership of homes and small businesses offer the pathway to prosperity.


Ms. Rice is chairman of the National Black Republican Association (NBRA) and may be contacted at www.NBRA.info.


http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=16500


Good read, article. sm

My cousin, who lives in Alaska, told me about this web site.  It has some interesting articles.  I enjoyed this one - here is the link/url.


http://alaskadispatch.com/tundra-talk/1-talk-of-the-tundra/121-the-world-according-to-sarah.html


A good funny read.........sm
Funny, and yet oh so true, in many respects.....please read....his column is good every week, and pokes fun where it's deserved, whilst intertwining salient facts therein....


http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,434143,00.html
What I read about Emanuel is not good at all.

What happened to Col. Powell maybe being Chief of Staff for Obama?  Anyway, I am not too thrilled about Emanuel being chief of staff.  From what I have been reading, he is the son of a Zionist, Israeli terrorist.  Also might be related to 911.


http://aangirfan.blogspot.com/2008/11/obama-and-rahm-emanuel.html


Many, many more articles like this about Emanuel. 


 


 


If you want to stay in a good mood DON'T READ...sm



Ann is such a tacky little witch that it's not funny.  Even if I were republican I would not defend her.  Kudos for Hillary for responding to her outright disrespect to these 9-11 widows.  I don't understand for the life of me how she could tout being pro-military, pro-America and call liberals Godless when she is walking around disrespecting four 9-11 widows with that xxxxxxx smile on her face.  Phew! I feel a little better already.

Hillary Lashes Out at Ann Coulter
Jun 07 7:16 PM US/Eastern








WASHINGTON


New York Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton lashed out at Ann Coulter for a vicious, mean-spirited attack on a group of outspoken 9/11 widows, whom the right-wing television pundit described as self-obsessed and enjoying their husbands' deaths.

Coulter writes in a new book, Godless: The Church of Liberalism, that a group of New Jersey widows whose husbands perished in the World Trade Center act as if the terrorist attacks happened only to them.



She also wrote, I've never seen people enjoying their husbands' deaths so much.

Clinton, who has felt Coulter's wrath over the years, responded angrily on Wednesday.

Perhaps her book should have been called 'Heartless,' the senator said. I know a lot of the widows and family members who lost loved ones on 9/11. They never wanted to be a member of a group that is defined by the tragedy of what happened.

The New York Democrat and former first lady said she found it unimaginable that anyone in the public eye could launch a vicious, mean-spirited attack on people whom I've known over the last four and a half years to be concerned deeply about the safety and security of our country.

The senator spoke after delivering a speech on protecting children from exposure to sex- and violence-saturated media.

Coulter appeared Tuesday on NBC's Today show, and reiterated her stance, saying the women used their grief to make a political point.

Her criticism was aimed at four New Jersey women whom she dubbed The Witches of East Brunswick, after the town where two of them live.

They have spent the years since the 2001 terror attacks supporting an independent commission to examine government failures before the attack, and in the 2004 presidential campaign they endorsed Democrat John Kerry.

The women are Kristen Breitweiser, Lorie Van Auken, Mindy Kleinberg and Patty Casazza of New Jersey.

The women, who are still pushing for changes in how the government guards against future attacks, issued a joint statement after Coulter's television appearance.

We have been slandered. Contrary to Ms. Coulters statements, there was no joy in watching men that we loved burn alive. There was no happiness in telling our children that their fathers were never coming home again. We adored these men and miss them every day, the women said.


I havn't read any slams, just good solid arguments.
ji
Do I need some kind of motive to post what I thought was a good read..and your point is..
xx
Thank you, Lurker!

I can't stop laughing and emailed this to everyone I know, as well as added it to my favorites.


This is priceless!  Thanks. 


Thank you, Lurker.

Now THERE'S a post full of kindness, understanding, tolerance, and love.  I wish there were more people like you in this country right now.  I was starting to feel very angry and in the midst of letting them drag me down to their level, but your post just lifted me up from all that (even sans the beads).  You must be very proud of your heritage.  I would love to learn more about it.


Thank you again for your post.


Thank you, Lurker nm

nm


Thanks, Lurker.

This was a great read and sums up very well the impression Ann Coulter has given me of herself and her so-called values. 


 


Yes, I will do this Lurker.
well aware of the hardships endured by native Americans as well as their many contributions, such as the Navajo codetalkers in WWII as only 1 example. That's what gets me about some of the rabid illegal immigrant bashers...**they're illegal** blah, blah blah. Yeah, we need to secure our borders, etc., but some of the arguments made by these people make me sick. If ANYONE got a raw deal it's the native Americans; except for them, we are ALL here illegally. I love the many wonderful traditions and meaningful ceremonies of native Americans; I will support this.
Thanks, Lurker.
I hardly have any, as well. 
Oh, come on now Lurker. sm
You post on the C board, too.  This is all silly.
Lurker?

Yes, I've posted on the conservative board a couple times recently.  Didn't take me long to realize it wasn't the place for me, and I don't plan on posting there any more.


However, I continue to read the posts there, note your ongoing confusion and truly hope you get back to school soon so they can teach you that the 9 in 9/11 indicates the month of September, not August.  I do applaud you for getting the 11 in 9/11 correct, though.


Another point of confusion:  I'm not Lurker.  I'm Liberal. 


But Lurker,
will all due respect, your posts ooze hatred.  I don't think you might be aware of it, but they do. 
Lurker. sm
You are the only one who has ever posted here, more than once, about AG and I and who we *really* are.  So it's more than reasonable for me to equate that kind of post with you. 
Lurker...
just a simple question. You have read the posts. Do you think I deserved the *fool*, *I feel I have been defecated upon,* comments? Do you think that because they come from a *liberal* that is okay? I have not said I am done with you, you are delusional to anyone. Yet Teddy has said I was mentally ill, have I taken my meds, am I nuts, and on and on and on. Why is acceptable to you, and you champion her, and let castigate conservatives for saying similar things to you?

It appears I was wrong about you. I thought you were above all that. But...alas...I guess I was wrong.
thanks for sharing this, Lurker
Kudos to those brave ladies.
Another one attacking Lurker...and on and on

Unacceptable answer for word verbiage. Do people actually let you get away with that?




[Post a Reply] [View Follow Ups]      [Politics] --> [Liberals]

Posted By: ? on 2006-03-03,
In Reply to: Find it yourself... - Lurker

You must run in really tolerant debate circles.  Best stay in them.  This kind of behavior is not tolerated in most political circles I know of.  But it is a good example of how far we have slipped into the he said/she said atmosphere of debate in this country.  Just say anything and never have to prove it.  It works well for the MSM, of which you seem so fond.  Well, should have known better. I am off for greener pastures and debate fields where people actually have to prove what they say.  Imagine that!


I don't see this as an attack and obviously neither did Lurker. sm
Please look to your own back yard. 
Bravo, Lurker.
Excellent post. 
No, Lurker, you are mistaken. sm
by *beyond you* I meant it was in God's hands, not yours.  I am done talking to you about it.  You are determined to be offended no matter what I say.  I have never quoted scripture or even interpreted it except to say that God will be the judge and that matter is between President Bush and God.  Walking the walk and talking the talk....well, I don't know what you mean by that.  Another insult I suppose, but since you don't know me, that would be hard for you to *judge* but maybe not, since you seem fond of judging.  As far as mistakes, well, I don't really know what you mean by that either.  Mistakes like drinking alcohol at one time?  Mistakes like stepping on an ant?  Mistakes like spending too much?  Hardly offenses to keep him out of heaven.  You have added many insults in your post. I am glad I did not stoop to that level. 
Bravo, Lurker...very well said.
*China is big* and *Russia is big* is the best our esteemed leader can come up with. Yep, it's hard work being the decider. Only demonstrates (yet again) he is a spoiled, uninformed adolescent with a simplistic view of the world. I've seen 7-year-olds with better table manners and a better grasp of geography. Ironic, also, that he and his puppetmasters show such disdain for the UN and Kofi Annan and yet Bush wants Annan to *give them a call*. God help us....but it's like we've suspected and feared all along: They seem to WANT WWIII. Yet they continue to get away with all kinds of stuff because there are people still fixated on Clinton's sex life. javascript:editor_insertHTML('text','');
javascript:editor_insertHTML('text','');
Lurker, was it this article?
We Won't Be Quiet. If so, I read it. It was fantastic!!! The other link was about Iraq. I will repost the link.

http://www.commondreams.org/views06/0901-28.htm
Lurker, you are not that obtuse. sm
Seems to me, you and Lydia are talking about totally different things.  Win what?  The spread of communism for one thing.  And the fact is, the US Military was not allowed to win that war and the antiwar movement had a lot to do with it, as I have said time and time again, and alot of innocent people died when we left Vietnam.  It's a funny thing to me that some people are so concerned with the innocent civilians dying in Iraq but not a tear was shed or a word uttered about the millions and millions who died at the hands of Pol Pot and North Vietnam once we left.  Selective memory must be wonderful.
On second thought, you are right, Lurker. sm

It's about MJF being used as a pawn to relay false information about stem cell research, 99% of which is false and unfounded.  It's about misrepresenting what embryonic stem cell research really is and what it will be.  So you are right, it's about a whole lot more than MJF.  It's dirty politics and the Democrats used MJF's affliction for their gains.  Shame on them.


Lurker, there is hope yet ....sm
Reports vary on the total number that showed up, anywhere from 500,000 to 750,000, for the rally in Washington today. There are two parts to the video from CNN. There were about 40 protestors there that were pro-war :)~ Also of note, the state of New Mexico has now filed articles of impeachment, so I guess that is a message to Pelosi that it is not off the table.

http://www.cnn.com/video/player/player.html?url=/video/us/2007/01/27/vo.dc.anti.war.protest.cnn

Lurker never said a thing about being set up...
until someone else said it for her, and then she pick it up and ran with it. That is typical of the left.
Thanks for your reply, Lurker

Thought I'd switch back over to this board.


Thanks for your reply to my question about your leaving Florida.  It sounds like a big transition in many ways, both geographically and emotionally.  I had inquired because I have similar thoughts myself and so far I keep moving farther and farther north and away from civilization.   Anyway, good luck and it would be good to hear when you're settled in. 


Hey Lurker, you're in crazyland over there, come back over here!!

Well, yeah, it's kind of crazy here, too, sometimes.  But less toxic, much more sane and more welcoming.  I kind of like it overall.


Nice to see you posting again.


I believe Lurker asked if she would go to help rebuild. sm
and MT said that she would if possible. Try and keep up.
I head the same thing, Lurker!

And I'm ecstatic!!!  I heard Craig Crawford say that Bush isn't the radical evangelical that some of his more rabid followers think he is.  Maybe Bush isn't as bad as I thought he was.  Maybe he IS choosing a woman who is *reasonable.*  Maybe he's finally waking up and realizing his numbers are going down because he's ignored the majority of the people in this country while trying to cater to the whacky radical minority who want use the GOVERNMENT to force their religious views and imagined moral superiority down everyone's throats.


I didn't even start out being this left-sided.  It seemed the more right-sided he leaned, the more left-sided I became, almost an involuntary reflex type reaction in rebellion.  With the nomination of Miers and the subsequent disapproval by Krystal, Buchanan, etc., I feel as if I can relax a little bit and finally feel there might actually be HOPE for America.  This is indeed a happy day! 


Thank you, Lurker; you're right on the money.
There are people you would jump off a cliff at the command of this administration; I guess that's what I find so difficult to believe. King Georgie can do no wrong no matter what. Where I get a little hot under the collar is when the rest of us are supposed to be happy to get dragged through the muck along with the rest of them. Hypocrisy and corruption apparently have no effect on the Kool-Aid drinkers. Yes, what does it take? Where is the outrage?


I agree the Lurker's above post is right on...
My post was to say that the pat answer of Reps to Dems who disagree with Bush is to call them nuts, morons or haters.  That's all I was saying.  For Heavens' sake, Lurker is most definitely RIGHT ON!  Do you think any of these rednecks would take this from Clinton!?  Hell NO!!
Excellent post. Thanks, Lurker.

Fear and ignorance.  The only way Bush knows how to lead.


Bravo, Lurker! Prrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

Agree with you, Lurker {{{{applause}}}}

Great article, Lurker; thanks.

Great idea, Lurker.
weren't any responses at the other board? As you say, they were/are gung ho about the war. Could it be some soldiers get more support than others? Would they be so supportive of these soldiers as well?

Gotham Gazette - http://www.gothamgazette.com/article/immigrants/20030501/11/368

Immigrant Soldiers
by Chaleampon Ritthichai
01 May 2003

Even though his coffin was draped with the American flag, U.S. Marine Staff Sergeant Riayan Tejeda, 26, was not a U.S.citizen. Tejeda, who was killed in combat in Iraq, was a native of the Dominican Republic.

Eight years ago he joined the Marines after graduating from George Washington High School.

“I hope the United States will remember that my son died for this country,” his father Julio Tejada told Newsday.

Tejeda’s death has brought attention to stories of immigrants who fought for the U.S. military throughout history and the current controversy over their immigration status.

For immigrants, joining the military could lead to a faster track to citizenship, which allows them and their immediate family to reap the same benefits as native-born U.S. citizens.

In early 1990s, immigrant soldiers became eligible for citizenship after three years of legal residency, two years less than civilians. More than 3,600 immigrant soldiers became U.S. citizens from 1994 to 1999.

Last July, President Bush signed an executive order that temporarily allows immigrant soldiers to apply for citizenship immediately. Nearly 5,500 military personnel applied and some already got their citizenships.

There is no law prohibiting illegal immigrants from joining in the army but the armed forces representative says anyone without proper documents is rejected, according to a report in the New York Times.

Tejeda and at least six other U.S. servicemen killed in the war in Iraq had not yet become citizens. Six of these immigrants were granted citizenship posthumously but their relatives did not receive the benefits that would normally go to the families of the citizens.

“It is an honorary status in commemoration of the valor and the sacrifices of the deceased,” the Bureau of Citizenship and Immigration Services explained in the memo.

More than 36,000 service members are non-citizens, making up about 5 percent of active duty service members. About a third come from Mexico and other Spanish-speaking countries and the rest are from China, Vietnam, Canada, Korea, India and other countries.

In New York City alone, 40 percent of Navy recruits were immigrants, 36 percent in the Marines and 27 percent in the Army.

Many are surprised by the number of non-citizens serving in the U.S. military but others say immigrants have always been a part of the military.

“Basically, both immigrants or non-citizens have served in the military since at least the Revolutionary war,” said University of Michigan Professor Cara Wong, who has been studying immigrants and war.

There were over 500,000 immigrants who fought in the Civil War. They were allowed to form their own units, elect their officers and speak their native tongues. “The Germans are true and patriotic,” said President Abraham Lincoln about the German immigrants volunteering to fight for the union army.

Some immigrant soldiers were even honored by the army for their bravery. During WWII Mexican born soldier Marcario Garcia, whose company was pinned down by the Nazis, fought his way out and, though wounded, was able to return with captured prisoners. Garcia was promoted to staff sergeant and awarded the Medal of Honor.

“The distinction between legal and illegal immigrants was non-existent until well after the Civil War,” said professor Wong.

The situation of non-citizen soldiers has caught the eyes of lawmakers in Washington D.C. Some are introducing bills that would shorten the waiting period to two years for foreign-born soldiers and others even argue for immediate citizenship for all immigrants on active duty in the armed forces.

But that did not happen soon enough for Tejeda. At his funeral, hundreds of people gathered to honor him at St. Elizabeth’s Church in Washington.

“He may never have been made officially a citizen of our nation,” said Mayor Michael Bloomberg. “But we are proud he was a citizen of New York.”

Spokesmen for Senator Charles Schumer and Representative Charles Rangel said that they are seeking citizenship posthumously for Tejada if his family desires.

An immigrant from Bangkok, Thailand, Chaleampon Ritthichai is the editor of The Citizen.
Oh Lurker, I couldn't agree more!

Something wicked this way comes, and we are in the middle of it. Oh yeah, I have been likened to Chicken Little, the sky is falling, blah, blah, blah, but I am cognizant of the falsities this administration would like us to believe, and although I am of average intelligence, not presidential material, am educated enough to know that they, WHOMEVER THEY ARE, were going into a HORNET's NEST in IRAQ, also going to make more TERRORISTS. Also, with my average intelligence, I knew enough to know that Hussain was keeping his people under control, and that NO terrorists would be stupid enough to make trouble or reside in Iraq.  He was master.  So he killed 30,000 people, maybe a little more.  How many have the BUSHWACKERS KILLED!?  Yes, of course, I'm upset with him and his cronies.  He has made AMERICANS LOOK STUPID, DISHONEST and MURDEROUS and no more humanitarian, maybe even less so, than Saddam.  At least Saddam had his reasons to kill his people.  What are HIS reasons for the killing?  Have not heard any that make any sense!  That is my take on the whole thing.  Plus the useless FEMA of the Katrina disaster, and on and on and on.  No time to spell it all out. 


Hey....Ahem....and friend Lurker...
another cut and paste for you. Please pay special attention to the portion regarding Mr. Clinton and how he made the focus of his presidency regime change...so much so he signed it into LAW. So it wasn't just the big bad Bushes....your fav prez Mr. Clinton signed into LAW in 1998, American policy for regime change in Iraq...OH SAY IT AIN'T SO....but you didn't read THAT in the CNN article did you??? Typical, typical...typicallll.

The Act found that Iraq had, between 1980 and 1998 (1) committed various and significant violations of International Law, (2) had failed to comply with the obligations to which it had agreed to following the Gulf War and (3) further had ignored Resolutions of the United Nations Security Council. The Act declared that it was the Policy of the United States to support regime change. The Act was passed in the House [2] and Senate [3] and signed into law by the US President Bill Clinton on October 31, 1998. Its stated purpose was: to establish a program to support a transition to democracy in Iraq. Specifically, Congress made findings of past Iraqi military actions in violation of International Law and that Iraq had denied entry of United Nations Special Commission on Iraq (UNSCOM) inspectors into its country to inspect for weapons of mass destruction. Congress found: It should be the policy of the United States to support efforts to remove the regime headed by Saddam Hussein from power in Iraq and to promote the emergence of a democratic government to replace that regime. On December 16, 1998, President Bill Clinton mandated Operation Desert Fox, a major four-day bombing campaign on Iraqi targets.

Can we let this regime change stuff drop now??
Lurker, isn't that the response you would expect?

Did you think that those folks would behave as adults?  They are bullying children, after all.  You were set up to be mocked and chastised. 


I do have to say, though, that your posts for the most part have been an eloquent and ethical plea for a more humane world.  I would think that anyone, no matter their personal ideology, would have been moved, even inspired, to ponder a different manner of viewing our world and our role in it.   


This all reminds me of trying to argue/debate with my mother who was a borderline personality (a mental disorder).  It's hopeless.  You cannot have a straightforward discussion/debate/argument with someone for whom the bounds of reality are constantly shifting as their logic will never be grounded in sane reasoning.  


I think "()" is just some teen-aged lurker.

Lurker, to me, took things personally. You can't do that in debate.
Were you ever in FORMAL debate class?  Say in high school or college?  No one attacked Lurker and the conversation was civil.  The end result was that people ended up thanking each other, Lurker included.  Try not to wspeak for every liberal on the board.  I would resent it if I were them.  If you could switch from attack dog mode for a few minutes, you would have seen the whole thread for the really great debate that it was until Lurker decided to take it personally. 
Lurker, 3/4 of the people who post here leave no name. That is nothing new.

I didn't know that Lurker told you how she felt.

In that case, I apologize.


And regarding looking in my own back yard, with all due respect to you and the board and your rules, I thought this WAS my back yard.  Out of respect for you and your rules, I have not posted on the Conservative Board.


All I'm asking is that, unlike me, THEY respect your rules.


See Lurker's post on Maryscott O'Connor...sm

The following is Lurker's post from the conservative board in response to a comment about a extremist liberal blogger.  Funny how the writer of the article on Maryscott O'Connor say she's angry, but I'm sure he thinks Ann Coulter is just spitting the truth.   But I agree with you Lurker. Much better things to expend energy on than extremist on either side. 


Great post!  I thought the people who just frequent the liberal board would like this.


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LURKER:  In this time of real crises, many many many real crises, why would some woman's blog be of importance to anyone other than those who frequent it? This type of venting and ranting has been going on for quite some time on talk radio and now in blogs, on both sides. I just don't listen to any of it, right or left.  One of my biggest pet peeves is screaming and degrading rhetoric, from anyone, about anything.  Who cares what this woman does, or Cindy Sheehan or the ever popular #1 offender Michael Moore. These are individuals expressing their freedom of speech just as Rush, Grover and Coulter do.  Just turn it off.



Of concern to me is outsourcing, the bond we are building with China (how can our administration tout Christianity and do business with those who murder their own people over religion, who force abortions, who plan parenthood better than anyone I have ever heard of, limiting births to 1 child, promoting abortion if that 1 child is a girl and on and on.



Of concern to me is Wal-Mart for many reasons, but on the China note, Wal-Mart gets 70% of its products from China. The other 30% come from 70 different countries, some of whom have oppressive dictatorships and harbor terrorists like the Philippines, Malaysia, Indonesia. Wal-Mart lobbied to NOT have goods go through additional safety measures at ports of entry because it would cut into their profit margin.



I am concerned that fewer and fewer people have health insurance or jobs or homes and will never have a home or afford insurance even if they manage to find a job.



I am concerned that this administration touts its Christianity while treating the least of its people so shabbily.



I am concerned that generals are speaking out about the inefficacy of this war and the stubborn refusal of Bush or Rumsfeld to do anything about it.



I am concerned that this administration is even thinking of going into Iran.



I am concerned that so many of our elected officials are involved in lies, coverups and that CEOs of corporations can steal the pensions of hundreds of people and don't have to pay it back...5 or 6 people go to country club prison for a couple of years, brush up on their tennis game  and 100s of 50+ people have lost everything and they don't have time to make it up, (nor should they have to).



 I am concerned that people all over our planet are dying from starvation and dehydration and disease.



I am concerned about what we have done to our own planet over the last 150 years in terms of depleting our resources.



I am concerned about this administration using Christianity as a reason to behave so un-Christianly. I believe that were Christ to sit in on a couple of cabinet meetings He would be appalled. There is the Bible cherry-picking...they can quote whatever serves them but dismiss what does not. What happened to every 50 years the wealth is redistributed amongst the people, every 7 years debts are forgiven. Who deleted or amended the 10 commandments. Thou shalt not kill...except when blah blah blah. Though shalt not steal....except blah, blah blah. If there was any thread continuing throughout the gospel of Christ it is the treatment of the poor. In the end we will be judged not on our military brilliance, our power or money but on how we, as a nation, treated the least among us.



Most of all I am concerned about apathy.



There is much to worry about and pray about and much still that can be done.  I just do not see blogs as up there in the top 2,000.


Thanks Lurker...and I agree with you about checks and balances...nm