There's that deafening silence from the other side of the aisle.
Posted By: Makes me so mad, I see red. sm on 2008-10-21
In Reply to: Very true. Can anyone imagine living on minimum...sm - oldtimer
But not for long. That greed gang is going down...double-digits, T-minus 14 and counting.
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Silence is deafening
on the conservatives board. Where else is a political junkie to go around here?
I'm sure the silence will be deafening.
nm
The silence from Sam is deafening!
This is an easy question, Sam. You should know the answer off the top of your head without having to do a Google search.
The Silence is Deafening
*crickets*
The silence is deafening........
The silence is deafening! For shame Sam nm
.
Thanks for the hand across the aisle GT...
and please keep your moniker if you wish...it does fit your life experience. I will remain sam. And yes, I believe we are big enough to put this behind us and start new. Neither of us are wrong...we are just very different...that doesn't mean we can't discuss and try to understand one another. I do look forward to lively discussions...I wish you the best in your job search, hope you find a really great one.
Looking forward to your return!
Thanks for that hand across the aisle...
and you hit the nail on the head. We are different, but we can find common ground and be civil. I look forward to visiting with you in the future about all the issues. Good evening to ya!
Candidates on both sides of the aisle have talked about...
affordable health care as long as I can remember. What they NEVER talk about is how they are going to realistically fund it. Hillary's plan ends up by being funded by the people who never get sick, who end up paying for all those who do get sick (that is the reader's digest version). And that is unfair in my book. That is what I am interested in seeing. When people say "America should provide health insurance for all Americans" what that means is, we will be paying for it through taxes. There is no other way to pay for it. The government has no money in and of itself...it is our tax money they fund things with. So, while your premiums may go down, your taxes will inevitably go UP, because that is how they are going to fund it. There is no magic answer here, at least from where I am sitting. One candidate talked about funding it through raising taxes on cigarettes. That is all well and good, but is it really the responsibility of people who smoke to pay for health care for America? And fewer and fewer people are even starting to smoke...so when smokers die off or quit because cigarettes get too expensive...then what? What will they tax next to pay for it? I am always interested in the specifics of how to pay for it. I don't like to hear "we will figure that out later." And, again, any plan is wholly dependent upon whether you can get both sides of the aisle on board for it...President can't pass it on his own. I just hope they will be honest and forthcoming about how they intend to pay for it.
Bush did reach across the aisle. They refused to
nm
I really agree with you, but since "they" have not extended the hadn across the aisle,......sm
so to speak, I felt that SOMEONE has to, we have to get this thinking ingrained and replacing this old, worn-out, stupid arcaic partison bullying and namecalling, and SOMEONE has to be the bigger person...why not an old Democrat like me??? :-) but I truly believe what I am saying also, friend!
silence? No way!
I hear no silence, however, what I do hear is people coming together to end this war and throw this bum out of office..YEEHHAAWW!!!!
No prob, gt; the silence
What you do DOES silence the rest of us.
nm
If this is all it takes to silence you....
your "issues" must not be worth caring about enough to post. How is it okay to silence me...that's fine. But then you complain that I am silencing YOU. Is this glaring double standard somehow escaping you? Are you so unconvinced in your "issues?"
Silence of the Pubs
The reason for the original post was to show that the Republicans and so called "independents" are quick to blame President Obama when the market is down, yet the cat has their tongues when the market goes up. Apparently, their motto is "If you don't have anything bad to say, don't say anything."
No one is foolish enough to believe that a one-day gain in the stock market means the end of the economic crisis.
Strange silence now broken.
First reaction is if these issues, which have been posted on O's website ever since he launched his campaign, are of such sudden concern to the cons and femocons, why did they not get addressed during the RNC? Do you not see the high-jack strategy as the cons try to talk out of both sides of their mouths and reinvent themselves as the new age liberals? How is this different than the now exposed folly of the compassionate conservative Bush/Cheney ploy?
Small business. Either you can't read, you think that we can't or your spin cycle is stuck in high gear. Go here: http://www.barackobama.com/issues/economy/#small-business. Plans to give tax relief for small businesses and startups, eliminate capital gains taxes on them and provide a $500 new making work pay tax credit (one of many) for workers. For all those IC MTs out there, this is aimed at reducing the burden of double taxation in the current structure where small businesses pay both employer AND employee side of payroll tax. Obama will INVEST $250 million per year in support of entrepreneurship, by creating national network of public-private business incubators to facilitate start-up creation. Your $250,000/yr figure applied to tax cuts on INDIVIDUALS who earn in excess of that amount. Therefore, your offshore, job loss, and massive flight to lower income argument does not hold water on this point. Please cite the right-wing rag you have taken this $6 billion dollar additional tax on small business claim. I'm not finding that in O's plan. The tax breaks to the "lower brackets" (losing their homes, can't decide whether to get medicine or food this month, and if they are lucky, can gas their tank once a month) is addressed below.
On the plight of the struggling rich. Define rich, please. From the bottom, INDIVIDUAL incomes in excess of $250,000/yr might look about right. From the top, $5 million a year maybe (one of McC's not-so-funny jokes, some would wonder). The 90% of the federal tax bill claim must be a typo. Go here for 2008 info: http://www.realclearmarkets.com/articles/2008/04/the_rich_and_their_taxes.html. Our top 1% of filers pay 40% or tax burden. An accurate argument would include these facts as well. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Distribution_of_wealth. In the United States at the end of 2001, 10% of the population owned 71% of the wealth, and the top 1% controlled 38%. On the other hand, the bottom 40% owned less than 1% of the nation's wealth. Let's say that one more time. Top 1% gets 38%, bottom 40% get less than 1%. Since they are not earning a living wage, probably that is why they cannot afford to pay tax. Got the picture?
There is only one reason our long suffering corporations are taking their business overseas. Greed. They do not want to pay their share and they get tax incentives currently for outsourcing. Do not take us down the path of needing to address sweat shop working conditions, 7-day work weeks, $2/day wages in developing countries where US labor laws do not apply. Greed is not a universal American value.
There you go again. Please try to keep this discussion in the context of McCain plans and how they are different than Bush plans. You are spinning way out in right field without a paddle on that ridiculous statement about keeping people in lower brackets. What in the world make you think this kind of ignorance is going to help JM/SP win the election.
Preying on discontent, fear and division was a blatent and nauseating subtext for the RNC this entire week. I do agree with inspecting history, and the history that is under the microscope now is Bush/Cheney and JM voting history. Do you really want to bring up govt "borrowing." Again, Bush is the record setter in this regard and while we are talkin' W, don't forget the Bush slash and burn policies toward our seniors. Here's a link for you to a rather exhaustive analysis on 12 reason privatizing social security is a bad idea. http://www.socsec.org/publications.asp?pubid=503. You can get back to me on that one with your rebuttal. My question would be putting WHICH people before WHICH party?
Survey Americans on which party they associate election fraud with in the past, say, 30 years or so and tell me what you come up with. So you forgot to mention what JM's plan is on this one. Again, just saying no to personal attacks and steering you back on course. JM's plan for lobbying and earmarks is what exactly. I see O has one.
JM hate war? LMAO. So what was all that military service orgie this week all about? The entire McCain family for generations have shown to us just how much they hate war. Where is his war prevention strategy? Did I miss the part where he sang Give Peace a Chance? Sam, really, do you care nothing about your own credibility or that of your candidates? Am laughing too hard to comment further on this.
Here's a link for you to serve as a primer on the Patriot Act controversy. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USA_PATRIOT_Act#Controversy. Will not address the attempts you are making to minimize the unconstitutional aspect of this legislation. I would like an explanation as to how RNC protestors engaging in destruction of private property, vandalism, resisting arrest, disturbing the peace and such have suddenly been charged with terrorism? The we have not been attacked yet defense does not make me feel warm and fuzzy about standing legislation that violates the constitution 9 ways to Sunday. Far mongering does not a justification make. O's plan demonstrates ways to tackle terrorism that do not involve trashing the constitution.
There are many issues swirling around the separation of church and state. Christian theocracy will be kept in the marginal fringes where they belong. Religious principles will not be incorporated into laws that seek to remove a woman's right to control her own body. Freedom from religion is also at stake here as are hate crime definitions that provide protection for Moslems in the US. That is the freedom the cons overlook every time.
You may not direct me anywhere in history on this subject that would attempt to blur the division between military and diplomatic initiatives. Hello. These are mutually exclusive concepts and one is designed to prevent the other. Got it? Where is JMs diplomacy? In the past 16 years, which party has demonstrated the ability to balance the budget and create surplus. Hey sambo, who turned a $559 billion surplus into a $400 billion deficit in just 8 years? Looks like there already has been a trillion-dollar screw-up that the next administration will be having to clean up. Wonder which party has the most credibility on this one?
Your prescription for poverty sounds like it was lifted straight out of O's plan. Read it before you try to claim it for the party who would ridicule it. My post ends here because the remainder of yours is recycled communist/socialist innuendo that has nothing whatsoever to do with the subject at hand. And the top of the evening to you too, dear.
The silence is pretty amazing.
Where are the pubs defending Bush's plan (and McCain's) to privatize Social Security?
Silence. Did everyone go to the religious board?nm
x
Don't ya just love the silence of the Bushwhackers.......
Must have guzzled too much BJ...........
Silence of the Lambs aka Pubs
Why are the Pubs and so-called "independents" who love to hate President Obama so quiet lately? Could it be the fact that...
U.S. stocks surged around 7 percent on Monday after the Obama administration detailed a plan to purge toxic assets from bank balance sheets, fueling optimism about a revival in bank lending and driving double-digit gains in financial shares.
The S&P 500 and the Dow industrials posted their biggest one-day percentage gains since late October after Wall Street finally got what it was asking for: relief for the battered banking sector and more data suggesting the housing market could be on the mend.
http://www.reuters.com/article/marketsNews/idUSN2329947120090323
More Silence of the Lambs aka Pubs
Their only joy in life comes from whining and complaining, so don't expect to hear from them when something good happens.
Yep, that's how dictators silence the masses...
--
Don't ya love the silence of the Obama lovers?
nm
O was wise ... wait... wait... I'm rolling in the aisle.
LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL
Osamabama 'distances' himself from every lame association he ever had with his rat pack of radical nut job friends.
And if he's lucky enough to get elected, he's going to distance himself from his fawning flock as soon as his advisors tell him there's no way in hades to pay for his free po'folk tax cuts he promised without throwing the economy into the tank.
I was never on SP's side.... s/m
but I think that it was extremely tasteless of this Canadian comedian to post as
French President Sarkozy and interview her for 5 minutes and making fun of her.
Extremely tasteless.
After all she was the running mate of McCain.
I am a democrat.
I don't think that either side... sm
has much room to talk.
I have seen articles, opinions and links posted, apparently by Republicans, about the issues facing Obama, and the first replies are the childish Dems who come on and say "well, it's Bush's fault that he has this or that to deal with" or some other childish remark.
By the same token, I have seen what I believe to be Democrats posting nasty articles and opinions about Sarah Palin and how she is giving interviews, how she obviously doesn't have the sense to be a major political player or whether she gave the clothes back to the party before going back to Alaska.
I'm with BWT. I think the childishness and catiness that I have seen on this board for the last week or so need to end and let's get to discussing the issues at hand. We won't be able to solve a danged one of them, but we can have a civilized adult discussion and we might even learn a thing or two from each other.
Reach across the aisle, folks. 
We are on the same side
I wanted to post and did not want to respond to an Ann fan, so I posted under your reasonable statement.
no just one side
This problem is not just a dem/repub problem. It is a greedy CEO/Wallstreet problem as well. It is a mass amounts of people went out and bought things they couldnt afford and houses they didnt need and couldnt afford problem. Did the gov make them go out and do that? Who made all these people sign their names on these subprime short arm loans that collapsed? It is their fault too. It is also a welfare problem. You know, those people who would rather pop out kids for a job than work for real.
...and just you on the other side.
...but not LAST night.
Get a job.
No one took Eric's side. sm
 But then, you know that. The rest I won't argue with you about. If you use science against God's Word, what more can I say.
The Other Side of Mel Gibson...sm
Disney Cancels Mel Gibson Holocaust Series
The ABC television network has pulled a miniseries about the Holocaust it was developing with Mel Gibson 's production company, the Wall Street Journal reported Tuesday, quoting an unidentified representative for the network.
Gibson was arrested on suspicion of drunk driving early on Friday and was reported to have launched into a tirade against Jews, asking the arresting officer if he was a Jew and blaming the Jews for starting all wars.
The actor, who holds strong conservative Catholic religious and political views and whose father is a Holocaust denier, apologized on Saturday.
The incident has raised questions about the future of projects Gibson and his Icon Productions company are working on, like the ABC television miniseries based on a memoir about a Dutch Jew during World War II, the newspaper said An ABC representative told the paper, without elaborating, it has been two years and the network still has not seen a script, so the project is being pulled.
A spokesperson for ABC, which is owned by Walt Disney Co. , could not be reached for comment.
Disney's movie studio arm still plans to release Gibson 's self-financed Mayan-language movie Apocalypto on Dec. 8, Hollywood's trade papers reported. The Web site Slate.com quoted Walt Disney Studios president Oren Aviv as saying he accepted Gibson 's apology.
Copyright Reuters 2006. All rights reserved. Republication or redistribution of Reuters content, including by caching, framing or similar means, is expressly prohibited without the prior written consent of Reuters.
We're on the same side
I am trying to understand where all this animosity is coming from. Why does it bother you so much that the last democratic president and former first lady/candidate/senator are going to be at the convention? How would it look if they weren’t there? Hillary and Obama are basically on the same page when it comes to policy, so I am guessing this is a personality issue for you? During the primaries, her tactics and strategies left a lot to be desired, to be sure, which may have been a mitigating factor as to why Obama was ultimately able to come out on top but, let’s face it, not by much. It will be extremely important that the party get past its in-fighting and focus on the task at hand of winning the election in November.
Bill and Hillary Clinton are and will remain influential party leaders for a some time to come. It appears that it is her die-hard base supporters that are acting like children. They are the ones who prolonging the division and ill-will which you are expressing here. Both the Clintons have been selected by the Democratic National Convention Committee to speak in Denver for good reason. The DNC recognizes just how pivotal their roles will be in bringing the party back together. This group of HRC’s supporters who are planning to disrupt the convention and demand a roll-call are not very likely to succeed in this effort. This serves no useful purpose whatsoever and is in nobody’s best interests.
Hillary will eventually “crawl back into her hole,” as you so eloquently put it, and return to her position as a junior senator, but not until she has done her job of trying to encourage party unity. I suspect that she still has much to contribute in that capacity and in roles yet undefined in terms of advancing party policies. Try not to take what the newscasters say as gospel. They relish in scandal and controversy. Do not give them the satisfaction. It should come as no surprise that the Clintons are disappointed in the primary results, but that does not mean that they are supposed to fade on off into the sunset. It is not their time to pass...not just yet.
Bill Clinton, a racist? Where is this coming from? Fox News? He does not hide behind mansion walls in the ghetto. His foundation continues to advance the cause of civil and human rights, both here and abroad. It is unfair to write HRC off as a disgrace to women who needs to “just go away,” based on this one less than stellar chapter in her political career. She is much more than that, just as Bill Clinton is much than the "impeached president" you so casually dismiss. I am wondering if you hated him this much while he was in office, or did this arise out of the recent primary process?
In any case, if Obama is defeated, HRC will not be responsible. It will be this divisive in-fighting within the party members that will be the reason. We are between the primaries and the convention. The entire campaign still lies ahead of us. Just give it a little more time. You will see Hillary and Bill come around as party loyalists who will play perhaps the most key roles of all in party unification. This is not just their job. It is up to all democrats to come together this fall and keep their eyes on the prize. Perpetuating this kind of division does nothing to advance that cause. Is this hatred really worth harboring to the extent that, in the end, we will be facing 4 or 8 more years of a republican regime? Try to keep that in mind the next time you find yourself this riled up, and ask yourself what I ask you now….where is this really coming from? I think I know the answer, but I am more interested in hearing yours at the moment.
Disrespect is nothing new on your side...
and it is not just directed at me, and to suggest so is being dishonest at best. You tolerate no opinion other than your own, want to discuss only issues that you are pro and do not tolerate discussion of any other viewpoint, and for people who call themselves Democrats that is a very undemocratic attitude. You hate an entire group of people (all Republicans...well I should say anyone who is not Democrat) for no reason other than that. Two sides? That's rich! There have never been 2 sides.
As to domination of the board....there are about 6 or 8 of you guys to 1 of mine. lol. Talk about blinders.
All voters should consider this regardless of which side
It should be very troubling that the mainstream media has been in the tank for Obama since day one. Ask Hillary Clinton or anyone else who ran (again, R, D, or I).
With that in mind, who gave them the right to choose our next President?
Incidentally, the media (left-wing, of course) actually selected McCain, too. They were absolutely certain that he would be the weakest candidate. Mitt scared the holy hanna out of them. I personally hoped for a Rudy-Fred ticket, in no particular order.
It should be interesting as to how many honest people there are reading this stuff to see how they'll react. Based on what I've read since Palin's speech, she's certainly changed quite a few minds.
The thing that surprises me the most is that the bulk of people on this board is women, yet so many of them put party above the person. I personally don't vote by genitalia. I think it's foolish.
"Woe to the other side who does not
recognize it." What I saw was very scary, an individual who has not clue one about what is going on in this country or out of it. Very scared, indeed. Woe, indeed. You make this election sound like a football game. This is our country, our children's future that is at stake. And no, I didn't find her very knowledgeable in the least, just mouthing words and throwing something someone told her to say. We will see, but I pray to God these two do not get elected.
The other side of the story....
http://www.newsmax.com/smith/barack_obama_tony_rezko/2008/09/02/126890.html
Another side of the coin.....
I respect your beliefs and am very happy you found your niche in life and saved your marriage. Kudos to you! I myself do not question Obama's morals - and I can't say that I question McCain's either. But, Bush got into the white house based on deceptive strategies aimed at leading the populace to believe he was on the moral high ground. (I see the same strategy being used in McCain's campaign). In view of what has transpired over the last 8 years, my faith in the pubs moral high ground has been trampled beyond repair. I believe torture of other human beings to be reprehensible and not advocated by any religion, but it continues and McCain supported it - even though he himself was tortured as a POW. The sex scandals - Larry Craig (airport bathrooms - it was illegal - otherwise, I don't care who he has sex with), Mark Foley (Repub House Representative - Once known as a crusader against child abuse and exploitation, Foley resigned from Congress on September 29, 2006 after allegations surfaced that he had sent suggestive emails and sexually explicit instant messages to teenaged males who had formerly served and were at that time serving as Congressional pages) and now the scandal surrounding the Department of the Interior on charges of getting into bed with big oil (literally and figuratively) drug abuse, etc. I find the whole thing ridiculous to base your campaign on "personality" and moral high ground. I am not saying that Dems did not have their issues with sex scandals - as we all know.
I believe Jesus Christ was once a very highly evolved human being and no longer has to incarnate as a human as he has reached perfection. I believe Buddha was a very highly evolved human being who no longer has to incarnate for the same reason. I believe that Ghandi and Mother Theresa were highly evolved. I believe that energy never disappears, it only changes form. I believe in life after death. I believe that love is the most important thing in life. Humans are not perfect. I do not believe that sex is sin. Dolphins have sex for pleasure and I am not equating humans to aquatic life - but Dolphins are highly intelligent. Do you think God judges them for indulging in pleasure? I believe that exploiting the vulnerable for sex is morally wrong (children, women....that's as far as I'll go on that). Sex between 2 consenting adults is not wrong.
I believe that every religion has it's place on earth and I am in no way authorized or vetted to judge which one is right and which one is wrong. They are all right. Paganism, Wiccan, the Jewish faith, Catholic, Muslim, etc., etc. We, as humans, have the right to decide what is right for us in that regard.
I think all religions know the difference between right and wrong and stealing from others, torturing others, even JUDGING others is morally wrong. You can boil it down to not having ANYTHING to do with religion.
And to believe that whoever is in the white house holds your moral values as a primary reason for decisions that are made is naive. I think the last 8 years proves that and for that reason, I fear more of the same. I am willing to cross party lines just to see if this disaster of a country can be repaired.
The other side of the coin....
Karl Rove would be working to get any Republican elected. That is what he does. He is not a member of the campaign and it is a free country...he can advocate anyone he wants.
If Obama was serious about change he would not have picked a senator who has been in the senate over 30 years. That is not change. That is also more of the same.
James Johnson, of Fannie Mae/Freddie Mac fame, who used to be an economic advisor to Obama...after he came under scrutiny for possible fraud, he left the OBama campaign with his tail between his legs. Don't see much difference in the two.
Other side of the story...
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/2008/09/16/2008-09-16_john_mccain_campaign_releases_troopergat.html
I'm just going to explain our side...
please don't start a war about this.
We are taught in the Bible that homosexuality is wrong and that marriage is between ONE man and ONE woman. We believe in the holy sanctity of marriage. Therefore it is violating the laws of God when homosexuals marry.
Again, it is not the homosexuals that we "hate" or "despise". It is the sin of homosexuality.
I do believe homosexuals are born that way. We are all born into sinful natures. Remember, in God's eyes, all sins are equal. We all have natural tendencies, and that includes homosexuality. I was born a compulsive liar. Since as far back as I can remember I have lied about anything and everything. Now that I am a Christian, that doesn't change. But with the help of Christ I am changing that and I have put away my sinful nature of lying. In the same sense, when a homosexual comes to know the true Christ, He will give them new desires and help them to withstand the temptation to go back to their old ways.
I know most of you won't understand this, but I just wanted to give you our viewpoint. True Christians do not hate homosexuals, or blacks, or immigrants, or abortionists, or anyone else. We just hate the sin, because sin separates us from God.
We want a president who is going to keep the sanctity of marriage, meaning one man and one woman. Marriage came from God, and it is a holy matrimony.
Please don't flame, I'm just trying to explain in a way that maybe you can understand. I see it from your side too. Before I became a Christian I didn't understand the big deal either. But now I do and I see the big picture. If God had meant for man and man or woman and woman to be together, he would have given us the "parts" to be able to do so.
On the lighter side (maybe)
This was sent to me from a friend. Don't know where the info came from.
Guess who I am?
I am 42 years old
I love the outdoors,
I hunt,
I am a Republican reformer,
I have taken on the Republican Party establishment,
I have five children,
I have a spot on the national ticket as vice-president
with less than two years in the governor's office.
Who am I?
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I am Teddy Roosevelt in 1900
How can anyone say that Sarah Palin is not qualified?
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And I'll be right there on the side with you.
I gotta take a break, this board is making me crazy.
On a side note..
Where in the Mojave desert did you live? I grew up in a tiny town called Inyokern and went to high school in Lone Pine.
On the up side of things.........sm
Since I've been such a downer, gloom and doom "prophet" in my last posts , here is an article that recommends buying now, if you have the cash and the stomach for it, and reap the rewards 10 or 20 years down the road. Might be our solution to no Social Security when that time comes.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/27829555/
I think I have the other side of the story.
I've been watching all those other stations for years. I just started watching Fox lately. How much more "open-minded" do you want me to be???
...and on the flip side...we will soon see...sm
what Obama will do with his regime.
I have a feeling it won't be pretty.
At least we'll have a reason to throw all the democrats out of all branches of offices when they fall flat on their you know whatsits, and find they can't do what they think they can.
The American people won't stand for what the country is about to become, you included, once you wise up and see what's about to come.
What other side this weekend???
I've been on all weekend and it is more drone of the libs praising their god and arguing with anyone who doesn't agree with them.
Who's side you on, Willis?
Bush is the one who refused to do anything about the illegals (cheap help for the rich). Oh, that's right, It's O's job to clean up Bush's mess and he just isn't doing it fast enough to please you. Darn. Heck, Bush would sign anything with a great flourish of the pen and an idiotic grin! He sho did love them cameras!
Why so bitter? Because your side
Typical sore-loser attitude.
I agree. But, you see, when the other side has no
nm
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