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Thx - the attacks are really getting out of hand

Posted By: Kaydie on 2008-09-15
In Reply to: Thanks, kaydie. Good post. nm - sam

Reminds me of that line in the movie where the guy says "I'm mad as he!! and I'm not going to take it anymore". Really though, I've read back through all the posts and not one post about something positive about Obama's plans. Just attacks to the other side and other posters. I feel if I'm going to get this I might as well just turn on MSNBC, and now I get my MIL who has such hatred for Bush is coming out saying that today market failure (whatever you call it- that 300 or so point drop) she's saying that is McCain and Palin' fault. I don't even get into political arguments with her anymore. It's just mind numbing how closed their minds are. Glad you liked my post.


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And my politics and faith are hand in hand. Plus I'm just answering her question.
x
The 2 issues you describe usually go hand-in-hand.
keep women out of power. The old 'barefoot-and-pregnant' story. As a feminist, I wouldn't vote for a candidate who was against EITHER issue. Being pro-choice has nothing to do with hating babies, etc. Pro-choice has to do with keeping a very personal, private choice just that: Personal & Private, between a woman and her doctor, and no-one else. If a woman hasn't any power over her OWN reproductive system, and whether or not the time is right (if ever) to bear a child, she certainly isn't going to be given much else to be in charge of, either.

The only reason this issue EVER became a hotbed political issue is that the religious fanatics in this country, who have been trying to control the reins of government, picked an issue that was certain to divide people. They took this choice out of the doctor's office and put it in the public eye so that the country could be divided, and in that way 'conquered'. Have to hand it to 'em, some of the campaign tactics, as repugnant as they are, have been pretty slick. Shows they've got some pretty fancy lawyers. The terrorist tactics (threatening, and even sometimes killing) docs who perform TABs; harrassing women entering family-planning clinics; and chasing some family planning clinics out of some towns.

There used to be a clinic a few blocks from my home, and every Friday this looney-tune and his whacked-out buddies would block park a truck with pictures of fetuses on it, and would block an entire sidewalk with their signs, fake babies (dolls), themselves, etc. I guess they think they're scaring people with their pictures & signs, but it only serves to infuriate them. In large part, the attempts to overthrow Roe vs Wade by the religious lunatics of the world is one of the main reasons I stopped voting Republican after Ronald Reagan, and voted Democratic instead.

And then of course there is the issue of our jobs. When that all started going down the toilet (or shall I say - to the Third World) I realized the 'trickle-down effect' I'd been led to believe when I was a Republican in the past was a lie. It doesn't trickle DOWN, the money only gushes UP -- to the ones who already have the most of it.
politics and religion go hand in hand...
Whether or not we like it, many of our laws are governed by religion. Without some sort of religion, who is to say that murder is "wrong," thus making it a religious argument, not a political one (by your methodology) and, yet, we still have a law against it.
I have seen some bullying get out of hand first hand
during the same grocery strikes that I referred to in the very small town where I grew up. Scabs were beat up and such. I am not saying it's the norm, but there can be tremendous pressure to vote one way or another--as can be seen right here.
need more attacks
More liberals need to start attacking back at the neocons.  For too long we have remained quiet while the republicans have been in full attack mode, especially during last year's election, smearing a true Vietnam hero, Kerry, whereas Bush never even finished his National Guard duty and Cheney and Rumsfield never went into the military but they find it is quite alright to send our sons and daughters to war for nothing.  We need more liberals to start screaming out about the terrible people in the WH. 
No Attacks?
Anthrax.
No need for attacks
he got what he wanted which was the Iraq War and taking out Sudam.  Show me bin Laden and maybe I'll be willing to give Bush some credit.  Something mighty strange that we with the mightiest miliary in the world can't get him.  But I guess Cheney would say, "SO??????"  What a couple of crooks!
How many terrorists attacks have we had since 911
nm
we don;t need personal attacks.

nm


 


personal attacks are

not allowed on this board. Stop immediately.


 


personal attacks are

not allowed on this board.  Stop attacking me personally with your imagining what I have or don't have in my work area.  Stick to the issues.


 


Why the personal attacks?

This has nothing to do with this conversation.  What this person makes and why they make that is none of our business.  The point was that she didn't live beyond her means and doesn't want a handout and that right there makes her a heck of a lot better than a lot of people. 


Let's talk about attacks....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YeVBaM2lQsg

http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=28656#continueA

http://newsbusters.org/blogs/warner-todd-huston/2008/09/12/conn-paper-tired-attacking-palin-attacks-angry-town-wasilla-inst

http://fredshelm.wordpress.com/2008/08/31/debunking-the-moonbat-attacks-against-palin-part-1/

There are plenty more, those are just a few.
It is called more attacks like the one we went through
Do you actually believe the govt is telling us about each and every plot they help dismantle to make the country safer. Oooh- can I be in your fantasy movie.

People may hate GW - You know our "President of the United States", but Americans (the patriotic ones that is) are grateful for the policies that have been put in place that enable them to find out when things are happening so we will not endure another 911. Sorry you don't like the fact, but that's what they are.

I for one am very grateful we have not been attacked again.

"And I'm proud to be an American where at least I know I'm free. And I won't forget the men who died who gave that right to me. And I'll gladly stand up next to you and defend her still today. Cos there ain't no doubt I love this land. God bless the USA!"
The attacks didn't happen here

they happened in London, England and you don't see people London whining and acting like the world is coming to the end.  They got up and got on those darned buses and trains.  These terrorists made very little headway at all yesterday. 


You all don't get the point do you?   You really don't.  No matter where we are in the world you're going to find fault with it as long as it is done under conservative leadership.


I think I understood every word you said loud and clear. 


and the personal attacks continue

Occurs to me there's no basis in any of your attacks.
Name one thing I made up and we'll see what the truth is. Go ahead, poser - explain what you mean.
Foiled Terror Attacks...sm
http://articles.news.aol.com/news/_a/britain-thwarts-plot-to-bomb-us-bound/20060810015209990001?ncid=NWS00010000000001
Fox Attacks Barack Obama..sm
(see link)
We were told by moderator -no more attacks on
nm
And now we revert to personal attacks
on posters when you can't them to agree with you.  What a waste.
Stop the personal attacks. SM

Stop with personal attacks, the vile name-calling, grammar policing and foul language.


Debate the issues.  Respect opinions. 


I'm not moderating for niceness but there is some troll behavior going on and it has to go. 


Moderator


 


Of course it's the fault of the terrorists for carrying out attacks.

And it's the fault of this president for obsessing about Saddam Hussein (since he's been doing since the early 1990s) and not doing enough to protect his own people from future attacks.


The terrorists have all the power here.  They're holding all the cards.  They once again managed to scare a large part of the world.  They also know something that American soldiers DON'T know.  The know what the outcome of their plan is going to be.  They use the element of surprise, and when they wake up in the morning, they don't wonder if they're still going to be alive the next day.  They already KNOW they won't be because they've planned it that way.  They control their own fate, as well as the fate of everyone who gets in their way.


Our soldiers have to deal with that every single day.  A car bomb here.  A suicide bomber there.  Every single day is 9/11 for them.  It sounds real nice to pretend to respect and honor them when participating in a photo op on an aircraft carrier.  Why doesn't he care enough about their lives to provide adequate body armor and Humvees for them?  He has no problem giving big tax breaks to his rich base (and YES, they are his REAL base, not the Christian right; just wait till he betrays you all with his moderate Supreme Court nominees). He has no problem giving free healthcare to all Iraqis. Forget about the American people for a minute. Why can't he care about our troops -- our CHILDREN -- enough to supply them with adequate equipment?  Of course, he personally would not know what constitutes adequate equipment because HE WAS TOO MUCH OF A COWARD TO EVER SERVE IN COMBAT.


As far as giving this President too much credit, you obviously didn't comprehend one word of my post.


HELLO!


can we just debate and stop with the personal attacks?
I know, Democrat, I know, and if I come across as harsh sometimes, that is just me..however, the post below that I condone terrorism really cut me..I have never condoned terrorism..to protest, of course, that is part of America, long live protests, but to say I condone terrorism..OMG..I have tried to debate logically, of course, not what conservatives believe but that is what debating is all about..two different ideas..I have not attacked personally  yet these neocons continue to post on the liberal board and attack the liberals for what they have posted and they have attacked me non stop..I thought a few weeks ago we made a deal that we would post respectfully  but the minute I started posting once again, there has been nothing but attacks, not logical insightful debate..If a neocon does not agree with me that Chavez is a good man or that I agree with protesting in Argentina (not breaking the law, just protesting), well then lets debate it..dont attack me and call me a terrorist..which I take very seriously and it is an affront to me, it is like cursing at me..Oh geez..I do have to say, Democrat, you have always posted above and beyond board..I have always enjoyed reading your posts..
Reminder: Watch the personal attacks. sm

Debate opinions, argue conflicting viewpoints.  Steer clear of personal attacks.


Thanks,


Moderator


 


It may be hard to credit Bush with no attacks when there is...sm
nothing tangible to show for it, right?


But then, that's the whole point.


No attacks on U.S. soil since 9/11.


There's the proof.


I'll be a believer and give President Bush the credit for this one.
Draft Dodger Cheney attacks War Hero
The words President Murtha are sounding pretty good!

 

DERRICK Z. JACKSON

White House plays chicken with a war hero



THE WHITE House is so deluded, it actually believes it can turn a soaring hawk into a scrounging chicken. Stung by the call by US Representative John Murtha of Pennsylvania to pull out of Iraq, Scott McClellan, President Bush's press secretary, said this week, ''It is baffling that he is endorsing the policy positions of Michael Moore and the extreme liberal wing of the Democratic Party.


Talk about playing the chicken-hawk card. A White House where most of the architects of war avoided combat in their own lives dared to associate two people who are worlds apart in world views. Moore made the anti-Bush ''Fahrenheit 9/11, which infuriated the right wing by breaking box office records for a documentary film. Moore was booed at the 2004 Republican National Convention.


Murtha is the 73-year-old recipient of two Purple Hearts and a Bronze Star for combat duty in Vietnam. He is a Democrat whose three decades in office are marked by support of President Reagan's policies in Nicaragua and El Salvador. Murtha was a top Democratic supporter of the 1991 Gulf War. He wants a constitutional ban on burning the American flag.


In a 2002 press briefing, former Deputy Defense Secretary Paul Wolfowitz termed the support of politicians like Murtha for the Pentagon as ''wonderful. In the 2004 vice presidential debate, incumbent Dick Cheney said, ''One of my strongest allies in Congress when I was secretary of defense was Jack Murtha.


For all those shows of patriotism, Murtha was skeptical about the rush to invade Iraq in 2003 of Iraq even though he voted to give President Bush the authorization to go to war. He publicly said Bush beat the war drums before building an international coalition. Murtha said he had not seen anything in intelligence reports that indicated an imminent threat. Murtha said Bush ''has put the country in such a box. He can say, 'You'll undercut me if you don't vote for this resolution.'


One month after the invasion, when no weapons of mass destruction had yet been found, Murtha warned that American credibility was at risk. By the September, the absence of weapons of mass destruction made him join the much more liberal House minority leader, Nancy Pelosi, in calling for Bush to fire the planners of the invasion. Despite the proclamation that ''we achieved a marvelous military victory, Murtha became increasingly frustrated with the chaos of the occupation. This summer, Murtha said administration officials were ''not honest in their assessment that they were winning the ongoing battle.


Finally, this week, Murtha unleased a scathing attack on Bush's Iraq policy. He called it ''a flawed policy wrapped in illusion. He said he believed military officials when he visited Kuwait just before the war and they showed him where American forces would be attacked by weapons of mass destruction when they approach Baghdad. But now, with no end to the killing in sight, he said, ''The US cannot accomplish anything further in Iraq militarily. It's time to bring the troops home. . .They have become the enemy.


Murtha talked about soldier after soldier he has visited in hospitals, wounded and maimed by the invasion. Yet, there's more terrorism now than there ever was and it's because of what? Is it because of our policy? I would say it's a big part.


In perhaps the most humble admission of his press conference, Murtha said, ''The American public is way ahead of the members of Congress.


This came the day after Cheney threw mud in the direction of critics who gave Bush his war authorization. Cheney accused them of making ''irresponsible comments. He accused them issuing ''cynical and pernicious falsehoods to make ''a play for political advantage.


He said, ''The President and I cannot prevent certain politicians from losing their memory -- or their backbone.


This was the same Cheney who gave us some of the greatest falsehoods of this generation with ''There is no doubt that Saddam Hussein now has weapons of mass destruction . . . We believe he has, in fact, reconstituted nuclear weapons, and that we would be ''welcomed as liberators.


Murtha clobbered Cheney's words the next day, saying, ''I like guys who got five deferments and never been there and send people to war and then don't like to hear suggestions about what needs to be done.


This hawk still soars, above the scrounging chicken hawks.


Derrick Z. Jackson's e-mail address is jackson@globe.com.  src=http://cache.boston.com/bonzai-fba/File-Based_Image_Resource/dingbat_story_end_icon.gif



src=http://cache.boston.com/bonzai-fba/File-Based_Image_Resource/spacer.gif
© Copyright 2005 The New York Times Company
 












No, I didn't....it was in response to all the attacks about unwed mothers..
but i guess you feel that is okay, right?
Senior moments on the trail: Mc attacks O ties to

For the slur that was dead on arrival, go here:


http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/10/the-khalidi-gam.html


 


Missile attacks targeted Al Qaeda strongholds.
President Obama is targeting the terrorists who are responsible for 9/11 and who may be planning future terrorist attacks against the United States. That is what he said he would do before he was elected, and that is exactly what he has done during his first week in office. President Obama has already done more to keep our country safe in the past 4 days than Georgie Porgie did in the past 8 years.
Shocking personal attacks after you just called people empty headed?
the hypocrisy is mind boggling and humorous at the same time.
Evil constant attacks on Palin are about to bring the biggest backlash
I believe you may have cost yourselves the election with the horrendous extent this was taken to.
hand ups?
On a prior post, I dont know which conservative one of them posted to me that democrats only give hand outs, republicans give hand ups.  I asked her to post what hand ups republicans ever have given to the poor and disadvantaged and all I got was a tirade about democrats promoting welfare, etc..the usual baloney from republicans..I still would like the poster to give me a few examples of what ever have republicans done to help the poor of America.
On the other hand....
Since all you guys couldn't see any big deal with Clinton's lying, you should'nt be losing too much sleep over this.
on the other hand
if a teacher was teaching a geography class and was teaching say on Israel. If he/she brought up say the name, Jesus Christ, and gave his opinion about Christ (let's assume the teacher is pro Jesus Christ) then I think his head would have rolled. He wouldn't be on leave. He would be fired immediately.

I heard the excerpts of this tape and the guy was off the deep end and basically giving a political diatribe. If a teacher cannot talk about religion and reiterate their beliefs I think the same should go for politics. Heck, I took three different POLITICAL science classes between the time I went to high school and graduated college, and all those teachers managed not to go off on a diatribe about a particular politician or a political group. As a class we did discuss the differences, but the teachers remained professionally neutral. I think a geography teacher should be professional and objective enough to teach geography without calling someone Hitler.

The darned thing about free speech is that it needs to be applied to everyone not just the viewpoints that one particular group agrees with. I have no problem with free speech as long as the opposite viewpoint is welcomed too. This does not seem to be happening in public schools. It seems one particular political viewpoint wants to hold a monopoly on free speech, and monopolozing free speech is basically nullifying it.
On the other hand.......
There are people who consider themselves homosexuals but because THEY believe it is wrong to act upon those feelings, they and only they choose not to participate in homosexual acts. Why is that?
then she should sue for $1, another lib with hand out....nm
//
That's not God's hand,....(sm)
that's US money.
On the Other Hand
The Republicans specifically slashed $40 billion in direct aid to states from this bill, states that are already reeling from budget shortfalls. This means huge cutbacks in essential state services like police, firefighters, teachers, and state hospitals and massive state layoffs in all areas. This will result in the loss of about 500,000 jobs as a consequence of slashing direct aid to states.

There was absolutely no reason to deny this aid to states except for Senate Republicans deciding they had to cut something, so this was it. They have no coherent approach to the stimulus package except that they don't like spending of any kind, and they've built up the least effective parts of the bill at the expense of the most effective parts.

Our house is on fire!!! And one factor of the fire department thinks the best way to put out the fire is with fewer firefighters and tax cuts, and they want to study the fire some more.
on the other hand...
We have gotten weekly checks regularly for 3 years (not enough to do anything with, but some grocery money) and all his medical expenses have been paid. However, we are now looking at not having any more medical care for the next 15 years because they refuse to do the knee replacement he needs until he is 45 years old. Also, the WC weekly checks are only there for 7 years total. After that, they owe you nothing. Plus, once you go back to work, the WC is hard to get to pay because they try to claim that you "reinjured" yourself on your new job.

We have a very good doctor that we use, he is just limited to the treatments he can offer.

Now, we will just have to let our private health insurance start picking up the payments for anything done.
On the other hand
Does this mean the affected couples can use this as a tax deduction since requiring a permit for the scheduled gatherings would put them into the 'business' category?

It would be well worth checking into.

Fight fire with fire...
You might be right, on the other hand. (see inside)

hand ups?? Where?? When?? In your dreams.
You mean like hand ups into the noose of a rope?  Hand ups into the rope tied behind a car to drag a poor unfortunate Black man?  Hand ups with a full five fingers and then put the other ones down and only leave the middle one standing?  Where, where have republicans given a hand up to the poor and unfortunate in America?  It has always been the democrats who have devised programs to help unfortunates..and yet when republicans fall on hard times they will use the democratic programs.  I have a friend who is solid republican and we decided years ago not to talk politics, to save our friendship.  Yet, when she got pregnant and had no one to turn to, as she was unmarried and her family was not nearby..what did she do?  Applied for Welfare, Medicare, you name it..The government paid for her pregnancy and surgery and has continued to pay for health care for her daughter..Yet, she is one who always would nag me and rag me about being democrat/liberal..Republicans are a bunch of hypocrites.
The upper hand? TI
17 plus Arab nations and Israel. Yes.  That makes sense.
2 first hand experiences
1) In London, many many years ago when my then husband was a chemical engineer working in the Middle East (we were on vacation in London) I became sick and a friend took me to a clinic. I saw a doctor, had tests, 1 xray, got medications and walked out. I kept asking "where do I pay, who do I pay?" and they said, it is free and I was not even a British citizen.

2) As far as insurance companies and pharmaceutical companies go...there is the crux of the problem. When we moved here to Tennessee, I went all over the place trying to get some assistance with my medication bills which had cost me close to $500 per month in Florida. I was not poor enough to qualify for any supplementals, and could not afford $500 a month (I had cut down to the 3 meds I really needed in Florida and just did without the other 2). Anyway, eventually, due to East Tennessee being a poor part of the state and people going without here a lot, certain pharmacies have cut almost all their overhead and have the least expensive of all medications. These are small "mom and pop" places, completely legal and above board, in fact, most are across the street from hospitals for convenience. What once cost me $500 for all 5 RXs now costs me $68. What does that tell you about pharmaceutical companies. I have a hard time believing the insurance companies are any better. Quite a profit margin I would say.

I have seen the stories about people going to India. They say the cost of flying, medical attention and aftercare is still less than it is here and that they can see a doctor of their choosing at a hospital of their choosing. It was on 20/20 or 60 minutes.
Thanks for the hand across the aisle GT...
and please keep your moniker if you wish...it does fit your life experience. I will remain sam. And yes, I believe we are big enough to put this behind us and start new. Neither of us are wrong...we are just very different...that doesn't mean we can't discuss and try to understand one another. I do look forward to lively discussions...I wish you the best in your job search, hope you find a really great one.

Looking forward to your return!
Thanks for that hand across the aisle...
and you hit the nail on the head. We are different, but we can find common ground and be civil. I look forward to visiting with you in the future about all the issues. Good evening to ya!
Sure and the pubs had no hand in it at all.
Maybe if the pubs weren't so against regulating it may have been averted too.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/22/us/politics/22mccain.html?_r=2&adxnnl=1&oref=slogin&ref=politics&pagewanted=print&adxnnlx=1222092873-DDzUm2VKJMYWutTohJrNDQ
You want to know about |AIG first hand? I live in...sm
Stowe Vermont. The Stowe ski resort was built as a pet project many years ago by AIG. It was very low key for many, many years for many reasons, zoning etc. So lovely and pristine, no high rise condos, a quaint small town Vermont experience. A few years ago, after years of wrangling, permits were obtained for a huge VERY luxury hotel, ski base lodge, million plus dollar condos, high end shopping in a ski village etc. Fast forward a few years, the hotel is completed and the base lodge almost done, condos halfway complete, no village yet. I guess that technically we Americans now own 80% of this resort. Maybe I can get a subsidized ski pass? I haven't heard of any slow down with the development, but I could be wrong. I wonder if we will be sold off but I doubt it. Very interesting. No one has any idea of the excesses of corporate America over the last 50 years.
You sure do hand her credit for ...
having a lot of power. I like Palin, but I don't believe that she has the power to "almost single handedly divide the country." Perhaps she is a better leader than I thought...
Then fairness should go on the other hand
Just skip over the posts you don't like.