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U. healthcare IS a disaster in other countries.

Posted By: Will be here too, why would it NOT?!!!nm on 2009-04-29
In Reply to: Good thing we have PSYCHIC wisdom on the board - Very reassuring!

nm


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But, the war on terror concerns all countries. Other countries
acknowledge the war on terror as concerning the world, so it is essentially a World War. 
what "obama disaster"
Obama has not even started yet! What could you possibly mean? Fartface is supposed to still be in charge - what a joke.
What "Obama disaster"?
I do keep up with the news, and you didn't answer the question.


....and the beginning of a disaster.
nm
....and the beginning of a disaster. - nm
.
Delta Disaster: Hang Together.



New





DELTA DISASTER:
HANG TOGETHER

By JOHN PODHORETZ

FOR the second time in four years, the United States has been changed utterly by a previously unthinkable event. And just as was the case after 9/11, how this nation responds to the deluge that is sweeping New Orleans away will help define the nature of its character for decades.

Just as Rudy Giuliani said that the death toll from 9/11 would be more than any of us can bear, the same is already true of Katrina. Who can begin to take in the notion that in the United States in the 21st century, a storm could kill in staggering numbers?

At the beginning of the 20th century, something like 8,000 people perished when Galveston, Texas — unprotected from storm swells at the time — was hit by a hurricane. But when Hurricane Andrew leveled the entire town of Homestead, Fla., 13 years ago and became the most financially deadly storm in American history, it took only 15 lives.

Now we're talking about several hundred times that number in the literal swamping of one of the world's great cities.

There can be no doubt that the immediate response will be one of breathtaking generosity — financial, spiritual and personal. That's what we saw in the wake of 9/11, it's what happened after the tsunami in December, and it's what we will begin to see as the next few days pass.

But what we don't yet know is this: Are we going to try to look forward, to figure out how to save New Orleans and prevent another calamity of this sort there and elsewhere? Or are we going to begin finger-pointing, searching for villains among the debris?

Some of that villain-hunting has already begun, in the typically vulgar, unwisely speedy efforts made by overly assured ideologues certain that they can connect a cataclysm to a pet issue — whether it be the American failure to pass the Kyoto global warming treaty or making the claim that spending on the war in Iraq squeezed out the possibility of shoring up the New Orleans levees.

Here we see the stirrings of a spiritual divisiveness taking hold — in the form of a know-nothing populism that sweeps everything in its wake and brings everything into the courtroom.

What happened here was a natural disaster. But there will be the temptation to turn it into a human conspiracy of greed and selfishness on the part of oil companies, concrete companies, politicians, insurers, re-insurers, goonish cops and the like.

If the recriminations become the story of the next months, everybody will simply go to the usual battle stations. The tort reformers will take on the trial lawyers. The global-warming crowd will face off against American business. The politicians will scream at each other, scoff at each other, and try to find some cheap advantage that will turn the tide against one party or the other.

The good that will be done —person by person, donation by donation, community by community — will be in danger of getting swamped by the bitterness and divisiveness that characterizes contemporary elite politics. Rather than finding common ground, there will be ugly partisanship and a cold standoff.

The horror of a flood is literally, very nearly the oldest story in the Book. There have always been times that the water will rise higher than the walls men can build to contain it. The New Orleans system survived the battering of nature for more than 200 years — but it met its match and was overwhelmed by it.

The best we can do is comfort the afflicted, mourn the lost, and try to rebuild. The worst we can do is turn on each other.

So what shall it be? E-mail:

podhoretz@nypost.com




Not even interested in the architects of the 9/11 disaster. sm
They either have more lucrative interests in Iraq or are just bent on ridding it of Saddam or all of the above (too much history there), and we all know good and well there were no jihadist extremist there before America invaded that country, so this so-called War on Terror in Iraq was INVENTED.
What do you mean "what Obama disaster"
Haven't you been keeping up with the news. He doesn't need to take office for all the disasters that are heading our way. Unfortunately this is not going to be taken care of before he gets in the office and if you think things are bad now, just wait.

The Obama disaster? Should be the Obama disasters. There are many more than just one.
...the beginning of a disaster - how true
See I can keep repeating over and over. What does bitter have to do with anything. This will end up being a disastrous 4 years coming up. Look at his ideals, his line up crew of who he is picking. The Clinton administration was a disaster. He's picking all the same people again, hence another disaster.
Anything to distract us from this current disaster
nm
I say they are going to other countries because ---
they get an incentive to go to the other countries,not because they are taxed too much - take away that incentive and see how many of them give the jobs back to us Americans!

And on $250,000 a year, I do not think that an extra $7500 is going to break the business - they will just find that many more deductions to lower their tax obligations.
Here are other countries that think --
Here are some of the other countries that think mandatory civil service is a good thing.

Which one of these countries would you like to live in? Or send your children to?

People's Republic of China
Albania
Colombia
Cyprus
Iran
South Korea
Russia
Serbia
Singapore
Turkey
Ukraine
So, because some other countries.....(sm)

have worse torture methods....that makes it okay for us to torture?  Yeah....that almost made sense.  So much for morality, holding ourselves to higher standards, being civilized....but hey, we're Americans, so it must be okay for US to do it. 


Communist, socialist, fascist?  No.....more like honest and a realist.  I love my country, but I am not so blinded by patriotism that I can't see our faults.


financial disaster, war, health care
You decide what is most important to think about. 
SP is a one-woman disaster area, but she'll
when it comes time for McC to start pointing fingers, the way some of the brighter pubs have already been doing.
It'll only be a disaster (I HOPE!) for all the corrupt
it'll also be a 'disaster' for all the unscrupulous companies in the US that send our work to India. That kind of a 'disaster' has been long awaited, and eagerly anticipated.

US MTSO's better start re-thinking their pay scales, because hopefully their 'sacred' cash-cow (India) is about to run out o' milk.
What other industrial countries would that be? sm
England had an immediate revolt as did France when they realized how their economy would be affected.  This is no argument.  Japan has reported it cannot meet the guideline deadlines.  In fact, nearly every country who signed (in a wise move, Russia did not) is having a major problem this.  This is a giant pink elephant.  The United States and the Bush administration continue to draw criticism for its refusal to ratify. President Bush refused to ratify the Protocol in 2001, claiming that it would hurt the U. S. economy, costing $400 billion and over 4.9 million jobs.  This agreement is grossly unfair because it exempts 80% of the world, including developing countries like China and India.  Tell me the good part of this.
Finding a way to GET ALONG WITH other countries would
!
The problem with that is now most countries
think of us as the bully. Now we can say we don't care what anyone else thinks, but we should. We need to. Preemptive is a sure way to make more Americans suffer. I am certainly not suggesting we sit and do nothing when we are attacked, but let's go after the people that came after us. That wasn't Iraq until after Saddam was out, AL Qaeda started in. Let's be real, the only reason we went there to begin with was for oil.

I too agree that we need both some drilling and a lot of work on new energy sources, new ideas, etc. We also need people to be more responsible. No, I don't call myself naive for saying that. Everyone needs to do their part.

Let's also be realistic, no candidate is going to do what they promises with spending until they get in there and start crunching numbers. They can promise whatever they want, but when the time comes it most likely won't happen. They can want to do a lot, but that doesn't mean they'll be able to. McCain's plan is not great either - we already have Greenspan saying that we cannot afford it.
well you mentioned those countries
in reference to our new socialist societies and you brought up the revolution, so ...
Other countries are 100% for Obama
It's very worrisome to think about that. I saw cover pages on a couple of papers in the news where they're saying nex to to Obama's picture "I am the one," in another one "The Messiah."
Other countries are not so crazy about him
I mentioned in another post that a lot of other countries do NOT want him to be the president. People in other countries are describing concerns as he says he is going to change the world and they like their countries just the way they are. The only countries that do want him as our president are our enemies.
Has to make you think about that one.
Do you know why other countries support O?
nm
Return them to their own countries......... sm
if they must be released at all. The left is screaming that we should not interfer with other countries' governments, that we should not force our democratic way of life on them. They certainly were not concerned in the least with our own citizens' human rights when they flew planes into the towers and the Pentagon and in a field in PA.

I say, if they must be released, release them to their own country where they can receive a trial according on their own laws.
But not all countries welcome the US' interference..nm
nm
The "other countries" as you say are

taking in the "safe" detainees...the ones that charges were dropped, etc. What is left will be the dangerous ones and guess who's country is going to be stuck with them?


O better get a good plan for the dangerous ones and he better NOT bring them into our country. I don't care what anyone says, they don't deserve to be in our country and having the same rights as citizens at trial.


Palin's pending pastor disaster. As requested,
Thanks to Fox's Rev Wright feeding frenzy/orgy, the media now spotlights SP's religious upbringing. Here are some "legitimate" sources of info on the newest area of inquiry into SP's views, mentors, influences, etc., as we become more acquainted with JM's VP pick. A nutshell description might be politics based on the concept of manifest destiny. Most of these sources have often been cited by right-singers on this site. Keep in mind, these are only the early returns on this inquiry. Stay tuned.

http://www.wasillaag.net/
Due to the avalanche of inquiries, the Wasilla Assembly of God Q&A link has crashed and burned for the time being. Their Official Statement on Sarah Palin is posted here.

http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/the_daily_dish/2008/09/sarah-palins-je.html
Statement from Senior Pastor Ed Kalnins on war, including "I believe that Jesus himself operated from that position of war mode."

http://www.nypost.com/seven/09032008/news/nationalnews/church_prayer_for_iraq_war_127206.htm
"Church Prayer for Iraq War." US soldiers battling terrorists in Iraq are "striving to do what's right" and are part of "a task . . . from God," Sarah Palin told worshippers at a conservative Pentecostal church earlier this year.

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0908/13098.html
"Jewish voters may be wary of Palin." After growing up in Wasilla Assembly of God, she switched to Wasilla Bible Church. This article deals with their views of Jews and Jews views of them. Visitors to the pulpit: David Brickner, of Jews for Jesus, who according to the Anti-Defamation League is “targeting Jews for conversion with subterfuge and deception,” asserts in essence that it's okay to bulldoze Palestinians. He goes on to say, "…terrorist attacks on Israelis as God's "judgment of unbelief" of Jews who haven't embraced Christianity."

http://blogs.marketwatch.com/election/2008/09/02/palin-said-war-in-iraq-gas-pipeline-are-gods-will/
"Palin said war in Iraq, gas pipeline are God’s will."

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/the-trail/2008/09/02/by_juliet_eilperin_when_alaska.html
Palin Asks for Prayers That War Be "Task That Is From God"

http://www.swamppolitics.com/news/politics/blog/2008/09/palins_past_pastor_bushfoes_he.html Tribunes Washington Bureau
"Palin's Past Pastor: Bush foes Hell-bound"

http://www.radaronline.com/exclusives/2008/09/meet-sarah-palins-pastor-ed-kalnins.php
"Meet Sarah Palin's Rev. Wright"
On John Kerry supporters: "I'm not going tell you who to vote for, but if you vote for this particular person, I question your salvation. I'm sorry."

Yeah, I am hoping Obama WONT be a disaster.
nm
Yeah, I am hoping Obama WONT be a disaster
See I too can keep repeating like you.
Distract from Obama's disaster by bashing Bush
nm
List of countries we have bombed
Here are the countries we bombed between WWII and 1999:

China
Korea
China
Guatemala
Indonesia
Cuba
Guatemala
Vietnam
Congo
Laos
Peru
Guatemala
Cambodia
El Salvador
Nicaragua
Grenada
Libya
Panama
Iraq
Bosnia
Sudan
Afghanistan
Yugoslavia

There are atrocities in lots of countries
and nobody seems to give a dam@. We are only interested in countries that have something we want.
Please notice countries in the EU maintain
as sovereign nations, each with their own cultures, languages, laws, etc. The idea is to identify common interests and to unite under certain criteria for the betterment of the region AND of each member state. It is sort of similar to the concept of the United States, only it is a union of separate nations with overarcing federal republic standards which each member nation strives to meet.
These are the 16 countries in the Middle East...s/m
Countries in the Middle East, they are all Arab
States, except Israel and Iran.

Bahrain

Gaza Strip

Iran

Iraq

Israel

Jordan

Kuwait

Lebanon

Oman

Qatar

Saudi Arabia

Syria

United Arab Emirates

West Bank

Yemen




People are so ignorant! Other countries with
nm
As are 3rd World countries, because Dubya
THAT's where the outrage belongs.
No other leaders of other countries bowed
At least none that I'm finding. I could be wrong but I've been searching to see if other world leaders like France, PM Gordon Brown, Swiss, or any other leaders that attended the summit if they bowed. I'm not finding anything. Only the One.
I wasn't kidding. I don't remember a disaster like Katrina during the Clinton sm
presidency with someone inexperienced at the helm of the fed agency responsible for it, but I will do my research on travelgate.
*Heckuvajob Brownie* starts disaster planning firm
Ex-FEMA Head Starts Disaster Planning Firm




Former FEMA Director Michael Brown, heavily criticized for his agency's slow response to Hurricane Katrina, is starting a disaster preparedness consulting firm to help clients avoid the sort of errors that cost him his job.


If I can help people focus on preparedness, how to be better prepared in their homes and better prepared in their businesses — because that goes straight to the bottom line — then I hope I can help the country in some way, Brown told the Rocky Mountain News for its Thursday editions.


Brown said officials need to take inventory of what's going on in a disaster to be able to answer questions to avoid appearing unaware of how serious a situation is.


In the aftermath of the hurricane, critics complained about Brown's lack of formal emergency management experience and e-mails that later surfaced showed him as out of touch with the extent of the devastation.


The lawyer admits that while he was head of the Federal Emergency Management Agency mistakes were made in the response to Katrina. He also said he had been planning to quit before the hurricane hit.


Hurricane Katrina showed how bad disasters can be, and there's an incredible need for individuals and businesses to understand how important preparedness is, he said.


Brown said companies already have expressed interested in his consulting business, Michael D. Brown LLC. He plans to run it from the Boulder area, where he lived before joining the Bush administration in 2001.


I'm doing a lot of good work with some great clients, Brown said. My wife, children and my grandchild still love me. My parents are still proud of me.












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Who would be silly enough to consult with him on how to handle a disaster? Nevermind, forget I asked

Around the world 150 at least countries engage in torrture and it is
kept more or less secret. Only if the human rights groups interfere it gets publicized.

'Under U.S. law, the War Crimes Act of 1996 makes it a federal crime to violate certain provisions of the Geneva Conventions. The Act punishes any American, military or civilian, who commits a "grave breach" of the Geneva Conventions. A grave breach, as defined by the Geneva Conventions, includes the deliberate "killing, torture or inhuman treatment" of detainees. Violations of the War Crimes Act that result in death carry the death penalty.'

Read what the Vatican says about the torture in
Abu Ghraib...

“ The torture? A more serious blow to the United States than September 11, 2001 attacks. Except that the blow was not inflicted by terrorists but by Americans against themselves.'
— Archbishop Giovanni Lajolo, foreign minister of the Vatican.'

In Abu Ghraib 99 percent of the prisoners were innocent and were tortured and many killed.
As retaliation there was a wave of beheadings after the torture pictures of the Abu Ghraib inmates were made public.

Why publish more pictures? To endanger the troops in Iraq, Afghanistan and Pakistan even more? No.




other countries started to takie in Gitmos and to you I say also
blah, blah, blah. Heard that already lots of times.

You bet that Obama will be able to work out a plan for all the Gitmos because HE IS SMART and POPULAR with dems AND FOREIGN LEADERS, who are more than ready to SUPPORT Obama!
Contrary to the Republicans who are just lurking and hoping for his DOWNFALL.

God bless Obama !


Yep, and now other countries can see how most Americans can be fooled by their media, etc - nm

Sorry, JTBB, other countries use worse torture than what was stated here.

They starve, cut off fingers, hands, pull nails out, burn private parts, and decapitate prisoners in other countries.  Why do you call other people with their comments "nimrods?"


If you want to torture to stop, why don't you go to those countries and fight against their torture? No...you'd rather call the American people nimrods. What is it with you? You used to have thoughtful posts, but now all you do is spew hate for Americans that do not support your views.


You are becoming anti-American IMHO and its sad that you could let the present government blind you to everything. You're either a socialist, facist, or a communist without announcing it up front. You have absolutely made me furious with your one-sided posts since the election. I try not to read them, but sometimes I do get a good laugh at your outrageous statements.


 


Poor women in 3rd world countries shouldn't live
baby that they dont want, and cannot afford to feed. Making birth control (which is a large part of what the funding is all about, it's not all about abortions), will improve the quality of life for millions of people, as well as the slow down the biggest environmental disaster the Earth faces - the overpopulation of the human species.
He would also have (and likely already has) best healthcare in USA.
I don't consider this a concern. Major factor in cancer is awareness and monitoring, and I'm quite sure he's getting the best monitoring and follow-up care available.
healthcare
Healthcare is already rationed in the US: If you can't afford insurance, you can't get it. If you're sick, you can't get insurance. If your employer enticed you with promises of insurance, but then didn't pay you enough to cover premiums, you can't get it. If you can't afford a procedure, then your long wait just became a lot longer.

Incidentally, what Obama is offering is *not* anything like what those countries you mention have. He's not nationalizing the healthcare system (like the UK) *or* nationalizing the insurance system (like Canada). Read his plan; it's a mixture of public and private plans, with more strict requirements on the insurance companies to cover everyone affordably, rather than gaming the system and cutting out sick people.

Personally, I'd love a nationalized system. Insurance companies are unnecessary middlemen driving up costs. That said, they're not the entire problem with healthcare costs--you can look to pharmaceutical companies for a big part of *that* problem.

What happens to healthcare...(sm)
Yes, more people probably will go to the doctor.  That means there will be a lot of health maintenance involved, and as we both know only too well, health maintenance is a key issue in preventing major medical issues, hence less surgeries, etc.  Check out France's healthcare system.  I think main issue we will have is going to be dealing with the drug companies to get costs under control.  At this point a lot of people don't go to the doc because they can't afford it, like you said; however, even more don't go because they can't afford the drugs.
What happens to healthcare...(sm)

Yes, more people probably will go to the doctor.  That means there will be a lot of health maintenance involved, and as we both know only too well, health maintenance is a key issue in preventing major medical issues, hence less surgeries, etc.  Check out France's healthcare system.  I think main issue we will have is going to be dealing with the drug companies to get costs under control.  At this point a lot of people don't go to the doc because they can't afford it, like you said; however, even more don't go because they can't afford the drugs.


BTW, regardless of Fox's ratings, they are undeniably a right-wing station.  That is a fact that is widely known and recognized.  Just because you agree with what they say doesn't mean they don't lean to the right.  And yes, the same holds true for MSNBC (to the left), but at least they admit it.  You also might want to look into exactly how ratings for cable news come about.  You might be surprised and what you could learn.


Healthcare

I'm not sure this is a good idea either.  Ireland has gov't run medical and those women were waiting years, yes years to get their Pap smears read.  They had to be shipped to the US because of a lab closure.  Can you imagine wondering if you have cervical cancer for years?  No thanks.


 


universal healthcare
Where are you getting that information about Obama and universal healthcare? The last time I heard him speak about it he wanted universal healthcare for people who couldn't get healthcare but leave the option open to people who could get their own healthcare (as they are doing now) to do so. He also spoke about companies being held more responsible to providing affordable healthcare for employees. I don't remember him ever saying to knock out the entire healthcare system and make everyone have universal healthcare.

As for McCain... I guess you like the economy and the war. He's not going to change anything if he's elected.