Very decent post, Suzie.
Posted By: Zauber on 2005-09-29
In Reply to: Not the poster who identified as Republican, but - Suzie
You obviously spent a lot of time and thought on it and I for one appreciate it, as well as your courtesy.
You raised so many pertinent points that are worth discussing. My time's running out for tonight (maybe can have more tomorrow) but would like to comment on one thing - I know that limiting the scope of the federal govt. is a truly a traditional Republican concern and I think it has merits in many ways. But, I think we have all gone to school these past five years and should be learning something about the dangers of limiting it too much. I think there is definitely a role for the federal govt. to play in business regulation. For so long we have heard that deregulation is a great thing - free market! Let the market adjust itself! - and that would be fine in Utopia where everyone acts with integrity, but let's face it, business run amok is not likely to regulate itself, and this is not an issue that state and local govt. can tackle effectively. If govt. serves any purpose at all, in my view, it should be to protect American citizens from blatant abuses of big business (not the good ones - just the bad ones) such as we see happening today with the credit industry, writing its own laws in the Republican Congress and behaving in a way that is simply outrageous.
Too often however, the cry of deregulation! and smaller govt.! is used by those who simply want the freedom to steamroll the public without pesky rules and scruples getting in the way. We have seen this happen before our own eyes during the Bush terms, over and over again. The American consumer has never before been so dangerously at the mercy of corporate abuse and only the federal govt. could be in a position to stop it.
So on that one point anyway, yes I agree we want to limit unnecessary federal intrusion into our lives and small businesses. However I disagree that shrinking the federal govt. so that it cannot perform its basic function of protecting and defending us from wolves and vampires of the corporate sort is a good idea.
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Suzie. sm
First, I enjoy your posts. Very much. As you can see, the vultures are gloating over the demise of three long-time posters. They got what they wanted. No respect for individual boards and blatant bait and switch routines. It's very obvious. I said it was my last post before, but I wanted to answer yours. Hopefully, once the gloating is over, they will find something worthwhile to talk about. Shameful.
Suzie, it is no use. SM
No amount of conciliation can stem the virulent Bush hatred. While the posters on the conservative board afforded the respect to not post here for the most part, like a pack of starving wolves, posters from this board nipped at every post by the conservatives. It's plain to see but only for those who seek truth.
Here's a perfect example, Suzie:
American Girl: Yawwnnn.... you're boring me to death....
Nameless Troll: By all means.... RIP.
MT: See, THAT'S what I am talkin' about! SM boring and lame! I am telling you, you are lame girl.
American Girl: Did they just wish me dead? ....RIP is a term usually reserved for the dead, right?
They degenerate debate to name calling, calling us evil, and then wishing us dead....all the while preaching to us about how evil and intolerant we are....the irony is bewildering but not unexpected.
MT: Don't forget when they told Nan she was old and would die soon SM and wished for her to burn in hell. That was an especial highlight of the nature of how they "never" say anything hateful.
(No name, but I admit it was me, completely frustrated and having sunk to their level): I know it's difficult but close your eyes and try to FOCUS for a second or two. Take a deep breath. You can do it. The poster was directly responding in kind to YOUR post in which YOU wrote: you're boring me to death.... Now feel free to twist and mangle that any way that makes you look like poor little AG who is always picked on, but YOU are the one who started this. The person was wishing you a peaceful trip while on the destination YOU indicated you were headed.
American Girl: Admit it though... you still wished me dead.... ![](http://www.forumatrix.com/smileys/wink.gif")
Nameless Troll: Not true. I don't wish anyone dead. I don't harbor that kind of hatred inside me. Sorry to bust your bubble.
Nan: They'll never admit it. sm It has to be your imagination.
These were just a FEW in an entire thread of insults (including one from Nan calling the person a slimy bottom dweller.) Not ONE post in this entire thread added anything of intelligence to any debate (including my own).
Does anyone reading this SERIOUSLY think the poster wished AG dead? When I read it, I see it as a very sarcastic response to a very sarcastic post. I believe it’s shortly after this point in time (when those three were getting exactly what they gave, after repeated threats and "chances" and "strikes" by them to the poster or else they would tell the Monitor) that they all three posted that they wouldn’t be coming back here any more. Those posts are gone now, and as we can see, one of them is already denying ever saying she was leaving. (To those of you who actually did read these posts and know they were there, please continue to rely on the accuracy of your memory because it’s correct.)
Now, when the day comes that AG recalls someone on this board "wishing her dead," are you going to believe that that is what the person REALLY wished, given the entire context of these posts?
Truman was decent, Johnson was not. sm
Johnson was not even liked by his own party. In fact, there were many conspiracy theories amont the DEMOCRATS that he had something to do with Kennedy's death. Kennedy, despite his personal life, was one of the best presidents we ever had. Truman and Kennedy and even Johnson were real Democrats, not like those of today.
Hey just me....I agree with you both....and one decent politician....sm
that I can name appears to be Bobby Jindal, republican governor of Louisiana.
What I find so interesting, is that there are lists and lists of corrupt Republican politicians and they are always run out on a rail, even when sometimes the corruption is made up, and yet the stigma remains, and they still resign.... and yet you are very hard to put to find a democrat corruption list.
Why?
Probably because when a democrat is corrupt, they usually stay in office, and no one prosecutes them, and they think they've done no wrong, even when it's the same thing that their rep counterparts have done. At least Louisiana has finally outsted Wm Jefferson, the dem with thousands of dollars in his freezer. Then there's the guy who had a relationship with his male page, another dem, can't remember his name. There are few other dems that have come to justice and have resigned, but the rest of them remain in office, business as usual.
It's too bad that any corrupt politician, republican or democrat or independent, seem to think they're above the law...until they're caught at it.....and even then, as I said, the dems, with the liberal media being enablers, tend to side step any wrong doing.
I wish sam was around. She could name them off in her sleep. My husband can also name them off, but I get so disgusted I stop listening. If the rest of the country doesn't care that their politicians are corrupt, and keep electing them, what can you do?
Here's a couple lists I found, but that's all I could find on a quick search, and they are from 2006 and 2007. Notice the dems on the lists....
http://www.judicialwatch.org/judicial-watch-announces-list-washington-s-ten-most-wanted-corrupt-politicians-2007
http://www.judicialwatch.org/6091.shtml
Finally - a decent interview
I caught the interview with Sarah Palin tonight. Part 2 is on tomorrow. I thought finally! Someone treating her with respect. The interview with Gibson last week was definitely a set up (been in the military and I know about investigations and such, and how to make people "uneasy"). As much as I cannot stand Hannity I have to say the interview was very respecful and not condescending. He asked her decent questions and asked her to explain herself on some issues which she did. When it comes to economics, energy and other issues she shows the wisdom and intelligence to understand what is happening and what needs to be done to get the problems fixed. There was no doubt in my mind by the end of the interview she will be one of the best VPs and I have confidence enough that if something happens to JM she will do just fine. However, JM's family lives to be quite a ripe old age so am sure he will be around for many more years to come. I'm just glad there was finally a fair interview. Asked her tough questions, had her explain her viewpoints and treated her with the respect she deserved. Can't wait to see the rest of it tomorrow. She'll be talking about how she has been treated by the media among other things.
Decent hadworking Americans....
were killed on Bush's watch. He couldn't even cough up any decent representation from FEMA when Katrina hit. Don't tell me how he protected us! Shame on YOU!
I see a couple decent things and especially
like this one:
"The measure also contains a provision denying lawmakers the automatic cost-of-living pay increase they are due next Jan. 1."
We shall see if that happens.
She is fugly...airbrushing is what makes her look halfway decent..nm
****
P.S. Please scroll down after reading above post. Washington Post article included.
Reprinted in Boston Globe. Sorry!
I wrote: I second JTBB's post, 'watcher's post is misinformed crap...sm
pYou have also to read what's posted 'inside' the message.
Oops, meant to post this under the loose trolls post...
I'm going to keep ignoring these troll posts. It's kind of fun, actually, just pretend you don't see them.
Post the direct link. I don't see the post you're referring to.
t
The post I quoted was the entire post. It was not taken out of context. sm
I imagine there are as many emotions and thoughts going on with our troops as possible and each does not feel the same as the other, which is obvious by the posts here.
Sorry gourdpainter, my other post should have been under the wacky Pakistan post (nm)
xx
Why did you post this? Republicans have been asked NOT to post here..Bye Bye.
Why did you post this? Happy Thanksgiving is enough but to be so happy we have a republican president? Why did you post that? I would like to remind you, you are on the liberal board. Are you trying to start trouble? If so, let me know and I will report you immediately. No, Im not happy we have a republican president, a warmonger chickenhawk president. Does that answer your question? Now, go back to the republican board. We dont want you here and actually the moderator and administrator have asked republicans not to post here..Bye..bye..
Forgot to post a link in 1st post. Sorry.
http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/money/tax/article1996735.ece
Please refer me to any post where I referred to either the post...
or the poster as ignorant. And I certainly never sunk to the levels you did at the top of the post, against a man who is ill in a wheelchair. Pot calling the kettle black...?
I re-read your post, and I stand by my post.
You are twisting his words by saying that he wants to make friends with terrorists. That is not what he said.
Ya gotta understand the rules. We have to post on this board only. They can post on any board they
The above post explains a lot about everything else you post!
Your revelation about being married to a career Army guy explains why your views are skewed so drastically to the far right! I thought it had to do with small-town Pennsylvania, but now I truly understand where you are coming from. Thank you for explaining that us. We will read your posts in a completely different light now that we know the truth.
If you want to post something on the subject, post
objective views. This is a one-sided publication that asks for donations to keep it going. Nothing I read in there posts anything against any democrats, just republicans. It is not a fair-minded reporting.
I like to read both sides of the aisle but this publication spews hatred for anything not democratic in order to sell books. To those who can't see both sides, this blog, or publication as they like to state, is just up their aisle. I shake my head at one-sided news. Taken from their web site:
"Indeed, a founding idea of the Consortium for Independent Journalism was that a major investment was needed in journalistic endeavors committed to honestly informing the American people about important events, no matter what the political and economic pressures.
While we are proud of the journalistic contribution that this Web site has made over the past decade – and while we are deeply grateful to our readers whose contributions have kept us afloat – we also must admit that we have not made the case well enough that this mission is a vital one.
Robert Parry broke many of the Iran-Contra stories in the 1980s for the Associated Press and Newsweek. His new book, Secrecy & Privilege: Rise of the Bush Dynasty from Watergate to Iraq, can be ordered at secrecyandprivilege.com. It's also available at Amazon.com, as is his 1999 book, Lost History: Contras, Cocaine, the Press & 'Project Truth.' "
I second your post and 'watcher's post
is misinformed crap.
My post was a direct answer to the direct post...
of Democrat. It was not a blank open-ended statement. And dial it back a notch...it is certainly your right to protest anything any time you want to. Just like it is my right to protest you protesting while men and women are still in harm's way, because you are in effect aiding the enemy. Apparently the Viet Nam experience taught you nothing. Americans protesting in the streets heartened the enemy and when they were about to surrender decided not to, based a lot upon what was happening in the American streets. I believe that the protesting in that war prolonged the war and cost more American lives. Hanoi Jane should have been tried for treason. That being said...lessons were not learned and the protestors are doing the exact same thing now. Exercising the very right bought for them by shedding of American military blood. And I still say common courtesy should keep people out of the streets and off the TV until the military are home safe. But it just proves the same thing to me over and over...the selfISHhness of the protestors vs. the selfLESSness of the military. They continue to put it all on the line for your right to protest anything you want to protest...it is up to YOU to decide where and when that is appropriate, and it is up to you to take the heat for same. It is up to me and others like me (in my opinion) to apply that heat. Go ahead and do whatever your conscience or lack thereof moves you to do. But do not expect those of a different mind not to protest the protest.
Thanks for the post. I think I will look up that
article.
And thanks for pointing out all the other "results" of his administration that, as you say, benefit nobody but the rich and/or the corporations or, as he himself once publicly bragged, "his base."
I know for a fact that when he ran for President in 2000, I told every single person I knew that if he becomes President, we're going to go to war with Iraq. (Nobody's gonna treat his daddy like Saddam did and get away with it.)
I didn't have a crystal ball. I had common sense and a good memory from the Gulf War when his father was President and how he didn't "finish the job." Seems a lot of other Americans forgot about that.
I really enjoyed reading your post and all the facts you raised that I failed to raise in mine. Thanks for the mention of the LA Times article. I'm going to try to look that up on the web. 
I know they don't. I said that in my post. NM
//
Actually, that post is right on. sm
You sound like a total lunatic, out of control and full of hatred. You sound like someone who could do just what "vs" says. You had best take a look at your behavior. YOUR posts are the ones who should be reported. You are one frightening person.
Re your post
From your post:
"Did you read Mein Kampf? Would that be good enough evidence for you, because he wrote about it in there."
Wrote about what? That the Jews were socialists?
This is an entirely different post.
Really wasn't directed to you anyhow.
your post is just sad
I'm actually feeling sad for you right now gt. You obviously don't know what Christianity is about. Pat Robertson does not speak for me, and I don't endorse what he said. I'm sorry you are so bitter and hate filled that you would wish anyone to burn in hell. There are some evil people in this world but my first wish for them is that they find Christ and turn from their evil ways with His help. I too hope one day you find Christ, gt, and quit letting misguided Christians and Christian leaders keep you from HIM. Their blunders are not worth your eternal soul.
thank you for your post
What a great post, so heartfelt and I thank you for it.
Yes I do. see my post below. nm
x
The post.
You think there is only one patriot here? Get a trip on your sour shrivled heart and try not to speak.
Whoops! I made a mistake. My bad.
This is the post where the NEOCON tells the LIBERAL not to speak ON HER OWN BOARD!
They can't show a post of a liberal telling Army Mom not to speak because it doesn't exist.
Where did you get that from my post?
Really? I did? Where do you read that in my post? I talk about taking care of the middle class and that the rich really dont give a darn about the middle class. I talk about a friend who is quite smug and out of touch with real America. No where do I mention anything about Kerry or Kennedy.
please post
I would appreciate it if you could post statements from Black Americans that they are okay with Bennetts comments.
What does that have to do with gt's post
I said if we had posted something like that we would have been castigated. You're just proving that point. I'm not in a pissing contest with you...really
And another *right-on* post!
I agree with every single word you said. America is becoming a very scary place indeed. I believe, as you do, that there are people who are eagerly awaiting the *Rapture* and indeed believe they have the *inside track* to heaven. Unfortunately, it look as if this country might actually suffer from their self-fulfilled prophecy if it continues going backwards in time under Bush's completely inept leadership.
Please keep posting. I really enjoy reading your posts.
Thanks very much for your post.
It makes me feel a lot better to hear someone say they're against this. When express outrage at my posting about the issue, instead of expressing outrage about the issue itself, it truly makes me wonder.
I honestly do not recall any threads on the conservative board about this issue. All I recall is total silence (or attacks) when the issue is mentioned.
I also wasn't trying to imply that the crime of child molestation is more prevalent in one political party or another. Obviously, that's irrelevant, and I have a hard time even associating a criminal like that with any political views one way or the other.
It's just that this seems to be a no-brainer, an issue on which virtually everyone can agree, yet the right seems to be eerily quiet when this topic comes up.
Thank you for this post!
Thanks for this post!! I heard about it somewhere but in the chaos that has become my life lately, I probably would have completely forgotten about it..so glad you submitted this..
Please see my post to you above.
I made a mistake and posted my reply in the wrong place. Sorry.
This post had nothing to do with the US...
being a guiltless superpower. It had to do with devaluation of life and a moral decline and what that can inevitably lead to. As to your post, yes, many bad things have happened in many countries...yet if you stack up the dollars, the American lives, that we have poured into human rights issues around the world, you will see that we are far, far ahead of the rest of the world. Nobody can do it all, but America as a country has been the least likely to turn its head in those cases. As a side note, I am of Cherokee and Choctaw descent and I do not believe, nor have I ever, that America as a country has thought my ancestors subhuman. There are always, within any culture, those who set themselves above others. Even among Indian peoples they enslaved other Indian peoples. No one, no culture, is blameless; and no one, no culture, can fix it all. However, as a country, America's record in giving of aid in money, human technical support, human military support, etc., far surpasses any other nation. And we continue to do it, even when we the hand are bitten by those we feed. Because that is what America is as a country. That is why I love this country, what she stands for, and while I am proud of every bit of my ancestry, I am also very proud to be an American.
Re: Your post
You wrote:
That is what America does. We point at what we believe to be wrong and say so. At least we used to.
I beg to differ somewhat on your view of our historical treatment of the Native Americans, being an amateur historian of the settlement of the West. The Native Americans alternately were glorified or vilified by the white culture. Had they not been portrayed as subhumans by our government at one time in the history of the West they would not have been exterminated so carelessly at times. As well, our history of race relations with blacks in the south is certainly nothing to be proud of. Perhaps another country should have come along in both instances and pointed at us, or we should have perhaps pointed at ourselves.
Your post
Yes, in some cases Native Americans were vilified by SOME in the white culture, not all. Yes, there were bad whites. Yes, they often attacked and killed when they should not have. Indians also attacked and killed when they should not have. The very first Americans, I am not talking about the West, but the colonists, got along with American colonists. And, as I stated, Indian peoples mistreated each other as well. There were wars, massacres, slavery, ill treatment. I do not say that to excuse anyone. I also do not think a the blame game for something that happened in the past is not productive. It does not enable people to learn from the past and move on. The persons involved in the villifying are long since dead. Yes, we need to learn from it, but we do not need to bear grudges. As I stated, I am of Indian descent, two different tribes. I bear no grudges. The people who did the deeds are long since dead and my bearing a grudge against men long dead serves no purpose. As to history of race relations with the blacks.... and if I might point out here members of my Cherokee ancestor's tribe, owned slaves. Slavery was not confined to the south. And, as a country, we DID point at ourselves. In case you do not recall, our country was divided and a civil war was fought. Many of my Cherokee ancestors fought for the Confederacy, the slaves they held right beside them. Members of the tribe of my ancestors were involved in the Trail of Tears, but they also held slaves. We need to leave the past in the past, learn from it, and move on steadfast in the idea that we will not allow it to happen again. That is the best thing we can do for those long since dead. Slavery was not the only issue in the civil war, but it was a major issue. So, I would say most definitely, we pointed at ourselves concerning slavery. No country would point at us because of slavery, because most other countries practiced it too. Slavery was not an American thing. Other countries had a class system, the haves and the have nots, and treated the lower cases horribly as well. This was not a problem that was originated in America. The difference is, it was not the entire country with us. We did not believe in that kind of behavior as a country, and we were willing to divide and fight a civil war because of that belief. As an aside, Africans enslaved each other. It was Africans who sold other Africans to white traders. As I said, there is blame to be had everywhere. Is there a country in the world with a history less repugnant to you than the US? Who has a history devoid of mistreatment?
No, want to see the post where I said....
....that I enjoyed finding errors and correcting people. This post says I enjoy doing research. I enjoy most research I do. I also worked in epidemiology in medical research for a good part of my 30s and 40s. Loved it. That's probably why I can be kind of exasperatingly exacting about people citing fiction as fact.
See my post above
It would certainly take an alternate reality to convice me of this.
THANK you for this post....if they want to
IF these posters want to continue to bury their heads in the sands, so be it.
and to FACT FINDER: You're gosh darn right - I'M scared of ALL of them - they all have an AGENDA...(members of the CFR/New World order/New American Century) -
How dare you be condescending and patroning to me or any poster and tell me to *run along* - I'm probably old enough to be your mother, or grandmother.
and remember, it's my generation that has the MOST number of voters today...those from 50-75 - we WILL make a big impact......
and no matter what I posted about Barack - I was not rude, patronizing, and condescending to any poster, as a few of you were.
We can all agree to disagree, now can't we? 
Just as an aside, I was evacuated on 9/11/01 from Newark Airport trying to get home (was in the financial district on 9/10/01) and it took me an extra week to get home....
so perhaps I'm more paranoid than most - and then you'll all have to forgive me because while we all changed that day, I never recouped from the incident nor will I ever. Yeah, it's my problem - but it's also EVERYBODY's problem.
And while I have Muslim friends - I also married French......and have watched France's Islamic population grow in leaps and bounds the past 30 years, coming close now to 30 percent of the country (60 million people in France, well over 25 percent are Muslim).......and I don't want that happening here. I want freedom for EVERYBODY - not people planning to take us down.....there are far too many extremist Muslims who want to do America harm (remember *Death To America* you hear chanted....remember so many of them dancing in the streets once 9/11 happened - Americans have short memories and forget far too quickly in my opinion).
I did read yesterday from some political blogger that down the road here in America, we should expect bombings in the street, car bombings - and when I spoke to my neighbors about this, they said *We are surprised it hasn't happened here yet* -
It's a very scary world today....so forgive me for my own paranoia - paranoia in this case being a heightened sense of reality.
Have a nice day!!
Your post...
Most of the information I found on S-CHIP was the expansion bill itself was on Congressional Library website, but there was no qualifying criteria listed because that is determined mostly by individual states. To find out what the qualifying criteria are, I think your best bet would be, since it is mostly state-administered, would be to go to the state websites to make a comparsion. Use New York state, like you suggest, go to their website and see if there is any information about qualifying. Then check the state site of midwestern, more rural state...like Oklahoma, Kansas, Iowa....if that doesn't work, just do internet search on *qualifying criteria for S-CHIP* and see what comes up. It could be that they don't publish that information on the net...don't know.
Now THIS is exactly why I used to like coming to this board. You see, I had just assumed that was written into the program, but it may very well NOT be, and if it is not, it SHOULD be.
I would still be against expanding it across the board, but I most definitely be FOR the income to qualify be driven by where the recipient lives.
Thanks!
Thanks, your post
must've been where I heard the New York thing. I didn't see an actual amount in the proposal either, so I think it will be up to the states to decide and I'm assuming the federal government will have the final say if a cap is too high. Funny how it's only the absolute maximum amount requested that gets reported as the 'norm'.
see post below
about Clinton being "blown to bits." Your response - Freudian slip? What are volunteering for? Retort to. Take it as you will through your personal filter.
I post
so others can chuckle at you.
Liked your post too
As I have said before, there has to be a happy medium between single-pay and what we have now. Everyone seems so scared to have the government control health care, but with what we have now, the insurance companies are controlling it!!!! Again, in my situation, I have a medical condition and have been denied private health insurance. Therefore, I have two options - I can work full-time, which is sometimes hard with the medical issues, or I can quit working altogether and get Medicaid. To me, that seems extreme. I know that there are thousands of people in my same situation and something needs to be done about it. Thank you for your post.
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