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name calling and finger pointing, again with no real facts but your opinion. sm

Posted By: nm on 2008-10-20
In Reply to: Wasilla has only 8,000 pop, so even 1 meth lab is a lot and - Bush ruined our country and

I expect no less from Palin haters


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With all the juvenile name calling and finger pointing
exactly who introduced the use of the word "idiots" into the post. BTW, for you first, second and third responder(s), posting the same thing 2 or 3 times makes for a pathetic majoriy of one. Read my lips. PA-THE-TIC.
Resorting to the 2nd grader finger-pointing and
Don't you recognize when you have run out of anything pertinent to say?
Facts versus opinion.
If you choose to ignore the facts, so be it.
What I just posted were facts...not opinion...(sm)

Obviously more than 1 of you need a calculator.  I'll go R-E-A-L S-L-O-W so you can maybe understand:


Bush's defense budget  = $512 billion


Obama's defense budget =  $534 billion


534B - 521B = 13B


13 billion -- that's how much MORE Obama allocates to defense spending.  Exactly how is he supposed to be cutting defense spending again?  Oh, but I forgot....Hannity SAID Obama was cutting defense spending, so it MUST be true.  You guys are just ridiculous.


The real facts....(sm)








Q:

Did electing a Democratic Congress in 2006 really lead to increased unemployment, higher gas prices and more home foreclosures?

I received this by e-mail and I’ve also seen it posted as a comment on a lot of blogs and news sites. Is there any truth to it?


You Want Change?

A little over one year ago:
1) Consumer confidence stood at a 2 1/2 year high;
2) Regular gasoline sold for $2.19 a gallon;
3) the unemployment rate was 4.5%.

Since voting in a Democratic Congress in 2006 we're [sic] seen:

1) Consumer confidence plummet;
2) the cost of regular gasoline soar to over $3 a gallon;
3) Unemployment is up to 5% (a 10% increase);
4) American households have seen $2.3 trillion in equity value evaporate (stock and mutual fund losses);
5) Americans have seen their home equity drop by $1.2 trillion dollars;
6) 1% of American homes are in foreclosure.

America voted for change in 2006, and we got it!

A:

No, and most of the figures in a widely-circulated e-mail are made up. In fact, the entire premise of the e-mail is a logical fallacy.

Like most of the chain e-mails making the rounds, this one is inaccurate. Some claims are outright false while others are grossly out of context. Overall, the e-mail commits the logical fallacy known as post hoc ergo propter hoc (or after the fact, therefore because of the fact).

Here's what we found:


  • Consumer confidence has fallen since October 2006, but it was not at a 2 1/2 year high prior to the elections. In fact, consumer confidence varies less with elections than it does with general economic conditions, many of which have little to do with the actions of politicians.


  • Gas prices were not at $2.19 per gallon before the election, but did reach that point nearly a year before the election and again (briefly) two months afterward.


  • The e-mail actually understates the equity drop by $500 billion. In fact, the stock market lost $2.8 trillion in equity from its most recent high point. But the e-mail fails to make clear that the high point happened nearly a full year after the election. It also neglects to mention that the market is higher now than it was in November 2006.


  • There's no clear figure on how much home equity has been lost since 2006 (the two most widely used measures give vastly different sums). But home equity loss and higher foreclosures have more to do with some unsavory lending practices and some bad decisions by homebuyers than they do with congressional activities.


  • The e-mail commits a whole series of post-hoc fallacies. That is, it assumes, without offering any evidence, that because one thing preceded another, the first must have caused the second.
We did find one accurate assertion, though. The unemployment rate really did increase from 4.5 to 5 percent.


The Two-and-a-Half-Year High That Wasn't

Because the e-mail has been around for a while and is undated, we can't say exactly when "a little over one year ago" is supposed to begin. We’ll assume that it means sometime shortly before the 2006 elections. Adding to the confusion is that there are two different surveys of consumer confidence. But we are certain that neither index shows consumer confidence at a two-and-a-half-year high prior to the 2006 mid-term elections. Here are the results from the Conference Board Consumer Confidence Index:


Consumer

As you can see, in the months leading up to the November 2006 election, consumer confidence actually declined. It was not at a two-and-a-half-year high. In fact, it had dropped 4.7 points between April 2006 and October 2006. And April 2006 actually represented a nearly four-year high. Consumer confidence last topped the April 2006 number in May 2002. Consumer confidence then climbed after the 2006 election, peaking in July 2007 before it began to fall off.

The University of Michigan's Index of Consumer Sentiment shows similar results:


Index

Here, too, we see that October 2006 does not represent a two-and-a-half-year high point in consumer confidence; January, February, June and July 2005 all saw higher totals.

Leaving aside the incorrect numbers, the e-mail is misleading to suggest that the November 2006 congressional elections caused a decline in consumer confidence. By that sort of logic, one could also suggest that George W. Bush's election caused the 10 percent decline in consumer confidence recorded by the Conference Board between December 2000 and January 2001, or the 12 percent decline in consumer sentiment that the University of Michigan measured between November 2000 and January 2001. But in fact, those drops had a much greater connection to the bursting of the dot-com bubble than they did to an election. The same is true of the decline in the last half of 2007, which owes far more to generally worsening economic conditions – or at least to the public perception that economic conditions are generally worsening
than it does to an election.


Did You Know That Congress Sets Gas Prices?

Despite what this e-mail implies, Congress little or nothing to do with setting the price of gasoline. Gas prices rise and fall with fluctuations in supply and demand. Prices go up when the supply decreases or the demand increases. Prices fall when supply goes up or demand goes down. There are those who believe that oil companies are manipulating supply, but if so that's the doing of oil-company executives, not Democratic senators or House members, some of whom in fact are calling for yet another investigation of oil-company practices.

U.S. policy can have some effect on global oil markets
wars in major oil-producing nations tend to reduce the oil supply, at least in the short-run but foreign policy is primarily the province of the executive, not the legislative, branch.

What's more, the e-mail includes some carefully cherry-picked figures, as this chart from the Department of Energy shows.


gas_price_graph

The e-mail implies that gas prices were at $2.19 per gallon just prior to the 2006 election. Gas prices did in fact dip as low as $2.19 per gallon, but they did so in January 2007, after the congressional elections. Gas prices also dipped below $2.19 per gallon in November 2005, a full year before the election. The e-mail also fails to mention that prices climbed to more than $3.00 per gallon in August 2006, 
when Republicans controlled both branches of Congress and the White House.

That Pesky Stock Market


The claim that Americans have lost $2.3 trillion in stock and mutual fund equity is not quite right. Economists use the Dow Jones Wilshire 5000 Total Market Index, an index that tracks nearly every U.S. stock, as the best measure of the entire U.S. stock market. On Nov. 7, 2006, (the day before the congressional elections), the Wilshire 5000 closed at 13,871.50. On April 30, 2008, the Index closed at 13,991.10. That represents a gain of about $119.6 billion in equity since the 2006 election.

But that's not to say that it's been a steady gain. On October 11, 2007, the Wilshire 5000 peaked at 15,819, then plunged to 13,037.3 on
March 19, 2008, a loss of $2.8 trillion in equity, or $500 billion more than the e-mail claims. Market gains since March have reduced the number to $1.8 trillion since that low point, which is somewhat lower than the e-mail indicates. There are lots of ways to look at numbers: between the 2006 election and October of 2007, the stock market gained over $1.9 trillion in equity, then lost $2.8 trillion before gaining $954 billion back again. But the fact is that anyone who invested in a reasonably broad-based array of stocks in early November 2006 and held all those stocks until today has seen a modest increase in their value.

Moreover, it is inaccurate to say that all these losses have been experienced “by American households.” It’s true that the percentage of U.S. households owning stock continues to increase. A 2005 joint report from two organizations representing investment companies and security firms estimated that about half of all U.S. households now own stock (mainly through mutual funds). But institutional investors – retirement funds, college and university endowments, investment companies like J.P. Morgan Chase and insurance companies
– control a large portion of stocks. At Microsoft, for example, around 63 percent of the stock – or just under 6 billion shares – is owned by just 2,300 different institutional investors. These institutional investors bear some of the brunt of equity losses, so it’s just wrong to imply, as the e-mail does, that "households" account for all the lost stock market equity.


My Kingdom for a House!

The e-mail is right about the bare facts of the housing crisis. It's true that about 1 percent of American homes were in some stage of foreclosure in 2007, and for the first time since 1945, home equity value fell below 50 percent (that is, Americans' mortgages are more than half the value of their homes).

Whether Americans have actually lost $1.2 trillion in home equity depends on what measure one uses. There are two different indexes used to track home value. Standard & Poor's Case-Schiller Home Price Index measures residential housing prices in 20 metropolitan regions and then constructs a composite index for the entire United States. Freddie Mac's Conventional Mortgage Home Price Index (or CMHPI) measures the value of single family homes that qualify for Freddie Mac or Fannie Mae underwritten mortgages, which, in practical terms, means that the CMHPI excludes any house valued at more than $417,000.

Measured by the Case-Schiller index, the crisis is actually worse than the e-mail says, at least for homes in those 20 regions. Case-Schiller shows a 12 percent decline in home value since November 2006. Standard & Poor's estimated the 2006 value of residential real estate held by individuals and nonprofits to be around $22.4 trillion. A 12 percent decline works out to about $2.7 trillion in lost home equity.

The CMHPI paints a very different picture. Its U.S. index, which is given in quarterly rather than monthly figures, shows a fourth quarter 2006 composite of 294.5 and a fourth quarter 2007 (the last quarter available) of 295.3, or about three-tenths of a percent increase.

The truth lies somewhere in between. As this map of foreclosure rates shows, many of the areas hardest hit by falling home prices are large, high-growth areas
in other words, major metropolitan areas where a lot of homes are priced at more than $417,000:


Map
Source: The Atlantic

Because the Case-Schiller index focuses on some of the metropolitan areas hardest hit, it likely overstates the amount of equity lost. By excluding homes valued at more than $417,000, the CMHPI understates the problem.

In any event, the e-mail is wrong to imply that the crunch is related to congressional elections. Indeed, blame really rests with two entirely different groups: lenders who (in some cases) fudged loan applications for buyers who weren't really qualified for loans, and home buyers who signed mortgages that they couldn't afford. Operating on the assumption that houses would always increase in value, some Americans essentially gambled on their home purchases. They were aided, in many cases, by subprime loans which generally have very low interest rates for a few years, but which later jump higher
sometimes much higher than rates for conventional mortgages. Many people used subprime loans to buy houses that they could afford (barely) for the first few years with the thought that they could always sell the house for a handsome profit just before the higher interest rates (and hence higher payments) kicked in.

Unfortunately, house prices didn't continue to rise. In fact, the frenzy to purchase houses resulted in unrealistically high prices
much like the stock market bubble in the late 1990s. And so, like that stock market bubble, when investors stepped back for a moment, they realized that they were overpaying. Since houses (like everything else) are worth only what someone is willing to pay for them, when new home buyers paused, housing prices leveled out and then began to decline, falling 8.9 percent in 2007. Many homeowners thus found themselves with the double whammy of a house that was worth less money than they owed and an increased payment that they could not afford.


Latin Alert

The e-mail is a classic example of the logical fallacy post hoc ergo propter hoc.
Post hoc fallacies assert that A caused B because B happened after A without offering any evidence that A and B are causally related. It's one of the most common fallacies, and not just in the political arena, either. They're very easy to construct: Just pick two things you don't like and attribute the second one to the first. It's that sort of thinking that might lead a sports fan to believe that his team wins only when he wears his "lucky" cap turned backward.

A simple rule of thumb is to treat any sort of "we did this and some really bad thing happened" argument with extreme skepticism. Causal arguments work only if there is an actual connection between the two events. A good argument can't just assume a connection; it has to show that one really exists. In case you want to delve further into this subject, we'd suggest you visit our sister site for educators and students, FactCheckED.org, and take a look at the lesson plan "Monty Python and the Quest for the Perfect Fallacy."

When you see this sort of claim presented without any evidence at all, you probably ought to just assume it's false. And if that claim happens to arrive in the form of a chain e-mail? Then we hope you'll take our advice and give your delete key some exercise.

- Joe Miller

Sources

Block, Sandra. "Home Equity Falls Below 50% for First Time on Record." 7 March 2008. USA Today. 18 March 2008.

Christie, Les. "Foreclosures up 75% in 2007." 29 January 2008. CNN Money. 18 March 2008.

FactSet Research Systems. "Microsoft Corp: Institutional Holders." 7 April 2008. Reuters.com. 7 April 2008.

Freddie Mac. "CMPHI Data: Census Division and National Series (1Q1970 - 4Q2007). December 2007. Freddie Mac. 7 April 2008.

"Historical Prices for Dow Jones Wilshire 5000 TOT: 7 November 2006 - 4 April 2008." 7 April 2008. Yahoo Finance. 7 April 2008.


Leonhardt, David. "Can’t Grasp Credit Crisis? Join the Club." 19 March 2008. The New York Times. 19 March 2008.

Manning, Jeff. "Chase Mortgage Memo Pushes 'Cheats & Tricks'." 27 March 2008. The Oregonian. 4 April 2008.

Nutting, Rex. "Home prices post first yearly drop in 16 years." 26 February 2008. Market Watch. 18 March 2008.

Reuters/University of Michigan. "Index of Consumer Sentiment: January 2000 - September 2007." 7 April 2008. Surveys of Consumers. 7 April 2008.

Standard and Poor's. "Case-Schiller Home Price History." January 2008. Standard and Poor's. 7 April 2008.

TNS. "Conference Board Consumer Confidence Index." 16 March 2008. Polling Report: Economic Outlook. 18 March 2008.

U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics. Unemployment rate, seasonally adjusted. 1998 - 2008, 18 March 2008.

Wilshire Associates. "Dow Jones Wilshire Broad Market Indexes." 7 April 2008. Wilshire Associates. 7 April 2008.

Yglesias, Matthew. "There Goes the Neighborhood." January 2008. The Atlantic. 7 April 2008.

 

http://www.factcheck.org/askfactcheck/did_electing_a_democratic_congress_in_2006.html

I suppose that may be true, but you give no facts, just your opinion...nm

Name calling? Point out 1 instance of "nasty name calling" in response to your posts
Your childlike accusations are patently false - but you are indeed welcome to your own opinion. I just don't have to agree.
You put your finger on it, chele.
They worry far more about their party affiliation than they do the taxpayers. We see where they have placed their loyalties, what they have, that is.
I think that's a bit one-sided. Can't put my finger on it right
now 'cause it's late (for me), but I will read it again in the morning and do a little research myself..
May we pick which finger??
x
No effort required. Just one finger.
(And that would be the middle one, of course.)
You must be using the finger-counting method,
try using both hands and all your toes. Your figures need to be multiplied by a factor of 2, one way or the other.
Really? I don't recall seeing his pinky finger.
He's only showed us his middle one.
Otherwise known as the 'fickle finger of fate'...

Then the first finger goes to Bill Clinton
If you want to start the pointing that is.
Thank you for pointing that out.
However, I still don't understand how the OP can attribute every post that she finds offensive to the same two people. There are a lot of people posting on this forum. Unless someone uses the same moniker all the time, there is no way to know for certain who is posting any particular message.
Thanks for pointing that out...
nm
thank you for pointing that out
;)
Bush has more character in his pinky finger than
nm
Finger sandwiches? Gee, I dunno...whose fingers were they? :) sm
The other day a German company came out with "Obama Fingers" - frozen strips of fried chicken. You know, snacky type dealie-bobs.

Unfortunately for this company, they didn't realize that associating fried chicken with a black person isn't considered "PC" and they had to withdraw them from the market. I guess we prolly won't be seeing Obama Watermeloncicles any time soon either. Darn! I was looking forward to that.

Hoo-boy, it's a weird, weird world, ain't it? What would we do without the Stereotype Police?
Not bent, just pointing out..

Rush just seems to have a problem keeping all his pills straight. What does that tell you. He's was buying stuff in parking lots. He was visiting multiple doctors. He has other people's medications on him and yet, he slams someone about pill use ...hypocritical I say.


We hate Bush, we hate Rush, we hate Rove...that is the right's mantra. Everytime we point out something that the right cannot defend or they just simple disagree with...out comes the ***the left's hatred is so palpable we can feel it. They are so negative and hateful about everything and everyone, ***   That is just not true. I personally have not hated anyone in politics since Nixon and I was young then and did not realize that hating him would accomplish nothing other than making me angrier and angrier. So that ***the left hates*** falls on deaf ears here.


 


I don't think she's arrogant but pointing out the
xx
I believe it is a website pointing out that there are...
people out there who do believe he is the "messiah." Not necessarily sent from God, but has become a deity to them. Did you read all the quotes on the site? Those are real quotes from real people...Obama DID use that "presidential seal" depicted there until people got outraged and he stopped using it. It is very, very concerning. And I think the answer is yes...there are a lot of people out there mesmerized by him. NO matter WHAT comes out of his mouth, they believe it. Did you see the star-gazed way they look at him? The kids "singing for their leader?" Wayyyy too freaky for me. Of course, I was not going to vote for him anyway because he is a flaming socialist, but this site would have given me serious pause if I had even thought about voting for him. Just my opinion.
Unfortunately, ours is pointing at boxes and...sm
and checking off things, but the nurses type in the history and other information themselves.  I was told that basically the only thing I would be transcribing would be a letter here and there, but they have never had very many of them anyway.
Anyone purposely pointing out Hussein
Is just a stupid loser.  You are a racist.  Obama is not Muslim but what if he was????  Timothy McVeigh was a Christian and he blew up government buildings.  There are many good muslims and good Christians AND good atheists.  Can you wrap your hands around that?  Anyone drawing attention to the middle name HUSSEIN is trying to cause trouble or fear that it sounds like a terrorist name.  How small minded you are.  Did you even graduate high school?  I won't be looking for your reply.  I'm busy planning a victory party for Obama.
And if his moral compass was pointing sm
to true north, he would have declined representing those clients.

You can argue the difference between ethics and legal ethics till the chickens come to roost, but if this man would represent these kinds of clients and make thse kinds of oppositions, I don't think he is fit to be the second in command of the DOJ.
EXCELLENT! Thank you for pointing that fact out. nm
x
Pointing to reality is "fearmongering"

February 8, 2009


IT AIN'T FEARMONGERING IF IT'S TRUE.... Just today, the LA Times has a good report on the unprecedented pressure on state budgets right now -- pressure that will not be alleviated by the federal recovery plan because Sens. Collins & Co. believe state aid isn't stimulative enough. While state shortfalls will lead to painful cuts in practically every state, Nevada is poised to get hit much harder than most.


The Times report noted, for example, that Nevada is "facing the most serious shortfall," and lawmakers will have to cut a striking 38% from its state budget. The impact across the state will be both drastic and unavoidable, most notably in the state's public schools, which will soon face a 15% cut.


It wasn't surprising, then, that Rep. Barney Frank (D-Mass.) criticized Senate "centrists" for cutting $40 billion in state aid from the stimulus package, noting that the aid, which appeared in the House version, was intended to stop states from "laying off cops and firefighters, money to help keep teachers going." Republican Sen. John Ensign of Nevada rejected Frank's comments, labeling the remarks "fearmongering." Indeed, Ensign seemed encouraged by the fact that state budgets, including his own, would have to be slashed, calling the budgets "bloated." He said, "What we should be doing is cutting back."


Got that? As the recession worsens, and government spending is needed to prevent more Americans from losing their jobs, a leading Republican senator whose own state is about to get pummeled, believes it's a good idea to "cut back."
I can think of a variety of ways to respond to this nonsense, but I think Matt Yglesias summed things up nicely:

The idea that it would be good for states to cut back in the midst of the recession is stupid. The idea that the recession won't, absent federal aid, lead to layoffs of state employees such as teachers and firefighters is also stupid. But the idea that it's simultaneously true that the reason we should eschew aid is that states need to cut back and also true that it's fearmongering to warn of layoffs is doubleplus stupid. What does Ensign think cutbacks consist of? States will be reducing vital services. The cutbacks will have the immediate impact of reducing the incomes of laid-off families and beneficiaries of state programs. That will have an additional impact on businesses where the newly laid-off teachers and cops used to work.


And the reduced level of service will have its own bad economic impacts. Cutting back public safety budgets will mean fewer cops on the beat. That means more crime which will further reduce economic activity. State cutbacks to child care subsidies will make it harder for people who lose jobs to find and accept new ones. The cutbacks to mass transit services that are happening across the country will introduce additional rigidity into the labor market and reduce patronage of businesses that people are accustomed to reaching via transit. And in the most severe cases, cutbacks in assistant to the severely impoverished will have a decades-long impact on the well-being of their children.


Sen. John Ensign is entirely comfortable with all of these developments -- those dreaded state budgets are "bloated," after all -- but doesn't want anyone to acknowledge this publicly. Pointing to reality is "fearmongering."
It's not enough for congressional Republicans to stand in the way of sound economic policy during a crisis; they also want to discourage everyone from talking about it


No, goofy. Republicans are REAL people, real
nm
If the real folks, with real hope, faith, and
and for our country's future who participate here on this forum were just a tad as healthy, wealthy and wise as this poster considers herself, we probably wouldn't be sitting in front of these silly computers trying to make a living!! Can't figure why she is here other than tell us how healthy, wealthy and wise she is and we are not!
No scare tactics. Just pointing out that we don't live
If we don't start talking with some of these countries, and trying to find a way to get them thinking of other things to do with their artillery than aim it at us, then sooner or later, our little plastic bubble could get blown to bits. We're not invincible.
Pointing out that middle name is hateful and racist sm
You know that is designed to stir trouble. Muslims are not all evil and Barack isn't even a muslim. Yeah that is his middle name SO WHAT RACIST?
Your opinion of torture is your opinion. Tough
nm
A racial post shooting the finger. Must be a conservative thing. Point this out.
I just read the thread and don't know what the heck you guys are talking about.

Sounds like you are all just trying to be disagreeable, no wait that's why you continue to post on the LIBERAL board. I see, that's the point. Excuse me.
Facts are facts - sorry you don't like it cos it doesn't support your candidate
You can't change facts. That's what makes them facts. You may not like it but that's the way it is.


Facts are facts. No bash intended.
It will be this stellar record from which voters will be assessing her and her running mate.
If you're offended, too bad. Facts are facts...
I know Muslims in this country who have turned from the hateful evil beliefs that were forced down their throats. They did not have the freedom to learn anything else growing up. But after they gained their freedom and came here, they were able to receive the Word of God and they have told me that NEVER were they taught anything about loving others, just other Muslims, and that the God they learned about spoke of nothing but killing and hate... so if Obama is receiving large donations from those middle eastern countries, as you say, and he is grounded in Muslim culture, being taught this in school for years as a child, do you honestly think he doesn't carry some of those beliefs with him? He's never denounced it.

Here ya go.........

http://bibleprobe.com/muhammad.htm
stating facts folks, just the facts....if it's getting
xx
Folks want facts, you give'm facts and still
xx
This poster wants facts, facts, facts...
xx
Poster wants facts, facts, facts.....
xx
History is history and opinion is opinion. You need to learn the difference.
x
When you can't fight facts for facts
then it's buh-bye....well buh-bye to you too....I'll have a dicussion with someone who will discuss and not blame.
When you can't fight facts for facts then it's buh-bye.

Facts, stick to the facts...sm
The subject here is the media and their treatment of Gov. Palin, which continues to this day, to this minute, by the liberal left.

Tthe media threw down their gauntlet as soon as she was picked on that Friday, and hounded her for almost a full week.

And you think she should have waved a white flag at them in her acceptance speech? She put them on notice, that she is above them. And continues to be, with grace and style.

She's not whining, and neither are we.

I just shake my head at your audacity.

The media is the one that started this with her, and you would do well to remember the facts in her case.




IN this case, the facts are the facts.........
--
We're not defending Bush we're pointing out the obvious
All you see in your view is Bush, Bush, Bush. Nobody else exists. You have yet to answer any of the questions I posed yesterday. We're not the one obsessing about Bush. I'm sure you'll counter that with I don't owe you any answers! It's really telling that for five or six days this board was mute about the Israel/Lebanon situation. You were too busy posting trash news about Bush like nothing was even happening, but I know that the left has wait for its talking points. You all cannot formulate opinions on your own. You have boilerplates ready to go though. *This is Bush's fault because _____________ but you have to wait on Howard Dean, Bill Clinton, etc. etc. to fill in the blanks for you. It's not just a phenomenon here but with all the left. You can count on at least two days of silence when something unforseen breaks out in the world, because they have to retreat to their bunkers to get their talking points straight, but it will always start with *This is Bush's fault because....
Who's doing the name calling here? LOL
Try reading a little closer!

I said it was an ignorant post. There is a lesson in semantics here:Surly you can tell the difference between "ignorant poster" and ignorant post?

My post was not "name calling" - I simply pointed out the poster's opinions were not based in known fact.

As to name calling, I would point out your use of the term 'naïve' - what part of my post criticising Obama A DEMOCRAT - didn't you read? Why would you assume I give the Clintons a pass?

both parties are corrupt to the gills and Americans in general are ignorant of what they are actually do to us ALL and to the world.

Read a little closer before you rant :)
Why do they keep calling?

Over the last 3 or 4 days I have gotten 6 or 7 calls (they call twice a day and always when I am sitting down to eat).  They are the democrats calling telling me all the wonderful things about Obama and I have to show my support and vote for him).  I keep telling them I am a registered democrat so they know who I am voting for and after they've gone on about him they then say "well you should vote your concious", but they always say it quite softly and one person I asked him to repeat what he said because I couldn't hear it.  The last one I told them if I'm voting my conscious why are you propping up Obama?


I don't understand if I'm a registered democrat why are the democrats calling me, shouldn't the republicans be calling me?  I have not received one call from anyone on the republicans side (and I haven't left my house since last Saturday when I went grocery shopping so know I haven't missed any calls).


This is just so frustrating.  I'd turn off my phone but I have friends and family that call me too.  Boy I cannot wait for the election to be over.


There was no name calling at all there nm
nm
Name calling. How like you.
xx