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I have to beg to differ with you on one point, Marmann.......... sm

Posted By: m on 2009-01-14
In Reply to: To Ashamed Black MT: - Marmann

Biracial offspring have existed in this country for many, many years, dating back to the days of slavery when white slave owners would take a slave to be their mistress or even rape an unwilling black slave just because they could. It has even been said that Thomas Jefferson fathered children by one of his slaves. And if Obama was born in Hawaii as he says he was, the culture there was much different than the mainland US, even though there were miscegenation laws in place at the time of his birth. If I understand Obama's family history correctly, his mother and father did not live together in the US, with the possible exception of Hawaii, during their marriage. Most, if not all of their marriage, was lived out in Indonesia.

But I digress........

Whether the man in the White House is black, white or another race or any combination thereof is of no consequence to me. The qualifications based on the Constitution and experience and knowledge to effectively and safely lead America are first and foremost and should be on the mind of every voting American.

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Beg to differ

Actually, Robertson is probably part of the White House staff.

And actually Robertson probably broke a law when he threatened Chavez life.  That's not free speech anymore.

I beg to differ, try looking it up
PNAC is real and what American Woman posted is real. You need to learn to research things yourself instead of believing what you hear out of Bill O'Reilly or Hannity et al. Try Google someday and look it up. You might actually get ::gasp:: informed!
I beg to differ


  My point in bringing this up was not about stem cell research, was not about Democrats or Republicans using people as props, it was simply and only about 1 man ridiculing another. I saw the original Rush, I saw the MJF ad, I saw the Rush apology. I was reacting to the original Rush and I thought it was over the top cruel. Whether or not MJF was on meds or not on meds was not my point. My point was that a young man has Parkinson's and a person in a position to reach thousands ridiculed him and in watching the initial video I was really sickened. It was just so cruel. So that is my point, the fact that Rush did a despicable thing, in my opinion. That's all.  My post was not to address stem cell research or political pandering or any of the other ludicrous things people say and do to get into office. It was a mere statement that one able bodied man made fun of one who is not, in words and actions.

AS an aside, if MJF had made that ad for the other side, say he was on TV , appearing exactly as he did in the Democratic ad and he said something along the lines of **I have Parkinson's and although it is devastating as you can see, stem cell research is not the way to go.** would you have thought he was being manipulative or off his meds or acting. Would you judge him as harshly??

I beg to differ....
Marines Discover Terror Training Camp Near Baghdad
Wednesday, April 16, 2003

BAGHDAD, Iraq — U.S. forces came upon a recently abandoned terrorist training camp on the outskirts of Baghdad where recruits were apparently taught how to make bombs and what to do if they got captured, the Marines said Wednesday.

The extensive camp consisted of about 20 permanent buildings on 25 acres south of the city and was operated by the Iraqi government and the Palestine Liberation Front, said Marine spokesman Cpl. John Hoellwarth.

Among the documents found were filled-out questionnaires that included such questions as "What type of missions would you like to carry out?" according to Hoellwarth. He said many recruits wanted to carry out suicide missions.

The camp included an obstacle course and what appeared to be a prison, to teach terrorists what to do if captured and interrogated, Hoellwarth said.

Recruits were also apparently taught how to make bombs, he said. The Marines found chemicals, beakers and pipes.

Hoellwarth said uniforms and gas masks were also left behind, along with bread and other food, suggesting the place had been used fairly recently.

And more:
Wednesday, Sept. 17, 2003 11:10 p.m. EDT
Press Reported Extensively on Iraq-9/11 Links

Confounded by a recent Washington Post poll that showed 69 percent of Americans now believe that Iraq had a hand in the 9/11 attacks, journalists are pressing the Bush administration to deny the notion unequivocally - in an apparent bid to undermine what for many was the most compelling rationale for making war on Baghdad earlier this year.

That why reporters this week questioned Vice President Di*k Cheney, Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld and even President Bush on whether they believed that Iraq had anything to do with the kamikaze attacks on the World Trade Center and Pentagon.

But if reporters really want to know why Americans see ties between Baghdad and 9/11, they need look no further than their own archives, where they'll find repeated and as yet undisputed reports documenting compelling evidence of Iraq's role in the attacks.

A Lexis Nexis search for the three months after 9/11 turned up no fewer than 85 mainstream news reports describing, for instance, activities at the terrorist training camp Salman Pak.

Here's what the New York Times said about the camp six weeks after 9/11:

"New information does suggest that Mr. Hussein was actively training terrorists to attack American interests throughout the 1990's.

"One example is the testimony of Sabah Khodada, a captain in the Iraqi army who emigrated to Texas in May after working for eight years at what he described as a terrorist training camp at a bend in the Tigris River just southeast of Baghdad."

According to the Times, Khodada described the camp as "a highly secret installation" where "non-Iraqi Arabs from Persian Gulf countries, including Saudi Arabia" received training in "assassinations, kidnapping, hijacking of airplanes, hijacking of buses, hijacking of trains, and all other kinds of operations related to terrorism."

In comments unmentioned by the Times but covered by PBS, Khodada said that when he saw the twin towers fall he thought to himself, "This was done by graduates of Salman Pak."

Here's how National Public Radio characterized Iraq's link to the 9/11 attacks in a report the same month:

"The case against Iraq is based on three things. First, Mohamed Atta, believed to be the key organizer of the September 11th attacks, met earlier this year with an Iraqi agent in Prague.

"Second, Iraq's stockpiled anthrax as a biological weapon.

"And third, recent allegations that there's a camp in Iraq where foreign terrorists are trained. The allegation about the terrorist training camp comes through a recent Iraqi defector. According to this story, the camp is located near the town of Salman Pak, southeast of Baghdad, and it contains a Boeing jetliner that could be used to train hijackers how to seize a plane."

Charles Deulfer, former Deputy Head, U.N. Special Commission for Iraq, told NPR, "There were lots of places in Iraq where training of non-Iraqis, or things, which by our lexicon would be considered terrorism, was taking place. That's why Iraq is on the terrorist list. Having a large aircraft, a 707, in a peninsula, completely visible from the air or from satellite, with no airline runways nearby, that's not there by accident."

"Meet the Press" host Tim Russert, who last week claimed that "no one" believes in an Iraq-9/11 link, was also singing a different tune in December 2001.

Interviewing Vice President Dk Cheney, Russert cited the then-recent comments of former CIA Director James Woolsey.

"We know that at Salman Pak, on the southern edge of Baghdad, five different eyewitnesses - three Iraqi defectors and two American U.N. Inspectors - have said - and now there are aerial photographs to show it - a Boeing 707 that was used for training of hijackers, including non-Iraqi hijackers trained very secretly to take over airplanes with knives."

Russert then displayed satellite imagery of Salman Pak for his audience, telling Cheney, "And we have photographs. As you can see that little white speck – and there it is, the plane on the ground in Iraq used to train non-Iraqi hijackers."

Then the NBC newsman asked incredulously, "Do you still believe there's no evidence that Iraq was involved in September 11?"

New York Times columnist William Safire went even further, detailing in late October 2001 extensive ties between bin Laden, his henchmen and Saddam's intelligence service leading up to 9/11.

"Faruq Hijazi, in 1994 Saddam's secret service director and now his ambassador to Turkey, has had a series of meetings with bin Laden. These began in Sudan, arranged by Hassan al-Tourabi, the Sudanese Muslim leader, and continued in Afghanistan. The conspiracy was furthered in Baghdad in 1998 between bin Laden's No. 2 man, Ayman al-Zawahiri, and Saddam's vice president, Taha Yasin Ramadan."

Safire continued, "To strengthen Saddam's position in the Arab world during his 1998 crisis with the U.N., bin Laden established the 'World Islamic Front for Jihad Against the Jews and the Crusaders.' The Muslim-in-name Iraqi dictator reciprocated by promising secure refuge in Iraq for bin Laden and his key lieutenants if they were forced to flee Afghanistan."

More from Safire:

"Bin Laden sent a delegation of his top AL Qaeda terrorists to Baghdad on April 25, 1998, to attend the grand celebration that week of Saddam's birthday. It was then that Saddam's bloody-minded son Uday agreed to receive several hundred Al Qaeda recruits for terrorist training in techniques unavailable in Afghanistan.

"That Baghdad birthday party, according to an unpublished spying report, celebrated something else: Uday Hussein's agreement with bin Laden's men to formally establish a joint force consisting of some of Al Qaeda's fiercest 'Afghan Arab' fighters and the covert combatants in Iraqi intelligence unit 999."

With the exception of Mohamed Atta's meeting with Iraqi intelligence in Prague, none of the above information has ever been disputed. In fact, in May of this year, Manhattan U.S. District Judge Harold Baer ruled that Iraq played a material role in the 9/11 attacks in a case brought against Baghdad by families of two World Trade Center victims.

But for a mainstream press that now seems primarily interested in making the case that President Bush made war on Iraq under false pretenses, these old reports and dozens more like them are suddenly very inconvenient. That's why they've disappeared down the media's collective memory hole.

Unfortunately, President Bush gave reporters a giant helping hand in perpetuating their cover-up when he said on Wednesday that even he didn't see any evidence tying Iraq to 9/11.

The White House is said to be reluctant to press the issue because CIA Director George Tenet has dismissed all evidence of a connection. The Salman Pak defectors, for instance, were reportedly treated dismissively in interviews with CIA debriefers who showed no interest in pursuing a possible Iraq-9/11 link.

Selective memory is a wonderful thing, ain't it??
Beg to differ on this.
In this regard, I don't think that 30 years of experience is a political liability, nor do I think choosing him is contradictory to the progressive change message. An example (of many) would be Biden's expertise in foreign policy, though certainly that is not all he brings to the table. This is one of the areas where change is most urgently needed. Fareed Zakharia interviewed Obama on his GPS program last weekend. For those fortunate enough to hear it, any doubts that Obama is right for this role would have been dispelled. He spoke with eloquence, confidence and strength about his rich understanding of Islamic principles, parties, politics and cultures. He, more than any other politician (including Biden) in recent times, expresses and manifests the VISION our country needs to turn the politics of war into the politics of effective diplomacy. As a perfect complement, Biden brings the bricks and mortar needed to transform this vision into a reality that, not only will clean up the mess we currently find ourselves in, but will also, in the long-term, help to restore the credibility and respect we have lost in the international community during the past 8 years…something that comes in mighty handy in the war on terrorism, that is of course, if peace on earth is the goal.

Joe Biden helps mitigate right-wing accusations of elitism by bringing his appeal to the middle-class worker into play. Washington DC is not Joe Biden's comfort zone. To borrow a few media buzz words, the kitchen table politics as exercised in coffee shops along the way by a daily AmTrak single father/husband/family man commuter are more his style. His dedication to domestic violence initiatives over time resonates strongly among those whose lives are directly impacted by this tragedy. This issue is not exactly a top priority among upper crust elitists. He helps to energize some of our country's most disenfranchised, whose turnout to vote could play a pivotal role in the outcome of this election.

Not enough experience versus too much experience. Some can find fault on opposite ends of any spectrum in their quests to generate discontent and doubt. What is important here (in terms of "change" and "hope") is whether or not an old-timer (or a relative newcomer, for that matter) has the capacity to approach the problems we face and the failures we must address in the spirit of finding new, fresh, inspiring and progressive proposals and the ability to gain consensus and MOVE FORWARD, away from the bipartisan bickering and politics as usual dogma that has brought us to this dark hour in our nation's history. Personally, I believe Joe Biden possesses all the qualities necessary to apply hard-earned lessons to a progressive agenda that are completely consistent with campaign message of hope and change.

I beg to differ but there are

many mothers who work full-time jobs and have children.  In this day in age, it is very difficult to have only a one income family.  Your thinking of woman staying home to be barefoot and pregnant is so outdated it is not funny.  This reminds me of my mother's yearbook where each student had listed their life ambition and about every woman put "to be a housewife."  Things have changed since the 50s.

Once again, why is this only directed to SP?  Obama has young children.  Why is it so crucial to say that SP should stay home to take care of her children instead of running for VP and not say the same for Obama and running for president.  A dad is just as important as a mom....so if you use this against SP...the same can be said against Obama.

So let us return to the 21st century where women have careers as well as children.

Beg to differ
"only what is told to you in your buildings you visit each week to get your weekly dose of brainshwashing)"

Now that's bitter. I'm not sure what church you went to, but in the building I visit, we are not taught to hate others but to love one another, regardless of how they act towards you. BUT, that does not mean we are to lay down, roll over, and let someone take this country down a road to destruction and destroy the very thing where so many before us came in hopes of making their lives better,i.e., hard work with the hope of actually becoming profitable.

You are right though about Obama.......the the core he is a Muslim, and they don't believe in letting you be rewarded for your hard work.

"My Muslim faith" wsa enough except for those who refuse to see and he said with his own mouth he is a Muslim, and not just by birth.

You make a good point when you say they contradict themselves. They accuse Christians of hating gays but Obama says he is a Christian. O lovers do hate it when you back them in a corner.

I would beg to differ with
It's the democratic congress that has ruined this country. Bush DOES NOT have absolute power. Did you real this entire post from the OP? Did it not frighten you that God Almighty could very likely turn his back on our country? I know when I read the scripture quoted in this post, it literally brought tears to my eyes. It scares me! America needs to WAKE UP...
I beg to differ.....(sm)

*I certainly have no problem with atheists, agnostics or whatever posting their lack of religious views that affect their political views.*

Uhhhh...if that were true you wouldn't be raising such a stink right now...LOL.

I beg to differ
I would give no credibility to Youtube period.  I am not looking for anything to praise Obama for....yet.  Time will tell.  If time tells he has done a good job I'm sure it will be reported in the regular news.  If he does bad the same will happen.  Fox News will make sure of that!
I beg to differ.......... sm
Bringing in the link about Johnston's mother's drug charges were intended to further the case against Palin.

As for hostility, no, I'm not hostile. I'm just tired of seeing people raked over the coals again and again for things that are beyond their control. What good purpose does it serve? Does it make you feel somehow morally superior that your daugther is not pregnant without the benefit of marriage or that your child's boy/girlfriend's mother hasn't been brought up on drug charges?

Give it a rest and get a life already.
I beg to differ.
The points BB made and the issues she raised will remain burned in the memories of many those who suffered through his 8 years of h*ll on earth.
I have to beg to differ here........... sm
Government programs are fine for those who have fallen on hard times and are unable to care for their children, and granted, there are others who abuse the system. However, an unmarried woman who is on disability and already draws assistance from the government for the care of her existing 6 children should not go on to birth 8 more children and expect the government to take care of her and them. This was no accidental pregnancy, this was a carefully planned and executed pregnancy done by in vitro. While this does not make in vitro in and of itself wrong, it does show an extreme lack of common sense and good judgment by a woman who does it for selfish purposes, that being her own admission that she wanted children because they would love her and not leave her, and who obviously cannot afford the children she has, much less 8 more. It also shows a disturbing lack of concern for other people, people who will be footing the bill for her and her brood for a long time to come in a state where there is basically no money left and is having to lay off over 20,000 people as it is. How can you say that it is nobody's business but her own? Seems to me it is the entire state of California's business as they are the ones who will be supporting her.

I won't even go into the logistics of caring for 14 children, all under the age of, what, 6 or 7 and 8 of them newborns.
I beg to differ
I live in a small village in SW Iowa (population 8- though 1 is in a nursing home for now). Contrary to popular belief, some of us are actually quite literate, can punctuate and use proper English, both American and The Queen's. We don't all have wheat chaff between her lips, nor do we all chew tobacco. We don't all vote Republican and some of actually managed to get beyond the 6th grade. We don't all read the bible, nor do we all marry at 16.

So, please, stop assuming everyone whose conduct you don't approve is from the midwest. Obnoxious knows no geographical boundaries.
This is where our beliefs differ...sm
*...and we need to support our country's efforts in Iraq and support the men and women who are there trying to keep just this thing from happening.*

Your Rush Limbaugh cup runneth over. Sure anything can happen in America, but it is ridiculous to believe that us pulling out of Iraq is going to be our death certificate. That somehow we will just lie down and surrender the USA to Arabs.

where our beliefs differ....
I don't listen to Rush Limbaugh on a regular basis (unlike some liberals, I am fully capable of forming an opinion without the help of others), and the opinion I stated is my own. Ever heard the old saying the journey of a thousand miles begins with one step...? Well, every time we pull out of somewhere or ignore an opportunity (like Bill Clinton did out of Somalia, like Bill Clinton did in NONreponse to HOW many terrorist attacks during his presidency) we lay the groundwork for defeat. What makes you think that the same waffling liberals now won't be the same waffling liberals who run to Canada or anywhere else they can if we are attacked here? Tell me, Democrat, why should I believe you or put faith in your party who want to run yet again, to NOT to just lie down and surrender the USA to terrorists? Please tell me how I can have confidence in that? Because you SAY you will?? You need to understand these people...every weakness you show empowers them. They would see us pulling out now as a great victory. Maybe YOU want to give them that. I DO NOT.
I beg to differ. The crowds were not as big...sm
as 2+ million but the excitement was exactly the same.
I beg to differ but Obama

does have an agenda and a long list of things he has promised already.  Just because he just moved in doesn't mean he can't make a moronic decision right now.  He is already trying to pass a stimulus bill that I feel won't do a darn bit of good.  I have a right to look at his promises and and see which ones I think are good and which ones are bad.  I have a right to watch him from day 1 to see what his intentions are.  It really bothers me that you people think we should just sit back and wait for something bad to happen before we start questioning things.  Things are going on now....yes...even in his first week.  This doesn't mean I'm not giving him a chance.  I accept that he is my commander and chief.  I have the highest respect for him for becoming the first African American president.  He is a good speaker....minus some of the uuuuuuuhs....and I think his two little girls are adorable. 

It is my job as an American citizen to take pride in my country and want what is best and in doing so....I have to watch and make sure that the people who have been voted into office are doing the right thing for America....not their own personal purses and wallets.  I have a right to question what he wants to do.  I have a right to contact my congressman and senators and let them know if I think they are idiots or not.  That doesn't mean I'm not giving them a chance....but I am watching closely. 

I beg to differ with you! Our forefathers sm
DID found this country on Judeo-Christian values! Go back and read some REAL history books that haven't been "sanitized."

The way they are re-writing history now, they are taking everything out that this country was really founded on.

You are very wrong!
There are a lot of Southern Baptists around here who would differ with you. sm
My husband's church, where his uncle is the pastor, definitely believes Revelations is telling of the future.  There have to be a thousand different interpretations of Revelations out there. But there are definitely churchs who believe differently that what you are saying.
I beg to differ, it IS about "we" people.
Yes, I am a middle class American. I still have healthy savings and the credit cards I have are not maxed, because of choices I have made. You cannot blame the Republicans for peoples' bad decisions. I am not a Republican; I am an Independent. Though I have to say...if any party has been hijacked it is the Democrats...might as well change the name to the socialist party, because that is what it has become. That is evident in the posts I see here. They have convinced you that the wealthy people/corporations in the world are evil. If you knew how corporations figured into the economy of this country, you would know that is just not true. Corporations employ millions of Americans. Small businesses employ most of the rest of us. Democrats want to tax them into oblivion and drive even more business offshore to get out from under the tax burden. We have a higher tax on our businesses than any other country...which makes us extremely noncompetitive. THAT is why we lose jobs overseas and jobs here. Because the Democratic party has put the rax rate so high.

I don't want more and bigger government...I want less. I don't want higher taxes. I want less. I want businesses to be able to open and operate and compete with business outside our shores rather than join that business to get out from under taxes. I would like for Democrats to follow the entire Constitution and Bill of Rights, not just the parts that serve their agenda. I would like to get back to the place in America where we are Americans first, and Democrats/Republicans second. I would like politics in Washington to change, and Obama is not the one to do that. He and his VP are the #1 and #3 most liberal senators in the senate. They are washington politics as usual. Obama's entire career has been washington politics as usual...as is Biden's...30 years in the senate in washington. They are exactly opposite of any change. That is simple fact.

As to Republicans not making country stronger...that is the one major thing I agree with Bush on. He HAS kept this country safe. He has kept us on the offensive. And that is why we have not had another attack. AL Qaeda is much weaker. We drove them out of Iraq. I have no reason to think McCain will not continue that. He has said he would, and with his military experience, I believe him.

Obama is scary to me for that reason. I think he is soft on terrorism. He talks about "factions" of radical Islam and how you have to identify the "faction." That says to me he doesn't get it.

I do not agree that all the kids want Obama. However...this election is about all Americans, young, middle-aged, older. We all matter in this election.
I beg to differ, you are definitely not a stupid redneck. LOL! nm
Sorry, I beg to differ - a 6 week blob of tissue is not a CHILD yet. nm
Well said Marmann
This is one post I definitely agree with you on. Corruption is on both sides. I don't think any one party has any right to lump the other side into one category. I say if you do the crime you do the time and it doesn't matter what political party you belong to. Name me an honest politician and I'll....well actually I don't know what I'd do. HA HA. There are just a few that are decent but that is a very few.
Hey, Marmann.
Do you ever feel like you are trying to reason with cement? That is how I feel when I respond to some of these posts.
Hello Marmann:  I too hope you will be feeling better
Marmann...the OP would be 3rd under GP's
By OP, I meant "other post." I appreciate your reply which I am still digesting and will answer soon while trying to grab a bath in the meantime!
Marmann......... sm
Please don't ever apologize for sharing. I, for one, don't mind at all and find the information fascinating and useful. CF is such a cruel disease as it does attack so many different systems and causes general havoc. I had not heard about the GI symptoms, though.

May God bless you through your illness and bring about healing for you. There is a cure out there...they just have to find it. In the meantime, be kind to yourself and take good care of yourself. I do enjoy your "discourses" (hehe) here. :o)
Thanks Marmann
Oh I've made plenty of mistakes, but I learned a long time ago it's okay to say you are wrong. Keeps us human and humble. :-)

Also, thank you for being nice to me. I've read your posts on this board and you have actually changed my mind about some issues I used to believe in. I love hearing people's different opinions because it gives me a different perspective on things and more things to research.

Anthony Hopkins is one of the greatest actors of all time. When you can make a character so real it's just amazing. Hard to separate reality from fiction sometimes.

Have a great weekend yourself.
Hey Marmann............ sm
good to see you around. I know you don't get on very often because of health issues, as you have described here, and just wanted to say I hope you are doing better.

It's funny (funny - strange, not funny = haha) how a person's opinion can change based on their life issues. I know you would give almost anything not to be in the position that you are in now, but be glad that there is some help for you out there in the form of Medicaid and other agencies. My best to you!

It is for "people like you" that others fight for Medicaid and other social programs.  The purpose is to help.  You should feel no guilt or shame at all!  You have paid your dues, you have worked for years, and if at this time in your life you need to pull on the reserve of social programs that can help, then you, of all people, deserve to recieve those benefits.  That's what its there for.

I do realize it can be difficult for people in your positions being stuck with the label of "those people," but you should know better than anyone that that is not what its about.  There are people out here who do understand your situation and also understand that most people are only one incident/misfortune away from being in that same situation. 

Hang in there and don't let it get you down. 

Thank you for that, Marmann. s/m

I agree with your assessment of JTBB's posts, as I as well find them illuminating and well researched and knew she would find this movie as intriguing as I did, as I am sure you would, and I encourage you to to check it out and let me know what you think. 

I don't post on this board very much, although I do enjoy reading it, and I very much enjoy the comments that are worthwhile and thought-provoking, (even if sometimes I don't agree), and it's pretty easy to separate out the people who actually have a brain in their heads from the people who accomplish nothing more than being snide, inconsiderate, and really just want to "stir the pot" and be insulting just to satisfy some deeply buried sense of inadequacy by feeling like they need to post a CV which in some way is supposed to prove a person has a clue about anything.

Marmann, I always enjoy your posts as well, as we are usually of the same opinion on most matters, so keep it up!!  

Marmann: s/m

When I tried to send you one through this board, your address came up, but the message said MTStars does not forward e-mail to either comcast.net or aol.com.  For some reason there have been issues with these two carriers.  I had an old work e-mail on here that I used, but I just updated it and it's now under my personal e-mail.  Are you worried about security from this website?  I'm not too worried only because our carrier seems to have pretty tight filters and I have never had any problems.  If you decide to brave it, just holla back.

At any rate, just let me know.  The discussions on here have gotten too toxic for me -- talk about swimming in a river of piranha!  LOL


Hi Marmann............. sm
Good to "see" you! Hope you are feeling okay these days.

In a nutshell, what my statement had to do with was from a biblical perspective. Israel is God's chosen people and anyone who stands against them or harms them is in danger of losing God's favor. I feel, as a country, we are rapidly losing favor with God and I don't want to see what happens when He totally removes His hand of protection from us.
yes, Marmann, sometimes it is best to
takea break to 'clear one's head.' Have a great week, too. See ya...!
I beg to differ on all three of the companies you labeled make crappy cars...
I have had 2 Ford's in my life, my husband has had one and they are most reliable cars ever..the same goes for Chrysler and GM...I happen to live in Ohio where we have Ford, Chrysler and GM within a 20-mile radius of my house...it is sad because it is really affecting the economy around here with them closing...I for one would never buy a foreign car...My Dad retired from Chrysler and my Grandfather retired from Ford...
Marmann...... Don't know if you will even read this....... sm
but I just wanted to respond to a couple of things you said.

First off, I'm not a big Bush supporter, but he is our President and there's not a whole lot I can do about that. I will say, though, that there was not a question of Bush's citizenship before he even got into office to create for him the stumbling block that Obama is facing. To roughly paraphrase Obama in a speech he gave upon entering the US Senate in late 2004, he stated when asked about plans to run for President that he did not believe in hiring an unqualified person for job and that he himself was not qualified to serve as POTUS. Yet, 143 days later, he suddenly decided that he is qualified after making a couple of Senate speeches and barely raising the blip on the radar during his career thus far.

If the SC does overturn the popular vote, I agree, there will be h-e-double toothpicks to pay in terms of civil unrest, the likes this country has probably never seen before. However, OTOH, the thought of sending an unqualified individual (his words) into the highest office in the land and possibly the most powerful in the world conjures up images of not just civil unrest within our country but global unrest when he brings to pass the items on his agenda, of which I am reserving further comment on at this time.

In all honesty, I sincerely hope that your last statement will be proven true. If Obama is deemed qualified, inasmuch as his birth certificate (let's just put aside his own statement), I sincerely do hope that he is the best POTUS we could have put in, because anything less will prove disastrous for our country.
Well, I try to be kind, Marmann.......... sm
sometimes I do better than other times! HAHAHA

I agree that God favors honesty in His people and I don't mean to infer that the Israelis are without fault, but I also believe that trying to take Gaza from Israel is wrong because it wase given to Judah, one of the original 12 tribes of Israel, by God through Joshua to be inhabited by His chosen people. As a Christian, one thing that I want more than anything in this world is for Christ to come back and take me home. Some Christians believe that, in order for all prophetical events to be in place for Christ's return, Israel must occupy that land that was given to the original 12 tribes as well as the temple must be rebuilt in Jerusalem which, as you may know, is in the planning stages and materials are being gathered. The main sticking point with the temple being rebuilt is that the Jews believe the Dome of the Rock occupies at least part, if not all, of the original temple site in Jerusalem.

I said all that to say this. Whether we humans see the treatment of Palestine and Isreal of each other as fair through the lens of the media or not, God sees the whole picture and He is in control.
This is a great article, Marmann........ sm
Thanks for posting it.

Way back when the primary caucuses started, I mentioned Chuck Baldwin on this board but I don't think there was a single reply, good or bad, to my post. I wish he had had a little more exposure during the campaigns and was on the ticket in all states. He was not on the ticket in Texas.

To be honest, I really believe that the reason there is so much noise being made about Obama and none about what Bush has done while in office is that most people, myself included, are not aware of all the intricacies of the US Constitution. It is a very intricate document and most American people are only aware of what they had been taught in high-school or college civics classes and not tne entire document along with the US Code which is the law that helps fill in the spaces and further explain the Constitution. Even if there was an awareness on the part of the majority of the people, most would have been reluctant to bring any law suits against Bush due to the fact that we are (were) mired in Iraq and facing challenges on our homefront as well. Bush managed to get us through 9/11 in a way that made us all feel safe. While things might have gone kind of downhill after that with his administration, most people likely did not want to rock the boat and risk showing America as being weakened by the impeachment of her President. This is not said to excuse Bush's actions but just rather to explain how this American feels about the whole situation, and I doubt I am really alone in my feelings.

Now that a precident has been set with the Obama B/C situation, Americans seem to have awakened and started paying more attention to what is going on in our government and researching and finding out what the Constitution really says and not just what the media tells us. Maybe in 2012, Baldwin (or another Constitutional Party nominee) will step up to the plate and campaign more aggressively and win the presidency. It's time someone started running this country the way it was intended to be run.
Way to go, Marmann, I find it reprehensible
for someone so cowardly as to personally attack you for your opinion.  Just another perfect example of the quality (or lack of) people supporting the McPalin regime. 
To Marmann, Linda and others - see information
Please, PLEASE do not always think snopes is correct. They have been wrong on many occasions. Just type in "has snopes ever been wrong" in Google and many links come up to show they have been wrong. Snopes is run by Barbara and David Mikkelson, a California couple who met through an folklore urban newsgroup. And there is no credible sources whatsoever on snopes to prove that this is false. And being from California who are huge Obama supporters...well how convenient they just happen to have this website and can put up information without credible sources and everyone believes them???

To others - If there was "nothing" to this story, Barack would not have been ordered by one of the supreme court justices to submit his original birth certificate which he never did. The phony birth certificate that the Annenberg foundation (P.S. the Annenberg foundation is a staunch supporter of Obama) claims is his birth certificate has too many flaws on it.

I know a lot of Obama supporters are trying to push this under the carpet and pretend it never happened and try to debunk anyone trying to search for the truth.

The truth is that the actual birth certificate was never submitted. And like one of the posters said below "Obama has not shown it. He does not have it and the hospital has no record of birth certificate" the copy they have I do believe will prove he was born in Kenya. If he had it and it was valid he would show it, not have it legally hidden away so that NOBODY can view it. Brother! Talk about sending out red flags. Anyone with any sense can see there is something very wrong with this. If he was legal he would have shown the real certificate a long time ago and proved the "so called rumors" to be false. But because he hasn't anyone with any sense has got to wonder why. Why isn't he showing the true certificate? Why did the DNC give him a pass without checking it out? Who is backing him? Why was he legally allowed to secure the certificate? Too many why's.

But to have the supreme court involved. They don't take "bogus" cases, so there must be something valid to the claim that it will show he was born in Kenya to an American woman and African father and became an Indonesia citizen (and we don't know if he ever applied for US Citizenship).

We will soon find out (I hope). If he does not provide proof then everything he does as a president will mean nothing because it will all be invalid.
I wish you well Marmann and good health
We may not agree on politics but I wish you all the best in whatever you are going through. Hope you won't have a long hospital stay. Take care.
I hope you feel better soon, Marmann.nm

Marmann, you're usually smarter than this....sm
You know that Cheney had to give up all interests in this company before becoming VP...he is also in no way responsible for this happening.

And I agree with the previous poster....you've gotten way out of hand with your hatred of Pres. Bush.

I wonder, when Obama is president, and things of this nature occur.....are you going to blame him, just as you are blaming Bush?

I think not...more's the pity....in your eyes, Obama can/will do no wrong.
Thank you, Marmann - funny not too many people here had anything to say about THAT..

Excellent post Marmann!!! nm

Marmann - what a great post
Well thought out and worded very well. I hoped for so much from someone who hadn't been in the DC crowd for years and years, but each day am disappointed more and more. I enjoyed the fresh ideas he presented. But, everything has changed from the campaign. It's heartbreaking to see our country headed the same way Germany was with WWII, being run by the same kind of leader.

I do believe you and are I starting to agree on many issues. For me, when I voted for the O I had hoped that things would finally turn around for our country. But slowly any "hope" he offered kept dwindling away. There is no reason to hope anymore because it's just getting worse. He's kept his promise of "change", but he portrayed change for the good, and as we're waking up we are realizing, this is not change for the good. It's getting worse. But he does have quite a way with the words and still makes some people feel good about getting "screwed". But I do not blame the O. He is simply a puppet for the people who are really running the country. He is just a "bearer of bad news". Unfortunately he will be the "fall guy". My best guess is if things keep going this way, he will be a one-term failed present just like J. Carter and Bush Sr. That is of course if they don't change the laws and he be allowed to stay in for 3, 4, 5 or more terms. Don't think they would do it? Well we never thought the constitution would be changed either.
Marmann, I think you need to do a little history review....
Marmann: Would you mind if I sent you an e-mail? s/m
I already tried, but MT Stars will not deliver to your server, which also happens to be my server as well.  I would like to continue an intelligent rational conversation with a grownup and it is just not possible on this board.  LOL
Correct Marmann, and as MTs this will help our pay rate and jobs sm
If companies are rewarded for staying in the U.S., bye bye philipines and barbados and india for MT cheapo transcription. Hello USA hard working MTs finally making DECENT MONEY.
AND.... getting tax breaks.