O's votes support his claims. JM's votes support Bush.
Posted By: Nice try. sm on 2008-09-05
In Reply to: okay.... - sam
Believe what you like. Voting records tell the tale. Could use a few more details on that budget. Just what programs will he slash and and how many tax dollars will be directed away from middle class and in the direction of the rich? How much longer can the infrastructure afford to crumble?
JM adopted O's withdrawal plan when he saw how well it went over with the public in an election year. He flipped on the war once. What's to stop him from flipping again once elected? The nation is war weary. Some prefer a surge in diplomacy, not military answers to diplomatic failures. Ask the Iraqis who have lost more than 100,000 among them how sucessful the war has been. Obama has always understood that the OBL/Taliban live in Afganistan, not Iraq. JM, a little slow on the draw there.
I see nothing in JMs platform that backs his claims about transparency. I see specific plan on the O side under technology initiatives, continued initiatives which originated under Clinton and were reversed during the undercover Bush administration. Pork barrel spending for pubs means something different than it does to dems. Slash the poor to give to the rich? Hard seel in the current economic frefall. Also find nothing in JM's plan to address runaway contract corruption in Iraq. Having Halliburton and companies there props up those struggling American corporations. Show me the plan.
Antiglobal/antidiplomacy. No surprise there. This is about the futureworld, not American imperial delusions of grandeur. So much data on the drilling scam being an immediate relief for gas problems out there it is not worth addressing. Can you say T-Bone Pickens, i.e., we can't drill our way out of this one. He should know. Been an oil man all his life.
Since these are just a few, what else do you have up your sleeve?
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Most of his votes are not voting votes....
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Is Obama losing support or winning support?
John Clodfelter of Mechanicsville, Va., whose son was among the 17 sailors killed in the Cole bombing, said he arrived at the meeting with apprehension over the decision to close the prison. But after listening to the president and being assured that the terrorism suspects would not be released, Mr. Clodfelter said his opinion changed.
“I did not vote for the man,” Mr. Clodfelter said, “but the way he talks to you, you can’t help but believe in him. He left me with a very positive feeling that he’s going to get this done right.”
No, I actually support Bush and do believe he did the best he could under the circumstances (sm)
and I wish McCain had won. But saying "all of this is going to come back at you with a vengeance", just running over and saying that and then going away, isn't really accomplishing much.
Please support your claim Bush stole the election.
Bush was duly elected by electoral vote. The electoral college is the way our elections were designed to be conducted. Plenty of time to have constitutionally changed the system if that's what we wanted to do.
The 2000 election was the third time in US history the electoral vote trumped the popular vote. All three ended in Republican victories. The other two were in the 1800s. How was this stealing?
The Kennedy/Nixon election was the narrowest popular vote margin in US history (1/10 of a percent in Kennedy's favor.) Nixon actually won more states (26 versus 22) but Kennedy had more electoral votes. A real squeaker of a Democrat victory this time.
There has been more than enough time since this first happened in 1877, again in 1889, and almost again in 1961 to amend the constitution. Don't get into a competition, the rules of which are clear, then whine about those rules when you lose.
Facts, please.
LOL. 3 more votes....obviously you ...
don't know who the heck she is....lol.
only two votes...
regardless of the weight of their votes, it was a "yes" to a bill that should be better. i still want to know what the crap this "tax exemption for wooden arrows made for use by children" is all about????
And why would we thank him when it took 217 votes for this to pass?
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It does not matter who votes for it or against it....
it is morally wrong. Because it is legal does not make it right. While I will obey the law of the land, as my faith teaches me to do, I will continue to speak out against a procedure that is murder, no matter who chooses it. See link if you do not believe that life begins at conception. View that and tell me that abortion is not killing a living baby and then defend it as right because someone chooses it. That choice is choosing to kill a child. The one portion of this. If you feel that a woman needs a choice of whether or not to kill a baby, so be it, that is your right and I respect your right to say it. I do not and will continue to speak against it, and I hope that you believe it is my right to do that as well. Some of us must speak for the most innocent who cannot speak for themselves.
http://video.msn.com/v/us/v.htm?g=76c82299-9a7a-4656-8ec4-0f6fc1fd6ae0&f=06/64&fg=copy
If it doesn't, whoever votes against it
will probably have a severe media backlash. They made these changes so that the two main arguments - that it covers illegal immigrants and rich people - are discredited. If it doesn't pass, I'm sure they're going to have to deal with the media.
90% yes, but most of the votes were unanimous, so
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Only 11 more votes and it would have passed. nm
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They are reporting they have the 12 votes they need. sm
Just like the Senate, they are making it clear they do not care what their constituents think. The peasants need to start getting mad and show up with their torches and pitchforks.
The more votes they get, the more viable they become. sm
I would still rather vote my principles than hold my nose and vote for a Nazi and a Communist.
Well I wish they could get enough votes to become viable but (sm)
I doubt that they will. I understand your feelings though because I share in them. I just feel like I have to at least choose one as better than the other and make my vote count, because one or the other of them is going to win, and I feel like right now every vote is needed.
If we could just get their votes counted
sure would be a wonderful thing for them. How many of their votes already been disqualified in Virginia, I believe I heard 200,000?
soldiers votes
you know, on the news last evening, in a very mild manner, it was mentioned that maybe only 30% of the overseas military's votes will be counted this election, due to mail problems, time constraints, etc. OUTRAGEOUS!!! To boot, this also happened 4 yr ago, and still no one has fixed it (tho 1 senator is allegedly trying). Where are all the hanging chad type screaming complaints, the concern for the (hate this word now): disenfranchised???? IMO this would not be a hard problem to fix, so why is it still broke? A soldier's vote should be most definitely counted, WITHOUT FAIL. Grrrrrr. not to mention, that in Ohio, reported also last night, the homeless can now list their park benches as their addresses, and vote. Mind you, you cannot collect help in the form of welfare/food stamps etc without a solid normal address, but you can vote. nevermind that the homeless are likely uninformed. (don't feed or house them, just give them a ballot and tell them who to vote for...) all the while, our military's votes are casually tossed aside, with an "oh well..." i am still fuming the next day.
With over 200 electorial votes sm
Obama is most likely the winner. I,too, congratulate him and Mr. Biden on their apparent victory, although I may not be happy about it. I just pray our country can survive what is coming.
We could only hope votes would be
changed, but don't think very many states allow that.
When all is said and done, I bet the total of ALL votes in MN will be....
more than the total of registered voters in the entire state of MN. Come on, give us a break. Do you honestly expect us to believe there are that many "missing" ballots? This has been going on since November 5. Where could those pesky 1,000 votes have been hidden all this time, blast those nasty votes.
That said, I have a question....with all this back room hocus-pocus, will the Republicans be able to filibuster? There are not 60 Dems yet are there?
Votes counted by hand is the only way sm
by someone not getting money from the government. They were never able to call the state of New Hampshire on the news because their votes were all counted by hand. I am not sure if they still do it that way. Votefraud.org specializes on this issue, and there is lots of information there.
Those who cast the votes decide nothing. Those who count the votes decide everything.
—Communist tyrant and mass murderer Josef Stalin
Let's wait and see how than relates in votes....
shall we? :-)
Every senator on the floor during these votes....
has the identical experience Obama has. Does not make them foreign policy experts. How many times does someone have to say she was at the state level? She has as much foreign policy experience as Bill Clinton did when he was elected PRESIDENT. Geez. Your #1 guy has done...that is why he has Biden. He has never made an executive decision in his life, even in his campaign other than I am Barack Obama and approved this message.
John McCain is the only one of them, including Biden, with real and extended foreign policy experience. He has actually met with world leaders, not run the foreign relations committee. He is already known and respected worldwide. That is a no-brainer...and HE is the one running for the job.
Good for McCain, he has 3 more votes! nm
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No, because the Republicans don't have enough votes to pass it on their own...
even if they wanted to. Only the Dems. So apparently, they just didn't want it bad enough to put their political but*s on the line. What other reason could there be? They don't want to be the majority in case it tanks. THAT is hypocritical.
Just a few more votes on their part would have passed it. nm
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I especially liked the majority of votes to Obama
that was interesting also. Lets get democrats back in the white house for peace and prosperity to ALL - :)
Doesn't matter to me. I can look up the votes...
on regulation and deregulation. McCain was right about this crisis looming, Dems killed the bill in committee. What I saw was a 30-year product of what is wrong with Washington now and someone who is the antithesis of Washington politics. I am ready for REAL change.
To use your words, hey genius...its the Patriot Act. And it has already been used to foil plots within the US. We live in a different world now. Obama voted to extend the Patriot Act by the way. Just so you know.
That's awful!!! If ANYONE's votes should count is is theirs!!! sm
The government should have made absolutely sure our soldiers' votes were here on time and if not, dammit, we should postpone the election until they do. They are leaving their families and risking their lives to protect this country and they don't even get a vote on who runs it?? That has me fuming mad!!!!!!!
What about the military votes not being counted? nm
x
by electoral votes - it is most definitely a landslide!
x
In 2012 none of our votes will matter, if anyone
The signs will be obvious and the end will be eminent. You should worry less about politics and more about your soul, as should we all.
So what? All legal votes, we are not Iran....nm
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She also posted the links to check the votes...
unless the Congressional Record is also conservative propaganda. Lurker had one opinion about what happened to the Dem party after the vote in 1964, this lady had another opinion. Lurker's opinion is somehow more true than this woman's opinion? If so, how may I ask?
So playing the gender card to get votes
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yeah McBush will get all the feminist votes now
x
If the American public votes that into office, then
The Democrats had enough votes to pass it without the Republicans...
but refuse to. Why don't THEY grow up and go ahead and pass it? Because they don't want to be the ones to vote it in if it tanks. I repeat...put up or shut up, democrats!
I dont care who votes for Obama. I never could in
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Tennessee Votes for Gore Statue.
I'd give my kingdom to be a pigeon for just one day.
Won't happen, because the party in power wants their votes.....
and the fact that they can VOTE and influence our elections is the WORST affront of all, and the fact that an American political party is on BOARD for that just reeks to the high heaven.
A 12-vote margin out of 400+ votes suggests
If not, folks, it really is "turn out the lights", because this could be the biggest tax increase and worst policy bill that has EVER BEEN CONSIDERED BY CONGRESS in the history of this country.
Roberts: Iraq Will Affect Future War Votes
Fool me once, shame on you....etc.
I feel better knowing Congress is smart enough to not believe BU_ _ SH _ _ twice from this farce of a president.
Roberts: Iraq Will Affect Future War Votes
Experience With Faulty Data Has Made Senators More Wary, Panel Chairman Says
By Walter Pincus
Washington Post Staff Writer
Monday, November 14, 2005; A04
The Republican chairman of the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence said yesterday that one lesson of the faulty prewar intelligence on Iraq is that senators would take a hard look at intelligence before voting to go to war.
I think a lot of us would really stop and think a moment before we would ever vote for war or to go and take military action, Sen. Pat Roberts (Kan.) said on Fox News Sunday.
We don't accept this intelligence at face value anymore, he added. We get into preemptive oversight and do digging in regards to our hard targets.
He said that agreement has been reached on the Phase 2 review that the intelligence panel is doing to look into whether the Bush administration exaggerated or misused prewar intelligence. The review may not be finished this year, he said.
The intelligence panel vice chairman, Sen. John D. Rockefeller IV (D-W.Va.), also appearing on Fox, called the review absolutely useful because if it is the fact that they [the Bush administration] created intelligence or shaped intelligence in order to bring American opinion along to support them in going to war, that's a really bad thing -- it should not ever be repeated.
Appearing on CNN's Late Edition, national security adviser Stephen J. Hadley said the White House is supporting the study, adding: I think that what you're going to find is that the statements by the administration had backing at the time from accepted intelligence sources.
He said that when administration statements turned out to be wrong, that was because the underlying intelligence was not true, but that's not the same as manipulating intelligence, and that is not misleading the American people.
Sen. Carl M. Levin (D-Mich.), appearing with Roberts on Late Edition, said that Iraq became the center of terrorism after the March 2003 invasion.
I'm afraid we're going to see Iraq is not only the center of the war on terror, which it was not before we attacked Iraq, but now it is going to, I'm afraid, export it.
He added that Iraq has become the heartland of terrorism. It was not before we attacked.
Levin, a member of both the Senate intelligence committee and Armed Services Committee, has been a leading critic of the Bush administration's handling of the war.
Levin also said that the United States must get allies, as many as we can, including in the Muslim world because this is a form of fanatic Islam which has to be defeated by the moderate Islamic people.
In a column in yesterday's Washington Post, former senator John Edwards (N.C.), the Democratic vice presidential candidate in 2004, said the failures of the Bush administration turned Iraq into a far greater threat than it ever was. It is now a haven for terrorists [and] has made fighting the global war on terrorist organizations more difficult rather than less.
The president and his senior aides have said since before the invasion that Washington went to war primarily because Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction and was a threat to the United States and its neighbors because of his connection to terrorists. Once fighting began, they argued that Iraq was the central front in the battle against terrorism.
In his Veterans Day speech on Friday, the president turned his original argument around, saying, The terrorists regard Iraq as the central front in their war against humanity, and therefore, We must recognize Iraq as the central front in our war against the terrorists.
Counting by hand of 100 million votes would be a task...sm
Not that it is an unworthy one, I just doubt it will be done.
One idea was that the computer gives the voter a reciept of their selection and then the reciept, once verified by the voter, is deposited into the machine.
Brainstorming, I suggest they take it one step further and have a real time tally for each candidate per voting center. That way the voters can verify that their vote was casted, counted, and affected the number. The last voters, along with the volunteers could verify the final numbers for the districts.
Merv Griffith is a conservative and votes Republican. sm
Bill Clinton said something totally different today. He said *Speaking to a packed room in Ottawa last night, Clinton said that Americans put Democrats back in control in Congress in the mid-term elections this week to send a message about the Iraq war and curtail the involvement of “special interests” in politics.
But the results also had to be seen, Clinton said, as “a rejection of hard-headed, ideological politics in which people just make up their mind what the answer is and then they try to make the facts fit the answer.”…
Voters also want a government that doesn’t veer too far to the right or too far to the left, he added.
“They thought that the government has gone too far to the right, is too unaccountable. So what they voted for was not necessarily to legitimize the whole Democratic agenda but to give us a chance to build the vital centre of America and to get things done and come together.*
Conservative issues won, which is something AG posted. That is very telling. One thing it is not is a revolution.
To make it easier for some people, I tallied the votes (sm)
O did not vote on the issues 289 times. He voted yea 220 times and voted nay 128 times.
I haven't had the time to really check out the yea's or nay's but I will in the next couple of days.
If you want to claim that the democrats in congress were not equally responsible for their votes...
there is no talkin' to ya. But anyone who knows how voting works, knows the Dems share responsibility for any action or inaction that was taken.
I still say Petraeus knows more about it than Barack Obama does. And frankly, than you or I do.
Yes, that is the same thing we heard about Viet Nam, so no matter what we promised them about helping them, we just left. And the worst genocide in history followed right behind...the killing fields of Cambodia. And here the left is...wanting to do it again. No matter what indeed. Sigh.
The voting machines is a must to make voters confident their votes are counting...sm
But the Democrat party needs to delineate what separates them from the republican party as terms of what direction they will take the country. That is definitely uncertain. The chances of them getting their voters out to the polls will be better, I think.
Dems have stolen/manufactured votes for Franken in this election...wonderful stuff
And who would u support?
Is this Tara again?
I don't support HRC but......she has won the
That means, for the people that actually turn out to vote, she has gotten their votes, which is what a democracy is all about. Delegates are not constitutional in the first place....they were illegally put in place to supposedly keep one state from taking over the voting process; however, super delegates are completely illegal and have absolute conflict of interest.
So, Obama has NOT won the popular vote.....HRC has. I don't care for either of them, but looking at Obama's bedfellows, it's quite clear where his thoughts really lie and I certainly don't want anyone like that running my country. We are taxed enough without representation of those taxes and he has made it quite clear, all he wants to do is RAISE taxes and GIVE TO THE POOR. Pleeeeeze, we have so many social programs in my county alone, it's pathetic. THe ones geared towards children are not working, Headstart is just a babysitter for a bunch of teenage moms (in my city) who sit all day, DO NOT work, and are so lazy, they can't even get off their butts and walk their 3 year old out the Headstart bus that picks their children up curbside. Stand at the door in their PJ's, kids aren't even dressed when the bus comes, and the lady has to get off the bus and stand hollering for them to come on NOW. It's sickening to watch. And, Obama wants more of that? How about calling it what it is.......children who aren't learning in school are not learning because they go home to sloppy lazy parents, some no parents at all, living with whoever they're push off on, and homework is the last thing considered important. The only meal most get is at HeadStart OR free lunches at school. Until Obama wants to call it what it is and stop blaming the education system, then he's no better than any other candidate who just likes to point fingers instead of getting a backbone and say what the problem really is......NO parents, drunk parents, doped up parents.....the list goes on and on......
They support NRA
so you can hunt and so you can defend yourself if someone tries to hurt you. It is called self defense. Killing an innocent child isn't self defense....it is called murder and it is also selfish. I just don't understand why some of you people would rather save a rapists and murders life and you don't believe in the death penalty for criminals but you have no problem ending the life of an innocent child who has done nothing wrong and has no choice in the matter.
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