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Talking about Florida, I can only imagine how things would have been...sm

Posted By: payback time in Florida on 2008-10-13
In Reply to:

different in our country if only AL Gore had been president for the last 8 years instead of George Bush.


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So just imagine how much "better" things will be for all
In our 'great' economy, we'll have:

- Gasoline that is unaffordable to all but the wealthy.
- Blackened coastlines from offshore drilling.
- Few living-wage jobs left in the U.S.
- More foreign missles (and passenger jets) aimed at our cities.
- The likely loss of a woman's control over her own reproductive system.
- Even less separation of church-and-state than there is now.
- Further disappearance of our country's middle-class (the ones they expect to carry our economy on its shoulders). There will be the rich, and there will be the working poor, and with the current state of housing and rental rates, more of them will probably graduate to the status of 'car-dweller'.

Yeah, it all looks like a rosy future, alright.
Yeah, think things are bad with Obama? Imagine
nm
Welfare in Florida
Welfare in Florida can add up to about $900-1000 a month! Add reduced rent to that, food stamps, reduced utility bills, and why would you want to work?

I am so sick and tired of driving by low-income apartments with satellite dishes in the front, high-end SUVs in the parking lot and big-screen TVs visible through the screen door.

So yes, welfare does pay!
Obama will take Florida because of ...sm
Jewish grandchildren enlightening their Jewish grandparents. 
No voter redo for Florida
CBS/AP) Facing strong opposition, Florida Democrats on Monday abandoned plans to hold a do-over presidential primary with a mail-in vote and threw the delegate dispute into the lap of the national party.

While the decision by Florida Democrats left the state's 210 delegates in limbo, Democrats in Michigan moved closer to holding another contest on June 3. Legislative leaders reviewed a measure Monday that would set up a privately funded, state-administered do-over primary, The Associated Press learned.

In Florida, a frustrated Democratic Party chairwoman Karen L. Thurman sent a letter announcing the decision.

"A party-run primary or caucus has been ruled out, and it's simply not possible for the state to hold another election, even if the party were to pay for it," Thurman said. "... This doesn't mean that Democrats are giving up on Florida voters. It means that a solution will have to come from the DNC Rules & Bylaws Committee, which is scheduled to meet again in April."

Members of Florida's congressional delegation unanimously opposed the plan, and Barack Obama expressed concern about the security of a mail-in vote organized so quickly. Hillary Rodham Clinton's campaign expressed disappointment with Florida's decision.

"Today's announcement brings us no closer to counting the votes of the nearly 1.7 million people who voted in January," Clinton spokesman Phil Singer said. "We hope the Obama campaign shares our belief that Florida's voters must be counted and cannot be disenfranchised."

Florida here - OBama is on every 5 minutes
c
My guess would be FLORIDA. Most dope-

Obama tried to help this woman in Florida.
http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/02/11/henrietta.hughes/index.html

This story really gets to me. Obama has someone on his staff to try to help this woman out, but it took a republican's wife to give Hughes a place to stay for free for awhile until she gets back up on her feet right away. It is neat to see how people come together to help her out.

I also think it is odd that she got to speak with thousands wanting a chance to ask a question.
You go girl - 60,000 people attend her rally in Florida

Not bad for a town whose population is 70,000 people.


http://news-press.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080921/NEWS0107/80921022


 


 


 


 


yeah, and I've got this land for sale in Florida..
A little naive. of course he is going to try to level the playing field. Perhaps you are the one misunderstanding.
Judge overturns Florida ban on adoption by gays

(CNN) -- A Florida circuit judge Tuesday struck down a 31-year-old state law that prevents gays and lesbians from adopting children, allowing a North Miami man to adopt two half-brothers he and his partner have raised as foster children since 2004.


"There is no question, the blanket exclusion of gay applicants defeats Florida's goal of providing dependent children a permanent family through adoption," Judge Cindy S. Lederman wrote in her 53-page ruling.


"The best interests of children are not preserved by prohibiting homosexual adoption."


The state attorney general's office has appealed the decision.


Lederman said there is no moral or scientific reason for banning gays and lesbians from adopting, despite the state's arguments otherwise. The state argued that gays and lesbians have higher odds of suffering from depression, affective and anxiety disorders and substance abuse, and that their households are more unstable.


Lederman said the ban violated children's right to permanency provided under the Florida statute and under the federal Adoption and Safe Families Act of 1997. Whether the ban violated the state's equal protection clause by singling out gays and lesbians should be considered, she said.


Lederman's ruling paves the way for Martin Gill to legally adopt the two half-brothers, ages 4 and 8, whom he has cared for since December 2004, the American Civil Liberties Union said.


The two boys, who are referred to as John and James Doe in court documents, were removed from their homes on allegations of abandonment and neglect.


On that December evening, John and James left a world of chronic neglect, emotional impoverishment and deprivation to enter a new world, foreign to them, that was nurturing, safe, structured and stimulating," Lederman wrote.


In 2006, the children's respective fathers' rights were terminated, court documents said, and they remained in the care of Gill and his partner.


"Our family just got a lot more to be thankful for this Thanksgiving," Gill said Tuesday, according to the ACLU, which represented him.


Florida is the only state that specifically bans all "homosexual" people from adopting children, although it does allow them to be foster parents.


This month, Arkansas voters approved a ballot measure to prohibit unmarried partners -- same-sex or opposite-sex couples -- from adopting children or from serving as foster parents. The measure is similar to one in Utah, which excludes same-sex couples indirectly through a statute barring all unmarried couples from adopting or taking in foster children.


Mississippi allows single gays and lesbians to adopt, but prohibits same-sex couples from adopting.


Neal Skene, spokesman for the Florida Department of Children and Families, said the appeal was filed so a statewide resolution on the law could be determined by an appellate court. He noted that another Florida circuit judge declared the law unconstitutional this year but that ruling had not been appealed.


"We need a statewide determination by the appellate courts," he said.


Gill's adoption petition cannot be approved until the appeal process is finished, Skene said, but the children will remain in Gill's home.


"These are wonderful foster parents," Skene said. "It's just that we have a statute, [and] the statute is very clear on the issue of adoption."


Several organizations -- including the National Adoption Center, the American Medical Association, the American Psychological Association and the American Academy of Pediatrics -- have said that having gay and lesbian parents does not negatively affect children.


The Evan B. Donaldson Adoption Institute, a nonprofit organization that studies adoption and foster care, hailed the decision.


"This ban, which was the only one of its kind in the country, has done nothing but undermine the prospects of boys and girls in the foster care system to get permanent, loving homes," said Adam Pertman, the Adoption Institute's executive director, in a written statement.


"So this decision by Judge Lederman is a very important, hopeful ruling for children who need families."


typo - meant cite things as hoax, not "site" things
Just thought I'd correct that before I get pummeled by the people who want to believe snopes is a truthful organization.
LOL. I can only imagine the

campaign ads that would have emerged from the Clinton campaign against Ms. Now-where-did-I-put-my-notes Pirro.


Hillary hasn't impressed me much lately, though, and I truly can't imagine myself voting for her if she runs for President. 


I would imagine...
the conservative magazine was interested because of the infighting that starts during the primaries...when the Democrats start taking potshots at each over over the bow. I have no trouble believing the Clinton campaign leaked it. While he was not in a medrasa (although the source I saw who went and investigated it was a reporter from CNN, so hardly impartial), it was a Muslim school. I also found it odd that the report said it could not be substantiated rather than it was a lie. Usually CNN goes big with the it was a lie and I did not hear that from this reporter, which makes me think there is more than they are telling. All that being said, I don't see how he can have first hand knowledge of Muslims and Islam if his father left when he was a boy and he was educated in non-Muslim schools, as he and everyone else seems to be saying, trying to distance themselves from anything Muslim. How is he more qualified than any other American politician to talk about Islam and Muslims? After all, he is not a Muslim...right? You aren't sure either, apparently. However, if he was, that is not the reason I would not vote for him. There are several others and more important ones in my estimation.
Trying To Imagine . . .
An Atheist President
I'd like to do more than imagine it. sm
I'd like it to be a reality - again (see below). Think of it, a president who bases his/her decisions on facts, reason, and logic rather than beliefs in a supernatural fantasy (i.e., the Bush administration).

Actually, presidents Lincoln, Jefferson, and I think Madison were athiests or deists. They certainly weren't christians, and neither were many of the founding fathers. And even those that were (christians) were, above all, secularists. I find it tragic that we've gotten so far away from that.
Imagine

JM in a meeting with Russian or Iraq leaders about nuclear arms.  JM gets mad, calls the leader a "#@@#$#" and shoves him.  Lord love a duck.


 


Just imagine a man outside

by his car and a young child walking by and the man says to the young child, "I've got some candy.  Do you want some candy?  You have to get into my car if you want a piece of candy."


Or how about Obamanation groupies.....Do you want change.  You have to get onto my bus and register to vote for change.  Remember Uhhbama is change.  HAIL OBAMA!  McCain bad.....Uhhbama good. 


Just imagine
the US government decided to rid itself of its low income housing woes by exporting it to the Indian reservations or 50 miles inside the Mexican or Canadia border. The could simply establish exclusive use infrastructure (roads, water, electricity, sewage), build a housing development, subsidize loans and pay ghetto residents a bounty to pack up and move out of the country.

Do not kid yourself into believing that Israel's splitering of the West Bank is some random accident. This is just one more of a long list of methods they have been using to shrink the geography right out from under the Palestinians to the point where it can no longer support the population and force their flight into the diapora, all neat and tidy. Why do you think they fight so hard to prevent the right of return?
Another lie - imagine that
Lie after lie after lie after attack after attack after attack.

This is just not true.
I definitely cannot imagine
a guy with multiple wives having the love and commitment for all of them that a person with only one spouse has.
And I certainly can't imagine........... sm
a man loving a man or a woman a woman in a sexual way and wanting to be married in the eyes of the law.....but that's just me. I guess all things are possible.

Certainly, a man with multiple wives, I would think, would not be able to give equal love and committment to just one. His attentions would be divided and I don't even want to think about the in-fighting amongst the co-wives. BUT who is to say that all marriages are based on love alone?
I can now imagine what Obama
felt when he was linked, ever so tenuously, with VP Cheney. 
I just can't imagine that happening.
I mean....wouldn't that look bad for the Dems for the VP to just say....I don't want to do this....I've changed my mind and then this close to the election start with a new running mate?  Besides....Hill doesn't want to play second fiddle to Barry.  Personally, I don't think true Hill supporters will like her lpaying second fiddle to Barry either.  I will be truly surprised if this happens.  I guess I will believe it if I see it but not until then.
Can you imagine all these folks
worrying about the pubs wasting 150,000 of their little handful of funds? You got Obama there who has spent more $$ than anyone in political history, and isn't near through yet. Now, how many hungry children could he have fed? Remember, this is another one of his lies where he first agreed to accept public funding, however.
You'd be wrong to imagine that.
Having been born in a silver-sppon neighborhood, I can tell you the best thing that ever happened to me is the divorce that busted me, my sisters, brother and mom back down into the middle class. Money was nothing but misery for family members trying to compete with it for attention. Be careful what you ask for.
Thanks for the visual. Having fun trying to imagine it.
x
Can you imagine what his life would be like if the
Life is hard enough for kids, even when everything goes as planned. The schoolyard is a cruel, cruel place.

And what about every time he does something wrong, or sasses back at his mom? There will be the either implied or spoken insinuation that it came from his dad's bad seed.
Hard to imagine how this could

  **'escalate violence' in the region since nobody has safe in those waters for years.  Should we be like the woman abused by her husband for years, who doesn't want him arrested because she doesn't want to 'make him mad'  ?


So these lawless jerks hijack, steal, kidnap, threaten murder, then swear vengeance when we oppose them?  http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/piracy


......One of the pirates pointed an AK-47 at the back of Phillips, who was tied up and in "imminent danger" of being killed when the commander of the nearby USS Bainbridge made the split-second decision to order his men to shoot, Vice Adm. Bill Gortney said. The lifeboat was being towed by the Bainbridge at the time, he said.


A fourth pirate was in discussions with naval authorities about Phillips' fate when the rescue took place. He is in U.S. custody and could face could face life in a U.S. prison.


**"This could escalate violence in this part of the world, no question about it," said Gortney, the commander of U.S. Naval Forces Central Command.


Abdullahi Lami, one of the pirates holding the Greek ship anchored in the Somali town of Gaan, said: "Every country will be treated the way it treats us. In the future, America will be the one mourning and crying," he told The Associated Press. "We will retaliate (for) the killings of our men.......


Imagine that; the usual suspects who
more to offer than more of the same swiftboating as the Kool-Aid drunks applaud them.
I don't imagine you bothered to read...
entire thread...but why would you? lol.
The clip has been pulled - imagine that!
They sure are trying their hardest to keep what it is they are about out of the news.

As the infamous Indiana Jones stated.....

"Nazi's.....I hate these guys."
Can you imagine living in a red state, and
having to walk down your street every day, knowing most, if not all, of your neighbors thought that way? Where trying to have an actual conversation with anyone would be like talking to a brick wall? Where you figure all the moms & dads sitting in bleachers at your kid's little league came probably wear white sheets at night? Brrrrrrrr.......
Gives me the heebie-jeebies.
I cannot imagine not knowing how many homes I have
They are just living in a parallel universe. He talks big but I can tell when McBush speaks that he really doesn't "feel" the pain of the middle class or heaven forbid, the poor or the seniors on fixed incomes. That is something he will never have to feel.
Now 120K, imagine that. DH makes that and more on his own...so much

for me having to work any longer (now I can wait by the mailbox for a check!). What a country where you get penalized for hard work and doing the right thing.


I'm agreeing with your post - imagine that :-)
However, I couldn't find where anyone called you "stupid". Someone who just put the initials sm above called me "stupid".

Here's my thing when I say O worshippers. I am not talking about all of you. There are a few that come on this board and cut down anyone who doesn't "google" and drool at the mention of Obama's name. They can't tell you his policies or ideas or anything. They just go on and on about how we're all trying to spoil their joy and glee that Obama was voted and their dancing in circles. Well that's all fine and good. When I say O worshippers/lovers I'm talking about people who know nothing about Obama's policies. I've read his policies and plans - I don't like them. That's my opinion. When people bash me for no good reason except that I'm not blindly dancing around in circles over-joyed that Obama got in and when I post some serious questions about his policies and ideas and get bashed for it, those are the people I call O worshippers/lovers.

This whole issue of political families "inheriting" their relatives seat is outright disgusting. There are so many qualified people to fill the seats and what do we get someone holding a seat for Biden's son when he returns from his tour of duty and it will just be handed to him without him having to campaign for it, or another Kennedy in the seat just cos her name is Kennedty and the most laughable one Chelsea? I am losing all interest in politics because all I see is corruption. They are treating their positions in the senate as though they are royalty and the position just handed down to their relatives. If I never see or hear of another Kennedy, Clinton, or Bush it will be too soon. There are so many unknown people in politics that are really good people, but they get tossed aside. Why? Cos they don't have money.

As for your last paragraph regarding how can anyone defend the Bush administration and what Cheney said, etc. All I can say is I agree, I agree, I agree 100%. Although I do have to say it goes even farther then those two ninnies - there were plenty of other players who had a say in this farce of a war, and the reason why or economy is going into a depression.
I think he's more deceptive than people imagine........
nm
I like it here. Besides, mostly all they discuss there is current events. Imagine that. nm

I can't begin to imagine what the parents must feel.
I would be so enraged if I were in their position that I'm not sure what I'd do. I hope I would remember that keeping my family together and supporting my child (or children if there are siblings) has to be a priority, but on the other hand, to know that this monster is free to walk the streets and do this to other children... I'm not sure I wouldn't do whatever was necessary to put him either behind bars or underground. I certainly couldn't condemn a parent in that situation who made that choice.

I really hope there is enough uproar over this to change things. Otherwise, what choice do people have to protect their children but to take the law into their own hands? These judges (and legislators, for that matter) need to realize that, like guards in a prison, government rules by consent of the governed. Fail to protect the governed or to enforce reasonable laws in a just manner, and the governed will assume control one way or another. I am not an anarchist by any means, but law and order is one of the most basic governmental responsibilities. We can argue til the cows come home about everything else we would or wouldn't like the government involved in, but if they fail on too large a scale in this most basic duty, vigilantism and anarchy become inevitable.
Miss Thang, I imagine that you could offend
nm
Very true. Can anyone imagine living on minimum...sm
wage and being made to feel you are not valued, never mind paying your bills. There are a LOT of working poor out there that do not look for a handout and struggle every day to be good parents. It is unbelievable to me that so many people think that the poor are all lazy and worthless. I am sure the sterotype makes the rich able to justify not paying a little more to those lazy ignorant people that just need to pull themselves up by their boot straps while I have a house for every month of the year and a yacht and never have to worry about if my light or heating bill is paid or if I have enough money to buy food for my kids. Don't get me started.
One would imagine so he can get bipartisan 1st-hand info
It is appropriate that he continues exactly on the course he is following for the moment...cabinet building, prioritizing and preparing initiatives for day one so as to hit the gound running.
When McBush is talking, he isn't talking to you unless you are wealthy or CEO

 


who provides campaign funds.  Do you know why lobbyists are making the headlines?  Because they are bribing the politicians of both parties - lobbyists work for private interests (AIPAC) along with the pharmaceutical company ($280.00 for a bottle of pills?  Only in America, folks), oil industry (record profits at your expense) credit card companies and unethical banking procedures (Funny isn't it how Visa wrote the reformed BK bill, making virtually everyone end up in ch 13 (garnishing income, including SS) after raising credit limits and offering transfer balances at 0 percent to everyone with a last name and a roof over their head?  Along with mtgs that were bound to turn into bad loans when house prices dropped which they always do after a bubble.  God, I could go on and on here but I get tired.  The nation is in such trouble.  Serious serious trouble.  There is a huge loan to an unfriendly country (did you watch the Olympics?  did you ever see Bush look more uncomfortable other than during the Stephen Colbert roast during the national press conference.  lol.  


Well I want you to know what fascism.  And I want you to know that those treasury notes are backed up by the taxpayers (you) and real estate including roads and govt buildings and parks.  Have you noticed why Save-Mart Center is owned by savemart and not a community business or the community itself?  There is somethign happening slowly and surely and it is NOT going to benefit middle class america one iota.  You must know that as a poor person, you have no power, no voice.  Elections are rigged and the politicans cease to care whether you like them or not - oh wait, that has already happened. 


THINK ABOUT THIS!!!!  Your 401Ks and investments/assets are what at are stake! 


Fascist governments nationalized key industries and made massive state investments. They also introduced price controls, wage controls and other types of Soviet-style economic planning measures.[12] Property rights and private initiative were contingent upon service to the state.[13].[14] Fascists promoted their ideology as a "third way" between capitalism and Marxian socialism.[15] Fascists in Germany and Italy claimed that they opposed reactionaries, and that they were actually revolutionary political movements that fused with conservative social values.


Talking to them is talking to a brick wall.
nm
Imagine that simple statement being recited by a white man about blacks.
It would have been labeled a racist remark.
I agree...Imagine the brave soul who would give an oppositional opinion...sm
It would be career suicide IMHO.
I am, not talking about Clinton, I am talking
about the torture of prisoners, crimes against the Geneva conventions.

It seems that you did not read the last sentence in my former post.

Are you saying that crimes from the near past should all be forgotten?
Oh I can always tell when things are going your way
the diatribes ensue.
How do you get away with saying things like that exactly?

Two things:

1:  His approval rating as I write this has now decreased to 29%.  (However, by the time you read this, it may be even lower yet.  He is most definitely *a work in progress,* and the number of Americans who are waking up and smelling the proverbial coffee is increasing at a rapid rate.


2.  The fact that the government has been tracking phone calls of hundreds of millions of Americans may be nothing more than a political *parking ticket* compared to what we might discover next week.


http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2006/5/12/19380/1332


NSA Whistleblower: There's More, People Are Going To Be Shocked



Fri May 12, 2006 at 04:38:00 PM PDT


From the subscription-only Congress Daily, Chris Strohm reports that NSA whistleblower Russell Tice will make some on bombshell revelations on Capitol Hill next week:



A former intelligence officer for the National Security Agency said Thursday he plans to tell Senate staffers next week that unlawful activity occurred at the agency under the supervision of Gen. Michael Hayden beyond what has been publicly reported, while hinting that it might have involved the illegal use of space-based satellites and systems to spy on U.S. citizens. Russell Tice, who worked on what are known as special access programs, has wanted to meet in a closed session with members of Congress and their staff since President Bush announced in December that he had secretly authorized the NSA to eavesdrop on U.S. citizens without a court order.  In an interview late Thursday, Tice said the Senate Armed Services Committee finally asked him to meet next week in a secure facility on Capitol Hill.


Tice was fired from the NSA last May. He said he plans to tell the committee staffers the NSA conducted illegal and unconstitutional surveillance of U.S. citizens while he was there with the knowledge of Hayden, who has been nominated to become director of the CIA. Tice said one of his co-workers personally informed Hayden that illegal and unconstitutional activity was occurring. [...] I think the people I talk to next week are going to be shocked when I tell them what I have to tell them. It's pretty hard to believe, Tice said. I hope that theyıll clean up the abuses and have some oversight into these programs, which doesn't exist right now. [...]


Tice said his information is different from the Terrorist Surveillance Program that Bush  acknowledged in December and from news accounts this week that the NSA has been secretly collecting phone call records of millions of Americans. It's an angle that you haven't heard about yet, he said.


what 2 things
In the last paragraph of your post Re: The Other Side of Mel Gibson, you state,
There's two things that booze does. You omitted the second thing. What, in your opinion, is the second thing that booze does?