That's how the mortgage cookie crumbles!
Posted By: Tough Noogies on 2008-09-30
In Reply to: Yes, but when it is your neighbor who overextended - themselves, they will go into foreclosure.
I am still against bailing out homeowners only!
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I'm a tough cookie and don't get offended easily
Well I guess you could call it a conflict with myself. On one hand I'd like to believe what they say (that they want a better America and to do good things for Americans and that their plans would be good for the country), but Bill's whole presidency really put a bad taste in my mouth and I was so relieved to have him out of the office. Mind you I'm no fan of Bush, but I was terrified to get Gore in there to continue on with more of the same. Anyway....Gore is a whole nother issue I won't go into.
I was against Hillary's campaign from the beginning. I never have liked her. I did like her while he was campaigning and for about the first two years of him being president, then started reading and learning things about her (her position at Rose Law firm, what she did to get where she's at, her literally having to be pulled off of Bill by the secret service, the foul language she used towards people, the way she would talk to the secret service, the mysterious deaths, her trying to socialize the health care system, the way she represented the US when she would go over to another country and was presented with a gift and she would turn to Chelsea and make a comment that she thought nobody heard but was picked up on the cameras as her telling Chelsea it was a piece of s@@t and she was not going to wear it, etc, etc. She also said another time to Chelsea that she was tired of doing stuff and having to talk to people (other leaders wives) her were below her "class". This was caught on camera so it's not made up.
I was turned off by her campaign tactics from the beginning. The lies, her little crying episode when she felt it served it's purpose. The "shame on you Barack" speech she gave all the while she had been putting out lies about him and his plans. It was the kettle calling the otherside black (or whatever that saying is). The real cincher was when she said she was staying in because we have to remember that "Kennedy was assissinated in June, right?" She never once apologized for anything and she blamed it all on the other side. She doesn't and has never taken responsibility for anything she says. She will say something and blame the other side. But it doesn't surprise me because Bill is the same exact way. A lot of what she did I believe was probably at the direction of the campaign advisers (Terry McAuliffe and others), but she is a grown woman and knows better and she could have said no. She inflated herself like when talking about how she is experienced in dangerous situations because she flew into Bosnia when it was under fire and she has answered the "red phone". Those were outright lies and she knew it. Then everyone says, oh she just couldn't remember. Well I was in the Army - believe me you know when your being fired at. Also claiming what Bill accomplished in the white house as if they were her accomplishments. When caught in her lies she laughs it off and says it was a "minor" mistake.
I do think she could unite the party, but she is choosing to divide it. She says in public she wants a party that is united, but yet she's not telling her supporters that they need to back the nominee. She's telling them that if they march to the convention they have another chance that she could be put on the ticket. She should be telling them that she is not the candidate and she is proud of how far she got but she'll just have to try another time. She is the person who could calm them but she is deciding not too.
I think I do have a lot of fear with McCain. I do not see much of a difference between Hillary and McCain. They have voted the same way in the senate. So the thought of those two are quite frightening for me. I just hope Obama picks the right VP choice. I do hope Clintons supporters do not march to the convention like they say they are going to. I need to read up on history but believe the last time that happened it was horrible and the party lost. Which brings me to the next point which is I have heard that that is Hillary's plan. She wants McCain to win so that way in four years she can run again and therefore she will do everything she can to make sure Obama loses.
I read that she is co-chair of the Senate India Caucus and that she and Bill accepted over 360K (she 60K from them and B 300K) and this is a group that is responsible for taking jobs away from Americans and giving them to other countries (India for one) - this means jobs like yours and mine.
B&H are pushing for a one-world government. They have been trying to get Canada, America & Mexico to become one country with one currency (similar to the Euro), and Hillary wants to be the world leader over it all. This is nothing I heard from any right-wing conspiracy group. This is some document I read somewhere but I can't quote it at this time (would take some research).
What I don't like about B&H ... Vince Foster (suicide?) and removal of documents from his office, Gennifer Flowers, Monica Lewinski (lies and cover ups), Travelgate, Castle Grande (sham transactions), Cattle futures, Waco, Elian Gonzales, mysterious deaths of James McDougal, Mary Mahoney, Ron Brown, Ed & Kathleen Willey, Jerry Parks, James Bunch, James Wilson, Kathy Ferguson. There at least 35 others but won't list them all. Them accepting illegal funds, destroying the white house before they left and air force one, Hillary saying that she was going to think of the cleaning lady in her office building as a human being. I did get sick of when there was a tragedy and he would be there in front of the camera he had his "sad pouty face" on, but as soon as he thought the camera was off of him he'd go into a laughing state and be quite jovial, then he'd see a camera and back was that sad face again. His lies that he belonged to all these black churches throughout his life. There are other things I can't remember right now.
When Bill was campaigning for president I heard about all the promises he made, lower the budget, cut in taxes, beter health care for Americans, this, that, and other promises. He never once held good on his promises (but in all fairness the same has happened with other politicians). During Clinton presidency jobs were lost to overseas, and about 3 weeks after he became president our military was cut back so much that America was not safe from it's enemies. Mind you at this time I still thought he was okay, but little by little that was being eroded away.
One thing about your statement that got me thinking about my opinions about his policies. I may be in the wrong about some of my feelings and its' been so long that I really need to read up about what he did in there. I just disliked him so much that I usually turned him off. I'd hear things here and there (and now I do have to admit I listened to Rush Limbaugh and Fox News a lot at that time) and I do realize that its not fair to judge them on things I heard from them.
Anyway...you have some very good issues you brought up and to tell the truth I do have to do a bit more research. I think overall is my basic disgust of the lies they have told throughout their careers. The way their "fan base" will not listen to truth and claim that Bill and Hillary are so innocent and never did anything wrong, it was all a conspiracy against them.
I never did have anything against Bill's affairs. It is not my busness whether he sleeps with other people and I don't find that as disgusting as a lot of people do. Nobody knows what was going on in their lives that brought him to that position and if I had a wife like Hillary I'd probably sleep with someone else too, but all I say is tell the truth. It was the lies and coverup that I had a problem with. I didn't care that he couldn't keep his boys behind closed doors, but be a man and admit it.
So to sum it up my biggest problem with them is they lie, they manipulate, when caught they say they never said it and when told its on film he comes out and says I'm not going to play that game instead of something like well if its on tape I must have said that and lets talk about that further at another time. I just really lost respect with them. In all fairness for them though I do have to say they are not the only politicians like that.
One more note is I liked your post. It was long but had some very good points and really is making me think twice about some things. I don't think I've answered all your questions, but you have given me a lot to think about. It hasn't changed my opinion since I first posted but is getting me to think and do some research. Tx.
The best arguments are straightforward and simple. Give that boy a cookie! nm
x
Why should we pay your mortgage?
Why on earth should the people who were smart enough not to jump on the bandwagon and buy a bigger house than they could afford give a 30% mortgage decrease to the people who went hog wild and spent above their means? I am not a homeowner, by choice, and I am totally against giving anyone a decrease on a mortgage that they agreed upon when they purchased their home. You make a mistake, you pay the consequences!
Mortgage
Somebody who cannot afford to buy a house should not buy a house, bedasue they do not want to lose out on the rent money.
There are people out there who buy a house, rent it out and expect the tenants to pay the mortgage. If something goes wrong, who pays the mortgage then?
Wrong speculations!
about that fixing your mortgage --
are they going to go back and fix everybody's mortgage that has already had their house foreclosed?
DH and I should get our mortgage fixed....
we have no debt but our home, have never missed a payment or been late, pay a few hundred dollars extra every month towards the principal, have never taken out a HELOC or used our equity (quite a bit) for anything and have a fantastic credit score. We should have our rate lowered below the 5% it is now for doing a great job. But no, we'll give a break to those who bought too much house, had to compete with the Jones' and who took out foolish loans to begin with.
The Mortgage Failure......
Check out the mortgage failures.
Tell me which failed more, prime or subprime
Tell me what is the rate of failures under the CRA or even Bush's ADDI (which i attack alll the time)
Once again, REALITY AND THE DATA doesn't fit ya'lls claims.
Basically what happened was.. we reformed bankruptcy laws.. so that people who ran into dire straights could not restructure.
We packaged the loans into commodity derivatives. These are sorta mirror bets on the loans. Sorta..as the same loan will be sold many times in many derivative packages.. that's why the housing derivatives are worth more than all the real estate in the US. Derivatives are actually not that bad.. when a market is stable and only has to deal with natural forces. The housing market was bubbled.. partially due to low interest rates that encouraged everyone to buy, even the rich, and partially due to the CRA and the ADDI.. which did add customers to the market (helping form the bubble was the extent the CRA and the ADDI had in this mess)
All it took was a few failures to pop the bubble..and make real estate prices drop,. and mind you, it was mainly prime loans (READ not loans given to poor people and not loans under the CRA) that failed. The derivative market.,.which like I said, is really mirrors of the same loans.. cause the defaults to explode with ten times the ferocity, because one loan could effect the price of dozens of derivatives.
Really the poor and even irresponsible people .. simply did not have the economic ability to cause this mess. Pool all their money together and waste it on hookers.. it would have zero effect without help from the rich elites and their magnifying packaged derivatives.
THE CRA and ADDI both had stricter requirements than loans you got from normal banks.. both required income data.. where many prime loans did not.. they also greatly limited you on how much home you could purchase..whereas private banks did not care if you tried to buy something you could not afford.
Don't believe me?.. Look in the phone book.. call your own housing authority - you can get a loan for 106% the purchase price of a home even today.. if you're poor enough.
Ask to hear the red tape and hoops you must go through.. Heck, it is probably easier to just get a real job and earn real money than go through the FHA.
I don't think we should bail out anyone's mortgage.
Anyone who took out a mortgage and signed a contract to repay the loan and needs to do so. I don't care if they are illegal aliens, legal aliens, space aliens, or United States citizens.
the whole mortgage thing upsets me...sm
I have a subprime mortage and have had for over 3-1/2 years, but I make my payments on time every month. I can't even get a refinance to go through with almost $40,000 in equity in the house and only needing a loan for $85,500, as I put down a big down payment when I bought the house, but if I had an ARM or was in foreclosure there are programs that would put me in a new mortgage. So, here I am trying to take care of my bills, be a productive citizen, and I get no help. Makes lots of sense don't it.
McCain's mortgage plan
Did anybody understand when McCain brought up plan to buy bad mortgages and renegotiate, etc. Would that be with the $700 billion we are already shelling out or would this be an additional $300 Billion the taxpayers have to pay. If I can get my mortgage renegotiated with the government, maybe I'll just stop paying my mortgage and get something out of this after all!
Citi is my mortgage holder too. sm
They are just downright nasty when you call, can never post things on time, and then have the nerve to call and ask me when I am going to send my check when I have my bank statement in front of me saying they processed the check 3 days before they called me.
I am with you...LET THEM ALL TANK. Why should I give ANYBODY more of my hard earned money. And that includes Obama and his "redistribution of the wealth" schtick.
Disagree. Mortgage lenders FM/FM
and sub-prime mortgages did it, along with all the money certain senate leaders got for sticking up for for FM/FM. It's called GREED.
Dear Crabby, about the mortgage
Yes, American people were also greedy, but there were predatory lenders who got higher commissions for giving out those certain types of ARM mortgages. Do you know what an ARM is? Even if people qualified for conventional mortgages, the mortgage brokers didn't offer them because there was more money in it commission-wise for them if they brokered the ARM loans. We can thank Bush and the repubs because they did not want to regulate any of this.
You really should educate yourself.
Fugget about Uncle Tom's Cabin. Is that your claim to fame? aww shucks.
I have my mortgage throught CitiCorp.....
I wonder if I will see any of that largesse....NOT. Guess you have to be on the letter head. Oh well....LOL
No need to wonder...current mortgage bank crisis...
brought to you courtesy of greedy democrats on Congress and greedy Democrats at the top of Fannie Mae. The handwriting is on the wall. This one's on you. McCain saw it coming in 2005 and the dems shut him down. Well, we are reaping what they sowed. To quote Toby Keith...how do you like them now?
Rush just said the same thing....give everyone with a mortgage...sm
something like $75,000 to pay down their mortgage.
Do you agree with him also?
Yes, slimy mortgage companies who have no oversight....they don't ask anything
just selling 'em as fast they could and packed them all up into nice little derivatives to drive up the bubble and make fast money - at our expense.
You don't mind paying for an illegal mortgage?
nm
If the current mortgage securities plan prevails,
come out of it all smelling like a rose. They are proposing to refinance the mortgages based on inflated appraised values that existed BEFORE the mortgage crisis, not the current lower values. In this way, the homeowners will still end up owing more on their mortgages than their homes are actually worth....they will just be paying for it for a longer term with more accumulated interest on the loan. Those terms are the ones we need to keep our eyes on and see how it plays out, but it looks to me like it is not going to make it into the next session of Congress.
BT, I am sooo with you, we also finally paid the mortgage, the cars are ours....sm
and no more credit, bad debts and loans killed the economy and Wall Street. Just providing for our 3 kids and making ends meet is the daily challenge, but we have each other and a good extended family, I so hope that the good thing that comes out of this crisis is LESS MATERIALISM in this country, back to simpler living and being happy with less!
I'd be happy if they just reduced everybody's mortgage rate to a fixed 3%. sm
Then everyone is still responsible for the debt they took on, yet they're still getting a break. It would free up a couple hundred bucks a month for me, which I could then use elsewhere to stimulate the economy. Fewer foreclosures, banks are still getting their money.
Yeah, but wouldn't it be great if they paid your mortgage?
Apparently, you have no problem with charity if it begins at "home."
Wrong. Democrats are responsible for the mortgage meltdown, not Bush....
McCain tried to tell them in 2005...Dems blocked the regulation he begged for for Fannie/Freddie. But the Dems were too deep in the pockets...Franklin Raines, Jamie Gorelick, James Johnson, Timothy Howard...all democrats, all walked away from fannie Mae with golden parachutes of millions...and we are left holding the bag. Fannie contributed more to Chris Dodd, Democratic head of Banking and COmmerce committe than any other senator in the past 20 years...followed closely by Barack Obama, who has only been IN the senate for 2 years...you do the math and follow the money. Democrats largely responsible for this. ANd you want to put one in the white house. Who wants to raise taxes in this financial crisis. What part of collapse of the economy don't you...and Mr. Obama...understand?
McCain has fogotten the stock market crash, mortgage/credit crisis,
unemployment rates, job losses, stagnant wages, rising prices in gas, food, health care, etc, etc, etc.
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