The present crisis was not caused by Bush or McCain...

• This could be why - Kaydie
  • Interesting article, did you see some of the comments and links... - sm
  • Here's another possible reason: - Marmann
    • or maybe his - IMT
      • I'm not blind. - Marmann
    • When did socialism and universal healthcare - solve anything? O's plans are the worst.nm
      • I wouldn't know. - Marmann
        • Anyone who thinks that socialized medicine is a good idea - Kendra
          • Obama is not going for socialized medicine - - Amanda
            • I mentioned nothing of Obama--I said that anyone - Kendra
              • I understood Obama's plans - Kendra
          • I agree - IMT
            • People take for granted being able to have any choice whatsoever in what doctor they see - Kendra
              • you would think - IMT
                • O says that he will force insurance - Kendra
                  • sounds like a good idea to me! - Amanda
                    • I think that they will go out of business - Kendra
                      • By the same token... - Amanda
                        • and we can do this all day - Kendra
              • my son was delivered and almost killed - Kendra
      • Yes, this is a sham that Americans are - falling for. Hide what's left of your money.nm
        • Bush/McCain/Obama - gourdpainter
          • The present crisis was not caused by Bush or McCain... - sam
            • Ya think? - gourdpainter
          • McCain - Marmann
            • Here is the WHOLE story on "taxing" - sam
            • Aw, the voice of wisdom. - gourdpainter

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they knew about this for weeks -- trying to railroad dems before election.

That's why it didn't pass last week. It was too one-sided.

I have asked that this post be removed because it apparently was really upsetting to some people.  While I normally don't post like I did below, I did it for what I had hoped would be a shock value, but it backfired on me.  I had hoped that my shock value would be that it would get some people to understand my position, but that didn't happen.  Therefore, I decided to ask the moderators to remove it. 

I believe everyone knows my position on gay marriage and abortion as I have stated them numerous times on this forum, so I will try to refrain from responding to any posts involving those issues, at least whether as to whether they are right or wrong.  Moral issues will always be that....moral issues...and are viewed through the individual's moral lens or compass.  I cannot change any one's to match mine, nor can anyone change mine to match their's.  Let's just leave it at that. 

');

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I think you like to present yourself

as being right and more knowledgeable than anyone on this board about almost everything that you address; much more important than *keeping things real.**   You want all of us to make note that you are right, more informed, more well read, more educated on just about everything that is discussed here...OKAY, you got it!!!, Enjoy it.

I still believe my friend, not because the cost of gas in CA is really that important, but because she is my friend and I have no reason not to believe her and even more, she has no reason to make it up, we were not discussing anything remotely related to energy or conservation; it was just a passing comment on her part as we drove past the local Chevron. But it seems to be quite important to you so, as I said, I will defer to you and all of your many resources in the future. No prob.

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I believe I used the word *present*. nm
,

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birthday present
I just wanted to make sure I was giving the correct information. This was for her birthday last year. He bought her earrings that cost $5,000 and she exchanged them for earrings that cost $12,000. She checked with her husband and he came back in and bought the earring for $12, 000.

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To be fair to the present administration..

There hasn't been a SINGLE PRESIDENT willing to address the borders.  I wish Bush would get off his duff about the border too, but if he did put a military clamp down on our border, you'd have a huge uproar from the civil liberties camp.  You can never make everybody happy. 

As for spending... Most Democrats never met a dollar they didn't want to spend.  Wanna have your hair stand on end?  Read a synopsis of The Big Dig in Boston, a la Kennedy and Kerry.  Talk about a money pit at the taxpayers expense.  If only it were a perfect world, but it never will be.

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Does anyone else see a clear and present danger?
L

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You mean the other women who dare to present
Americans are not a monolith.

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He does not present the certificate that states the
nm

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When you can't defend the present why do you always bring up the past?

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Well pardon me, but how can you discuss the present without a history of sm
what shaped it?  It isn't possible.

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I am posting here to present a differing view...
just like the liberals who post on the conservative board. This IS America, my friend. We do have the right to do so. Why is a different opinion so aggravating to you? I have read, and heard from liberals own lips, what liberals stand for. There are a few of you who post on this board who are the antithesis of that, sooooo....why are YOU posting here and what does it matter who else does?

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Obama refuses to present an official
!1

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Even most liberals present thought it was poor taste.
x

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Whoa, that is actually like a Christmas Present from the IRS, what an unheard of concept!!!....sm
True, you can do it yourself, the IRS just makes so daunting and intimidating with all those forms, and then you worry if you make another mistake, you will get another penalty.....Just those three letters together give most folk the heebie geebies.

Also, taling about not needing a service, most people do not know that you DO NOT need those miriad of services who will "talk down your credit bills" and renegotiate. Especially in these times, banks are very eager to get payment and work with you, most banks have a "hardship" department where you can talk to reps who can negotiate lower settlements, eliminate fees, figure out a very good payment plan without fees, etc. You can do it yourself without paying a debt relief service.

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Is Newt your president? Lets stick with the present
There is about to be an explosion of spending and for those that really do work and think they won't be paying taxes, think again! You could only use half your brain or whatever is lucid and understand the ONLY way to pay for that kind of spending is by EVERYONE who works to pay taxes.

You really need to get off your one-party tunnel vision way of thinking, and I would say think like an individual, but I can see you are a follower of Obama, and as we all know, most of them have never thought for themselves.

I'm an independent......sure as heck didn't want a totalitarian government in power and if I had to choose between Newt and that backside kisser we have in office now, I'd choose Newt....


Too bad we're stuck with Obama and his crooked cronies!!

I feel it safe to say you have never had an independent thought in your life.....

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I were you I would not call the present US president 'naive and stupid.' nm
nm

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There IS no constitutional crisis.
Recession teetering on the brink of depression. WAKE UP, will ya?

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Maybe it isn't a crisis, just extortion and
I bet it won't be long before some of the anti-union people (poster below) will be begging for union representation.  Since Reagan kept his promise to break the unions it's been a downhill course and I imagine we've just about reached the bottom of the hill.

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Don't ya'll pay attention? The Popes (past and present) had already decided this.
...Madsen, a Washington-based writer and columnist, who often writes for Counterpunch, says that people close to the pope claim that amid these concerns, the pontiff wishes he was younger and in better health to confront the possibility that Bush may represent the person prophesized in Revelations. John Paul II has always believed the world was on the precipice of the final confrontation between Good and Evil as foretold in the New Testament.

Before he became pope, Karol Cardinal Wojtyla said, "We are now standing in the face of the greatest historical confrontation humanity has gone through. I do not think that wide circles of the American society or wide circles of the Christian community realize this fully. We are now facing the final confrontation between the church and the anti-Church, of the Gospel versus the anti-Gospel."

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"Drive the American Economy into the dirt and then present socialism as the only way out!"
nm

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Actually, you are wrong about his role in this crisis....
concerning Fannie and freddie, he tried to get legislation passed to deal directly with them...and the Democrats blocked it. Fact is, John McCain was on the RIGHT side of this issue, and perhaps if the Democrats had listened to him in 2005 we would not be facing this crisis today. In the interest of full disclosure and truth, this is what he said regarding that legislation:

Mr. President, this week Fannie Mae’s regulator reported that the company’s quarterly reports of profit growth over the past few years were “illusions deliberately and systematically created” by the company’s senior management, which resulted in a $10.6 billion accounting scandal.
The Office of Federal Housing Enterprise Oversight’s report goes on to say that Fannie Mae employees deliberately and intentionally manipulated financial reports to hit earnings targets in order to trigger bonuses for senior executives. In the case of Franklin Raines, Fannie Mae’s former chief executive officer, OFHEO’s report shows that over half of Mr. Raines’ compensation for the 6 years through 2003 was directly tied to meeting earnings targets. The report of financial misconduct at Fannie Mae echoes the deeply troubling $5 billion profit restatement at Freddie Mac.
The OFHEO report also states that Fannie Mae used its political power to lobby Congress in an effort to interfere with the regulator’s examination of the company’s accounting problems. This report comes some weeks after Freddie Mac paid a record $3.8 million fine in a settlement with the Federal Election Commission and restated lobbying disclosure reports from 2004 to 2005. These are entities that have demonstrated over and over again that they are deeply in need of reform.
For years I have been concerned about the regulatory structure that governs Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac–known as Government-sponsored entities or GSEs–and the sheer magnitude of these companies and the role they play in the housing market. OFHEO’s report this week does nothing to ease these concerns. In fact, the report does quite the contrary. OFHEO’s report solidifies my view that the GSEs need to be reformed without delay.
I join as a cosponsor of the Federal Housing Enterprise Regulatory Reform Act of 2005, S. 190, to underscore my support for quick passage of GSE regulatory reform legislation. If Congress does not act, American taxpayers will continue to be exposed to the enormous risk that Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac pose to the housing market, the overall financial system, and the economy as a whole.
I urge my colleagues to support swift action on this GSE reform legislation.

He saw it coming, tried to tell the Dems, and they blocked it. Chris Dodd, head of banking and finance comittee, Democrat, largest recipient of donations from them. Guess who was #2?

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The truth about the housing crisis...
I will warn you this is long, but if your interested in the truth this is a good place to start.

Would the Last Honest Reporter Please Turn On the Lights? By Orson Scott Card Editor's note: Orson Scott Card is a Democrat and a newspaper columnist, and in this opinion piece he takes on both while lamenting the current state of journalism. An open letter to the local daily paper - almost every local daily paper in America : I remember reading All the President's Men and thinking: That's journalism. You do what it takes to get the truth and you lay it before the public, because the public has a right to know. This housing crisis didn't come out of nowhere. It was not a vague emanation of the evil Bush administration. It was a direct result of the political decision, back in the late 1990s, to loosen the rules of lending so that home loans would be more accessible to poor people. Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac were authorized to approve risky loans. What is a risky loan? It's a loan that the recipient is likely not to be able to repay. The goal of this rule change was to help the poor - which especially would help members of minority groups. But how does it help these people to give them a loan that they can't repay? They get into a house, yes, but when they can't make the payments, they lose the house - along with their credit rating. They end up worse off than before. This was completely foreseeable and in fact many people did foresee it. One political party, in Congress and in the executive branch, tried repeatedly to tighten up the rules. The other party blocked every such attempt and tried to loosen them. Furthermore, Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae were making political contributions to the very members of Congress who were allowing them to make irresponsible loans. (Though why quasi-federal agencies were allowed to do so baffles me. It's as if the Pentagon were allowed to contribute to the political campaigns of Congressmen who support increasing their budget.) Isn't there a story here? Doesn't journalism require that you who produce our daily paper tell the truth about who brought us to a position where the only way to keep confidence in our economy was a $700 billion bailout? Aren't you supposed to follow the money and see which politicians were benefiting personally from the deregulation of mortgage lending? I have no doubt that if these facts had pointed to the Republican Party or to John McCain as the guilty parties, you would be treating it as a vast scandal. "Housing-gate," no doubt. Or "Fannie-gate." Instead, it was Senator Christopher Dodd and Congressman Barney Frank, both Democrats, who denied that there were any problems, who refused Bush administration requests to set up a regulatory agency to watch over Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, and who were still pushing for these agencies to go even further in promoting sub-prime mortgage loans almost up to the minute they failed. As Thomas Sowell points out in a TownHall.com essay entitled "Do Facts Matter?" ( ]" target=_blank>http://snipurl.com/457townhall_com<http://snipurl.com/457to>] ): "Alan Greenspan warned them four years ago. So did the Chairman of the Council of Economic Advisers to the President. So did Bush's Secretary of the Treasury." These are facts. This financial crisis was completely preventable. The party that blocked any attempt to prevent it was ... the Democratic Party. The party that tried to prevent it was ... the Republican Party. Yet when Nancy Pelosi accused the Bush administration and Republican deregulation of causing the crisis, you in the press did not hold her to account for her lie. Instead, you criticized Republicans who took offense at this lie and refused to vote for the bailout! What? It's not the liar, but the victims of the lie who are to blame? Now let's follow the money ... right to the presidential candidate who is the number-two recipient of campaign contributions from Fannie Mae. And after Freddie Raines, the CEO of Fannie Mae who made $90 million while running it into the ground, was fired for his incompetence, one presidential candidate's campaign actually consulted him for advice on housing. If that presidential candidate had been John McCain, you would have called it a major scandal and we would be getting stories in your paper every day about how incompetent and corrupt he was. But instead, that candidate was Barack Obama, and so you have buried this story, and when the McCain campaign dared to call Raines an "adviser" to the Obama campaign - because that campaign had sought his advice - you actually let Obama's people get away with accusing McCain of lying, merely because Raines wasn't listed as an official adviser to the Obama campaign. You would never tolerate such weasely nit-picking from a Republican. If you who produce our local daily paper actually had any principles, you would be pounding this story, because the prosperity of all Americans was put at risk by the foolish, short-sighted, politically selfish, and possibly corrupt actions of leading Democrats, including Obama. If you who produce our local daily paper had any personal honor, you would find it unbearable to let the American people believe that somehow Republicans were to blame for this crisis. There are precedents. Even though President Bush and his administration never said that Iraq sponsored or was linked to 9/11, you could not stand the fact that Americans had that misapprehension - so you pounded us with the fact that there was no such link. (Along the way, you created the false impression that Bush had lied to them and said that there was a connection.) If you had any principles, then surely right now, when the American people are set to blame President Bush and John McCain for a crisis they tried to prevent, and are actually shifting to approve of Barack Obama because of a crisis he helped cause, you would be laboring at least as hard to correct that false impression. Your job, as journalists, is to tell the truth. That's what you claim you do, when you accept people's money to buy or subscribe to your paper. But right now, you are consenting to or actively promoting a big fat lie - that the housing crisis should somehow be blamed on Bush, McCain, and the Republicans. You have trained the American people to blame everything bad - even bad weather - on Bush, and they are responding as you have taught them to. If you had any personal honor, each reporter and Editor would be insisting on telling the truth - even if it hurts the election chances of your favorite candidate. Because that's what honorable people do. Honest people tell the truth even when they don't like the probable consequences. That's what honesty means . That's how trust is earned. Barack Obama is just another politician, and not a very wise one. He has revealed his ignorance and naivete time after time - and you have swept it under the rug, treated it as nothing. Meanwhile, you have participated in the borking of Sarah Palin, reporting savage attacks on her for the pregnancy of her unmarried daughter - while you ignored the story of John Edwards's own adultery for many months. So I ask you now: Do you have any standards at all? Do you even know what honesty means? Is getting people to vote for Barack Obama so important that you will throw away everything that journalism is supposed to stand for? You might want to remember the way the National Organization of Women threw away their integrity by supporting Bill Clinton despite his well-known pattern of sexual exploitation of powerless women. Who listens to NOW anymore? We know they stand for nothing; they have no principles. That's where you are right now. It's not too late. You know that if the situation were reversed, and the truth would damage McCain and help Obama, you would be moving heaven and earth to get the true story out there. If you want to redeem your honor, you will swallow hard and make a list of all the stories you would print if it were McCain who had been getting money from Fannie Mae, McCain whose campaign had consulted with its discredited former CEO, McCain who had voted against tightening its lending practices. Then you will print them, even though every one of those true stories will point the finger of blame at the reckless Democratic Party, which put our nation's prosperity at risk so they could feel good about helping the poor, and lay a fair share of the blame at Obama's door. You will also tell the truth about John McCain: that he tried, as a Senator, to do what it took to prevent this crisis. You will tell the truth about President Bush: that his administration tried more than once to get Congress to regulate lending in a responsible way. This was a Congress-caused crisis, beginning during the Clinton administration, with Democrats leading the way into the crisis and blocking every effort to get out of it in a timely fashion. If you at our local daily newspaper continue to let Americans believe - and vote as if - President Bush and the Republicans caused the crisis, then you are joining in that lie. If you do not tell the truth about the Democrats - including Barack Obama - and do so with the same energy you would use if the miscreants were Republicans - then you are not journalists by any standard. You're just the public relations machine of the Democratic Party, and it's time you were all fired and real journalists brought in, so that we can actually have a news paper in our city. This article first appeared in The Rhinoceros Times of Greensboro , North Carolina , and is used here by permission.

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