Iraqi Colleagues Killed U.S. Soldiers, Military Says
Posted By: PK on 2006-06-21
In Reply to:
And 19 Republican senators and a conservative poster crashing this this board think that monsters like this should receive amnesty for killing our soldiers. Unbelievable.
Iraqi colleagues killed U.S. soldiers, military says
SAN FRANCISCO, California (AP) -- Two California soldiers shot to death in Iraq were murdered by Iraqi civil-defense officers patrolling with them, military investigators have found.
The deaths of Army Spc. Patrick R. McCaffrey Sr. and 1st Lt. Andre D. Tyson were originally attributed to an ambush during a patrol near Balad, Iraq, on June 22, 2004.
But the Army's Criminal Investigation Command found that one or more of the Iraqis attached to the American soldiers on patrol fired at them, a military official said Tuesday. (Watch a mother's quest for truth -- 1:26)
A Pentagon spokesman knew of no other similar incident, calling it extremely rare.
The Army has conducted an extensive investigation into the deaths but declined to provide details out of respect for relatives of the soldiers, spokesman Paul Boyce said Tuesday evening.
It was unclear whether the investigators had established a motive or arrested any suspects.
The families of McCaffrey and Tyson were to be briefed on the report's conclusions Tuesday and Wednesday by Brig. Gen. Oscar Hilman, the soldiers' commander at the time, and three other officers.
When they come I have my list of questions ready, and I want these answers and I don't want lies, McCaffrey's mother, Nadia McCaffrey, said.
Soldiers who witnessed the attack have told her that two Iraqi patrolmen opened fire on her son's unit. The witnesses also said a third gunman simultaneously drove up to the American unit in a van, climbed onto the vehicle and fired at the Americans, she said.
Nothing is clear. Nothing is clear, she said. Her son was shot eight times by bullets of various calibers, some of which penetrated his body armor, she said. She believes he bled to death.
Nadia McCaffrey has become a vocal critic of the war in Iraq, and said her son had reservations about it, too, though he served well and was promoted posthumously to sergeant.
I really want this story to come out; I want people to know what happened to my son, she said. There is no doubt to me that this (ambushes by attached Iraqi units) is still happening to soldiers today, but our chain of command is awfully reckless; they don't seem to give a damn about what's happening to soldiers.
Iraqi forces who had trained with the Americans had fired at them twice before the incident that killed Patrick McCaffrey, and he had reported it to his superiors, she said.
Boyce said the U.S. military remained confident in its operations with Iraqis.
We continue to have confidence in our operations with Iraqi soldiers and have witnessed the evolution of a stronger fighting army for the Iraqi people, he said.
Patrick McCaffrey joined the National Guard the day after the terrorist attacks of September 11, 2001, his mother said.
Tyson's family could not be located, and a message left with his former unit was not immediately returned.
McCaffrey, 34, and Tyson, 33, were members of the California National Guard. Both were assigned to the Army National Guard's 579th Engineer Battalion, based in Petaluma.
Sen. Barbara Boxer, D-California, pressed the Pentagon for answers about the case when Nadia McCaffrey was unsatisfied by explanations from the military.
Mrs. McCaffrey is set to receive a briefing from Pentagon officials (Wednesday) afternoon in California, during which we hope they will provide her with a full report of the facts surrounding Sgt. McCaffrey's death, said Natalie Ravitz, a Boxer spokeswoman.
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Iraqi Soldiers Speak Out in Favor of Murtha
On January 5, 2006, Congressman Murtha held a town hall meeting with Cong. Jim Moran (D-VA 08).
The soldier who asked the first question served in Afghanistan and said that morale among troops is high and that he would gladly serve in Iraq today. His comment was the only one replayed by Fox News the next day.
But the majority of soldiers in attendance spoke out against the current policy. Fox News did not broadcast their remarks.
Here are some excerpts.
John Brumes, Infantry Sgt. US Army:
Everything that the Bush Adminstration told us about that mission in Iraq is absolutely incorrect. Furthermore, I'd like to say ... I came home to no job, no health insurance. Until we take care of this war, we can't take care of the problems that matter like health care.
I've witnessed both ends... Congressman Murtha, I implore you to keep doing what you're doing.
John Powers, Capt. 1st Armored Division, served 12 months in Iraq:
The thing that hits me the most is the accountability. ... Where is the accountability for those men [who took us to war], as well as where is the accountability for Paul Bremmer, who misplaced millions of dollars and claims to keep accountability in the war zone?... I know that if we lost $500 we would be court marshaled. So where is the accountability for this leadership?
Garin Reppenhagen, served as a sniper in Iraq for a year in the First Infantry Division:
My question is also about accountability. The soldiers that you see, Congressman Murtha, at the hospitals... those are my friends. After coming back, being a veteran, my question is why? Why did we go to this war, why the hell did it happen, why are we in this condition. A lot of soldiers are debating whether this war was fraudulent to begin with. And there doesn't seem to be a clear answer. A lot of Americans now are debating the fact over whether or not the war was fraudulent in the first place. How come there hasn't been an investigation on the fraudulent lead up to the war by this Administration?
C-SPAN has the full broadcast here.
Iraqi PM says Reckles soldiers should stay home.
So much for all that *winning their hearts and minds* talk. 
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20060706/wl_nm/iraq_maliki_dc_2
Reckless soldiers should stay home: Iraqi PM
By Ibon Villelabeitia
Thu Jul 6, 1:41 PM ET
Iraq's prime minister urged the U.S. military on Thursday to keep reckless troops from serving in Iraq in order to prevent abuses like the alleged rape and murder of a teenager and her family by U.S. soldiers in March.
Expanding on calls for an independent inquiry and a review of foreign troops' immunity from Iraqi law, Nuri al-Maliki said commanders should do a better job in preparing their soldiers.
There needs to be a plan to educate and train soldiers, and those who are brought to serve in Iraq shouldn't bear prejudices nor be reckless toward people's honor, Maliki said.
The U.S. military is investigating a group of its soldiers over the rape and killing of a family of four in Mahmudiya, south of the capital, in a case that has strained relations between Washington and Baghdad.
Former private Steven Green, 21, has been charged with rape and murder in a U.S. federal court. He had been discharged from the army because of a personality disorder before the case came to light.
At least three other soldiers are being investigated in the case.
The Mahmudiya incident and other incidents before that ... produce sadness, pain and condemnation from Iraqis, Maliki said.
IMMUNITY
Maliki, facing pressure from Shi'ites and Sunnis to hold Americans accountable, has slammed a U.S. occupation authority decree that grants immunity from Iraqi law for the 140,000 or so foreign troops in Iraq, saying it emboldens soldiers.
I think this matter has become necessary to review and solve, either by reviewing the issue of immunity or reviewing the nature of the investigating committees, he told reporters in Baghdad, a day after he first called for a review of the law.
The rape and murder case is the fifth in a high-profile series of U.S. inquiries into killings of Iraqi civilians in recent months and has outraged Iraqis.
American commanders, keen to repair the military's tarnished image after three years of complaints from Iraqis that U.S. abuses go unpunished, pressed murder charges against 12 military personnel last month. Marines are under investigation for the killing of 24 unarmed Iraqi civilians in the town of Haditha.
Iraqis have complained of Americans' lack of cultural sensitivity -- including searching women's rooms during raids or not taking their boots off when entering. Commanders say they are improving such procedures.
Though heavily dependent on America's military muscle, Maliki faces delicate negotiations with its main ally Washington over how to regulate the presence of the U.S.-led forces in Iraq, now under a U.N. mandate that expires in December.
Copyright © 2006 Reuters Limited. All rights reserved. Republication or redistribution of Reuters content is expressly prohibited without the prior written consent of Reuters. Reuters shall not be liable for any errors or delays in the content, or for any actions taken in reliance thereon.
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Getting ready for all the excuses that cronyism attaches to their colleagues. It's coming soon,
I'm sure. It won't be long before all those Bushites come up with some lame explanations that they think they can use to fool people. Just a bunch of con artists!
Oh, I feel you. I don't know which is better for the Iraqi's, b/c what is usually reported is sm
the military casualties, not the civilian casualties in Iraq.
Fox News did report this week about a military man whose family was murdered, wife and children while he was out working. That's awful, that's terror. When I hear stories like that I do think of the terror the people are experiencing due to this war, but they did have it bad under Sadaam. They're in a catch 22.
Iraqi death toll....sm
See link for full article below.
*According to the graph, Iraqi civilians and security forces were killed and wounded by insurgents at a rate of about 26 a day early in 2004, and at a rate of about 40 a day later that year. The rate increased in 2005 to about 51 a day, and by the end of August had jumped to about 63 a day.
Extrapolating the daily averages over the months from Jan. 1, 2004, to Sept. 16 of this year results in a total of 25,902 Iraqi civilians and security forces killed and wounded by insurgents.*
Detained Iraqi children
Okay, this is about as disturbing as it gets. I came across this thread on the Democratic Underground website:
Source: AFP
Agence France-Presse
BAGHDAD -- US troops are holding nearly 950 children and teenagers in a military prison at a Baghdad base, some as young as 10, a top commander said Monday.
Brigadier General Michael Nevin of US military police said many of these youngsters, mainly 15, 16 or 17 years of age are illiterate and have been detained for planting bombs and even for "picking up a gun and firefighting."
...
"These juveniles have been involved in something that is perceived as a security threat to Iraq or coalition forces," Nevin told Agence France-Presse during a tour of Camp Cropper.
...
"In January we had around 100 juveniles. Now we have around 950," Nevin said.
...
One of the commanders at Camp Cropper, Lieutenant Colonel Malcolm McMullen, said the juveniles were now part of a wide-ranging educational program launched by the military.
"Many of them come from broken homes with no education," he said.
So, curious as to what type of educational program launched by the military, as I thought it funny this little tibit of information was left out, I came across this:
http://www.kavkazcenter.com/eng/content/2007/11/10/9066.shtml
I think we need to dig further.
Obama and Iraqi oil for food...
http://www.americanthinker.com/2008/03/obamas_iraqi_oil_for_food_conn.html
The Iraqi war has further destabilized the middle east. It has....sm
But obviously you don't think so so tell us how it has helepd to stabilize the region?
A blog by an Iraqi about his homeland and Democracy. sm
I read this every day until he stopped posting. It's very informative and not something seen in the MSM. There are other links there that are still active.
This is my first time hearing protestors against the Iraqi war...sm
getting soldiers killed??
This is not Vietnam. We are not trying to stop communism from spreading (not that I would have agreed with that then). This is supposedly to stop WMD, then to spread democracy to the Iraqi people, and now because there was a connection to al Queda.
The loss of live was tremendous in Vietnam compared to the Iraqi war. If we had lost the number of troops we did in Vietnam, I would be in Washington sitting on the lawn myself.
Not sure this answered your question, you have to explain your question further??
Iraqi terrorist training camps?
Links between Saddam's regime and al-Qaeda, as claimed by the Bush Administration (which formed a crucial part of the WMD justification for the Iraq invasion), were non-existent or exaggerated, according to the report of both the United States Government's 9/11 Commission and the Pentagon. There was never any real proof of training camps in Iraq. As far as terrorists having been in Iraq at one time or another....it's a middle eastern country.....they were way down toward the bottom of the list of terrorist hang-outs.
Raped Iraqi woman feared US troops...sm
I don't usually post reports of the bad side of US soldiers in Iraq because I believe the most of them are doing their jobs with integrity, so even after reading this it is still hard to believe. Thanks to the brave soldiers who spoke out against their comrades. This story reminds me of some of the bad stories I've heard of Vietnam.
Please somebody say it aint so...
------------------------------------------
Raped Iraqi woman feared US troops: report
Mon Jul 3, 2006 07:06 AM ET
BAGHDAD (Reuters) - A woman apparently at the center of a rape-murder probe by the U.S. military in Iraq was only 15 and voiced fears about soldiers' advances before she and her family were killed in March, the Washington Post said on Monday.
Quoting the mayor of Mahmudiya, near Baghdad, an unnamed hospital official and neighbors of the alleged victims, the newspaper named the woman, her parents and 7-year-old sister as having been killed in their home in the town on March 11.
The paper did not affirm the woman, Abeer Qasim Hamza, was killed by Americans, but local people quoted appeared to believe the dead family was the one involved in the U.S. investigation.
A U.S. military official in Baghdad told Reuters details of the incident they described were at odds with U.S. documents in the 10-day-old investigation of at least three soldiers. U.S. officials had the rape victim's age as 20, he said. However, he added, he was not aware of any other such cases in the area.
The U.S. military has given few details publicly. Officials say at least three soldiers are under investigation over the alleged rape of a woman and the killing of three relatives, including a child, in their home at Mahmudiya on March 12.
Two are suspected of rape and one of these, since discharged from the army, is also suspected of murder, officials said.
The Washington Post quoted Omar Janabi, who said he was a neighbor, saying Abeer Qasim's mother had told him on March 10 that the young woman had complained repeatedly about advances made toward her by U.S. soldiers at a nearby checkpoint.
Janabi told the newspaper he was one of the first people to arrive at the family house after the attack. He said he found Abeer sprawled dead in a corner, her hair and a pillow next to her consumed by fire, and her dress pushed up to her neck.
DEATH CERTIFICATES
The paper said death certificates from Mahmudiya hospital identified the victims as Abeer Qasim Hamza, 15, shot in the head and burned; her mother Fakhriyah Taha Muhsin, 34, killed by gunshots to her head; her father Qasim Hamza Raheem, 45, whose head was smashed by bullets; and Hadeel Qasim Hamza, 7.
The inquiry was launched after two soldiers from the 502nd Infantry Regiment came forward last month to make allegations about comrades. The killings had previously been recorded by the military as the work of guerrillas, U.S. officers say.
Local residents and officials in the area, one of the most dangerous and violent in Iraq, have offered Reuters reporters conflicting accounts of incidents involving U.S. troops.
Two years after the scandal over U.S. prisoner abuse at Abu Ghraib jail and coming after a string of murder charges against U.S. troops and accusations over the killing of 24 people in the western city of Haditha, the rape allegation is potentially incendiary in Iraq's conservative Muslim society.
Iraq's main organization of Sunni Muslim clerics, long hostile to the U.S. occupation, said on Sunday the Mahmudiya case revealed the real, ugly face of America.
In recent months, officials say, commanders have cracked down on rogue soldiers in a bid to gain the trust of ordinary Iraqis and of their new government after three years of growing resentment that U.S. officers say risks fuelling the insurgency.
Where was the concern of anyone when Saddam was killing the Iraqi people?
I must say, this is one of the most egregious of all arguments that is made in this country, or any country. Saddam tortured, killed, maimed and raped his own people for decades and not a word was said. Now with a chance for a free Iraq, this concern surfaces. Where was it all these years?
Afghanistan - war on Al Quaeda and Taliban; Iraqi FREEDOM - kill Saddam Hussein
Two different wars based on entirely different premises.........
None. But I have not killed any either. sm.
with an organization who facilitates adoptions and alternative choices to abortion. Many girls have decided to not abort and keep their child when they have a support system and don't feel so alone. It is important work. I do put my money where my mouth is. Sometimes the easy fix is not the best fix. Why not go to the net and Google children of rape or children of incest or read some of the positive stories for people who chose life for the child. In the grand scheme of things, what is nine months of pregnancy for an entire lifetime of another person? To the tune of almost 2 million a year? If we can help ONE girl choose not to kill her baby I consider that a victory.
They killed themselves!
Good grief! Is there anything else that hurts your feelings? Just let us know so we can walk on eggshells for you. 
What if the protesting is getting them killed. sm
Like it did in Vietnam?
Who Killed The Electric Car?
Wow, I just watched that documentary and it was very eye opening! The movie just talks about automotive manufacturers and oil companies crushing electric car manufactuing in the 1990s. Cars can run off of electricity alone, but of course the oil companies would lose trillions of dollars if electric cars became the norm for most Americans. I highly recommend watching the movie.
I also recommend replacing at least one regular light bulb in your home with an energy-saving model. If every household in the US did this, we could reduce global warming pollution by more than 90 billion pounds over the life of the bulbs; the SAME AS TAKING 6.3 MILLION CARS OFF THE ROAD. Wow! Just a small thing we can all do to make a big difference.
I have believed for years that big companies are running this country. They seem to have most politicians in the palm of their hand. It's sickening, really. Greed is such an ugly destructive thing, and these big corporations will never feel that they have enough money. They want more, more, more and will crush anything to get it. Many politicians are their puppets, and big corporations have entirely TOO MUCH power over this country and do not have the average American family's best interests at heart. We all need to stand up and demand more freedom from foreign oil.
my son was delivered and almost killed
by Amy the Bryman student nurse midwife.
who killed the electric car?
I love this documentary. I think GM has bad karma.
Coulter says Murtha should be killed.
It's apparently acceptable to advocate assassination as long as you're a darling of the Republican party.
http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1002689569
Latest Ann Coulter Outrage: On Fragging John Murtha
By E&P Staff
Published: June 15, 2006 11:55 PM ET
NEW YORK With the brief debate over Iraq in Congress producing such acrimony this week that one congressman suggested opponents of the war support al-Qaeda, it should come as no surprise that columnist and author Ann Coulter would top them all.
In an email interview with John Hawkins at the Right Wing News web site, Coulter was asked, among other things, to offer short comments on several individuals. After harmlessly dismissing former Ambassador Joseph Wilson as the World's most intensely private exhibitionist, she said of Rep. John Murtha, the hawkish ex-Marine and now antiwar congressman: The reason soldiers invented 'fragging.'
Fragging, which became a well-known expression --and occurence -- during the Vietnam war, means soldiers attempting to kill their own officers for one reason or another.
This was so over the top that conservative Mike Krempasky at RedState.org posted, I've said before that's its kind of ironic that just about every phrase Stewie from Family Guy uses to describe Lois could easily be applied to Ann Coulter. Well - once again, Ann proves us right. He went on to call her fragging remark absolutely disgusting....there's no excuse - NONE - for the allusion to soldiers who kill other soldiers. It's despicable - and frankly, so is Coulter.
Coulter's column is syndicated by Universal Press Syndicate. On its home page, Universal hails her witty, no-holds-barred commentaries on the Washington scene. She tackles the hot issues with fervor and stands up for the things that she believes in.
E&P Staff (letters@editorandpublisher.com)
Never said Bush killed anyone. Complicit, yes.nm
z
Would you like me to quote how many children killed TI
by Hamas Muslim suicide bombers? Children have been dying all along. You have so little scope of this picture, it is insulting.
Democrats killed our economy when they took
nm
How many Hamas do you supposed they killed
when they bombed the women's dormitory at the University? Explain to me what threat the five Ba'lousheh sisters, ages 17, 14, 8, 4 and 2 and residents of Jabalya refugee camp, posed to Israel? All five were buried today. It is not enough for Israel cripple and starve the refugees with its ongoing strangling blockade of food, supplies and medicine and turn Gaza and he West Bank into one huge armed prison camp. These blood thirsty barbarians will not rest until they have satisfied their appetites with their latest fix of Arab slaughter. After all, it's already been 2 long years since Lebanon....way too long for the more ravenous among them to endure.
No, it was over 1,000. killed. Check YOUR facts.
I am not sure how reliable this source is, but here goes:
http://links.org.au/node/823
Occupied Ramallah, Palestine -- December 27, 2008 -- Today, the Israeli occupation army committed a new massacre in Gaza, causing the death and injury of hundreds of Palestinian civilians [latest reports place the death toll at more than 200].
They did not state the number of wounded, but that is a far cry from the "over 1,000 killed" that you quoted. And if you do any Google searching at all, the number varies by whatever web site you go to.
And why does Israel have to kow-tow to the world? Why does Israel get blamed for all the troubles in the middle east? Ask yourself what provoked Israel to do that? I just can't see Israel waking up and saying, "Oh boy, what a beautiful day, let's go kill ourselves some Palestinians." Everybody knows that Palestine is a Hamas stronghold and that any terrorist groups in the middle east get their money and weapons from Hamas by way of iran and other countries that hate the USA. And that is most of them.
The guy who killed the doctor isn't an extremist.
//
Cigarettes killed my dad but he still would HATE this
nm
What facts do you have that Bush killed this woman
I think the onus is on you here to prove that Bush killed somebody, not for me to prove he didn't.
Eventually, Saddam would have killed enough of his own people sm
maybe we wouldn't have to worry about it, right? I mean, really, he was only killig his own people, so what is the problem. He was persecuting his OWN people. What a guy.
You man after Israel killed 6 Palestinians on November 5 and
failed to lift the blockade, a condition of the truce they ignored the entire time? Your ignorant statement about the Kool-Aid is completely illogical since Obama voiced a fairly unequivocal sympathy for Israel back in June during his visit there. My thoughts are completely my own and are based in reality, one shared by pretty much the rest of the world outside the homeland, and on my own experiences, not 60 years of US and Israel lies and propaganda.
Do you know how many young people BUSH KILLED FOR OIL? sm
Even Palin admitted in her interview with the moron Glenn Beck that the war was at least partially about energy resources. Wise up!
Tiller the Baby Killer -- Killed
Gunned down at church this morning.
Another way to use soldiers
Out of respect for your request, Democrat, I will call myself Starcat.
It seems to me the last sentence sums it up very well, but Bush doesn't have the guts for that, does he? Just canned questions and canned answers.
Bush Teleconference With Soldiers Staged
By DEB RIECHMANN, Associated Press WriterThu Oct 13, 4:35 PM ET
It was billed as a conversation with U.S. troops, but the questions President Bush asked on a teleconference call Thursday were choreographed to match his goals for the war in Iraq and Saturday's vote on a new Iraqi constitution.
This is an important time, Allison Barber, deputy assistant defense secretary, said, coaching the soldiers before Bush arrived. The president is looking forward to having just a conversation with you.
Barber said the president was interested in three topics: the overall security situation in Iraq, security preparations for the weekend vote and efforts to train Iraqi troops.
As she spoke in Washington, a live shot of 10 soldiers from the Army's 42nd Infantry Division and one Iraqi soldier was beamed into the Eisenhower Executive Office Building from Tikrit — the birthplace of former Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein.
I'm going to ask somebody to grab those two water bottles against the wall and move them out of the camera shot for me, Barber said.
A brief rehearsal ensued.
OK, so let's just walk through this, Barber said. Captain Kennedy, you answer the first question and you hand the mike to whom?
Captain Smith, Kennedy said.
Captain. Smith? You take the mike and you hand it to whom? she asked.
Captain Kennedy, the soldier replied.
And so it went.
If the question comes up about partnering — how often do we train with the Iraqi military — who does he go to? Barber asked.
That's going to go to Captain Pratt, one of the soldiers said.
And then if we're going to talk a little bit about the folks in Tikrit — the hometown — and how they're handling the political process, who are we going to give that to? she asked.
Before he took questions, Bush thanked the soldiers for serving and reassured them that the U.S. would not pull out of Iraq until the mission was complete.
So long as I'm the president, we're never going to back down, we're never going to give in, we'll never accept anything less than total victory, Bush said.
The president told them twice that the American people were behind them.
You've got tremendous support here at home, Bush said.
Less than 40 percent in an AP-Ipsos poll taken in October said they approved of the way Bush was handling Iraq. Just over half of the public now say the Iraq war was a mistake.
White House press secretary Scott McClellan said Thursday's event was coordinated with the Defense Department but that the troops were expressing their own thoughts. With satellite feeds, coordination often is needed to overcome technological challenges, such as delays, he said.
I think all they were doing was talking to the troops and letting them know what to expect, he said, adding that the president wanted to talk with troops on the ground who have firsthand knowledge about the situation.
The soldiers all gave Bush an upbeat view of the situation.
The president also got praise from the Iraqi soldier who was part of the chat.
Thank you very much for everything, he gushed. I like you.
On preparations for the vote, 1st Lt. Gregg Murphy of Tennessee said: Sir, we are prepared to do whatever it takes to make this thing a success. ... Back in January, when we were preparing for that election, we had to lead the way. We set up the coordination, we made the plan. We're really happy to see, during the preparation for this one, sir, they're doing everything.
On the training of Iraqi security forces, Master Sgt. Corine Lombardo from Scotia, N.Y., said to Bush: I can tell you over the past 10 months, we've seen a tremendous increase in the capabilities and the confidences of our Iraqi security force partners. ... Over the next month, we anticipate seeing at least one-third of those Iraqi forces conducting independent operations.
Lombardo told the president that she was in New York City on Nov. 11, 2001, when Bush attended an event recognizing soldiers for their recovery and rescue efforts at Ground Zero. She said the troops began the fight against terrorism in the wake of the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks and were proud to continue it in Iraq.
I thought you looked familiar, Bush said, and then joked: I probably look familiar to you, too.
Paul Rieckhoff, director of the New York-based Operation Truth, an advocacy group for U.S. veterans of Iraq and Afghanistan, denounced the event as a carefully scripted publicity stunt. Five of the 10 U.S. troops involved were officers, he said.
If he wants the real opinions of the troops, he can't do it in a nationally televised teleconference, Rieckhoff said. He needs to be talking to the boots on the ground and that's not a bunch of captains.
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Soldiers are no different than anyone else....
in that there are those who disagree with this administration and the war. However, the overwhelming majority of the military respect the commander in chief and they believe in their mission. But, if you only watch CNN and liberal media, you will not hear from those soldiers. For every article from a liberal source you find that Bush did not listen to leaders, I can find one from a conservative source to counter. We will have to agree to disagree. I do not find this administration stubborn...I find this administration trying to stick to its guns so to speak, doing what is best in the long run for this country as far as countering terrorism. I know you do not understand nor want to understand the danger; however, I do. Every time Reid or Pelosi do something stupid, the liberal media lauds them as heroes and you can go right to the Arab news outlets and see how they pick it up and run with it. Al Qaeda must be lovin life right now. And that makes me SICK.
As to the half staff, talk about stubborness...I do not know and still do not understand why you cling to that as some kind of evidence that Bush doesn't care about the soldiers or people in Iraq, because he ordered a half staff for the VA Tech victims. And why you would say just because we have always done it that way... sheesh. Hanging onto this just screams at me that it is your problem with Bush personally and nothing else. I cannot see how you can find fault with the half staff and criticize the man for showing up at Va Tech. And..frankly...he cannot control what the governor said, but that being said...I do not understand the reaction of the left to it. But then I do not understand the reaction of the left to much of anything. I do not understand how you profess compassion for the Iraqi civilians yet want to cut and run and leave them to the terrorist thugs. That makes absolutely no sense to me. A President showing compassion for those kids at VA Tech, and you don't like that...what kind of sense does that make? The President shows compassion meeting with families of fallen soldiers, and if you look at him you can tell the toll this has all taken on him personally...if you took the time to look...not that you give a darn. I would like to say I understand you, but I don't. I used to think I did, but you have changed. It kinda reminds me of the at commercial I once saw that said: *You will be assimilated. Sadly, I believe you have been.
Who are these many soldiers?
I would be interested in knowing. I did not say you or anyone was Anti American...do not put words in my mouth. You used the word patriotic, I used it back to you. I said it was not illegal...and it is not. Congress voted for it. It is not illegal. If a soldier said it was immoral it is his right, like it is your right. However, when you talk about pulling funding when we have troops in battle, yes, I think that is unpatriotic, and if a soldier said we should pull funding, yes, I would say he was unpatriotic too. I have never heard a soldier say so. I have certainly never heard "many" soldiers call the war immoral either.
For the soldiers
As a tribute to our soldiers I felt a strong need to post this. As a prior US Army soldier I was proud of my country when I served and I am proud of all our soldiers in today's Army, and proud of anyone who decides (past, present, and future), that they love our country so much and the freedoms it offers us to give their time to the military. This is no small step. Your whole life changes in the blink of an eye (or however long it takes you to sign your name) and you will never be the same again or look at things the same as you did before.
The election recently has brought this to mind. I can remember the times my mom sending me an absentee ballot to vote and when I turned it in to my First Sergeant he looked at it and said Soldiers do not have the right to vote. You are a soldier in the Army and you will serve your country. We were "An Army of One" and our individual viewpoints do not matter. (When I joined J. Carter was president and this was the next election when Carter/Regan were running). So I threw my ballot in the garbage and followed my First Sergeant's order as a soldier is trained to do.
I have been reading that 68% of our veterans support J. McCain and only 23% support B. Obama. There is a post below that has an article that is focusing on only those 23%. In any organization you are going to have disgruntled employees, but if you were trying to judge a company would you base your decision on the few disgruntled or what the company employees have to say as a whole about their company.
Here are what some of the veterans are saying about their choices (link will follow below to the actual article) - This is how many in the military feels.
Most military will not vote for Obama, with every rule there is an exception but I personally know that the majority of the military will never vote for someone like him!
Because he is too inexperienced, and unfit to be the commander in chief of the Military!
His stance on foreign policy terrifies me!
He preaches change, but never says what that change will entail, but if you look at his record you can deduce that the change he talks about is a dumbed down version socialism, which sounds nice on paper but never works!
I’d much rather have a Commander in Chief who’s been in the military and one who knows what war is like, and McCain has 2 sons who are both in the Marine Corps and have fought in Iraq…
I’m sick of people telling me that they need to pull the troops out, when I am trying as hard as I can to rehabilitate and get back out there to finish the job! pulling us out would undo everything that we’ve worked for, everything that I sweat and bled for out there, everything that some very dear friends have died for! And by pulling us out you’d be saying that what we did didn’t amount to anything, and those lives lost were in vein.
There is a responsible way of pulling the troops out and there is an irresponsible way. If we just got pulled out of there then there would be a vacuum effect that would turn Iraq into more of a terrorist breeding ground than it ever was before, more so than even Afghanistan. And that would undo everything that we worked so hard to accomplish!!! I have been for this war from the very beginning, and even after facing death, being shot, and having all the surgeries I’ve had since I’ve been home I believe in the cause now more than ever. But even if you opposed the war to begin with we can’t abandon those people now it would be selfish, reckless, and utterly irresponsible to do so and would actually make things much worse for us in the long run.
I’m not the biggest McCain supporter there are many issues I don’t agree with him on but he at least understands all of this, he understands what we are going through over there, he understands combat, and he understands what is at stake in this war that the American people have seemingly abandoned and forgotten, not only our future but the future of an entire nation of people is at risk if we give in and pull out!
Some people don’t think it’s our responsibility to fight for other countries and stabilize their governments but as I’ve said before in previous blogs “It’s a good thing France didn’t have that attitude during our revolution, otherwise we never would have won our own Independence!!!”
Obama is not a competent Commander in Chief! You tell me what exactly he stands for???????? CHANGE? what the he!! is he gonna change? HOPE? what kind of hope? are you kidding me? he never says what the he!! he’s talking about, he just throws out what people want to hear but never provides a solution!!! Most people I talk to that say they’re gonna vote for him can’t even answer those questions, but they’re gonna vote for him because someone they know and respect says they are gonna vote for him! Why don’t you at least look into it yourself and make an educated decision! I can at least respect that! But that doesn’t seem to be the case in most people I’ve come across.
http://twana.wordpress.com/2008/09/08/veterans-against-obama/
One other note is that we need a person like McCain who will be workign towards winning the war and bring our troops home as the hero's they are. Not Obama's idea of pulling them all out irresponsibly and then they'll end up like the soldier's after the Vietnam War. They'll be called everything you can thing of (invader's, murderers, etc.). They'll be treated the same exact way the soldier's were treated from the Vietnam War.
I pray for our troops every day, and will pray until the election is over the the right person (McCain), will win this election.
Do you actually know any soldiers?
Are you honestly suggesting that the soldiers who are on the front lines are less informed than you are?
You think you 'have more opportunity to see the big picture and the real motives behind it' than the men and women putting their lives on the line.
Lady, please get a grip.
Maybe go volunteer at a VA Hospital. Then perhaps you will stop preaching your uninformed views from your keyboard.
I am sure that our soldiers would sm
rather shoot these terrorists too. They can't, they have to do what they have to do to get information out of them.
I can think a whole lot worse I would do to them that would get the information out of them a whole lot faster. Think I will save that though.
Sounds like you want to create a military force of a bunch of "mamby pambies" who do nothing but make sure the terrorists/prisoners are so comfy in their little beds. Good grief should we sing them to sleep to?
What do you think they do to Americans when they capture them? A whole lot more than we ever do to them. Come down to reality will ya?
NOBODY WHO SAYS THEY ARE GLAD A HOMOSEXUAL WAS KILLED IN PHILADELPHIA IS ENTERTAINING EITHER...
yet one the liberals who post here told me that AL Franken was an entertainer and he said that...soooo....is PERFECTING JEWS any WORSE than I WAS GLAD THE PUDDING HOMOSEXUAL WAS KILLED IN PHILADELPHIA? DO YOU UNDERSTAND?????
And if you would read my posts, you would see that I do not agree with what she said, and I do not WATCH her...because someone does not watch her does not change what she is. I did not say I was personally entertained by it...far from it. But others are...they buy her books, they go to her lectures...and an amazing number of liberals do it to heckle her or read her books just so they can slam her...but their money spends just like anyone else's...they are the ones who keep her on the front page. I also said people would ignore her she would go away. She needs an audience, and liberals make up a good deal of that audience. Geez....dial it back a notch, will ya???
Getting a blow job is worse than sending Americans to be killed?
If choosing between a president who had his penis sucked in the oval office, and a president who threw unequipped National Guard troops under the bus to try to impress his daddy, I'll take the Prez with the healthy sexual appetite any day.
10 Reasons to Impeach G. W. Bush and Dick "Shoot 'em Up" Cheney (BTW it is too bad Cheney and Bush never went hunting together):
1. Violating the United Nations Charter by launching an illegal "War of Aggression" against Iraq without cause, using fraud to sell the war to Congress and the public, misusing government funds to begin bombing without Congressional authorization, and subjecting our military personnel to unnecessary harm, debilitating injuries, and deaths.
2. Violating U.S. and international law by authorizing the torture of thousands of captives, resulting in dozens of deaths, and keeping prisoners hidden from the International Committee of the Red Cross.
3. Violating the Constitution by arbitrarily detaining Americans, legal residents, and non-Americans, without due process, without charge, and without access to counsel.
4. Violating the Geneva Conventions by targeting civilians, journalists, hospitals, and ambulances, and using illegal weapons, including white phosphorous, depleted uranium, and a new type of napalm.
5. Violating U.S. law and the Constitution through widespread wiretapping of the phone calls and emails of Americans without a warrant.
6. Violating the Constitution by using "signing statements" to defy hundreds of laws passed by Congress.
7. Violating U.S. and state law by obstructing honest elections in 2000, 2002, 2004, and 2006.
8. Violating U.S. law by using paid propaganda and disinformation, selectively and misleadingly leaking classified information, and exposing the identity of a covert CIA operative working on sensitive WMD proliferation for political retribution.
9. Subverting the Constitution and abusing Presidential power by asserting a "Unitary Executive Theory" giving unlimited powers to the President, by obstructing efforts by
1. Violating the United Nations Charter by launching an illegal "War of Aggression" against Iraq without cause, using fraud to sell the war to Congress and the public, misusing government funds to begin bombing without Congressional authorization, and subjecting our military personnel to unnecessary harm, debilitating injuries, and deaths.
2. Violating U.S. and international law by authorizing the torture of thousands of captives, resulting in dozens of deaths, and keeping prisoners hidden from the International Committee of the Red Cross.
3. Violating the Constitution by arbitrarily detaining Americans, legal residents, and non-Americans, without due process, without charge, and without access to counsel.
4. Violating the Geneva Conventions by targeting civilians, journalists, hospitals, and ambulances, and using illegal weapons, including white phosphorous, depleted uranium, and a new type of napalm.
5. Violating U.S. law and the Constitution through widespread wiretapping of the phone calls and emails of Americans without a warrant.
6. Violating the Constitution by using "signing statements" to defy hundreds of laws passed by Congress.
7. Violating U.S. and state law by obstructing honest elections in 2000, 2002, 2004, and 2006.
8. Violating U.S. law by using paid propaganda and disinformation, selectively and misleadingly leaking classified information, and exposing the identity of a covert CIA operative working on sensitive WMD proliferation for political retribution.
9. Subverting the Constitution and abusing Presidential power by asserting a "Unitary Executive Theory" giving unlimited powers to the President, by obstructing efforts by Congress and the Courts to review and restrict Presidential actions, and by promoting and signing legislation negating the Bill of Rights and the Writ of Habeas Corpus.
10. Gross negligence in failing to assist New Orleans residents after Hurricane Katrina, in ignoring urgent warnings of an AL Qaeda attack prior to Sept. 11, 2001, and in increasing air pollution causing global warming.
Congress and the Courts to review and restrict Presidential actions, and by promoting and signing legislation negating the Bill of Rights and the Writ of Habeas Corpus.
10. Gross negligence in failing to assist New Orleans residents after Hurricane Katrina, in ignoring urgent warnings of an Al Qaeda attack prior to Sept. 11, 2001, and in increasing air pollution causing global warming.
Yes, our soldiers deserved better.
I think these are fallen soldiers...nm
soldiers votes
you know, on the news last evening, in a very mild manner, it was mentioned that maybe only 30% of the overseas military's votes will be counted this election, due to mail problems, time constraints, etc. OUTRAGEOUS!!! To boot, this also happened 4 yr ago, and still no one has fixed it (tho 1 senator is allegedly trying). Where are all the hanging chad type screaming complaints, the concern for the (hate this word now): disenfranchised???? IMO this would not be a hard problem to fix, so why is it still broke? A soldier's vote should be most definitely counted, WITHOUT FAIL. Grrrrrr. not to mention, that in Ohio, reported also last night, the homeless can now list their park benches as their addresses, and vote. Mind you, you cannot collect help in the form of welfare/food stamps etc without a solid normal address, but you can vote. nevermind that the homeless are likely uninformed. (don't feed or house them, just give them a ballot and tell them who to vote for...) all the while, our military's votes are casually tossed aside, with an "oh well..." i am still fuming the next day.
Tell that to the soldiers there who have heard
##
And you know this, how? Talk to the soldiers
We have several in our town who have been stationed down there and they will certainly tell you it scares the he!! out of them to see Obama is shutting Gitmo down. They personally have heard those incarcerated bragging about what has been done and laughing at the U.S. til the next attack when they heard Obama is closing it down.
Yea, why don't ya just feel sorry for all those poor guys down there, right up until the next attack!
Winter Soldiers
Short script on article of our war on terror - a sad commentary on what is really going on and how our soldiers are responding to it.......
http://www.truthout.org/031709A
Winter Soldiers Speak Out in Europe
Tuesday 17 March 2009
by: Maya Schenwar, t r u t h o u t | Report
![US]( "US") Pennsylvania before the Winter Solider hearings last March." src=http://www.truthout.org/files/images/A1_031709A.jpg>US veterans march from Philadelphia to Valley Forge before the Winter Solider hearings last March. (Photo: Susie Husted)
Last March, a group of soldiers and veterans gathered in Washington, DC, to recount their experiences in Iraq and Afghanistan. They spent three days testifying, confessing and mourning. They revealed atrocities never before spoken of - the brutal murders of civilians, the destruction of homes and villages, the rape and sexual assault of both civilians and US military women - and displayed photos and video footage to back up their claims. The event was titled "Winter Soldier," harkening back to the 1971 Winter Soldier Investigation, in which veterans gathered in Detroit to give testimony about war crimes they had committed or witnessed in Vietnam. Both Winter Soldiers zeroed in on the US military policy's devastating effects, straight from the mouths of those charged with carrying out that policy.
Full article excerpt can be found at: http://www.truthout.org/031709A
You have real issues and I've never killed an abortion doctor
nor have I condoned the very few that have. We are not all murderers. I'm sorry that something has has happened in your life to make you so against God, but demonizing us will not make your issues go away. We are not trying to be superior, but if you want religion to stay out of schools then all religion and theories (which liberalism is full of) needs to stay out too. If you want it vanilla and equal well then it works both ways.
Republicans want amnesty for terrorists who killed or wounded US troops.
The following is a compilation of Senate Republicans defending the proposal to give amnesty to terrorists who have killed or wounded US troops. These statements were made on the Senate floor yesterday.
TED STEVENS - IF THAT'S AMNESTY, I'M FOR IT: I really believe we ought to try to find some way to encourage that country to demonstrate to those people who have been opposed to what we're trying to do, that it's worthwhile for them and their children to come forward and support this democracy. And if that's amnesty, I'm for it. I'd be for it. And if those people who are, come forward... if they bore arms against our people, what's the difference between those people that bore arms against the Union in the War between the States? What's the difference between the Germans and Japanese and all the people we've forgiven? - Sen. Ted Stevens
MCCONNELL SUGGESTED A RESOLUTION COMMENDING IRAQIS FOR GIVING TERRORISTS AMNESTY. ...might it not just be as useful an exercise to be trying to pass a resolution commending the Iraqi government for the position that they've taken today with regard to this discussion of Amnesty? - Sen. Mitch McConnell
ALEXANDER COMPARED IRAQI AMNESTY FOR TERRORISTS TO NELSON MANDELA'S PEACE EFFORTS. Is it not true that Nelson Mandela's courage and his ability to create a process of reconciliation and forgiveness was a major factor in what has been a political miracle in Africa...Did not Nelson Mandela, win a - the co-winner of - a noble Nobel Peace Prize just for this sort of gesture? - Sen. Lamar Alexander
CORNYN: IRAQI AMNESTY DEBATE IS A DISTRACTION. It makes no sense for the United States Senate to shake its finger at the new government of Iraq and to criticize them... it really is a distraction from the debate that I think the American people would want us to have. - Sen. John Cornyn
CHAMBLISS: AMNESTY IS OK FOR EX-INSURGENTS AS LONG AS THEY ARE ON OUR SIDE NOW. Is it not true today that we have Iraqis who are fighting the war against the insurgents, who at one time fought against American troops and other coalition troops as they were marching to Baghdad, who have now come over to our side and are doing one heck of a job of fighting along, side by side, with Americans and coalition forces, attacking and killing insurgents on a daily basis? - Sen. Saxby Chambliss
Germany, who killed millions of Jews wants to prosecute Rumsfeld.
That makes sense.
Yeah, and also I wonder how these soldiers would feel...sm
about the party who CLAIMS to support them but disrespect their families when they speak out. After all, did they not fight so freedoms like, freedom of speech, would be guaranteed?
I understand that families speaking out are not protected from retort but it is hypocritical to accuse liberals of not supporting the troops when you are the ones blasting fallen soldier's families. What do they just *support* conservative soldiers with conservative families???
I'm just sayin'
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