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Is this what it has come to, a bunch of draft dodging, sm

Posted By: Democrat on 2005-11-21
In Reply to: John Murtha to appear on Meet the Press today! - American Woman

stay-at-home politicians calling decorated war veterans cowards. They have their nerve.

I have been out of the loop lately with politics, but this tops all.


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Most are dodging the fact, tho.....
that a man asked a question and got for that a background check which was made public. That really does not bother you? Really??
As usual. Dodging the issue.
Your comfort zone has everything to do with why you "won't go there."
Nice dodging of question -how pitiful.nm
nm
Still dodging the subject at hand I see....pitiful..(nm)
x
draft
Yes, there will be a draft, its inevitable, and that urks me to the core.  I have a friend who went to Canada to avoid Vietnam and he is still there as a teacher..and believe me, if anyone wants my help in the coming draft, they got it. Using 9/11 as an excuse for this war bugs the crap out of me..I grew up in NYC, the WTC and all of Manhattan and Brooklyn were my stomping grounds..Relatives on my mother's side of the family still live there.  I moved to CA with my then husband 20 years ago (going back to NYC hopefully within a year or two) and when 9/11 happened, it tore my heart apart.  I wanted so to be there, to put my hands in the dirt of the WTC, to help in any way I could..My cousin who lives in Brooklyn could see the smoke when she looked out over the water, my friends in Wesley Hills and Nyack, NY had debris on their lawns..To use 9/11 for political gain makes me want to vomit..My cousins daughter worked at the WTC for a Japanese bank, she was on floor 42 when 9/11 happened..She got out okay and now works in New Jersey for the same bank..9/11 is sacred and should never be used for political gain..It just shows the character of these creeps..MQ had a worker that was flying back from Massachusetts..She was scheduled for a later flight but the airline told her and her daughter there was an earlier flight.  The mother, the MQ worker, decided to take the earlier flight, the daughter remained at the airport.  That earlier flight turned out to be the first flight to hit the WTC.
I have not seen a draft yet.
Everyone that is in Iraq joined the military of his/her own free will. Many, after the war started.
Draft System To Be Tested...sm
Military Draft System to be Tested
Body: Associated Press | December 22, 2006

WASHINGTON - The Selective Service System is planning a comprehensive test of the military draft machinery, which hasn't been run since 1998.

The agency is not gearing up for a draft, an agency official said Thursday. The test itself would not likely occur until 2009.

Meanwhile, the secretary for Veterans Affairs said that society would benefit if the U.S. were to bring back the draft and that it shouldn't have any loopholes for anyone who is called to serve. VA Secretary Jim Nicholson later issued a statement saying he does not support reinstituting a draft.

The Selective Service readiness exercise would test the system that randomly chooses draftees by birth date and the network of appeals boards that decide how to deal with conscientious objectors and others who want to delay reporting for duty, said Scott Campbell, Selective Service director for operations and chief information officer.

We're kind of like a fire extinguisher. We sit on a shelf until needed, Campbell said. Everyone fears our machine for some reason. Our machine, unless the president and Congress get together and say, 'Turn the machine on' ... we're still on the shelf.

The administration has for years forcefully opposed bringing back the draft, and the White House said Thursday that its position had not changed.

A day earlier, President Bush said he is considering sending more troops to Iraq and has asked Defense Secretary Robert Gates to look into adding more troops to the nearly 1.4 million uniformed personnel on active duty.

According to the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office, increasing the Army by 40,000 troops would cost as much as $2.6 billion the first year and $4 billion after that. Service officials have said the Army wants to increase its force by 20,000 to 30,000 soldiers and the Marine Corps would like 5,000 more troops.

The unpopular war in Iraq, where more than 2,950 American troops have already died, complicates the task of finding more recruits and retaining current troops - to meet its recruitment goals in recent years, the Army has accepted recruits with lower aptitude test scores.

In remarks to reporters in New York, Nicholson recalled his own experience as a company commander in an infantry unit that brought together soldiers of different backgrounds and education levels. He said the draft does bring people from all quarters of our society together in the common purpose of serving.

Rep. Charles Rangel, a New York Democrat who has said minorities and the poor share an unfair burden of the war, plans to introduce a bill next year to reinstate the draft.

House Speaker-elect Nancy Pelosi has said that reinstating the draft would not be high on the Democratic-led Congress' priority list, and the White House said Thursday that no draft proposal is being considered.

Planning for the Selective Service exercise, called the Area Office Mobilization Prototype Exercise, is slated to begin in June or July of next year for a 2009 test. Campbell said budget cuts could force the agency to cancel the test, which he said should take place every three years but hasn't because of funding constraints.

Hearst Newspapers first reported the planned test for a story sent to its subscribers for weekend use.

The military drafted people during the Civil War and both world wars and between 1948 and 1973. An agency independent of the Defense Department, the Selective Service System was reincorporated in 1980 to maintain a registry of 18-year-old men, but call-ups have not occurred since the Vietnam War.

What do you think?
Then I expect you to be the first in line for the draft.
Everyone has the right to protect themselves, their beliefs, religion, and country, but it seems that yours takes precedence over everybody elses and you can't seem to bring yourself to that level of understanding.

I don't have a stomach to being lied to and I especially don't stomach flippant remarks about my beliefs, as I have a right to protect them. Hatred is formulated. It has been formulating for years. Love turns to hate. Jealousy turns to hate. Intolerance turns to hate. Just give the right stir, formula 101.

2006 NIE report findings stated the the occupation of Iraq is creating more Islamic radicalism.

"An opening section of the report, “Indicators of the Spread of the Global Jihadist Movement,” cites the Iraq war as a reason for the diffusion of jihad ideology. The report “says that the Iraq war has made the overall terrorism problem worse,” said one American intelligence official."

Who's wearing the blind fold? Two hates to do make peace or tolerance.


I do know what the original SS draft looked like....
A great great uncle of mine was a friend of Roosevelt and was a long-time military man. He finally retired and went back to the midwest when Roosevelt called him and asked him to please come back to Washington to draft a plan for SS.

We are fortunate to have this to see and I can guarantee you it had nothing to do with freeloaders and moochers but was to look out for the older crowd. Yes, they were taking into account the average lifespan of a man and then their windows, so she could have money to help feed their children if he died early. This was in part because of the stock market crash where so many lost their life's savings. It was never never meant to be what it has turned into. Wealthy older Americans were not to have this money JUST because they hit a certain age. If they had money, they were not to draw SS, only those with extreme need.

Unfortunately, over the decades government has turned SS into anything but its intended use.
He is registered - but we do not have a draft so it does not matter -
They no longer draft people. To be honest, I think they should though. The military is made up of poor people who feel that is their only option. I bet if we got some of those rich boys in the army putting their butts on the line, then a lot of decisions that are made at this point would be made differently!!!
but we do not have a draft anymore, so it does not matter!
On Jan. 27, 1973, Secretary of Defense Melvin R. Laird announced the creation of an all-volunteer armed forces, negating the need for the military draft.


I just read the draft of the bill on line...
the lenders are getting the bailout all right, but there are provisions in the bill about letting people in foreclosure get "modifications" so they can keep their houses. We are essentially buying the bad mortgages from the lenders, we the taxpayers. And then those folks who got those mortgages they really didn't qualify for and could not afford to begin with...can try to pay it back, which in and of itself is not a bad thing...however, the rub is the "modifications." I don't disagree with modifying the interest rate to the average others are paying...but there is a thing there that says "reduction of loan principal" as one of the options. I think that is going too far. I think they should have to pay back every dime they borrowed no matter how long it takes...becaue of they don't, WE have to. Sigh.
Draft Dodger Cheney attacks War Hero
The words President Murtha are sounding pretty good!

 

DERRICK Z. JACKSON

White House plays chicken with a war hero



THE WHITE House is so deluded, it actually believes it can turn a soaring hawk into a scrounging chicken. Stung by the call by US Representative John Murtha of Pennsylvania to pull out of Iraq, Scott McClellan, President Bush's press secretary, said this week, ''It is baffling that he is endorsing the policy positions of Michael Moore and the extreme liberal wing of the Democratic Party.


Talk about playing the chicken-hawk card. A White House where most of the architects of war avoided combat in their own lives dared to associate two people who are worlds apart in world views. Moore made the anti-Bush ''Fahrenheit 9/11, which infuriated the right wing by breaking box office records for a documentary film. Moore was booed at the 2004 Republican National Convention.


Murtha is the 73-year-old recipient of two Purple Hearts and a Bronze Star for combat duty in Vietnam. He is a Democrat whose three decades in office are marked by support of President Reagan's policies in Nicaragua and El Salvador. Murtha was a top Democratic supporter of the 1991 Gulf War. He wants a constitutional ban on burning the American flag.


In a 2002 press briefing, former Deputy Defense Secretary Paul Wolfowitz termed the support of politicians like Murtha for the Pentagon as ''wonderful. In the 2004 vice presidential debate, incumbent Dick Cheney said, ''One of my strongest allies in Congress when I was secretary of defense was Jack Murtha.


For all those shows of patriotism, Murtha was skeptical about the rush to invade Iraq in 2003 of Iraq even though he voted to give President Bush the authorization to go to war. He publicly said Bush beat the war drums before building an international coalition. Murtha said he had not seen anything in intelligence reports that indicated an imminent threat. Murtha said Bush ''has put the country in such a box. He can say, 'You'll undercut me if you don't vote for this resolution.'


One month after the invasion, when no weapons of mass destruction had yet been found, Murtha warned that American credibility was at risk. By the September, the absence of weapons of mass destruction made him join the much more liberal House minority leader, Nancy Pelosi, in calling for Bush to fire the planners of the invasion. Despite the proclamation that ''we achieved a marvelous military victory, Murtha became increasingly frustrated with the chaos of the occupation. This summer, Murtha said administration officials were ''not honest in their assessment that they were winning the ongoing battle.


Finally, this week, Murtha unleased a scathing attack on Bush's Iraq policy. He called it ''a flawed policy wrapped in illusion. He said he believed military officials when he visited Kuwait just before the war and they showed him where American forces would be attacked by weapons of mass destruction when they approach Baghdad. But now, with no end to the killing in sight, he said, ''The US cannot accomplish anything further in Iraq militarily. It's time to bring the troops home. . .They have become the enemy.


Murtha talked about soldier after soldier he has visited in hospitals, wounded and maimed by the invasion. Yet, there's more terrorism now than there ever was and it's because of what? Is it because of our policy? I would say it's a big part.


In perhaps the most humble admission of his press conference, Murtha said, ''The American public is way ahead of the members of Congress.


This came the day after Cheney threw mud in the direction of critics who gave Bush his war authorization. Cheney accused them of making ''irresponsible comments. He accused them issuing ''cynical and pernicious falsehoods to make ''a play for political advantage.


He said, ''The President and I cannot prevent certain politicians from losing their memory -- or their backbone.


This was the same Cheney who gave us some of the greatest falsehoods of this generation with ''There is no doubt that Saddam Hussein now has weapons of mass destruction . . . We believe he has, in fact, reconstituted nuclear weapons, and that we would be ''welcomed as liberators.


Murtha clobbered Cheney's words the next day, saying, ''I like guys who got five deferments and never been there and send people to war and then don't like to hear suggestions about what needs to be done.


This hawk still soars, above the scrounging chicken hawks.


Derrick Z. Jackson's e-mail address is jackson@globe.com.  src=http://cache.boston.com/bonzai-fba/File-Based_Image_Resource/dingbat_story_end_icon.gif



src=http://cache.boston.com/bonzai-fba/File-Based_Image_Resource/spacer.gif
© Copyright 2005 The New York Times Company
 












McCain should draft Tammy to cover all his bases.
nm
Obama has already said he is in favor of draft - see link inside
http://www.wsws.org/articles/2008/sep2008/obam-s13_prn.shtml


BTW, no the actual sneak in the draft registration thing
nm
also, courts ruled the draft was not forced servitude in Butler v. Perry. nm
x
sorry bunch of

comments.  nit pickers unite!!


 


 


Bunch of wussies
Which is why we are where we are right now..We are pansies, wussies.  We dont take a stand, we are wishy washy.  I am just acting like a republican and striking back and using the good old smear campaign that republicans have perfected.  You continue to be quiet, mild mannered and you will get no where in today's politics.  Hate??  Nah.  I hate no one.  Im just playing the same game the republicans are playing.  What is good for one is good for the other..I think it is fun watching the lying opposition squirm, makes me smile.
Boy that's a whole bunch of people.
Please provide evidence that backs up your claim that liberals always, always utilize name-calling.  Not sure exactly how many million people that it just in the U.S.  Does this also include Europeans, etc.?  Please share where you got this information.  Seems like kind of a ridiculous claim, but that's just my opinion.
What a bunch of prudes.
besides that, I think the whole nation is due for a HUGE party after having endured 8 years of W and a perfectly wretched presidential campaign. An exciting celebration is just what the doctor ordered in the midst of a collapsing economy, the post dismal holiday blues and unemployment/food stamp and jobless rates at highest in decades. What would you have them do? Sit around reviewing their shrinking 401Ks or file their taxes perhaps? Sheesh. Lighten up, will ya?
what a bunch of hicks
Watch CNBC for the rest of the week 24/7 and then vote.
what a bunch of negative

nellies.  Why even bother getting up in the morning with that burden of resentment on your shoulders?


 


What a bunch of losers.
lawsuit after lawsuit and NOW we have Obama being portrayed as having quadruple citizenship. Do you hear yourselves? Preposterous. Ridiculous. Stupid. Full of all kinds of phoney outrage. For crying out loud, get over yourselves.
Along with a bunch of Republicans

banks by tens of billions of dollars.


http://www.comcast.net/articles/news-general/20090206/Bailout.Oversight/


What a bunch of Pelosi!!!
In other words...what a bunch of bu!!sh!t.
GOP, bunch of liars and criminals
The GOP's Spreading Plague
    By Joe Conason
    Salon.com

    Friday 30 September 2005

Voters are notoriously slow in voting out politicians accused of corruption, but they may reach the tipping point with the latest revelations.

    To be an honest Republican these days must be to wonder what awful revelation is coming next - and how the Grand Old Party, which once claimed to represent political reform, became a front for sleaze, corruption and cynical criminality. Across the country, from the Capitol to statehouses, Republican officials are under indictment, under investigation or under suspicion.

    This week's headlines featured the indictment of Rep. Tom DeLay and the probe of Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist, but the infection of venality among their fellow partisans is now reaching epidemic proportions. So widespread is the plague that keeping track of all the individual cases, and their increasingly baroque variations, has become a distinct challenge.

    Consider Jack Abramoff, once the prince of K Street lobbyists and a dedicated right-wing ideologue who boasted of his powerful connections to DeLay, Karl Rove, Grover Norquist and the entire Republican apparatus in Washington. Already under investigation by the Justice Department for his influence peddling among House members, including DeLay, and his swindling of Indian tribes, Abramoff was indicted last month for bank fraud in a separate South Florida case involving a casino boat company that he partly owned.

    The fraud allegedly committed by Abramoff and his business partner Adam Kidan involved a phony wire transfer they used to purchase a controlling interest in SunCruz from the company's founder, Konstantinos Gus Boulis, in 2001.

    Abramoff and Kidan later fell out with Boulis in a bitter business dispute that turned violent. In February 2001, gunmen ambushed Boulis on a Fort Lauderdale, Fla., highway and shot him repeatedly. On Tuesday, Florida authorities arrested three New York men with mob connections for the Boulis killing. Two of the men - Anthony Moscatiello and Tony Ferrari - had received payments totaling more than $240,000 from Kidan and Abramoff. Moscatiello, a longtime associate of the Gambino Mafia family, and Ferrari were supposedly providing food and consulting services to SunCruz - or so Kidan claimed when questioned by prosecutors. There is no evidence, however, that Moscatiello and Ferrari provided any services to the company.

    Connecting the dots isn't difficult here: Kidan and Abramoff want to get rid of Boulis, who won't go away. Kidan and Abramoff hire Moscatiello and Ferrari with SunCruz money. Moscatiello and Ferrari allegedly whack Boulis, without any motive of their own. If the Broward County state's attorney has sufficient evidence to win convictions for a capital crime, some people will probably be talking soon in hope of avoiding the hot shot.

    The stunning fall of Abramoff, who has yet to hit bottom, is certainly the most colorful tale of Republican depravity. The corporate money laundering to Texas politicians that led to DeLay's conspiracy indictment, and the suspicious insider stock transaction that spurred investigations of Frist by the Justice Department and the Securities and Exchange Commission, seem mundane by comparison. Outrage will be warranted if their misconduct is proved, but everyone sadly knows that these felonies are now common practice in our political and corporate culture.

    Corporate misbehavior has also brought down right-wing publisher Conrad Black, neoconservative strategist and former Bush advisor Richard Perle and the entire corporate board of Hollinger Inc., the Republican-friendly media conglomerate formerly controlled by Lord Black - and that he and others are plausibly accused of illicitly looting for their own benefit. Furious shareholders forced Black to relinquish control of the company and are suing him, as well as Perle and former Black deputy David Radler, for $500 million. The SEC is also suing Black and Radler, and the Justice Department is investigating the former Hollinger directors.

    Last month, US Attorney Patrick Fitzgerald, who also happens to be the special prosecutor in the Valerie Plame case, accepted Radler's guilty plea to mail fraud and wire fraud. Radler is now believed to be cooperating in the prosecution of what former SEC chairman Richard Breeden, a Republican who investigated Hollinger on behalf of shareholders, termed a corporate kleptocracy.

    Kleptocratic morality evidently ruled at least two Republican statehouses in the Midwest as well. Currently under indictment are former Gov. George Ryan of Illinois, whose trial on bribery charges began last week, and Gov. Robert Taft of Ohio, who pleaded no contest last month to charges of accepting illegal gifts from a state contractor.

    That contractor is Thomas Noe, a coin dealer who received lucrative investment deals with the state's Workers Compensation Fund and is now at the center of a gigantic scandal known as Coingate. More than $12 million has disappeared from the fund, and former GOP official Noe stands accused of laundering money to various Republican politicians, including the Bush-Cheney campaign. Like Abramoff, Noe is a Bush Pioneer, responsible for raising at least $100,000 for the president last year.

    Still another Pioneer is currently under criminal investigation in a celebrated corruption case involving Randy Duke Cunningham, a prominent Republican representative from San Diego with a senior position on the House defense appropriations subcommittee. On Aug. 18, FBI and IRS agents raided the offices of defense contractor and Bush fundraiser Brent Wilkes.

    Wilkes is reportedly a former business associate of Mitchell J. Wade, the head of a defense contracting firm called MZM Inc. who is under investigation in San Diego for alleged bribery of Cunningham. According to newspaper reports, Wade purchased a home owned by Cunningham at a price inflated by at least $700,000, and also permitted the congressman to use his 42-foot yacht free of charge. Federal agents searched Wade's offices in July.

    Although prosecutors have brought no criminal charges in the case yet, they have filed civil court documents describing the home sale as a violation of federal bribery laws - and Cunningham, who has served in Congress for decades, has already announced that he will not seek another term next year.

    The Republican National Committee's new treasurer, Robert Kjellander, is under investigation too. (Naturally, he is also a Bush Pioneer.) Not long after he assumed his new post at the party's Washington headquarters, Kjellander received a federal subpoena for records of his dealings with the Illinois Teachers' Retirement System, a state pension fund, and the Carlyle Group. Federal prosecutors are reportedly looking into alleged corruption at the fund, and have asked Kjellander to provide information about a $4.5 million fee he received from Carlyle for his role in arranging investments by the fund with the huge private equity fund. Carlyle, of course, is closely connected to the Bush administration, including the president's father, George H.W. Bush, who has worked for the firm as a rainmaker and advisor.

    In fairness, it should be said that all these pols and parasites may be innocent (except for those already convicted), or at least not guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. It is also true that voters have historically been slow to evict politicians from office because of corruption charges.

    But public opinion of congressional Republicans is hitting new lows, and Americans are growing furious about the war in Iraq, the government response to Hurricane Katrina and rising energy prices. The natural impulse to throw the rascals out can only be encouraged by the Gilded Age spectacles now unfolding in Washington and in cities across the country as the indictments continue to come down between now and November 2006.




    Joe Conason writes a weekly column for Salon and the New York Observer.
Well you had to know the threats were coming next from this bunch..nm

They are a scary bunch aren't they?sm
“When the government fears the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny.” –Thomas Jefferson
looks like a bunch of sheep to me living in USA..sm

hmmmmm....?  Just because everyone is voting for Barack doesn't make any of it right - they all are bad candidates to some of us......


blechhhhhhhhhhhhh


JMO.........no flames required......


Yes. We are all a bunch of stupid wretches
x
I just got off that site after reading a bunch

of questions. Some are inappropriate as:"Why does your wife look so miserable all the time." This has nothing to do with serious questions. There was also one on there about somebody losing their labradoodle and what was he going to do about it. Others are down right nasty. I call that abuse.  


Some people are just plain nuts. There are over 11,700 questions listed on there and I think I only got to read around 300. Most that I read were appropriate and relate to questions on what he was planning to do.


Now, before you scream at me, I didn't vote for him, I'm definitely not a fan of his, but I'm willing to watch and see what happens and give an opinion or two once in a while....and that's all it is, an opinion, like everyone else on this board are allowed.


I love it! Bunch of bums. NM

Yeah, thanks a bunch for posting....sm
Even though most of the "blame" can be contributed to the dems through the years, repubs are, in part, also to blame, for not sticking to their guns.

Sam has been posting this stuff for weeks, and I don't care if she does paraphrase what she reads, because she makes it easy to understand too.

Anyways, this guy is spot on for his short in a nutshell review, too. Really liked his website.



I think we should be glad the bill didn't pass. It still had a bunch of crap in it. Maybe they'll get it right this next time.
I'm thinking of buying a bunch of really mean -
pitbulls, and teaching them to seek and destroy wall street CEO's.
Yep, but you won't get the bunch of blind eyes on
xx
I want facts, not a bunch of mumbogumbo.
x
Can we avoid lumping everyone into one bunch?

I'm a liberal and I have to say, I really resent it when people say the libs this or the dem's that and refer to all of us in one great big bunch that worships Obama and thinks he's the messiah.   It really bugs the crap out of me.  He's a man.  He's not my Savior. 


I have seen condescension and name calling from BOTH sides of the fence, none of which is appropriate coming from anyone who calls themself an adult.  I do find it interesting that it seems to be much more accepted in this election cycle than in years before.  I don't know if it's because of the proliferation of message boards and the complete lack of humanity that tends to go with posting on them, or if it's this particular year and set of candidates/winners.


Let's give the man a chance.  Yes, he's a man.  I believe he is a very smart man and I have high hopes for him.  Let's avoid name calling, liberal bashing, conservative hate, etc.  That just does everyone a disservice.


Pelosi, O and the bunch don't have the balls to do it...nm
//
Low class for that bunch ain't news to me.....
@@
I saw it too. What a bunch of brainless blabber.
Ultra-left garafabarf skank.
their deeds won't be lost....they get a bunch of
nm
Agree. what a bunch of garbage.
nm
This is the biggest bunch of bunk and lies
I've ever read. It's just hilarious how far people will go to try and discredit the very successful Limbaugh. Predictable drivel from the liberal press.
The saying, 'a few bad apples spoil the bunch' is true...sm
I think the loose recruiting tactics to beef of the military that is what is causing these chain of events. My question is how can America screen soldiers to prevent stuff like this?

And to take away their immunity is just as scary to me. There's no time like the present to start unhooking the training wheels.
I find it amusing how a bunch of MTs sitting
around in their robes typing all day have suddenly become the political pundits of the world, interjecting their wisdom (often found on the internet) and view points with such ferociousness. Alert the media! These women are a force to be reckoned with!
You anti-choice people are a bunch of
Get a life, and keep your hands of my body, and every one else's who doesn't happen to agree with you. If you don't like a woman's freedom to choose, then don't choose it yourself. But you sure as he11 aren't going to tell me or anyone else what to do.
I would rather send a bunch of brown envelopes..
against people like you showing how full of (insert word here) you are.
No, the big-money bunch in Orange County had
because they PAY him to.
Yep, remember him calling us a bunch of old cronies?
Back a while he said he was wasting his time on us "old cronies" If that's not mysoginistic (not to say incredily condescending), I don't know what is.

That's okay, though, TS likes himself enough to make up for all of us who don't.
Wrongo, just-the-bad-breath. I've seen it and I do know a bunch of
We have no time to be wasting on these ridiculous notions.

And this has nothing to do with liberal or conservative. It has to do with whether or not you have one iota of common sense, and it's becoming more evident by the day that you don't.