I don't automatically think spanking is abuse
Posted By: but the OP that started this thread on 2008-03-05
In Reply to: I think too many people.... - spanker
said it was okay to give 'em the belt. That is abuse, plain and simple. If you feel a need to spank your child, then do it with your own hand, not another object. It's too easy to hit too hard with an object because you're not feeling the pain you're subjecting them to.
As for the gov't interfering, they have to because there are too many wackos in this world that do beat their kids to a pulp. If they all parented with a little more sense, like you obvioulsy do, then I would agree that the gov't shouldn't interefere, but unfortunately the wackos of this world don't care.
It sounds to me as if you're raising some wonderful children. You've definitely offered up some very good advice. I saw no where in your post where you said that you've used a belt, and I'm not saying that you did. I'm simply referring to the OP that started this thread that beating with a belt is abuse.
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That's why we automatically think the worst
Everyone remembers the exceptions, rather than the vast majority whose ailments turn out to be minor.
In any case, there's no point in worrying until you're sure there's something to worry about.
when I removed IE 7 it automatically reverted back to IE 6...sm
everything is back to normal now. Thanks
But not believing in Christianity doesn't automatically
.
Dang it, my posts keep automatically putting anonymous....sm
It is me though.
Spanking.
spanking versus ISS
Here is a quick question for all of you that think that the spanking from the school is okay and before any of you make any snap judgements, I was spanked as a child and when my children were smaller, they too were spanked(BY THEIR PARENTS)....Do you all realize that this school that uses these "swats" as punishment, would be on the phone immediately if they saw you or found out that you "swatted" that same child as punishment for deeds done wrong at home? Since nowadays they want to tell you what you can and cannot do as a parent to acutally parent your child( and then of course complain about said kids nowadays), that by alloing them to do something to your child that they would gladly report you for is quite ridiculous.
How long is this ISS. For five tardies..it sure as heck shouldn't be a whole day or even a half day..it should be something realistic. Yes, I do know what it is like to have to deal with school principals who are jerks, just remember that this is your child and not theirs and that it is your job to look out for them.
If you really feel that just to get this over with right now, you want to let them swat her, that is your choice but since she is so obviously not interested in ISS, I would definitely make sure that she and the school knows that this is a one time pass and yes, I too would either make her do some work around the house or take something away if only for the hassle.
Btw, five tardies in 4 or 5 months is really not that terrible IMO. That is about one a month. My goodness, we all assumed it was cause she talks anyone think that maybe the girl had to use the bathroom during her time of the month. I would also find out when she was tardy and how tardy. My son was given a tardy cause the bus was late getting him to school and I called and let them know that that is not acceptable in my book. They had given several kids on his bus tardies and after several phone calls and a check with the bus company, the tardies were removed. Yes, if my son had been chatting or something, I would not have bothered to call, I would have just remind him that tardiness of his own making is not acceptable.
Best of luck.
The problem with spanking (For me) is that
my kids don't seem to think it's a big deal. My husband piped in because I don't hit hard enough (true perhaps, I value my hands!). I don't want to be swinging a bat though! I suppose an inexperienced spanker should just find an alternative punishment.
So I guess I mean spanking is OK for certain circumstances IF your hand gives a good smack!
spanking, not beating.
Teens this day and age have no fear, of anything, it seems. Back in my days of growing up, just the thought of my parents finding out I did something I wasn't suppose to, was enough for me to keep myself in line.
And NO, we were never beaten, but did get a few pats with the belt, which were far and few inbetween.
You say spanking does not build trust?
It sure makes a kid do good, though. I would not raise my kids to be terrors and surely not with g'kids. I just do not have it period.
You can get in trouble for spanking with an object...
I'm not against spanking when appropriate, but I used to work as a legal secretary and saw people get child abuse charges for spanking with belts. I think if you use a bare hand it is legal, but the law probably varies from state to state. Just wanted to warn you!
Spanking just taught my child it was okay to hit.
We never spanked our kid until he was around 2.5. Then dad got fed up with his behavior one day and spanked him. We also tried swatting him on the hand when he did something bad. Now my son has decided that hitting is what we do when we are mad and now hits me whenever he is upset. He never did this until he started receiving spankings. I really don't think spanking/switching is the answer and just sends the wrong message to the kids. But that is just my opinion and I realize everyone is entitled to raise their kids as they see fit.
All spanking does is make kids respect you to your face (sm)
it does not teach them anything at all. When my kids were very young and I could not reason with them, they did occasionally get a swat to get them to listen to me, but once they are old enough to reason, there is no reason to use physical force on them. I am telling you, all it does is raise sneaky kids.
spanking builds fear that you mistake as respect
A child who has been abandoned by both parents has no trust in anyone. Why do you think spanking is the right way to build trust? We just need to agree to disagree on this issue. I trust the counselor's recommendations more than yours as hers have proven to work. Spanking does not _make_ ALL kids do good. Sigh.
I'd say yes they really did abuse
the 'emergency' but rather than contacting an attorney I would just try to recall where you might have given her contact information - call them and change ASAP and I would not even fill in that spot in the future citing your experience in these two situations and the problems it caused and if they fuss - give them a phoney name and addy and let it go. I think it is there for your safety really, secondly for them to collect should you not pay a bill - I have only been called once in my 55 years as my son got behind on his credit union car payment and they traced me down through 3 counties - so think you definitely had an unusual experience.
Abuse
Call your local shelter and they will advise you on ways to leave safely. NEVER take abuse - physically, verbally, or mentally from anyone. Forget the church kid, learn to love yourself, and lead by example for your children. If you act like a doormat, do not be suprised when you get stepped on!
You need a long time on your own before you are ready to think about entering another relationship. You are not out of your present relationship yet, but you can be if that is your decision. Best wishes to you.
Lilly
I think it is abuse.
Take the poor doggy into your house. Your cat may hide, but my guess is the dog will ignore the cat. I got my Sheltie when I had 2 cats and they all got along just fine. Please don't leave this poor thing outside, especially if it hot in your area. If you cannot bring it in, call the authorities. It is kinder than leaving her out to suffer.
It is ABUSE!
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This IS animal abuse. Thankfully, in most states animal cruelty is becoming a felony. In my state (NY) it can be punishable up to $5000. Animal abandonment is also a felony with one year in jail and up to $1000 fine. Failure to provide proper nutrients is another law that seems to have been broken.
Our animals needs protection from the elements, proper food and water (and not just a bowl to catch rain water,either) They also need love and companionship, and by this I mean not regulated to the backyard to vegetate.
Animals can think....how do explain service dogs, search and rescue, and guide dogs? Have you ever seen a dog given a task to do and watch him/her go through the paces to get it done?
As I stated before, contact an area dog club to see if they have members willing to help, or if they know of a Sheltie rescue who can help. Contact your area vets for such phone numbers. Or, you can contact me and I'll see if I can locate a Sheltie rescue that can help.
Abuse
Your post makes me very sad. Your husband is abusive. Husbands and boyfriends come and go in our lives; however, family is ALWAYS family. Please seek counseling for yourself. You cannot change him. After you become stronger through counseling, you will see the situation clearly for what it is - abusive.
Call your sister and invite her for a visit. Better yet, get a plane ticket and go see her. Don't ask, just do it.
Best wishes.
Lilly
Abuse
Every county has a program for abused woman and children. You do not have to be physically abused for them to help you. Find out the name of the program near you, Domestic violence, Reach, etc. You can call them and they will allow you to take your children and live in a house, the whereabouts is not known to anyone on the outside. It is free and they are very caring. You can start there and they will help see that you and your children are safe away from this maniac. Good luck.
There's always abuse
of the system. Making it illegal doesn't stop that. There are a lot of drugs out there that are, in my opinion, worse than marijuana as far as addictive qualities and doctor's prescribe those drugs routinely and easily for things such as back pain which is not life threatening but can be debilitating. I think it would be much easier to hold standards to legal medical use marijuana than it would to criminalize alcohol and the numerous other prescription drugs that are out there and abused.
it's abuse duh
x
Child abuse
That's your opinion - and pedofilia - obviously you did not BF or have a good bond with your children. Do you also consider it child abuse that I did not use disposable diapers? What about the fact that I worked as a wet nurse? Some things are just natural - You should read the book, The Family Bed - BF may be looked upon differently in the US - but that is only cultural - and I do not bend to cultural issues - I did as I pleased - and no one else cared or ever even discouraged me from BF my son as long as I did. Unless you've been there - you do not understand - sorry for you.
It is not abuse, but it is neglect
If you cannot take the dog in, I would definitely call the authorities. It is completely unfair and wrong for the dog to be left alone outside for that long with no shelter and no place to go. Who knows, maybe your cat and they dog will get along. I have 3 cats and a 128-pound German shepherd, and they call get along just fine together! But, if you cannot do this, just call the authorities for help/advice. I'm sure the dog would want you to do this so that it can get out of this situation!
Abuse causing this?
I had a son (I hear boys are worse than girls) who wet the bed until probably early teens. My aunt was a nurse, said NOT to belittle, get after, etc., etc. He definitely was NOT abused. Think children just do sometimes. I was told he would grow out of it and he did.
Sibling abuse
I picked up my 6-YO grandson today to bring him to my house for the weekend. When I got there I could tell he'd been crying and had a puffy bottom lip. He showed me where he had a missing tooth and said his 8 1/2-YO half brother (not my grandson) knocked it out. His mom sits on the couch and says nothing to dispute it, so I'm sure it's true. This brother is also his babysitter after school until mom and step-dad get home.
Not too long ago DHS was involved and step-dad was charged with abusing my grandson. Of course they always try counseling first before thinking about removing a child from the home.
I constantly worry about the environment he is in as I've seen the way older brother treats him, but never anything quite like this. At what point is it considered sibling abuse as opposed to normal fighting that brothers might do. Is this something I should report to DHS?
p.s. His mom is just beginning to speak to me again. She blames me for the last DHS thing even though I wasn't the one who reported it (only because I didn't know about it). Once I heard about it, I did go make a report about neglect that I'd observed. Then they were conveniently busy for the next 5 weekends so I couldn't see my grandson. It's a long story, but there is nothing in writing about visitation. I have pretty much had visitation with him every other weekend for the last six years.
What to do.
Sibling abuse
They're home alone 2 to 3 hours before parents get home. Parents are trying to save money, which is the only important thing to them. I agree entirely that he is too young.
The thing is, parents were home today when this happened. They were probably just getting up. They do not get out of bed before 10 on the weekend, even though kids are up at 6 or 7. I pick my grandson up at 10, and he has not had breakfast yet. This is the norm.
Child abuse, hardly
My child was circumcised years ago, did fine. Years later my 2 male grandchildren were not circumcised and as they were aging were running into lots of trouble, could not retract the foreskin because as they grew, so did the foreskin, could not keep the penis clean and finally at an older age (when more painful for them) had to get circumcised. Well known fact, smegma collects there and causes infection and could lead to worst things than just infection, has been linked to penile cancer.
no, not child abuse. what will they think of next? SM
How about - combing the tangles out of your daughter's hair (ouch)?
or ripping off a band aide?
or making them eat their vegies?
Or maybe it's all that substance abuse she admitted to
I know I don't look like that and I'm close to that age. :P
THIS IS CALLED ELDERLY ABUSE
And the courts see it as this. You can have abuse other than striking a person. Taking advantage, which this is, of a person her age is something that needs to be nipped in the bud not tomorrow but immediately. A person can have an excellent mind, no dementia but are flattered when they think someone is smitten with them. Family and children services know about things like this. She is in a position for the right person to take plenty of advantage of whether it is her money or otherwise.
blatant emotional abuse
You say he is out and about all the time with work or just doing fun stuff.
Talk to an attorney then, when he leaves the next time, have the separation papers filed and put his rear end out. He has probably already talked to an attorney if he is trying to talk YOU into taking the kids and leaving.
A judge is going to be more favorable toward keeping the kids in their home.
His abusive behavior toward you touches on the kids emotional health too.
Give him the boot girl!
What constitues animal abuse
I would like to know what you all think about this situation. Our neighbor next door has been gone almost 12 days. We just moved here so do not know them. The day they left there was a little sheltie dog that found its way to our yard and all weekend long laid under their truck and on their front lawn and ours. We gave it food and water, but it had no collar. Couldn't bring ourselves to call authorities as the life span is not long for strays. 3 days later it was gone, we assumed its owner found her or she found her way home. A few days ago we heard a dog crying and found her in the back yard of our neighbors who have been gone a long time but she is being given food and water. She has just been alone for almost two weeks and crying from only what we can assume is loneliness. Don't know our neighbors enough that when they return to say anything to them but I sure feel like giving them a piece of my mind. If we didn't have a cat we would have taken her in. It is so heartbreaking to think people don't think of their pets as anything more than a piece of property like an old shawl they don't know what to do with anymore. Just want to know what people think about this. I about cried myself to sleep last night thinking of how she must feel.
Boarding on abuse of the children
Ladies, you need to have a talk with these men. They are really abusing these children by running them down, waking them up from sleep? What gives with this? A child needs a lot of sleep anyway, more so than we do and why a person would harp on a child much less wake up from sleep to harp some more borders on nothing but abuse. The guys you are with need a wakeup call. Why are you letting them get away with this? They should find healthier outlets than what they have now.
It's only child abuse if you hit them hard enough
check with your CPS. There is a BIG difference between spanking and beating.
Here is why you DO NOT take an abuse spouse like this to counseling sm
BTDT a couple of times. He manipulated the whole thing to his "issues" with me.
He told counselor: She makes me angry. Counselor looks at me: Why do you feel the need to make him angry?
He told the counselor: I don't like her looks. Counselor asks me: I have you considered getting some help with your weight and looks (umm 140 at 5Ə"??? Where was the problem?)
He told the counselor: She makes this marriage about the kids instead of making it about me...I make all the money...I do all the work (never housework)...and she sits on the couch and eats bonbons all day (what is a bonbon?). THIS MARRIAGE NEEDS TO BE ABOUT ME and what I want, NOT about the kids. Counselor: Why do love your kids so much and why can't you put him first?
LOUSY counselor. I went to another one on my own who said: You may not have bruises, but you are being abused. I know the situation you are in and he forbids you to work and it isn't like you actually have the time. It may take you some time to choose to get out. So, lets focus on ways for you to be stronger until you can walk out the door. HE didn't get any better HE got worse as I started to develop a backbone.
So to all those who say go to counseling, stay in it, learn to be stronger, don't let his words hurt you...YOU ARE FULL OF IT. You all may like being treated the way that DONE is, but I don't. I am a person too, as is DONE. Anyone I might ever be with needs to think I am so wonderful, special, lovely, kind... you name it, they could not stand NOT to be with me. DONE'S husband is telling her, essentially...you okay I guess, but not that great. Plus which, you can't do anything the way I think it should be done. You don't have feelings because you are average looking and this marriage is all about me. Toro poo poo.
Some of you are not very bright, I am sorry to say, but there it is.
some advice about animal abuse
turn him in as soon as possible. People like that do not deserve animals. Someone ought kick him once in awhile.
Call the Animal Protection Society in your area immediately. I can't stand people who abuse animals and someone who knows this is being done and not doing anything about it is just as bad
You may have to report it but not as sibling abuse (sm)
Child abuse and neglect by the parents that BOTH children live with. The 8 year old doesn't need to be punished, they both need to be taken care of. The thing is, as you know DHS is not always going to fix the problem and if the mother finds out it was you, she will probably not let you see your GS again. That is a problem. I am not sure. Does your son have any type of rights to visitation, etc? Can he not go to court and say that his child is not being taken care of appropriately? Where is the older child's father?
Let me clearly state that this is abuse on many levels.
I'm another one who has BTDT...17 years ago, but when I read something like this, it seems like it was last week.
I remember exactly what my state of mind was when I finally was able to realize I had reached the end of my rope. That alone took me 10 years to figure out. I was overwhelmed with what lay beyond the escape I could not imagine being able to engineer. The fear was paralyzing. It would have been nice to have help and support, but I was so ashamed that I could not seek it or accept it. I ended up learning how to take my anger and turn it inside out. I transformed it into self-empowerment.
I am sure there are plenty of people who would like to help. You just may not know who they are or how to find them, but they're out there. Everybody's situation is different. It would be helpful to know where you live (town or city and state). I would be more than happy to help you gather some information, but need to know the geography.
Also, what kind of support system do you have beyond your household? How many kids? What about friends and family? Any possibility of staying with them, or would you feel safer being in a location your husband does not know about? If you are an MT, your job is portable....a huge help in this circumstance.
Share as much or as little as you feel comfortable with and see what we can help you come up with. This kind of thing probably has a better outcome if you have a plan (especially in view of your children and their schooling), but even without one, it can be done.
Let me be the first to assure you, life is really sweet once you get yourself and your kids to the other side.
I really feel that what she is doing is child abuse.
nm
your parenting style is really bordering on abuse
and what makes this so sad is the fact that your children are so young and cannot control what is happening to them. They are trapped in a world ruled by your iron fist.
I think that constitute abuse! Dogs are very social - sm
animals, and their human families are their *pack*. That poor dog is bored and lonely. It's crying proves that food and water alone are not enough to nourish an intelligent, social animal like a little Sheltie. I would tip off animal control. I'm sure it can be done annonymously. If the dog is confiscated, you can help it out by looking for a Sheltie-rescue in your area, and if not, possibly a regular animal rescue group. If she's healthy & has a good temperament, they may pull her from the shelter and foster her 'til someone can adopt her.
Or -- if that sounds too drastic, if you know the other people are gone, why not climb the fence into her backyard, and befriend & play with the dog? That would be better than nothing, although it sounds like the best option would be to find that dog a new family.
why does He allow abuse of helpless children/animals?
nm
I also read abuse of prescription drugs.
Legal, illegal- does that really matter how it is obtained?
Makes me sick. They do have proof of abuse. PLUS
NM
Need some advice about possible animal abuse sm (this is long)
my son rode school bus home with a friend to the friend's house last friday (i had never been to their house, but his friend has been here once and i've talked a few times with parents on the phone). these people some like really nice people, very religious. i went to pick up my son friday evening and was a little shocked. had a weird vibe about the dad right off the bat. i don't like to judge people at all, but when i first saw him i thought hoosier, looked kinda creepy to me. their house was ok, but i felt dirty when i left. he has a couple of dogs, one he says he doesn't like that it's the most stupid dog he's ever seen (extremely adorable dog! seems very lovable) and another dog that has puppies and he bragged "listened to him very well". when i was getting ready to leave, this "momma" dog comes around to the front and seemed extremely scared, especially when he was by her. he was trying to show me how good his dog listened to him. but she was putting her head down, slouching down like he's getting ready to strike her. it made me feel so uncomfortable. i'm a HUGE animal lover. so the next day my son goes back for a b-day party. on the way to their house, my son tells me that the dad kicked the "momma" dog because she was eating the cat's food. (the cat is really skinny too). when i got to the house i was able to get a better look at this dog because it was daylight and the poor thing looks so unhappy and her rear end area looks like her hair is coming off, i don't know if it's mange or what. i just felt so helpless for this dog.
i called my vet office and asked them who can i call if i suspect animal abuse (we don't have a local humane society or ASPCA type place, just animal control), and they said the police. i'm kinda scared, because my son really likes his friend and i don't want to cause problems, but these people have six kids (they seem like really nice kids, well mannered). but the look on the dog's face just breaks my heart and here it is tuesday and i can't get those two dogs out of my mind. oh, another thing, when i was leaving there friday evening i said something about keeping the kittens (yes, they have kittens too) away so i don't hit any and he said something like it's ok, if they get in the way, owell.
so my question is do i get a hold of the police and tell them this???? i just want the dogs taken away. i want to be anonymous. i don't want to cause trouble for this family, but just want the animals taken away. the dad told me that this is the third litter of puppies for this momma dog since last november, and if he finds out who the daddy is ........ well i thought to myself, why don't you get her spade. i was furious! i thought about writing a letter to the police station. what do you all think?
thanks
Do you think that piercing a child's ears is abuse?
nm
humans who abuse/kill children and animals
should be eliminated....quietly, and under cover.
Really think court case, child abuse charges
when another mother breastfed her child past a so called normal age. The poster says do not worry about what others think and the kids did not have to wear braces, but what about emotional issues that might come to pass with a 6 year old still on the boob? Most in this country, I am sure, would agree with these posts that you overstepped bounds in a mother-child relationship when this happened. Some things just should not happen.
Animal abuse was finally passed as a felony
and it should be enforced as such...for good reason. These "kids" would probably not think twice about taking a human life. It is well documented that people who will abuse animals will/and do all sorts of other criminal activity. To say they only need counseling and help is not right in my opinion. They DO need counseling, but they also need to pay for the crime they did, period.
Do you not think someone with repeated DWIs probably has a mental problem and has had crap thrown at them as a child? But you would probably want them to serve a sentence. Anyone who engages in criminal activity such as this or repeated criminal activity probably has not had a good upbringing. That does not mean that they do not serve their sentence though.
To compare hollywood celebrities who walk away from DUIs to this case is crazy. If anything, don't let them off cause the others are being let off. Instead, why don't you advocate that more is done in our justice system to assure everyone has to pay for their criminal activity. I do not think 3 years is too much at all. During those 3 years, hopefully they will also get the help they need too.
That is ABUSE Humane society or ASPCA should be called
Dogs dont just bark for no reason. In my opinion a person who puts there dog out and the dog is distressed and barking and the person does nothing to work with the dog and leaves to avoid the barking is abusing that animal. That is like locking a child out. If you really do love dogs like you say anonymously call the ASPCA or Humane sociey and let them explain it to the owner.
Paddling is child abuse. Even Florida doesn't allow it.
xx
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