Do you recall the pre-Patriot Act world?
Posted By: How about pre-media conglomerates...sm on 2008-10-29
In Reply to: here's what I think - 4 more of the last 8?
when diverse viewpoints were at our fingertips and not dictated by Mega-Media outlets riding around in the pockets of political status quo? Not only has this dummed down American audiences nationwide, but it has been a direct assault on the democratic process.
Patriot Act provisions:
1. Law enforcement agencies authorized (and sometimes forced) to search telephone, e-mail communications, medical, financial and other records without a warrant. This has been exercised against their own citizens, the most recent instance being voyeuristic easedropping on intimate conversations between American troops serving in Iraw and their spouses...right to privacy in 1st, 4th and 5th admendments notwithstanding.
2. Eased restrictions on foreign intelligence gathering within the United States. This has allowed them to expand their definition of terrorisim to include individuals and groups exercising their 1st amendment right to redress the government via political dissent.
3. Expanded the Secretary of the Treasury's authority to regulate financial transactions, particularly those involving foreign individuals and entities. An example of this would be freezing funds of a first generation natural born citizens sending money to their family members who still live overseas.
4. Enhances the discretion of law enforcement and immigration authorities in detaining and deporting SUSPECTED (not proven) of terrorism-related acts. This has not worked out well for many perfectly innocent citizens and permanent residents whose only crime is to have a Moslem name.
5. The act also expands the definition of terrorism to include domestic terrorism, thus enlarging the number of activities to which the USA Patriot Act’s expanded law enforcement powers can be applied.
Abuse of the Patriot Act has been rife and is the stuff of legend, as is the controversy that surrounds it. The erosion of civil right stemming from this one piece of legislation is breath-taking, but the mindset that created it....even more so. I will be voting for a candidate that shows at least some sort of awareness of civil rights. Those are the freedoms I worry about.
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Really? I don't recall seeing that in my
xx
As I recall
those pubs in Congress along with their bush leader didn't do a thing for the good of the country and they were replaced by the Dems but with Daddy Bush as the "decider" it was unlikely he was going to let them get away with anything for the good.........not that they tried either.
I don't recall ever
defending Bush no matter what. There are a lot of things that I don't agree with Bush on as well. I think both parties need a good cleaning out. I'm not a Cheney fan either but I do get what he is saying. If they want to let out part of those memos....let them all out so we know what happened and what we got in return that may or may not have benefited. How are we to know for sure if only half of this is opened up and looked at. You have pubs lying and dems lying alike. If the dems want the pubs to go down.....then the dems involved should go down with the ship as well. I'm tired of the double standards and the finger pointing.
However, I still say this is all best left alone until after our troops are home. It does no good for anyone to have us fighting amongst ourselves at home and releasing information that could endanger our troops even more than they are.
I also don't really think that our tactics as far as treatment of prisoners should be out there for all to see because, like I said before, what is the point of anything if terrorists know they are going to be treated well with no threat to their life. They would have no reason to spill the beans. They would just have to be patient until they got out.
I'm not here defending the GOP and Bush and Cheney. However, I personally see nothing wrong with waterboarding in an attempt to save lives.
Obviously this is something that you and I are going to have to agree to disagree on. As per my research and understanding, terrorists are not covered under the Geneva Convention and therefore Bush didn't order anything unlawful in that instance. But seriously....this is something that should be investigated after our troops are home and safe. I don't think Bush is worth putting our troops at higher risk.
Add to that the Patriot Act..
They could not get the Patriot Act passed before 9/11. Read this Act. It is downright scary and at the very end it states "or other purposes." What "other purposes?"
yes. Patriot. nm
nm
Don't want a patriot, need someone
who is highly intelligent, who takes time to think through his/her decisions, not a shoot off the hip kind of guy.
what does this have to do with the patriot act?
nm
Now here's a patriot...Not..(sm)
Rush Limbaugh: *I Hope Obama Fails." Somebody's gotta say it.*
http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/home/daily/site_011609/content/01125113.guest.html
I don't recall saying in my post that you were gt. SM
What an odd thing to say. Anyway, I don't like posting over here. I just happened to see that you were ungracious when I apologized and talking about slander when you did the exact same thing to me so, in other words, nothing has changed here. And you are not funny.
I do not recall saying that I did not agree with...
abortion because God would never approve of it nor want it. I may have said God would never approve of it or want it, because I believe that to be true. However, I do not remember saying that was the only reason I was opposed to it. What about people who are not religious who think abortion is morally wrong? Again...you do not have to be religious to be opposed to abortion. There are a lot of people (nonreligious) who are against the death penalty for the same reason. Frankly, what difference does it make anyway? My point all along was that opposition is on moral grounds, and I certainly was a moral person BEFORE I came to know God. Are you saying you are not a moral person because you are not religious? Did I miss something??
Ah. Well, then perhaps we should sterilize everyone right now to make sure the antichrist is never born. That is how much sense that argument makes.
For the last time, piglet. I perceive abortion to be wrong because it kills what to me is a person. I don't need God or anyone else to tell me that life begins at conception. If it didn't, the child would not grow and mature. Whatever the stage the life is in, it is necessary to kill it so that it does not continue to grow. If you want to equate that with plants and animals, that is certainly your prerogative.
Again, I don't know why it chaps you so much for someone to have a different opinion.
The moral police? You mean like saying theft is wrong? Like saying war is wrong? Like saying assault is wrong? Like saying rape is wrong? That kind of moral police?
Again...there are laws on the books right now that you can be charged with two murders if you kill a pregnant woman. Do you oppose that too? Scott Peterson...charged with Laci and Connor's death. Connor was certainly not viable outside his mother's womb. You are saying it was okay if Laci wanted to kill him, but murder because Scott killed Laci and therefore terminated Connor's life at the same time?
Try telling a pregnant woman who WANTS her child the instant she finds out she is pregnant, that that child will not become a child and is only alive like a plant or an animal until it takes a breath. Tell her that when she mourns if she loses it, oh it wasn't a child anyway, it was an embyronic sac so get over it. Two women, 6 weeks along, one wants it, one doesn't. One knows it is alive and can't wait for it to be born. The other one wants to abort it. What makes the wanted child anymore alive than the unwanted child? Nothing, because they are BOTH alive. You can justify it in the name of choice if you want to. Just call it what it is. You want a woman to have the right to kill the living child within her, because her choice trumps the child's right to live. I just don't happen to agree.
I did notice this also and never did before. Can anyone recall? nm
.
And you know, Zville, as I recall, at one
point in his life, Mr. Obama was addicted to some form of illegal drug, and I don't believe it was a prescription drug. I don't recall if he ever went through any type of rehab or not like Rush did.
I don't recall MTPockets
saying they were leaving the board. Just saying goodbye to others who were leaving. I think several of us on this board could grow up a bit. This is getting ridiculous. Enough already and let's discuss important things instead of this elementary drama.
I don't recall ever sayin that
I agreed with the Bush administration 100% either. I'm not a pub. I'm an independent who personally thinks that our government has a whole is doing a p!ss poor job. Bush and Cheney weren't perfect by any means but they are out of the White House now. They cannot be blamed for the bad decisions Obama makes during his administration.
Maybe we should put that patriot act to good use....(sm)
like on the nuts at Fox News who are doing nothing but inciting violence.
http://leesearles.wordpress.com/2009/04/07/rightwingnuttery-glenn-beck-and-the-rise-of-fox-news-militia-media-edition/
I don't recall saying I was on the left. Newsflash:
Really? I don't recall seeing his pinky finger.
He's only showed us his middle one.
I don't recall Obama making
any promises to the gay and lesbian community. He himself is against same sex marriage.
As for this healthcare BS.....when it comes to pass and it isn't as great as he professed it to be and we are getting taxed out of the ying yang to pay for it....I'm sure many will be ready to get rid of Obama and any fellow cronies on the dem party. So don't count your chickens before they hatch.
As for the promises he has broken. Gitmo is still open. We are still in Iraq and now in Afgan. He promises he wouldn't raise taxes on 95% of Americans which is a downright lie especially if he is going to pay for this healthcare plan of his. He said lobbyists wouldn't have a place in his administration and yet he appointed some. Obama is nothing but a liar. The reason a lot of people still love Obama is because the mainstream media continues to portray Obama as doing no wrong. If some of these people would actually pay attention to what is going on and actually do a little research as well as lay off the kool-aid.....I'm sure more people would not be satisfied with Barry.
Sheehan, a true patriot
I have followed this courageous woman who sacrified her son for this war and I have nothing but praise and respect for her. She is a true American.
Michael Moore a patriot? sm
in WHAT alternate universe? Investigate? He wouldn't know a true investigation if it bit him on his very large butt. During the last election when he called Americans in general and Democrats in particular stupid...well I guess he loves the country but holds the people in contempt...particularly liberals as that is what he said...a patriot? Well the founding fathers would spin in their graves on that one. LOL...omg. Michael Moore a patriot. LOL.
He was a true patriot! I'll bet you are
proud of him.
I didn't vote for or against the Patriot Act and neither did you....
Congress did. Obama voted to reauthorize it as well.
The Patriot Act has nothing whatsoever to do with communism. What would make you say that?
Patriot Act/health care
You mean HC, of course. She was not different than any other congress and senate members. Patriot Act parts 1 and 2 were passed BEFORE the Iraq War WMD Bush lies, people die justification based on faulty intelligence was revealed. It makes me crazy that it is still there and I truly hope to see it revised or scrapped sometime in the next 4 years.
I am asking you, seriously...do you know when you started feeling vulnerable to govt control? I feel that too, but I am sure for different reasons than you...and I really am interested to know what make you feel that way.
Obama's plan is not a socialist plan like the ones you are referring to. He is not taking free enterprise out of health care. He is proposing to open up the existing plan that now covers Congress, the senate and federal employees. I have looked at that plan. It offers a number of choices in terms of deductible amounts, types of coverage (HMO, PPO, etc), premium amounts and the like. Pre-existing conditions are covered under some of those plans, if not all of them. He is aiming his pre-existing changes toward private insurance companies as part of his health plan.
It works like any other group plan. If you broaden the base of employees (in this case, citizens added to the plan by CHOICE, not force), the premiums come down. The care remains the same. You are free to choose the plan that best suits your needs or elect to keep your existing insurance. For Obama, it is a question of giving people access to affordable health care. He is not suggesting to transfer tax dollars to create the kind of plan you are describing that you consider to be subpar.
What is TriCare? I have to leave for a little while, but when I get back I will try to retrieve the link I used to inspect the existing federal plan and if I find it, I will post it later this afternoon. BTW, I know I come on strong and use sarcasm to a fault when I feel I am dealing with a poster who I think (sometimes mistakenly) is either ill informed or showing disrespect...not when having healthy debates over differences in opinion, beliefs or ideology. Those debates end up being the most informative of all and are a lot more satisfying than just preaching to the choir.
Huckabee forgot about the Patriot Act...
Ummm audacious? More control? I'm getting whiplash from looking behind in order to look ahead.
P.S. I don't recall anyone posting a near death threat to the
remote to that.
Why is it you are the only ones who are "free" to display your anger on your board?
If you take a look at the posts on this board, the only time they get nasty is when a troll from your board comes here and begins spewing your hatred and rage.
Why are you so angry? Your guy won.
Whenever a liberal raises an issue concerning a Bush administration policy or decision, I seldom see an intelligent thoughtful response come from most of you. Instead you attack the poster on a personal level when that poster never personally attacked YOU. They complained about Bush. Are you BUSH??
Time and time again, most of you come back with "all liberals" insults and rarely, if ever, address the question or issue that was raised.
If you can begin to understand that it isn't YOU PERSONALLY that we are referring to, maybe then we can begin to have an intelligent conversation on this board.
If you are a conservative, I respect your right to your opinions, and I'd like to learn more about them. I can't do that if all you do is throw insults, which you are "free" to do on your board, but if we are angered or insulted by them, we are not likewise "free" to express that.
I had hoped that these new boards would eliminate the personal favorites that seemed to exist on the other board. Looks like that isn't the case.
And as far as approaching the administrator about fairness, if I can't do that, then I truly don't belong in a forum like this one. I belong in one that doesn't play favorites, where intelligent discourse can occur, where personal insults and attacks are prohibited for everyone, not just for some.
I just wonder how many people you've chased away from here, besides me.
seem to recall someone else protecing herself again a WITCH...haha
hmmm, real sound judgment there. So if Palin wins and decides to seek advice from shamans or witchdoctors, you are okay with that?
I recall Bush on a train with the press
not long after the 2004 election stating that he had 3 1/2 years to go...with a heavy sigh, thoroughly disgusted me. He should have recused himself then, and we would have been much better off.
And I think I recall reading about sperm doners
test tube babies, IVF, etc. The complete ig that people have that you have to have 1 man and 1 woman to have a baby. You know what? I can't have kids. We tried for over 30 years. Nothing worked, adoption never worked either. That's why they have other means (like sperm doners, etc.)
You know you can still have your "traditional marriage" between a man and a woman and call it traditional marriage, and for the gay and lesbians let them have a marriage to the person they love and want to spend the rest of their lives with just like you do.
Leave the tradition of marriage alone? Gee why not segregate whites and blacks in schools, and why don't you tell us whether different races can marry? How much further are you going to take it? If two people love each other they should be allowed to marry. They are human beings and have feeling just like you or I do. If I ever find myself without my husband in the future I have some woman friends that I share deep affection with and if we want to marry its nobody else's business and what we do in our own home does not affect you. Does that change the way you feel for your spouse? Has all your vows and trust for each other gone down the drain now because two people of the same sex love each other and want to share the same human rights that everyone else takes for granted. Talk about discrimination and making someone feel totally inferior and less of a human being, oh and what's next, only catholics can get married but mormons and lutheran or Jewish people can't. Man, now I know why I am not a Christian. So let there be two branches of marriage. Traditional branch where you say "I Marge take Fred to be my lawful partner, blah, blah, blah" and then you have another branch of marriage where you can say "I Judy take Barbara to be my lawful partner. I promise to take care of her when she is sick and dying. I will love her til death do we part". And this allows her to be able to make the decisions and have the same rights that all other human beings can. If you believe in a loving God, then he loves all people no matter what. He doesn't discriminate. He doesn't need any spokesperson interjecting their opinion as to what they "think" "he" wants.
Also, our lives on this planet are too short. Why wouldn't you want other people to be happy and share in the same happiness you share with a partner. Their getting married doesn't affect you.
I guess our definitions of a Patriot differs
and I guess that's okay, but the truth will come out in the wash, eventually. All the media filters in the world will not keep the truth coming from coming out eventually, and we may all be surprised at what the truth actually is which may be drastically different than either one of our points of view.
Bush to criminalize his protesters under Patriot Act
By Patriot Daily
News Clearinghouse
1-13-6
George Bush wants to create the new criminal of disruptor who can be jailed for the crime of disruptive behavior. A little-noticed provision in the latest version of the Patriot Act will empower Secret Service to charge protesters with a new crime of disrupting major events including political conventions and the Olympics.
The Secret Service would also be empowered to charge persons with breaching security and to charge for entering a restricted area which is where the President or other person protected by the Secret Service is or will be temporarily visiting. In short, be sure to stay in those wired, fenced containments or free speech zones.
Patriot Daily News Clearinghouse's diary:
Who is the disruptor? Bush Team history tells us the disruptor is an American citizen with the audacity to attend Bush events wearing a T-shirt that criticizes Bush; or a member of civil rights, environmental, anti-war or counter-recruiting groups who protest Bush policies; or a person who invades Bush's bubble by criticizing his policies. A disruptor is also a person who interferes in someone else's activity, such as interrupting Bush when he is speaking at a press conference or during an interview.
What are the parameters of the crime of disruptive behavior? The dictionary defines disruptive as characterized by unrest or disorder or insubordination. The American Medical Association defines disruptive behavior as a style of interaction with people that interferes with patient care, and can include behavior such as foul language; rude, loud or offensive comments; and intimidation of patients and family members.
What are the rules of engagement for disruptors? Some Bush Team history of their treatment of disruptors provide some clues on how this administration will treat disruptors in the future.
(1) People perceived as disruptors may be preemptively ejected from events before engaging in any disruptive conduct.
In the beginning of this war against disruptors, Americans were ejected from taxpayer funded events where Bush was speaking. At first the events were campaign rallies during the election, and then the disruptor ejectment policy was expanded to include Bush's post election campaign-style events on public policy issues on his agenda, such as informing the public on medicare reform and the like. If people drove to the event in a car with a bumper sticker that criticized Bush's policies or wore T-shirts with similar criticism, they were disruptors who could be ejected from the taxpayer event even before they engaged in any disruptive behavior. White House press secretary McClellan defended such ejectments as a proper preemptive strike against persons who may disrupt an event: If we think people are coming to the event to disrupt it, obviously, they're going to be asked to leave.
(2) Bush Team may check its vast array of databanks to cull out those persons who it deems having disruptor potential and then blacklist those persons from events.
The White House even has a list of persons it deems could be disruptive to an eventand then blacklists those persons from attending taxpayer funded events where Bush speaks. Sounds like Bush not only has the power to unilaterally designate people as enemy combatants in the global war on terror, but to unilaterally designate Americans as disruptive in the domestic war against free speech.
(3) The use of surveillance, monitoring and legal actions against disruptors.
Bush's war against disruptors was then elevated to surveillance, monitoring, and legal actions against disruptor organizations. The FBI conducts political surveillance and obtains intelligence filed in its database on Bush administration critics , such as civil rights groups (e.g., ACLU), antiwar protest groups (e.g., United for Peace and Justice) and environmental groups (e.g., Greenpeace).
This surveillance of American citizens exercising their constitutional rights has been done under the pretext of counterterrorism activities surrounding protests of the Iraq war and the Republican National Convention. The FBI maintains it does not have the intent to monitor political activities and that its surveillance and intelligence gathering is intended to prevent disruptive and criminal activity at demonstrations, not to quell free speech.
Surveillance of potential disruptors then graduated to legal actions as a preemptive strike against potential disruptive behavior at public events. In addition to monitoring and surveillance of legal groups and legal activities, the FBI issued subpoenas for members to appear before grand juries based on the FBI's intent to prevent disruptive convention protests. The Justice Dept. opened a criminal investigation and subpoenaed records of Internet messages posted by Bush`s critics. And, the Justice Dept. even indicted Greenpeace for a protest that was so lame the federal judge threw out the case.
So now the Patriot Act, which was argued before enactment as a measure to fight foreign terrorists, is being amended to make clear that it also applies to American citizens who have the audacity to disrupt President Bush wherever his bubble may travel. If this provision is enacted into law, then Bush will have a law upon which to expand the type of people who constitute disruptors and the type of activities that constitute disruptive activities. And, then throw them all in jail.
Patriot Daily News Clearinghouse
Obama voted to extend the Patriot Act...
just so you know. After he said he would work to repeal it. There's some honesty for ya. Frankly, I don't think throwing your pastor and mentor of 20 years under the bus for your political career is particularly moral either. But that is just me.
This should make **patriot** Cheney happy.
NM
I don't recall saying I was right or left for that matter. What happened to your ability to sm
consider that and not label?
If I recall, Mahatma Ghandi resided in the country...
where the fighting was going on that he protested against. He did not move to, say, the US and bus to DC and protest and then bus back to home sweet home safe and sound. I challenge you and the other *peace* protestors to PLEASE stop preaching to the choir. It is idiotic to say that anyone (other than terrorists who seem to) WANT war. I certainly do not want war. I certainly do not want to have citizens killed 3000 in one day either or to allow my way of life (and yours) endangered by peaceniks. Umm....try dropping daisy in the barrel of a terrorist gun. See how far that gets you. You do not have to convince me peace is better when nations can live in harmony. Problem with that, Lurker, is that all the nations involved need to be of one mind. Despite what is being portrayed by many of the peaceniks posting, we did not bring 9-11 on ourselves. It was a cowardly, craven attack. You need to convince the people who are the real threat to that peace..the terrorists. Tehran. Kim Jong Il...picky any of them to start. Go to their capitals and protest and carry your signs. Talk to THEM about giving peace a chance. If you are serious about it, do something more than carry a sign and sing silly songs.
As to supporting the troops but not the mission...the person who wrote that opinion piece has no clue. There are a good many people who do join the military for purely patriotic reasons and because they love their country. A good many joined after 9-11 for that very reason. I will try one more time to make the point. When you do not support the mission, when you protest and hold signs that 9-11 was an inside job, that the President of The United States lied them into the fight, that they are fighting and dying for a lie, fighting and dying for nothing, ...if you think that does not affect morale and is anything but hurtful to the real live human beings with feelings putting their lives on the line for this country that they swore to defend against enemies....helllooooo. That is NOT in any way, shape, or form supporting. And you don't seem to give a rat's patootie what effect it has on them. In fact, it seems like you could not care less. Because, in case you and your peacenik friends don't realize it, they are there and they are staying there for the forseeable future. Why is it sooo hard for you to just support them while they are there? For people who are supposed to really care about others....that shows an amazing lack of empathy. Common decency should keep you from doing that while they are still over there.
Saw the spot in the NY Times about the protestor spitting on the disabled veteran. Way to go, support the troops!
Tell me again how noble the protest is. Get off the bus and on a plane to terrorist central. Talk to them. They may not doubt your sincerity as much as I do.
The Patriot Act is up but some want to keep it, including Schumer. Don't blame Bush for that. nm
Please give examples of people violated by the Patriot Act
like rr said, Nancy Pelosi said she knows of no one who has been abused by the Patriot Act.
I recall junior high being full of tattle-tales.
Speak for yourself.
We lost our freedom with the last admin. - wire tapping, Patriot Act, etc....nm
x
That's true - and Barack Obama is a true Patriot too.
Again we can agree to disagree. How John McCain has voted goes against everything I want as a President, but there are an equal number of people to me who feel opposite. That's the way it goes.
Your last comment brought to mind how true that is. Being a true patriot is not harmful in a candidate. John McCain is a patriot. So is Barack Obama.
What in the world are you
talking about ??? Oh, wait, I get it. The writer above said his mother said If Roe v. Wade is overturned, that's it for me. Out of that entire article that one sentence is what jumped out at you??? Our country is in a really really big mess both domestically and foreign policy-wise. The full and total attention directed towards the empire the Bush administration is so desperate to build will be what finally does us in and Roe v Wade is the most important issue on the table for you??. Prioritize, and by the way, we are killing babies, ones who are already here, the unborn ones in Iraq, in their mothers' wombs when their mothers are shot, men and women, American and Iraqi, British, Italian, etc. right now. Killing is killing is killing. It is what it is. It is not wrong in the US to kill the unborn but just fine and dandy in Iraq.
World War III....sm
With the news of Israeli conflict, Iran's missles, Iraqi War, I feared we were entering WWIII, so when I read this article today it confirmed my suspicions.
I don't know how in the world...
you turned this article which is about the major cheerleaders for the Iraq war, the neocons, into something that maligns the left. The only thing left about this article is me and the fact that I posted it on the liberal board. This article says neocons are upset. Neocons think the current administration is incompetent. Neocons regret what they have done in the past and would not do it again. None of this has anything to do with the American left or all those worldwide who thought attascking Iraq was a farce from the beginning. We have not turned on public opinion. We have been anti-war since before it started. Public opinion was very much against us in the early days of the war, in this country anyway, but some of us knew this would turn out to be the disaster it is. I myself was flabberghasted when I read what these neocons said. I never thought I would see the day Richard Perle or David Frum would have regrets and voice them to the public.
Just in your little world....
you are rather ad nauseum in your hate and bile...keep it up, you'll help her get elected....
How do you know what my world is.....
You make that assumption when in fact, you know nothing about my life. I come from a home where we were dirt poor but it was all I knew, so I didn't know we were poor. And there was no 2 of us as in your home. There was a single mom with two children. She worked a factory job where ladies there were treated horribly, making very little. We grew our own food when we could and I ate the same stuff over and over until I was sick of looking at it. But it was ours. No one said it was easy to get a job but my uneducated mother found a job and because she had no college education, she worked her butt off for very very very little. My clothes were homemade and not store bought like the girls I went to school with. She worked 2 or more jobs to have something under the tree at Christmas. She took a cheese sandwich to lunch everyday (and nothing else) and went to work burning up with a fever because as far as the boss cared, they could find somebody else to put in your place. My mother gave and gave and hasn't gotten anything financially to show for it to this day. Work is all I knew. I applied for a PELL grant to go to college (and for the poor, they can also get those, even those that aren't really considered poor can get them). I worked more than one job, went to classes, and then went to work again. I didn't know what a free ride was and never knew anything about welfare, etc. My mother NEVER took a dime from the government. I bought a piece of a junk car to get around in...seemed good enough for me, because that's all my mother had as well. You just prayed it kept running.
"we are just not buying into the mentality that we should just be lucky to have jobs and we should just work hard for our money" That is called entitlement mentality. Our community is packed full of those that feel entitled. Have another child, feel entitled. Too good to flip hambugers?, no problem, feel entitled.
"I totally disagree with you and I am not all that intereseted in what people who have money think or what their opinions are about what to do with my money." Really? Obama is rich and feels perfectly at ease telling you what to do with your money and what he wants to do with your money! That doesn't bother you? I have no problem with a social program for those unemployed who needs food/clothing/shelter until they get back on their feet. That is not what happens....it becomes a way of life for millions who get very used to not having to do anything but feel "entitled".
"I am talking about rich people who do not pay taxes and get all the tax breaks and credits while I pay higher in percentage of taxes on everything, such that I cannot even survive on what I am making now." Obama is one of those.
I don't know where you live but there are PLENTY of help for the disadvantaged in my community. Taxpayer dollars have built new low income housing, single family housing at that, to the tune of millions. While my mother still lives in a home over 100 years old, those living in a brand new home (complements of taxpayers) at a reduced price, while they are able to ride around in a brand new vehicle. They have 24 hour security protection even though I am already paying for that once by the name of local police.(I don't have private security protection). They have ellaborate wrought iron fences that surrounds their little estate that costs taxpayers to the tune of thousands and thousands (I don't have a wrought iron fence around my home). Like this is going to keep out any unsavory people. Right!! THey just drive right in.
In addition, the people who really need this are the single moms and elderly who are struggling. This type of housing takes any incentive away to do anymore than they have to to to live there. After all, just one spouse has to work so they can say they don't make anymore than they do, and this affords them free housing, food, healthcare, and free babysitter by the name of Head Start. Why isn't the other spouse working? Because they may hit that magic number by a couple of dollars that put them over the "entitlement" line. My mother's highest grossing income ever was 11,000 dollars and she NEVER took a handout. She is now of Medicare age and living paycheck to paycheck. If I offer to help her pay bills, she will not accept it. I have gone in and taken her electric bill and just went down and paid it before she knew it.
"have you ever had to decide whether to buy groceries or to pay the electric bill that is going to be shut off" You make 40K a year and can't pay your electric bill? I'm certainly not implying that's a lot of money, but sister, my mother's total for the year is $10,800 and she pays her electricity, buys her groceries, pays home insurance, pays gas bill, small phone bill all with that. And that's on top of her health care bills and medication. She has just underwent breast cancer and mastectomy and still has managed, so don't tell me you can't afford to live on 40K a year. My husband and I raised two children on less than that and he didn't want me working for a lot of those years so I could be there with the children. And there are two of you working. Mother drives around in a jalopy of a car without air conditioning and we are in the humid south. She now has watched her beautiful neighborhood turn into HUD housing (also paid for by me), loud obnoxious children who manage to walk around in Tommy Hilfiger and other such expensive clothes but their two parents can't afford to pay their own rent? Same parents have new model vehicles sitting in their front yard while mother drives around in a wreck. Nobody paying for her house.
My daughter and her husband didn't make that until just recently and they still managed to put money away for hard times just in case and good thing, he lost two jobs back to back with downsizing and mergers. They never went to a movie, ate at home every night, no newer vehicles, just what they already had.
"the republicans just seem to want to get rid of dead weight and just use people as servants" (Where have you been?) When Obama gets through taxing you to death to pay for his own "social programs", just who do you think will be dead weight. Who do you think will be servants then? How in the world could you possibly think you will be better off financially by being taxed more to pay for more garbage programs? You will then definitely be a servant....to the government!! That's what welfare states are....that's what our public education system is.....they can't turn a page in a book without the government telling them it's okay. They can't teach what needs to be taught unless the government tells them what to read, how to teach. This didn't start with Bush...it started a long time ago. Public education is completely dependent on government funds and that is what has turned all the students in them into servants. It's a reality now, not after the next election. It's been a reality for several decades now.
As far as crime is concerned, even our local police chief (who is black) said the people committing crimes are and will continue to be just plain thugs, criminals. They have no excuse. Honest hardworking people do not just start going out and committing crimes because the economy is bad. What happens is little Johnny can't get his $200 sneakers and $80 jeans anymore (which is the parent's fault in the first place), so he feels "entitled" and goes out and robs, steals, and kills for money to buy them. Those who will do those things will do them regardless. It has nothing to do with the economy.
I'm not saying it is easy but if my mother can live o less than $11,000 a year, I feel 40K a year is doable, unless for some reason you have out of control debt through no fault of your own (credit cards, expensive vehicles, luxury items, etc.). I know unexpected medical bills can put many right over the top and I understand that. My husband's medical bills due to a chronic condition is growing every day and that is a concern for us but I see people with things they want but don't need and they complain they don't have enough money. I was listenign to a cashier at WalMart the other day griping about how she just didn't know how she was going to buy her baby's Bday present, and yet, she had hair braids that cost $180 to get done (I asked her, while she went on and on about how long it took to get it done)and salon nails to the tune of $50 a pop and yet she couldn't afford her baby a birthday present?!!
How in the world
can they compare the republicans to Hitler. I do believe that McCain wants smaller government.....not bigger government. A comparison of Hitler and Obama sounds much more feasible.
Why in the world does he need one
Is he running for office too?
How in the world
can you say the economy was doing great before the Dems took control of Congress? Bush has borrowed, borrowed, borrowed and now he's borrowing even more so his cronies can take billions before he leaves office.
What in the world
is this country coming to????? For goodness sake! I did not vote for Obama, but the man is human. I was nervous. Good grief!!! He is about to take a very big step in his life with responsibility that most of us in our right minds would not take. He looked nervous and excited to me coming towards the steps, and I am sure he was very nervous when he was being sworn in. I wish you people would just grow up.
Many of you sound like high school girls - - did you see Michelle's dress.... blah, blah, blah..... Bush had an embarrassed look on his face..... blah, blah, blah.....
GROW UP!
In a PC world, you
have to be politically correct at all times. Many people are sensitive about their children with disabilities. I could see where his comment could be offensive. However, it does not personally offend me and I have an autistic son myself.
I think a lot of people need to simmer down. Yes, it was a bad joke and he probably should not have said it, but his main point was that he sucks at bowling....nothing more.
Political correctness has really hurt our country. Any time someone says anything about color, sex, or race.....certain people will jump up and scream about it. Being the president, you are under a much bigger magnifying glass.
It is my opinion that he probably shouldn't have said it....but it isn't the end of the world. However, I'm sure if this had been Bush's goof.....the liberal media and dems would all be screaming about it.
So what? Not everyone in the world wants to become
N/M
How in the world is
this going to boost the economy? Joe Biden said yesterday that he would tell his family not to go anywhere in confined spaces like airplanes, subways, etc. The White House had to back peddle and rephrase what he said but I personally agree with Biden. You won't see me flying anywhere, etc. until I know for sure how serious this is. Less people are flying. No one is flying to Mexico. Do you know how devastating this will be to airlines, etc. if more and more people don't fly because of this? The airlines are already hurting.
Blame Mexico? It is true that this started in Mexico, but things happen. I don't hate Mexicans. I'm just tired of paying for illegal ones. I don't blame them for this flu. It could have started anywhere, etc. and as much as people travel...something like this was bound to happen some time.
I think your post sounds more like a conspiracy theory and I don't get into those. Besides, we have no vaccine for this. Money may have been given for research into a new flu vaccine but there is currently no vaccine for swine flu. So I really don't see where you get that we got a vaccine and now all of sudden....boom....everyone has the swine flu.
This is something that cannot be blamed on the current administration. I personally don't like the idea of Obama having been in Mexico with this all going on but we didn't know at the time. I personally feel that Obama has handled this swine flu thing well. He has tried to be informative yet to keep people from panicking at the same time. I personally do not feel that this is something we can hold over Obama by saying he hasn't kept us safe because the swine flu is in the US. I think that is just insane to say. Besides, the normal flu strain kills thousands of Americans each year and no one thinks a thing about that.
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