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Aruba is a foreign country. Their laws

Posted By: yeah but on 2005-07-06
In Reply to: I think the father of the killer should be shamed publically - sm

are different than U.S.  Father said "no body, no crime" because he knows in their system if they have no body, they have no crime. Therefore, they have to find a body...or they can't prosecute for murder.... Their laws, not ours.  That is what it is when you travel outside the country, you are under the foreign country's laws.. Really too bad but that is how it is.

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So you are educated in the laws of Aruba? Wow.
I sound like I have lack of knowledge about this case, as does Mrs. Twitty.  So, I guess me and Mrs. Twitty should look to you for explanations and answers as to where her daughter is and what happened to her?  Do you have some inside info the rest of the world is not privy to?  I'm just wondering because if not, you are blowing a lot of hot air around and basically just about as uneducated about the laws and the evidence surrounding this case as the rest of us.

This is NOT racisim.  This is plain common sense and courtesy. 

It's the topic of the moment. You must be in a foreign country maybe.
There was a catastrophic hurricane with a devastating flood afterwards! A disaster of biblical proportions! Many people lost their homes, the worldly positions, billions of dollars in loss. Lives were lost, the poor, the elderly and the infirmed. We watched it on the news (it was on here in the U.S. around the clock). Try www.cnn.com for all the details.
I was living in a foreign country with my parents, probably getting ready for
elementary school. Didn't even know who he was. I don't remember my parents mentioning it, but it was shortly after that when the stupid joke about "What would it take to reunite the Beatles?" came out.
Hey rimrods!!! He fully disclosed he was foreign, it was foreign
trying to catch him telling lies when he already told you he was. Really smart people around here. Call names, insult, tell everyone to leave and go to another site and then wonder why your posts are being deleted. At least he's not feeding everyone a load of CRAP about offshoring. He simply told the truth.
I think all state labor laws are pretty much in line with the federal laws as far as PTO SM

among other things.  Basically, federal law states that an employer is not required to offer paid time off or paid holidays.  An employer doesn't have to pay you for time not worked.  It states quite clearly that PTO is an agreement between the employer and employee upon hire.  So, if you have an agreement with your employer stating you accrue PTO and get certain Holidays off with pay, then upon termination or resignation, you are entitled to any unused time you have accrued.  However, since not mandated by any state or federal laws, if an employer refuses to pay you for any unused PTO, you will have to take legal action, likely in small claims court.  You will probably eventually win, but you have to decide is it worth all the trouble and legal fees?

When you actually get right down to it, labor laws really don't do much for the working class.  We are not guaranteed anything except minimum wage and a safe work environment.

Yes, she is an American, but she is an American missing in a foreign country. Just as we have to abide by the rules of another country's government, when in that country, the same holds true here.
There is an excellent team of volunteers from Texas in Aruba, the FBI also is on the island. I've heard on CNN that there have been cases of young,female tourist being kidnapped in Aruba, then shipped not to far to Venezuela, to be held to work as a prostitute.
In that case, then we'd have to tell yet another government, that we followed the trail to your country and now our agents will be moving in
We are the greatest nation on earth, but we do not have the right to just force our way into another country and demand they do things our way
FBI in Aruba
Do you have any clue as to how many born and bred American citizens, under the age of 21, many under 15, our precious children, who have been taken by their parent, who is of another nationality, kidnapped from their custodial parent and wisked away to a foreign country by the other parent?
This usually occurs when the idiotic courts give visitation to said parent, knowing full well they are a flight risk, yet duh...."trust they won't do anything stupid"

As of 6 months ago, there were 2138 children born in the US, American citizens, that have unwillingly been taken to a foreign country, leaving their custodial parent caught in this catch 22 of trying to get their child back

The Hague Convention specifically prohibits this action, has rules to force the other country to return these children, yet the custodial parent is often left to hire Soldiers of Fortune to go in, stake out the country, living area, school where these children are, then they attempt to do what our country, the country that SHOULD be bringing these children home, fail to do! This should automatically be done, yet we have to try to argue "diplomatically" all the while these kids are kept from their parent the courts gave custody to. It's not cheap to hire a hit squad to get your kids back, it cost's thousands of dollars to do so.

In my opinion, the USA/FBI/CIA/ SECRET SERVICE all should be concentrating on THESE innocent victims a bit more than a young 18 yr old that made a bad judgement.
Where is the face time for the mothers or fathers of these children...the media won't give it to these kids, unless it is deemed worthwhile, and IMHP, each and every one of these children is worthwhile. It's just such an overwhelming thing to go through...I know, my nephew is somewhere in Saudi Arabia, growing up now for 3 yrs thinking his mother is dead or did not want him
The parents had to known she was going to drink in Aruba. Why would these 17 and 18 years want to go of course to drink or they could have went to Florida instead. Even though this girl made bad judgement if she drank to much and went off with these guys this did not have to happen. We need to blame who ever did this. If my 18 year old wanted to go to Aruba I would probably say yes but lecture her a head of time. I know my 18 year probably drinks in college but I told her I don't want to know this. What I do not see I don't have to worry about it. I have no control of her when she is in college but she is not allowed to drink in our house or anyone elses until she is 21. I have a feeling that her body has been thrown in the ocean. The whole situation is so so sad.
perhaps you should go to Aruba and help with the investigation (nm)

Speaking of Aruba....
You are EXACTLY right. Good post. We're both going to be crucified for this.
Any thoughts on the case in Aruba?

Little by little they are losing ground.  Commentator was saying that even if the last person to see her alive was Joran, the 17-year-old still in jail, they can't prove anything.  Maybe they fell asleep on the beach and when he woke she was gone.  Commentator said that if after all this time they could not break a 17-year-old and get a confession, with his two friends and father in jail, there is a possibility that he did not do it. 

PS:  I think her mother should go home instead of second-guessing the government over there.  She is convinced the three are guilty with the father as an accomplice.  How do you come to that conclusion with sureness?  That's kind of like some foreigner over here coming over and if something were to happen to them and they disappeared after a night of drinking and last being seen with a stranger, his parents come over and criticize our legal system because we can't PROVE foul-play.  Just a bit over-the-top for a mother who should be grieving the loss of her daughter instead of criticizing the authorities.  Hey and another thing, how about criticizing the chaperones who lost contact with the daughter and did not discover she was missing till she failed to show up at the airport!!


Missing girl in Aruba
Here in the midwest, we recently had a "found college girl", seven years after she disappeared from Texas, and was presumed dead. Turns out, she and her parents had a huge blow-up over a boy, she took off, never to be heard of again....UNTIL, somehow, someone saw her picture in the very same Wal-Mart she had been working in for 5 yrs! She still did not want to talk to her folks, but they since have made small inroads into reuniting
I was just in Aruba -very nice island

Aruba is just like any other tourist destination where as long as you stay in the tourist areas, do not wonder off into the downtown areas at night and practice basic street-smarts, then there is no need for alarm and it is just as safe as any other place. I went to Aruba last month and we had a nice stay but I also went there years ago when I was about 16 w/my friend and her family. Of course we drank our little hearts out but we stayed in the hotel area and never wandered off. I will admit that we were harrassed by locals a bit (and I think it was because we were so young) but we ignored them and ALWAYS stayed together- we used our street smarts!!

It sounds as tho this young girl did not have as much street smarts as you or I.  I would never  leave with guys I just met by myself even if I were at a bar in my hometown area, nevermind in another country! It is common sense but unfortunately this young girl didn't know any better, or for whatever reason maybe she thought that she was safe with these boys and she probably thought they were just regular kids just like her & her friends. It is very sad that she possibly had to pay the ultimate price for what she thought was just an innocent mistake.

We as parents try to protect our children from so much, but at the same time, I think sometimes we are so focused on keeping the evil of the world out, that we possibly make our children more vulnerable.

Aruba is not as well equipped to handle this situation (sm)

as the U.S. is...so therefore, if they are in over their heads, THEY should ask for the U.S. to help, period! That is a resort country, equipped basically to show tourists a good time, and not to handle a missing American case! See my point?

I don't know how you can take off for weeks at a time with all your close relatives and go to Aruba
and not be wealthy.  Could you?  Indefinitely?  You and your husband?  And her husband said they may buy a house there if necessary because the mother is not going home w/o Natalee.  So assuming that resort island property is not cheap, they can afford to buy a house in Aruba?   Can you?
Chandra Levy's parents said the same thing. It's not about Aruba.
It's about the parents.  Be mad as hell if you want to.  Blame Aruba.  But do it quietly.  Because if the parents knew ANYTHING, they would catch the perpetrator.  They know nothing but just spout accusing everyone of illegal activity just as you do.  I do know Aruba and not everyone is related to everyone and there is a blend of nationalities just as Joran is Dutch and the two boys with him were obviously a different nationality.  To oversimplify the situation by calling everyone crooked and criminal in Aruba is insane.  Perhaps Natalee did some drunk swimming and everyone else in Aruba who has lived life nicely on this pleasant island and never killed anyone before are being falsely accused.  Consider that.
Speaking of Aruba and Natalle Holloway from post below
It looks like the Arubans are forming a protest of their own who are offended at Mrs. Twitty and the media reporting they are not conducting a proper investigation and their system is bad while America's system of law and order allowed the sex offenders kill children in Florida and Idaho.  The Aruban people have a point you know.  One news person interviewed protestors and a very literate gentleman suggested Mrs. Twitty was under Aruban law and she should respect that or go home.  In a short statement Mrs. Twitty seems to be backtracking after the protests after Mrs. Twitty stated the legal system allowed criminals (the two brothers) to go free and walk among its citizens and tourists.  It's about time these people speak out when Americans come over and criticize their government without a clue how it works or if it is working.
Again, there are professional American search teams in Aruba.
Nobody knows the terrain of the island better than the native Arubans.  Together with advice from the FBI, the search team from Texas and the hundreds of Arubans who do know the island they are doing what they can do.  They do not need the hysterical rants and accusations from Mrs. Twitty

Oh, boo hoo!  Those foreigners learn our language so they can take our jobs and our money, you numbskull.  They aren't here to help us.  They take advantage of our laws which actually seem to favor foreigners over citizens, especially if the foreigners are "minorities."  (An interesting term since the only true minority in this world is white people.  About 85% of the world's population is non-white.)  

People like you who think you are so tolerant, are part of the problem.  In this country we would all be learning Chinese if the situations were reversed and China was the country with the open door policy and all the wealth. 

BTW, I lived and worked in Latin America and learned Spanish BEFORE I went there - I didn't expect the people of Colombia to pay to have everything I needed translated into my own language, which is precisely what these foreigners who come here to leech off us expect.

I'm an MT....slavery is not foreign to me.
Whatever it takes.
foreign docs
And why do a lot of those same ones who speak such poor English also make no sense in putting together their sentences?  I have several that sound like they are clenching their teeth together and straining to get the words out which makes it even worse.  I know exactly what you mean.  Their oughta be a LAW! 
Those foreign guys

Yeah, we've all had our share of "those" guys.  I worked in Radiology for a Spanish guy for about two years.  He thought his English was perfect, so anytime there were blanks he went off of his latino-rocker.  So I finally get this guy "nailed" where I can transcribe his reports just as fast as the others, and then what happens..  ? I lose the stinkin' account to VR!  So he still sends me work on occasion and guess what .... he's crystal clear NOW, and why?  Voice Recognition doesn't DO gibberish ... it trained HIM!  HA!   (Course he has to speak slowly now, losing lots of "billable hours"  And of course, they had to hire an Editor to clean up the reports, punctuate, and correct his English.)     Go figure!  ');>

Seriously, though, if you can't stay with that ESL day-in and day-out for at least a month, you will never get him.  Why companies bombard MT's with different docs from day-to-day is just beyond me.  If QA were REALLY that important, they wouldn't do that.

You all are talking foreign to me
I have ShortHand and love it, but you left me way behind. A Shorthand course would be great.

isn't SPI a foreign company
Maybe you could work for them.  They bought out Cymed.
foreign dictators
Wow, you sound so full of hate!!!Do you even know how difficult it is to learn another language? Have you ever tried to speak another language?

I don't particularly care for ESL's but...
foreign dictators!!

From one blondie to another--I couldn't agree with you more!

Drives me crazy, not to mention my so-called "productivity!"

What does the site being down have to do with foreign MTs?

Bonus from OJT - foreign dictators. (sm)

I learned OJT in a small hospital with a PDR, Dorlands and a boss with an attitude from &*^%&*^.  There were only about 7 doctors on staff, 4 of which were foreign.  I started off learning to cope with a Thai accent in a physician who had had a speech defect, a Nigerian, a Swede and a Czech.  It was a painstaking way to learn, but I am greatful every day that accents have become a way of life for me.  I almost prefer them to some of those mealy-mouthed speed demons. 

I can remember cursing when they would say "Go back up and change this".  Just rip that paper out of the typewriter and start again. 

My children can't imagine a time before computers.  Will have to take them to a museum someday and show them what life used to be like.




It's not the foreign workers who are at fault sm

The fault lies with the big US corporations who are the greedy SOBs that have outsourced the jobs so they can save billions over what they would pay workers in the US. 

So, to be rude to and cuss out these working people is not going to get us anywhere.  What we should do is boycott the corporations who are sending the work overseas.  Maybe if they lose enough business they will get smart to themselves and bring the jobs back to the US workers. 

I don't do foreign-speaking docs....
Either they speak English and speak it clearly or they don't have me for their transcriptionist. I'll be danged if I'm going to spend 15 minutes trying to figure out their dictation because they "don't speekee English," or they dont' want to take the time to speak it clearly. Let an MT who doesn't value their time or money transcribe for them! Some may think that's heartless, but that's just the way it is. I'm in this business to make money, not coddle docs who can and refuse to speak straight.
First Job, given only foreign dictators, and never the same. Doing allright, however, should I look
This is my first job, and I am never given the same dictator.  Also, this is hospital work with basically any kind of reports.  Only doing about 200 lines a day for 6 cents.  Should I look for another job???
Focus stands for Foreign

Focus is an Indian company, you know.  Most who have been there were not happy, and many MTs only go there because they are fresh out of school and find it hard to get the experience they need.  Just FYI.

I do have a 2nd job with US owned co. that I love. Foreign
It's shameful if the new owner is foreign but
I think the foreign kid adoptions are liberal Hollywood

I don't think these kids are anything more than a fashion accessory/photo op for these phonies. I'm sure she and the other "stars" who adopt these kids for whatever attention/approval-seeking reasons have a full staff on hand 24/7 to take care of the kids when the cameras aren't rolling.

I doubt Angelina's ever been vomited on or crapped on (at least not by her kids anyway). 

I think MTSO should inquire of foreign docs if they want their

Like it should be standard practice for transcription services to require hospitals to ask------------------

Dr. Pammmmbogmamajama - would you like your dictation to go to India.  Check YES or NO.

Dr. Filiyambo - would you like your dictation to go to PHILIPPINES.  Check YES or NO.

Dr. MacIntiremeout - would you like your dictation to go to IRELAND.  Check YES or NO.

Dr. Chinese - would you like your dictation to go to CHINA.  Check YES or NO (we have to know they are creating offices in Shanghi as we speak)

Hey, I can deal with "the boys" from home.  But I'm sick and tired of  feeling like I chose the wrong profession and should be working in the State Department as translator and should certainly be drawing down lots more salary and getting a WHOLE lot more respect. 

That way we could keep the English dictation in the United States and have it being done by people who have English as their first language.

Ha! Those jobs they'll just import the foreign PhD on
on one of those work visas as they do nurses and teachers. Pay 'em less and put another American out of work.

Wake up, America! No job is safe any more.
Do you charge more for foreign-speaking doctors? nm
really?? Worse than the offshore foreign transcriptionists?
That's odd.
venting re foreign patient names
I just typed a long report where the patient has some weird foreign name so it's difficult to tell gender. The doc dictates as a male throughout, i.e. he, his etc. At the end changes it to a female.
Tired of these low class foreign doctors
They live here but they cannot learn the language.  Most should not be here in the first place.  They were admitted to medical school with the proviso that they return to their own countries to work as doctors and help their own people;  they got all these fancy or free grants to pay for their schooling; American citizens were pushed aside to fulfill the foreign student enrollment requirements for medical school to "help the needy countries health problems".  Then they got dollar signs in their eyes.  They refused to learn how to talk.  They are arrogant, sloppy, nasty, and are too mentally compromised to even learn how to push the right buttons to enter patient numbers into systems.  What pigs!!!!!!!!!!!  And they expect perfection?   I think we should sign every report off with a blurb saying unable to understand dictator, please return him/her to his own country. 
are you working for third world foreign doctors?
This has been my experience.
TransTech does this group, too. Awful foreign residents! nm
My company foreign owned but they have US office people
Site was foreign built from the beginning..just listed at top only for US
True! Computer techs are all foreign. Used to be a good-
still have a tech job are usuallyh IC's, with no job security and no benefits. Lots of computer and microchip manufacturing jobs, that spawned the 'Silicon Valley' in California have gone offshore. Now even radiologists have to worry about their jobs, as some places send the x-rays digitally to Philippines to be read.

What I'd like to know is.... What exactly is going to be LEFT in the United States for US to do? Gas station attendant? Nope... most are self-serve, unless you live in Oregon. Wal-Mart Greeter? Hmm... not old enough (or retired enough) for that. Farm worker? Nope. Mexicans have cornered that market. Waitress? Nope. Lots of eat-in restaurants going belly-up these days. Typesetter? Nope. Newspapers are going extinct. Web designer? Nope. Most people can design their own nowadays. Retail? Same as the restaurants. Teacher? Whoa - talk about an underpaid profession! Nurse? Another underpaid one. Not a good choice for us work-at-home recluses. Truck driver? One of the few jobs where they need people, but to make ends meet these days you have to pretty much live in your truck. Flight attendant? Not a good choice for us recluses who hate to fly. Rap artist? Pretty saturated field. Hair stylist? I don't even comb my OWN hair most of the time, and haven't cut it in years. So I'd be pretty useless unless someone with long hair wanted a French braid. Chef or short-order cook? Not if you only cook TV dinners. (Does that count as cooking?) Dog-walker? Nah - I'm a cat-person. Bike-messenger? In my town, most of em don't live very long. You never see middle-aged bike messengers. Taxi-driver? Nope - the Sikhs have cornered that market. Executive secretary? (What? Go back to wearing heels and pantyhose? NEVER!)
Samtel does this all the time. Pretty sure she/he is foreign because of the plain stupidity in it a
foreign med school gradutes take separate board exams..nm
which are different than American med school grads. There was an article in The NY Times indicating that new regulations are being pushed that would require foreign med school graduates to take a two-part board exam to practice medicine here, with one part of the exam being English proficiency. Hmmm..that should be interesting. I don't think you have all of your facts straight.
In some areas there are laws against leaving a dog tied in a yard like this.  it is considered neglect or abuse or something
OT laws
What you're talking about here is illegal and violates the Federal labor laws. It is also not legal to just not pay someone if they work OT. You still have to pay them, and then deal with not following policy through whatever disciplinary action you have in place. But over 40 hours means OT pay, period. There is no exception to that and if your supervisor is advising you differently, he/she is asking you to break the law.