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It is the jobs of their constituents to hold them accountable...sm

Posted By: oldtimer on 2008-09-29
In Reply to: I thought with the posts it would be obvious...so I apologize. - sam

and vote them out if they are not doing their job. You turn a deaf ear to anything the dems on this board have to say, only causing us to tune you out when you keep the broken record going.


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Someone needs to hold them accountable.
Obviously their own party is not going to. Glad to pile on Bush and the Republicans for every wrong they think they did, but accept no responsibility or ask accountability of their own party who let us ALL down.
Oldtimer, I do not understand that. No way, no how.
Why do all of a sudden want to hold leaders accountable?
wHat about Bill Clinton committing felony perjury? Having sex with an intern in the oval office? Where was the personal responsibility and who is holding him accountable? WHen are you going to drop the double standard and apply the same set of rules to everyone?
If you don't think libs hold the dems accountable
They are harsher in their criticisms than the conservatives.
temporary jobs lead to permanent jobs -
projects are always just temporary; however, they lead to more permanent positions. Also, by the time some of these "temporary" jobs are over, the crisis should be settling down too. Do you think that rebuilding our infrastructure is going to happen in a day, week, or month?

What should we do? Tell these people who will be temporarily paid not to work for the next couple of years on these jobs because they are only temporary? That is a good idea - nobody do the temporary jobs, that way the projects will never get done and the deficit will not go up, and the economy will just continue to decline...

That's a great way to handle it!
If you would hold your Dem Congress as responsible as you hold me...
THAT would be progress. lol.
These constituents have to take
responsibility for themselves and their children.  It is not for our government to make decisions for people.... plain and simple.  People have the right to ask questions, but also have the right to be told it goes against the constitution which is the underpinning of our freedom, and if you believe in freedom, it really is that simple.  
do you think the dem's constituents are not against it also?
I am voting democrat this year, but I was still against all this they are doing - I think many democrats are - not just me.
Why should the republicans vote no because their constituents are against is, but if the dems vote no because their constituents are against it, it is just a setup?
I am not trying to cause an argument - just asking a question...
Yup, he's got plenty of constituents who'd like him out.
Nothing like earning respect like this:

http://philly.metro.us/metro/local/article/Who_wants_to_be_Santorum/3165.html
The ones who think their constituents are stupid..
Will pay for their mistake next election day.

I live in a pub state and our governor is a fool. If he turns down any of the stimulus package with this area hurting so badly in the current economic climate...he won't be here come next election day. I have heard from MANY on both sides of the issue who will definitely vote him out if he pulls such a stupid move.

Of course, that just leaves more for the reasonable heads of state who want to actually improve the lot of their constituents...
She was mayor, constituents had asked her...
about some questionable books in the library. In a meeting with the council she brought up that concern. According to that same Alaskan (Kilkenny, a Democrat, go figure), the same one who wrote the email cutting her to ribbons and one of the points was "She has hated me since 1992"....the first time she described the issue it was "I remember she brought up something about some books in the library but she never took it anywhere." Now, since she is running for VP, it has become "She tried to ban books!" Typical political crap. She was doing her job. Constituents brought her concerns and she brought those concerns to the council.

I saw the military head of the Alaska National Guard last night on TV, and the sitting mayor of Wasilla. Both had nothing but good things to say about her. The National Guard gentleman was really PO'ed that people so minimized the role of the governor as commander in chief of the National Guard. She was involved last weekend in deploying Alaska National Guard assets to Louisiana to help with Gustav.

You would think these folks would spend more time talking about what there #1 is doing than trying to crucify the other side #2. But, that is the way of the left. Politics of personal destruction and the bloodier the better...and enjoying every minute of it. McCain has more character in his pinkie.
The constituents who brought her their concerns...
does freedom not extend to them also? They don't have a right to at least ask about the books? Which is what they did...and she took their concerns to the city council, which is her job as mayor. Why do you seek to curtail others' freedom in the name of freedom? They did not get what they wanted, but they certainly should have the freedom to ask and be heard. Isn't that exactly what you are saying we must protect??
Yeah, there have been but I can only be accountable for myself...sm
Like I said before, you get trolled on your board and then come and take it out on the liberal posters like we are the trolls over there. That's why I suggested the new posters use monikers. Now, I know the trolls won't use monikers; they'd rather drive by and insult like they have been, but now that Starcat has a moniker at least I won't get her posts confused with the troll.

I don't have a short memory. I know there have been trolls for years, but I don't know what point you are trying to make. All I asked is for them to show us the respect of using a moniker, so those of us who are not interested in their sarcastic, insult filled, anti-everything-liberal posts could ignore. Remember, this is the liberal board where you can expect liberal view points being discussed.

They should all be held accountable s/m
Especially given Cheney's brazen admission to not only knowing about, but giving the green light on the types of torture that we used to deem punishable by death.  If we as Americans don't stand up and demand accountability for these heinous acts, we are no better than the other despotic nations that allow this. 
So when will Bush be accountable
for the atrocious outrageous things he and his cronies have done?  Accountability?  Reps don't even know what that word means.  My belief is that the Obama administration should try them for war crimes, treason, on and on. 
Update: Pat's finally being held accountable

for his hateful words.  Israel now refuses to do business with him because of his bizarre remarks about Sharon. Needless to say, I was very happy to see this.






  MSNBC.com

Israel pulls plug on Pat Robertson deal
Officials angry over evangelical leader's comments about Sharon's stroke


The Associated Press

Updated: 8:14 a.m. ET Jan. 11, 2006



JERUSALEM - Israel won't do business with Pat Robertson after the evangelical leader suggested Prime Minister Ariel Sharon's massive stroke was divine punishment, a tourism official said Wednesday, putting into doubt plans to develop a large Christian tourism center in northern Israel.


Avi Hartuv, spokesman for Israel's tourism minister, said officials are furious with Robertson's suggestion that the stroke was retribution for Sharon's withdrawal from the Gaza Strip last summer. We can't accept this kind of statement, Hartuv said.


Robertson is leading a group of evangelicals who have pledged to raise $50 million to build the Christian Heritage Center in Israel's northern Galilee region, where tradition says Jesus lived and taught.


Under a tentative agreement, Robertson's group was to put up the funding, while Israel would provide land and infrastructure. Israeli officials believe the project will generate tens of millions of tourism dollars.


But the project now is in question in light of Robertson's comments, said Hartuv.


We will not do business with him, only with other evangelicals who don't back these comments, Hartuv said. We will do business with other evangelical leaders, friends of Israel, but not with him.


A day after Sharon's stroke on Jan. 4, Robertson suggested the prime minister was being punished for dividing God's land, a reference to the August pullout from the Gaza Strip and four West Bank settlements.


God considers this land to be his, Robertson said on his TV program The 700 Club. You read the Bible and he says 'This is my land,' and for any prime minister of Israel who decides he is going to carve it up and give it away, God says, 'No, this is mine.'


Robertson's comments also drew condemnation from other Christian leaders and even U.S. President George W. Bush.


The ministry's decision was first reported in Wednesday's edition of The Jerusalem Post.


Christian center planned near Galilee
Robertson's Christian Heritage Center was to be tucked away in 35 acres of rolling Galilee hills, near key Christian sites such as Capernaum, the Mount of the Beatitudes, where tradition says Jesus delivered the Sermon of the Mount, and Tabgha -- on the shores of the Sea of Galilee -- where Christians believe Jesus performed the miracle of the loaves and fish.


The project underlines how ties have strengthened in recent years between Israel and evangelical Christian groups that support the Jewish state.


Israel was considering leasing the land to the Christians for free. Tourism Minister Avraham Hirschson predicted it would annually draw up to 1 million pilgrims who would spend $1.5 billion in Israel and support about 40,000 jobs.


Hirschson, however, is one of Sharon's biggest supporters, and a member of the centrist Kadima party recently founded by the prime minister.


Hartuv left the door open to continuing the project, but only with people who don't back Robertson's statements.


We want to see who in the group supports his (Robertson's) statements. Those who support the statements cannot do business with us. Those that publicly support Ariel Sharon's recovery ... are welcome to do business with us, Hartuv said. We have to check this very, very carefully.


© 2006 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.





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src=http://msnbcom.112.2o7.net/b/ss/msnbcom/1/G.9-Pd-R/s49325650366130?[AQB]&ndh=1&t=17/0/2006%208%3A1%3A0%202%20300&pageName=Story%7CWorld%20News%7CMiddle%20Eas%7C10802750%7CIsrael%20pulls%20plug%20on%20Pat%20Robertson%20deal%7C&g=http%3A//msnbc.msn.com/id/10802750/print/1/displaymode/1098/&ch=World%20News&c4=World%20News&c5=Middle%20East%20and%20North%20Africa&c7=handheld&c8=N&c15=10802750&c16=Story&c18=08&pid=Story%7CWorld%20News%7CMiddle%20Eas%7C10802750%7CIsrael%20pulls%20plug%20on%20Pat%20Robertson%20deal%7C&pidt=1&oid=javascript%3AprintThis%28%2710802750%27%29&ot=A&oi=482&s=1024x768&c=32&j=1.3&v=Y&k=Y&bw=644&bh=484&ct=lan&hp=N&[AQE]


© 2006 MSNBC.com




URL: http://msnbc.msn.com/id/10802750/


Holding people accountable and blaming

people are 2 different things.  Blaming either party will get us nowhere.  The situation is upon us and the blame game is only holding up the resolution.


Holding people accountable may help to prevent a similar situation in the future.  Holding someone accountable means owning up to their part in the problem and making retribution to fix the problem.  If someone went along with this and gained financially from it, then that person should be accountable - own up and pay up.  If someone went along with this and gained politically, then that person should be accountable - own up and give up (your position). 


I took serious offense to your comment because you didn't say it was directed to the politicians on the hill.  You said as a general statement to all dems. 


jobs
my husband has been a carpenter and self-employed since he was fresh out of school.  after 20 years he had no job, no work anywhere.  he had to go take a job at a store making less than half of what he used to make.  now they are saying they may be laying him off and he hasnt been there long enough to collect unemployment.  I cant imagine things getting worse, but I fear they are going to.
Not me, I have 3 jobs, thank you. Why?
nm
JOBS
Maybe Obama is thinking these jobs will last until he is out of office, and then when the jobs are finished, and people are out of work, he can say, see what happened when I was no longer in office.
Yes, we can always hold
more people see through the BS. Bush & Co. certainly are out in full force *catapulting the propaganda* and swiftboating anyone who disagrees, so who knows? Hopefully fewer people will buy it this time.

I'm sure your grandchild is the cutest and smartest!


You and your family are in my thoughts and prayers.

If you hold with J, that should be enough. nm
nm
We should not have to hold him up. He should hold
nm
Well hold onto your hat.....(sm)
because I know of 3 pub senators who are planning to say yea (despite threats from the GOP).  LOL.
Well of course Obama wants to keep jobs in the USA. Here is why.
Do you want $8,500 of your dollars to fund the Useless Nations? I know I don't.

Barack Hussein Obama has a legislative record in the Senate and one of his proudest accomplishments is The Global Poverty Act (S. 2433).

Barack Hussein Obama's Global Poverty Act will commit us to a stealth United Nations-inspired global tax of $845 Billion dollars... that comes to approximately an $8500.00 tax burden for every household in the United States!

Cliff Kincaid of Accuracy in Media wrote:

"[T]he legislation, if approved, dedicates 0.7 percent of the U.S. gross national product to foreign aid, which... would amount to $845 billion 'over and above what the U.S. already spends.'"

"The plan passed the House in 2007 'because most members didn't realize what was in it.' Congressional sponsors have been careful not to calculate the amount of foreign aid spending that it would require."

The United Nation's actual record on ending pain and suffering around the world is pathetic and dismal.

Here is the link, check it out for yourselves before you flame me. I am sure I am not the only one who is worried about what will happen when/if he gets into office.

ExposeObama.com


It is not that Americans won't do the jobs...
it is really that they will not do them for the wages given. Unfortunately, we expect a cheap food source, which we get. If farmers have to pay Americans to labor away in fields, they will have to pay more than they do and our food costs will go up. I am actually okay with that. Perhaps retail markup will have to go down some, as well. Coming from California, I know what kind of living conditions migrant famers live in (huge amounts of people in subpar housing, etc.) and understand that Americans WILL do the work, but only for a fair amount of pay.
I've had jobs since the day I was old enough to
even though there were times I could barely scrape together 2 cents to buy something I or my family needed. Yes, jobs are pretty easy to get, if you don't think you're "above" working at a gas station, McDonald's - whatever it takes. There are plenty of people who use social programs in lieu of finding a job. I see it all the time. They milk the system, if you don't admit that, you're in denial. I don't believe for one minute that the hard-working people in the country that make decent money should have to pay for these people. I have no problem with programs for those who truly need it, but if you were truly to examine most of the recipients of these programs, a good lot of them are abusing it. I worked in a law office where I saw this and I worked in medical offices where I saw this. The sad reality is that those who milk the system are darn good at it and REAP the benefits, but the people who truly need welfare, disability, etc., fight for sometimes YEARS and never receive benefits.

I think it's highly tacky of you to insinuate that the only way Whoopie could've attained her success is by using social programs. That is a borderline racist remark, IMO. Would you say that about a successful white actress? Hmmmph.
Just WHO do you think does provide jobs?
the middle class?
how to figure out which jobs are on their way out
Anything that requires a loan: houses, cars, trade schools, university of Phoenix type schools, shopping malls, vacations and travel, elective surgeries or cosmetic dental lasik surgeries, etc.

Jobs that will increase:
Anything that helps America:
Teachers, nurses, geologists, scientists, infrastructure, power grids, alternative energy, solar.
how it affects our jobs
It will affect us if the automakers fail because it is estimated that upwards of 6 million, and some estimates are as high as 10-12 million, people could potentially face unemployment. That is those working for the big 3 as well as those who supply them and those who work for business that all of these people utilize. 6 million is a lot of people now without health benefits and paychecks. Obviously, that will have an impact of numbers of doctor and hospital visits.
Green jobs.......... sm
would take quite a bit of time to implement as it would take time to build the utility facilities, not to mention retrofitting households to use green energy. I don't think this is a viable short-term plan to help our country, although I do see a benefit from it long-term. However, in creating green jobs and bankrupting the coal industry like he said he would that creates yet another situation where people will be jobless and not paying taxes. With a good portion of our electric energy coming from the coal industry, this number could be significant enough to offset any benefit obtained with green energy and green jobs.

We are in a financial crisis and I don't see that there is anyway out of it (unless they yank that Golden Fleece) without immediate tax increases on all tax-paying Americans.

Like I said, a plan is just a plan and even with a Democratic Senate, I don't foresee his tax plans coming to fruition in the near future.
You nut jobs can have this place

Keep on ranting about the stupid b/c like as if you are smarter than Hillary and McCain.  If there'd been even a SNIFF of wrongdoing in the b/c, they would have drug it out and already drug it through the mud.  Personally I don't think a lot of the nut jobs who hang out here are even MTs.  I think they are professional political pot stirers!!!


They are bragging about 3M jobs

being created. Guess what DH reminded me of? There are millions more unemployed than the 3M (he said 10M, but I'm not sure on that), plus most of these jobs will not happen until 2011. How's that going to help?


I'm serious. That will leave 7M still on the unemployment rolls. We are really in for a long haul here. Thank heavens I don't live in a city. At least we can grow our own food.


You know if they want to create jobs

why aren't we drilling for oil?  Why aren't we getting wind farms going?  If our government would take more money to look into alternative fuels, not only would that stop our dependency on foreign oil but we will need workers to maintain those things, etc.  Those will be jobs that will last.  It won't be like construction work like Obama wants.  Once the roads are repaired and bridges fixed, etc....then what?  I just think we are going in the wrong direction and I just don't understand why.  We need to tap our resources with offshore drilling.  We need to drill Alaska.  While we are doing that, we need to look for alternatives to oil.  The sooner they do that, the sooner car companies can make environmentally safer cars and vehicles.  I mean....come on.


I read somewhere that most of the jobs
won't get up and running until 2010 or 2011. It takes time. Everything takes time, and so, in the meantime, we have to go it on our own. It's sink or swim right now.
Particularly the construction jobs.
Those often take at least two years of planning, getting bids, getting materials and getting started. Not very helpful right now. I think everyone on the Hill has totally lost any connection with the real world.
From my understanding, the jobs

created would only be temporary. Don't forget, road and bridge construction only lasts in the summer in the northern states, and when those road and bridge jobs are done, what's next?


The money being doled out for infrastructure is definitely not enough. There are many, many roads and bridges that have to be built/rebuilt in the country and any one of them would cost $1 million and up.  PA is getting $2.7M for roads. Is that going to take care of the roads? Doubt it. Headlines recenty in our paper stated PA was going to get $6B. I checked the charts and don't see where he gets that figure.


Jobs going overseas
I forgot to mention - as MSMT said in her post titled "It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out what's wrong with the economy" - it stated on yahoo was an article about the layoffs at Dell in Austin.

"Everyone in the room was fired, their jobs shipped overseas".

That's one instance.

I'm taking an online course and 6 students wrote in stating they need to get retrained because they just lost their jobs within the last month. Their job went overseas.


But think of the ''green'' jobs
created by the new technology.  Someone will have to develop a ''fartometer'' to measure the bovine emissions.  Each cow will be fitted with one by a trained technician. Somebody will have to monitor the readings.  Somebody else will have to compile the data.  And  there will need to be a billing department to calculate the ''gas tax'' due.  Surely there will be a place in this new bureaucracy for displaced MTs?  (Unless the readings are remotely transmitted to Pakistan...)
Every group has their nut jobs.
You cannot group all conservatives into that category especially since there are just as many nut jobs on the liberal side.  Get over yourself and give me a break! 
The right not only defends their nut jobs sm

they have people out there like Lamepuke and Billo the Clown pandering to these crazy loons.  Some people would sell out their own mother for ratings and to put more millions of dollars into their own pockets.  It's pretty pathetic that these two despicable TV/radio man sluts have to resort to attracting the lunatics of the world to boost their ratings.


Whoa...hold on there.

This is/was a good board with some good folks.  PERHAPS she just hadn't seen these posts.....maybe....hope that's the case.


Otherwise, I agree that it's probably time to boycott this board. I have long been aware of the definite bias of the powers that be.  But I still hold out hope for fairness in the long run.   And I was banned on the conservative board for calling someone stupid!!!!  (which I shouldn't have, I admit).


Oh, just hold that thought.

This is great - can we hold em to it? sm
First Rummy, then we will work on the rest. I think they are starting to realize they are getting backed up to the wall.

Boxer quote: You can put lipstick on a pig, but it is still a pig. Love it.
who they hold responsible for what?
nm
hold on to your hats

The bottom is starting to drop out of this thing.  I am positive the media (who are angry already about the phony "bias" attack by McCain) will NOT let SP's silence go unnoted. 


 


ifin' they did I would hold them

up as shiny examples of Moral Magnificance, same as Palin's daughter.


 


I''ve got a tux on hold

and a vacation day scheduled . . . just in case.


 


Nah, we have to hold our mouth in a
different position in that case. Must have been something else.
Whoa and hold on!!!

First and foremost, please express my personal appreciation to your husband for his service to this country.  By no means would I EVER  ridicule a military person.  They have served and DIED for the freedom we have and they continue to do so.  I say the war in Iraq is ridiculous and that is my personal opinion.  I think it was wrong from the getgo and I think it is WRONG to put our service men and woman in harm's way with many of them sacrificing their lives needlessly.  There has never been peace in the middle east and there never will be (IMO) all the way back to biblical times.


Bush's "excuse" for the war was to capture or kill bin Laden wasn't it?  So why has that not been done?  Because, again in my opinion, the war is not against terrorism but about the wealthy oil barons.


AND, I pray for you and your husband.  You too are making a great sacrifice and, again, your husband is serving his country and for that he deserves and gets from me the utmost respect whether or not I happen to agree with the politicians who sent him to war.  May he be safe and soon return to you.


Whoh! Hold on there.

CLINTON put a lot of those people in government spots. I think he called it Affirmative Action. 


 I worked for a patent attorney back then and after Clinton got in, half the patent office were, (how can I say it without being branded a racist?) Indian, Pakistani, and a mix of other races. My attorney would be furious when they would return a patent for an error, and he would have to do a 15 page brief on why there was NO error.


Why are all the gas stations and motels now owned, or mostly owned, by other races?  Where does the money come from?


There is a large VRAJ temple (sic) a few miles from my house. No one could afford to buy the property when it went up for sale because they wanted close to $1M for it. People from all over the world come there, yet a white person is not allowed to step 1 foot on their property or they will be arrested.


What's up with that?


I hold government as a whole
responsible and that includes all parties.  They are all greedy liars who just want to keep their seat and will say and do anything to draw followers in to get elected.  So this promise of change is not change at all.  It is the same political game that has been played since the very beginning.  They all suck.  I say we storm Washington with our pitch forks and torches and get all new people in office.  What say you?  LOL!